A main ploblem in PWI (pls staff read it)
Comments
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They can't heal as good as IH b:surrender and with these suicidal teams its going to be hard tooBoozer - Lost City wrote: »Mystics will heal just as good as clerics.Xarathox - Dreamweaver wrote: »
Faction runs are complete jokes.
yup
Btw don't know if anyone said this but..clerics and barbs tend to team with particular people; people they know (mostly barbs). Why? Because..there are to many people out there that don't know how to play their classes, they're basically dead weight on the team. Though on Raging Tides I tend to find clerics and barbs (for fc and tt) kind of moderately, takes some time but you got to use your common sense sometimes when you want to find barbs for your team. Like if every ones spamming for barbs for fc..don't try to start a fc team..blah blah blah..yeah[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Move along..move along0 -
Shasynn - Heavens Tear wrote: »Unfortunately I'm a squad former...Anyone had to do that...Anyone that sacrify himself to make the game run...
...But I'm really tired to do that...pls...ELIMINATE BH!!!!! and let us play more rewardful Normal quests b:cry
You wanna get rid of BH because you have terrible luck at forming squads? Why punish the people that don't?
Make more friends. Problem solved. And it's not like BH is totally optional or anything.
As for everything else...
Just about anyone can tank these days, people are just reluctant in lower squads to let someone other than a barb (or bm) do it. Yeah, there's only one specialized healing class, but is it really that unusual? If anything, the introduction of the new classes will solve what you're complaining about because mystics will be able to replace clerics in certain squads, assuming the squad members aren't all total idiots. I don't really think there's a shortage of clerics so much as an influx of bad players that make decent clerics reluctant to go with random squads; so, following that logic, it really wouldn't matter how many different types of healers there are because the majority of them would probably prefer to stick with people they know.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Evict is a sexy chalupa.
retired, etc0 -
Wow, not sure if I wanna laugh at ppl QQ'ing about not finding BH squads for days or cry at the laziness to go and do something else in the meantime til they find one.
Go make a barb or a cleric....then see if even then you are able to get your BH's done. Sitting on 7 bh's that I've had for over 2 weeks now. And also, BH is NOT a "quest" that must be done like culti or the such. BH is like CS, OHT, WQ...it is completely optional.
And like many have already mentioned, cleric and barb is not necessarily needed 4 all ur runs. C'mon now...think a little outside the box and stop QQ'ing cuz u had 2 spend "hours" looking for a bh squad. >.< Which btw, imo...is totally whacked. lol I fly by and if I see a bh squad lf a cleric, i snatch it up. If not, I keep flying to my next mission. I am not about 2 sit there and QQ as I pose by HH for hours...good gawd. Go out and actually grind or work on other quests til then.
And as a side note...there are many times I do absolutely NADA....I'm not about 2 let ppl think that just because I'm a cleric, I am at your beck and call. I will roam Arch and just shop....and ignore all the "Cleric, come rez me" or "Cleric, come kill my mobs and heal squad". It's like any other class, either you can or want to do it and need to do it...or not. b:shutup
Expand your friend list, join a good faction, offer tele and pots if needed, and most of all...learn patience. If you don't find a bh squad after looking for hours...umm....move on and work on other quests perhaps? Or if all the QQ'ing over not finding the "needed" classes for your BH is so stressing you out....just...don't...do...them. b:cute see? easy fix already!0 -
Wait, when did this turn into a thread about eliminating BH because YOU can't do it without your "perfect" "balanced" squad??
Thats like me demanding that double jump be removed from the game because I suck at jumping.
Stop feeling so confined by classes and labels. This is your problem, not the game's. It is possible to get a reputation as someone no one wants to squad with for one reason or another. I can think of a few some people refuse to go anywhere near.
Is the game perfect? No. Are there things that could really benefit from being refreshed? Of course. Can you do things without your "standard" squad? ABSOLUTELY.
I haven't gotten to try the combinations listed by Elviron on page 3 of this thread, because sadly I don't know many archers. But I can see ALL of those being successful.0 -
Just because your faction sucks doesn't mean they all do.Xarathox - Dreamweaver wrote: »These exist? where?
Out of 200 people in a faction, you might get 3-4 who are interested in doing the exact same thing you are, at the exact same time you're ready to do it and during the same damn playing time you have.
Faction runs are complete jokes. You might get one or 2 in a week but you sure as **** aren't getting the help you need at all times. That's why WC exists. However, that's proving to be a waste of time anymore too.
I'm always able to get faction runs started for, just about anything really. Nirvana, TT, BH100, Delta.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"My understanding of women only goes as far as the pleasure. When it comes to the pain, I'm like any other bloke - I don't want to know."0 -
@LeiMei
I am not saying that will always work as it is highly dependant on how good and the edge the players have at that time.
Those combinations had more chances of failing but didnt because of some of the members knew how to get by the problem points.
1.) For that FC, we did not pull whole passage but instead used Thunderous Blast on each mob group. 4 lvl10 Thunderous blast is rather effective :P. For the big room, we asked the BM to try pull all the mobs and the archers gave their speed buff to the BM. 4 BoAs on the mobs did quick work of them even without stun or HF.
The archer who tanked had a charm and did most of the bosses from max range with BM HFing every now and then.
It wasnt perfect but hey we got the job done instead of spending hours looking for a barb.
2.) BM interrupted and sparked at the right time to avoid getting hit by the armour breaks. and I happened to have a genie with interrupt skills to help as well.
3.) 1 Herc veno and 2 venos with interrupt skills on their pets and hthe 4th helping in healing the herc and other veno pets when needed. My role was DDing and not stealing aggro. Cleric AoE healed everyone. Slow but got the job done.
4.) Blackhole can be stunned, knocked back, frozen, sealed, etc. So all the DDs rotated their immobilization and knockback skills instead of sparking and DDing
5.) It was a no brainer really. Cleric BBs, 1 archer lured, the rest was aggro ping pong :P. Pot when necessary.
While all of them had equal/more chances to fail, they didnt because of the strategy used. Also it wasnt because we wanted to try new stuff, more like we couldnt find anyone else needing to do the instance at that time :P.
The important point I was trying to make here was that, instead of wasting time looking for a particular class, try to see if you can do with the stuff with the people you have in your squad before giving up totally and not doing anything.
Its a game, give it a shot and see how it goes.0 -
Shasynn - Heavens Tear wrote: »It's quite annoying and fastidious wait HOURS and HOURS on central platform to search for Clerics and Barbs for ANY dungeon u whant to do.
I spent a lot of time waiting Clerics and Barb for BH, TT, FF and so on
I ASK U: It's a well balanced system of play when u need only 2 class to do anything????????
It's quite unuseful u introduce new class....Sorry....IT'S DANGEROUS!....These new classes will need Clerics and Barbs to do anyting too.
Why all the game and class skills are so unbalanced?
- The game: A lot of bosses and impossible mobs that u can kill only with the supports of Cleric and Tank
- The classes: A lot of unuseful classes (archers, sin, wiz, psy...and so on) that can't combact a boss without the support of a tanker and in particular of THE ONLY CLASS THAT CAN HEAL (Cleric).
Sorry for my speeking frankly but tihs is a main problem that more ppl feel in this game. I hope staff will read this and will work to improve the game.
Ty bye.
Well its quite of a reality check here... Who wants to be a outcasted class?
Barb's repair fees are making people repell and refrain from playing barbs... cleric's hardship of dealing with idiots/noobs and pingpong layers with no control of their aggro would be enough to **** any off (not to mention their costs in raising themselves too) and psys and wiz being casters; people nowadays care about APS, not casting
Like how the veno came out with their herc one season, and everyone wanted a veno in their squad, now its up until the APS season..
I've had a few buddies that went from barb to sin.. well, I guess in a better and positive thinking, its better that than them as barbs going to 5 APS build....... -_- One said "I'll start playing my barb again until i feel that I'm appreciated" lol
I really think PWI should take down or at least lower the repair fee for barbs.. that's the most painful part, along with the ping ponging... makes one feel fail when a barb has so many aggro skills and yet can't hold aggro when there's a sin or a BM or even an Archer around.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
@ Elviron, totally in agreement w/u on experimenting w/what works and what doesn't work instead of wasting so much time on LF a specific type of squad. The funnest BH squad I ever did was a squadful of clerics in 79 way back when we couldn't find a tank. b:victory No deaths and we all got our tank/DD fix 4 the day. lol
Going in w/out a "rainbow" squad just means learning the ins and outs of your class and using your skills to your advantage and the squad's advantage. This seems to be lacking lately in PWI imo.
As for myself, I will only squad w/people I know. Too many players go all whacky on runs, cause a squad wipe, and then decide to blame the tank and/or the cleric. b:shutup I stopped helping many random squads for this reason alone.0 -
i never had a problem with my Barb finding a squad..quite the opposite really. I didn't get a moments piece being requested to help tank this or that BH. You have to remember its a team effort running a BH unless you have a single uber hard player who just pummels everything in view...but thats just boring to watch.
Yes Barbs are used as buff machines but i was always on hand to grab back agro from the DD's when they got in trouble.....and to catch at the beginning of the pulls.Maybe your just unlucky with the groups you got i dont know.
Anyway BH's are an option you dont have to do them and hopefully when i do eventually come back to play on the game i would happly tank any BH as i found them fun..and it is a game after all........ and i would never ever try to do any run without a cleric in THE TEAM!!
Blue0 -
To be honest, I will squad with anyone and everyone just to experience different play styles and strategies, even if the run completely fails. Every failed run for me is an indication on how not to do things or what additional help is needed :P. Every successful weird squad run is an indication on the necessary factors needed to make such a run successful.
Limiting myself just to friends or faction limits my own gameplay and strategies to how those select people think and do stuff.
However the worst thing you can do is to blame/go all ballistic on someone for making a mistake. Everyone is a person and will make mistakes now and then and you need to treat them with as much respect as you would expect to be treated with.0 -
The point was that you tried Elviron, as much as anything b:victory
And if you guys are anything like my friends you had fun doing it, whether you failed or were successful.
Half the fun is trying new things and seeing if you can do things other people call impossible or too hard or whatever.0 -
Elviron - Dreamweaver wrote: »To be honest, I will squad with anyone and everyone just to experience different play styles and strategies, even if the run completely fails. Every failed run for me is an indication on how not to do things or what additional help is needed :P. Every successful weird squad run is an indication on the necessary factors needed to make such a run successful.
I AGREE WITH UUUUUU!!!
Reading some asnwers I understand why is so difficult form a squads...Because a lot of people want to play only with their frineds.
When I had to kill a boss I NEVER ask in my guild...I form a squad or join a new random squad.
In this way I know a lot of players. They could be asses or newbie, that's true, but sameone could be very expert. In both case I learn something.What's wrong and what's right.0 -
You never ask your guild for help? Don't you realize thats part of what being in a guild is all about. The higher levels in your guild are experienced compared to you and you SHOULD take full advantage of their experience any time you can. Rather then worry about knowing hundreds of players why not know maybe 30-40 people in your guild where you help them so they can turn around and help you? Knowing a lot of players doesn't exactly help anything i used to have a full friends list. Not anymore though because people were just using me for tanking purposes being i am built to tank and know how to hold agro. Good luck with the game.0
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b:chuckleb:laughb:victory
ah hah I found the trick to finding a sqaud really fast.
buy some chip packs.
find an NPC giving a way a BH quest or I, II & III if you are able.
then mount up and sit above it all, with Slogan for ur lvl# "looking for Squad" or "Looking for More" over your head.
then sit there in the sky rolling the packs into chips.
keep reading chat.
you will be surprised how many are not using world chat.
but the real trick is to want to get those 1000 Chip packs rolled and not even care if u get a group.
suddenly everyone wants you.
but if your a cleric thats kool too.
because when you BB it is faster to roll chip packs.
so drink one pot roll ten packs, drink one pot roll ten pack etc...0 -
This summer, prepare to believe...once more, all over again..."The barb and cleric show".[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Bodyguard for Secret Passage at your service, now accepting daily installments of just 2.5m for your leisure.0 -
What balance is there if there's no need for barbs or clerics?
What use will a barb be if anyone can tank?
What use will a cleric be if everyone can heal like them?
-.-[SIGPIC]Octavia is best pony[/SIGPIC]
Vicious's Brony. Brohoof!
youtube.com/user/SkaiPW - Assassin PvE/PvP Videos!0 -
I have to pee but my shift is only over in 10 minutes!
WHY?
Also, fail thread, it was discussed a few times before
Do I catch myself trolling? Oh wow. . .Feel free to PM me for help.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Mistress Myra forced me to use her sigpic ↑
With PWI since Dec 21st '08
pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=922912
youtube.com/user/kasPWI0 -
Eoria - Harshlands wrote: »Hint: Archers end up being better tanks than barbs at end-game. Seriously. Barbs just end up being buff monkeys and pullers.
Clerics still end up being needed though, but there's a higher percentage of them out there than there are barbs.
I lol'ed at this. Archers have never or never will steal aggro from my barb even if they have like 10+ level advantage.
If that is the case, then why are archers in general NOT tanking in FF? I do not mean the +6 or higher refines ones either, but even so, they still die quick? Obviously, in TT1-3, drummer hits a LVL91 BM I know for 8k DMG with a magic attack (physical marrow on I think and he had high APS and kept using demon spark, so he stole aggro, haven't payed attention about the marrow) , An archer are easily one shot to TT bosses. Even if they get 9k HP, they still can't tank even -10 (or 20 for that matter) lower leveled TT. I know on my archer I get hit for 5k from a boss in TT1-2 b:shocked . I think phys. attack less since my barb can tank there lower leveled (then again HA is it), I just have to cancel every single magic attack and I am fine. But archers tanking at endgame? Sure for certain bosses, but other than that, is a bad tactic. No blood paint, not much defenses.
Clerics I heard are "not needed" due to bloodpaint b:chuckle I know for a fact that 5APS BMs have an easier time just because clerics are reduced to "buff monkeys" most importantly BLOODPAINT and defenses. I have made 500k from a 5APS BM to help open TTs and he soloed most of them with ease.I, II and III spark is the most cheesiest skill in PWI and it should be removed or massively nerfed.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
@Yulk
Ive duoed FF with a 8x cleric with +3 equips and less than 6k hp, without using a charm or pots.
Ive tanked 1-3 with the same equips and cleric without barb buffs.
....ijs0 -
OP would love my guild. We've so many clerics we're the ones who have trouble finding squads :P Can't count them times I've been invited to DD on a bh or TT or Nirvy cause they already had 1 or 2 other clerics in squad.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks for the sig Ophida
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My main is a high level cleric, but I've refused to do any dungeon runs unless it was faction member. Reason : people expect merciful and all powerful Jesus instead of a cleric.
For each run I pay hours, repair coins, dozens of mp pods or even various powders to keep myself alive, lost experience points if not ALL of them, and every so often receive blames for all sorts of accidents - especially from the stupid ones they scream the loudest.
For each run I receive either nothing, or maybe some arrows, a cape, or a single hp pot from random distribution. Only twice did faction members thanked me with pods or coins. Only faction members ever remembered to turn back and help take aggro off me.
Dungeon runs are heavily unprofitable business, thus I don't participate unless have to.
As for needing healer to do things - pods, powders, and dumplings are your independence chips.[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]0 -
@Ted
So I can haz joo as me pocket cleric?0 -
Heck no!
Being a DD in those instance is too damn easy compared to actually having to cleric :P[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks for the sig Ophida0 -
Heals are still skills.Ubnext - Sanctuary wrote: »Clerics have a 25% gain of mana while healing group. this sucks because that is what the cleric is there for, but when the squad is in fight the cleric suffers the reduction loss as if it were fighting to. in actually we are healing.
Look. Cleric is supposed to be a support class, whose job is to heal. Your job is to heal, with what ever costs it comes. If you don't wanna be a support class/heal, then DON'T play cleric. YOU chose a class which is very mana consuming, you can't expect people to pay for it.the mana regen should be upgraded to at least 50% while in battle, because you guys don't supply me with mana pots, nor do you wait so I can meditate. so it is all out of pocket expense to me.
plus pay for my gear so I have MP recov +3+3+2+7 etc.
And as a side note, there are apoc poths that makes you mp regenerate by 50 and 100 for 10min. You can always use those. Also after lvl 75 you get to use Herb Yuanxiao that recover 5k mp over 10 sec, which are quite cheap.
see above.notice this gear is more expensive than HP recov gear. no one gives the cleric a break on anything. but you expect us to be there for you.
I've never had problems get into squad on my cleric.but when a Cleric wants a squad no one is the heck around to help with their bounty hunter.
I roll one chip stack, then yell BH51 roll then BH1 for 30 minutes. I have 1K plus vhips and still no one invite.
It doesn't make game balanced in ANY way.so yeah lets make it more balanced.
being it is the clerics whole purpose to be in the squad to heal the squad let the cleric not suffer from battle mode.
actually regen should be 100%. that would be balanced.
...And you would die 2k times instead of 1k =Pand how about make all armor MP when refining instead of HP.
if I had 9K mana at lvl 60 I could heal myself and everyone else adequately. I wouldn't need hp refinement
(except when I solo, ) but u could put that on my helmet*Semi retired*0 -
FatherTed - Dreamweaver wrote: »OP would love my guild. We've so many clerics we're the ones who have trouble finding squads :P Can't count them times I've been invited to DD on a bh or TT or Nirvy cause they already had 1 or 2 other clerics in squad.
DD? Hell we make Ted TANK everything!
Ted, come tank a full delta, I'll DD, we can get a psy to heal..... it'll be awesome b:laughAll the world's a game,
And all the men and women merely gamers:
They have their wipes and their rezzes;
And one man in his time plays many alts.0 -
Shasynn - Heavens Tear wrote: »An Exemplar little story
Two evening ago I tryed to form a squad for FF run
Immediately find other 3 ppl like me (sin, BM, psy)
So we started to search a cleric and a tanker.
Ask for 1 hour in chat...nothing....Other 3 squad were searching for clerics and tanks like us.
After about 1 hour and half, find cleric....so needed only a tank...what a lucky!...
So searching a tank...ask in chat...wait...minutes...hours...
The cleric, tired, left us...He joined a squad ready to go for a TT....
We were again without cleric and tank...4 ppl are waiting to play.
Finally finded a tank...a Barb that ask "only" 100 k to join us...Now needed only a cleric...wonderful!...
...But....No cleric free....
After 3 hours all togheter resign...3 hours spent unusefully for 4 ppl...
...I logoff and went to sleep.
Today morning the same...I'd wait asking for 1 hour to form a squad for BH 79...4 DD find immediately... but no cleric and no barb.
I resign...I had only 1,5 hours in lunch time to play.
...I logoff and back to work.
...This is a game for ppl who had a looooooooooooooooooot of time to wait!!!!
Hey, why dont u get a veno or a sin, they can solo it for.
its all about money and made in china
if they dont care about me why would i care about them
nothing will change the game is going to a quick end0 -
I accept your challenge, Thrash![SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Thanks for the sig Ophida0 -
Shasynn - Heavens Tear wrote: »It's quite annoying and fastidious wait HOURS and HOURS on central platform to search for Clerics and Barbs for ANY dungeon u whant to do.
I spent a lot of time waiting Clerics and Barb for BH, TT, FF and so on
I ASK U: It's a well balanced system of play when u need only 2 class to do anything????????
It's quite unuseful u introduce new class....Sorry....IT'S DANGEROUS!....These new classes will need Clerics and Barbs to do anyting too.
Why all the game and class skills are so unbalanced?
- The game: A lot of bosses and impossible mobs that u can kill only with the supports of Cleric and Tank
- The classes: A lot of unuseful classes (archers, sin, wiz, psy...and so on) that can't combact a boss without the support of a tanker and in particular of THE ONLY CLASS THAT CAN HEAL (Cleric).
Sorry for my speeking frankly but tihs is a main problem that more ppl feel in this game. I hope staff will read this and will work to improve the game.
Ty bye.
I will make it simple : I rarely do BH on my cleric with random squads for a few reasons :
1 : the amount of unrefined rank 8 bozos running around is ridiculous... I do not expect to have to res during the extremely tedious bosses of TT just because some guy in the squad gets one hit.
Solution : stop going with random squads and find a decent faction or make some friends.0 -
I did an FC squad on my wizzie that consisted of 1 cleric, 2 archers, 2 venos, and a wiz (myself).
And there was only one death in that squad--the tank, which was one of the archers.
That was one of the few times I've done an unconventional barb-less squad.
Inversely, I did a bh delta squad (100+ squad) where there were 2 sins, 2 clerics, 1 BM, and 1 psy. It didn't work, and ended up with all but 1 sin and and myself getting 1k'd. A few days after, I did a delta where the barb was 98, and has never done one before. We succeeded (and popped a virgin delta cherry in the process).
Or way back in the day...when Dreamweaver was a itty bitty server. And we had to kill what used to be Mantavip (he still is Mantavip in my book, dammit! **** that nightstalker/nightspike **** that they renamed him to). It took me three hours to get that quest done, and it wasn't because we couldn't find a barb and cleric. It was because we didn't think to make a magic class tank it first.
The point here is that unconventional squads work too. Trial and error may have to play a role here. I have played healer on my wiz when a cleric wasn't in squad. I have played tank a few times when a barb wasn't in squad.
With that being said, I leave you with this screenshot of an unconventional squad, which, despite what happened here, did succeed.
http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh145/idontgiveacluck/PWI/afkclericdeath.jpg[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Better known as Destini, also known as _Yvi.
ty Nowitsawn.
I dunno if I'm coming or going some days...b:shocked0 -
Boah stopp that QQing about such things and quit the game when you are basically not contented b:angry
Think about it:
1) Every game have classes how act as tanks and in every game you need a Cleric/Priest or whatever they are called and a Tank thats the normal way a MMORPG is build <.<
2) You cant find a Barb for for BH between 29 and 69?
Ask higher Lvl about Frost and Nirvana and how this done maybe you get an answer why nobody finds a Barb any longer for random squads and why people dont want to play a Barb any longer.
Its just no use to play them cause in the higher Lvl's you are not needed any longer so you sit on a 100+ char with no use -.-
3)Think about it:
What would happen to a MMORPG if anyone could do everything alone. Squads? Factions? Friends? Help? Why it isnt needed any longer O_o
If you want to do everything alone roll a 5aps Sin...I am from Germany and I am sorry if my English isn't very good b:surrender0
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