Im surprised...

LShattered - Heavens Tear

No one has ever tried this as their endgame build...not very good for TW, but pk it would be very good.

http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=3da7f71ed701eca5

instant cast mages would have to be the most broken thing ingame if anyone ever decided to make one. There is a cheaper option with beamhoof slicer but what the hell, this is just an example.

Only needs two pieces of -9 casting, both which all servers have...im pretty sure.

Ursa - Dreamweaver

search on youtube and you will see how broken it is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9o0FZf7xvwM

as you can see , after a certain point, there is no channel animation, not even cast one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQWUtAwt_tU&playnext=1&list=PL2A11CE7B5836714C&index=39

Stubbie - Heavens Tear

^^hehe that is my ksing gears for event but i dont really use it in pk coz i dont always get fully buffed and i would lose 30 att lvl from bonus set of r9 . Wen unbuffed and wear chan gears i got like 6k8 hp and 2k phydef lol .

Joshcja - Sanctuary

chan caps at 99% after that it gets bumped down to 90

instacast only exists on private servers where they use a early version of pwi that does nto have the nerf

demon wizz with 90%+ chan with quaff/spark would still be obscenly fun to play though

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver

and how do u know that nobody has it? XD
yesterday I saw a wiz with ~76 chan (not that gear, -6-6 oht sleeves and some belt/rings with -3-6 though)

i dont think it will be broken pve-wise (either single targer or aoe)

Ursa - Dreamweaver

chann wiz to the point of glitch is kinda' impractical in PWI.
Possible, but impractical even for decent cash shoppers.
Elem neck/belt will bring pdef to such low values it won't even be funny. Archers out-range you, sins cand pwn u from stealth, a TE shot from barb/BM in air can make you respawn and so on.
yeah, you will have some awesome dps...but at what cost? You need DPS for PvE - roll a -int class, will be cheaper than a 80+ channel wiz.
On private servers there is nothing better than insta-cast wizards. They just rule the PvP world plain and simple. But the G20 gear available on those servers and the shards give you enough HP and Pdef to survive.

HarmOwnie - Dreamweaver

@ThanosQRT:
i was in FC with that wiz he's lvl 100 and doing great. Of course he is demon so ~-70% chan + demon -chan skill bonus is awesome

So for a sage wiz im asking myself the question how much -chan should i get because as sage -chan is also important but while demon goes for higher DPS sage goes for the one big blow so normally crit and +magic and nowadays also +att lvl stones should be the thing to go for to cover the slower casting. The question is how many -chan can a sage wiz expect i mean normally i would use phys necklace + belt which both dont have chan modifiers and for the weapon beamhoof slicer and shiranbansho are vs rank 8 or nirvana swords which dont have a -chan modifier on it. I mean it would be still possible to add -6% chan stone but here is the question -chan or saphire sharding on the weapon? How many -chan should a sage wiz get and what would be the best items for boosting dmg

greetz harm0wnie

/Groovy/ - Harshlands

Joshcja - Sanctuary wrote: »

chan caps at 99% after that it gets bumped down to 90

instacast only exists on private servers where they use a early version of pwi that does nto have the nerf

Quoted for truth

LShattered - Heavens Tear

98/99% is proper instant cast, above 100% becomes slow again. Sure you would die quickly if you didn't cash shop a lot...but replace the games with g11 physical shards if you can afford them and you have a very nice amount of phys def.

The video Ursa posted is of a 97% wizzy, which still has animation for some skills.

The whole point of being an insta cast wizard is for killing your opponent before the seal/mountain press wears off.

If i had the money i would already have an insta cast wizard by now lol

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver

HarmOwnie - Dreamweaver wrote: »

@ThanosQRT:
i was in FC with that wiz he's lvl 100 and doing great. Of course he is demon so ~-70% chan + demon -chan skill bonus is awesome

So for a sage wiz im asking myself the question how much -chan should i get because as sage -chan is also important but while demon goes for higher DPS sage goes for the one big blow so normally crit and +magic and nowadays also +att lvl stones should be the thing to go for to cover the slower casting. The question is how many -chan can a sage wiz expect i mean normally i would use phys necklace + belt which both dont have chan modifiers and for the weapon beamhoof slicer and shiranbansho are vs rank 8 or nirvana swords which dont have a -chan modifier on it. I mean it would be still possible to add -6% chan stone but here is the question -chan or saphire sharding on the weapon? How many -chan should a sage wiz get and what would be the best items for boosting dmg

greetz harm0wnie

1)the -chan stones give -3% chan, pwicalc has an error
2)r9 sword has -10%chan, nirvana glaive can have a lot of -chan (raygan has -10% -6% i think; or -10% -3%, not sure)
3)r8 top, r8 ring = -12%, 99 sleeves + set bonus -9% add a lunar ring and u sit on -27%chan
4)with a lot of -chan a wiz could easily reach 3 sparks/min. still i dont think that it would be near the dps of a 5aps sin/bm

LShattered - Heavens Tear

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver wrote: »

1)the -chan stones give -3% chan, pwicalc has an error
2)r9 sword has -10%chan, nirvana glaive can have a lot of -chan (raygan has -10% -6% i think; or -10% -3%, not sure)
3)r8 top, r8 ring = -12%, 99 sleeves + set bonus -9% add a lunar ring and u sit on -27%chan
4)with a lot of -chan a wiz could easily reach 3 sparks/min. still i dont think that it would be near the dps of a 5aps sin/bm

It isn't even close to 5 aps in PvE, but it would be interesting to see how it would do against a sin in PWI.

Adroit - Lost City

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

It isn't even close to 5 aps in PvE, but it would be interesting to see how it would do against a sin in PWI.

What makes you think you'll have a chance at attacking a sin? lulz.

LShattered - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

What makes you think you'll have a chance at attacking a sin? lulz.

I wouldn't...since i would never get this far...ever. But what makes you think you wouldn't be able to?

Adroit - Lost City

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I wouldn't...since i would never get this far...ever. But what makes you think you wouldn't be able to?

My experience fighting good sins.

MageFizban - Lost City

Let's face it. In 1v1 pvp, sins get the jump on you. Personally, I'd think this build would be better in TW than in open world pvp. . .unless you plan on going out of sz, popping a detection pot, and rolling all the sins your level before they can react of course.

At least in a TW, you can stay back and spam the hell out of your skills without taking as much focus fire as in a 1v1 or small group pvp.

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I wouldn't...since i would never get this far...ever. But what makes you think you wouldn't be able to?

Good sin never let you hit him. You can trust adroit.

LShattered - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

My experience fighting good sins.

Absolute Domain>Spark>Seal>Faceroll keyboard?

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

you are dead>Absolute Domain>force stealth,returns during cd>Spark>Seal>Faceroll keyboard?

b:avoid

Adroit - Lost City

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Absolute Domain>Spark>Seal>Faceroll keyboard?

Pretending they didn't one shot you out of stealth, they'd basically need to go afk immediately after their first hit for this to work. Unfortunately, most sins don't make a habit out of ninja AFKing while visible. Nice try though.

LShattered - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

Pretending they didn't one shot you out of stealth, they'd basically need to go afk immediately after their first hit for this to work. Unfortunately, most sins don't make a habit out of ninja AFKing while visible. Nice try though.

If you get over 100% chan with demon spark and then switch so you only have 99%, then when you spark the animation doesn't show.

What makes you think a sin would 1 shot you if you have 10k phys defense? Unless they are like Accel on HT, have warsoul daggers, mad attack level I don't think most of the sins would. Besides, when they stealth again your seal timer would be running out and you could be getting chi again.

I think it might actually be quite viable against sins, then again I don't think you have ever played an instant cast character so you wouldn't know how OP they can be.

Most of the time they are supposed to be ninja's though. They kill you before the seal wears off then run off again and chi up.

Adroit - Lost City

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

If you get over 100% chan with demon spark and then switch so you only have 99%, then when you spark the animation doesn't show.

What makes you think a sin would 1 shot you if you have 10k phys defense? Unless they are like Accel on HT, have warsoul daggers, mad attack level I don't think most of the sins would. Besides, when they stealth again your seal timer would be running out and you could be getting chi again.

I think it might actually be quite viable against sins, then again I don't think you have ever played an instant cast character so you wouldn't know how OP they can be.

Most of the time they are supposed to be ninja's though. They kill you before the seal wears off then run off again and chi up.

Having insta cast would cost more than rank9 (you'd probably be rank9 anyway).. and rank9 sins will one shot you out of stealth.. easily. Especially because you'd be using mdef orns for the -channeling. Oh ya, almost forgot to mention they fixed insta cast with the raging tide's expansion if I remember right.. but that doesn't really matter because you'd never get a hit off anyway.

Identical one shot me at half damage (pdef charm) while I was full buffed (over 10k pdef) before rank9 came out. Identical double sparked in stealth (seen in buffs) frenzy, atk charm, chill, probably glitched power dash for crit (he did crit me) and then used tangling at basically the same instant as he headhunted me (I was recording when Identical did this.. and being that he tangling'd me I got his target for a split second before I died). I knew he was in cube so I used a pdef charm thinking it would save me.. but it obviously didn't.. not to mention he didn't zerk.. so I'd need to more than double my hp to stand a chance. But lets pretend that you somehow survive the first hit and move on.

We first need to agree that a sin has a fkn stupid stun lock. You can not tank a half decent sin for the duration of headhunt + occult + w.e else they use. There is no denying that. Your only option is for them to be stupid and let you do something.. or you use your genie. There are basically 3 genie skills that you can use to protect yourself: domain, faith (probably need to use an ironguard with this), or expel. Badge of courage will sometimes work.. but obviously you need something else to prevent a stun after (badge off headhunt stun and they can still occult you right after). Really it doesn't matter what you use.. they have the option of just going into stealth again and trying again a couple seconds later now that your genie is out of energy. There ain't diddly squat you can do to save yourself without genie energy. Now lets continue and pretend that by some miracle you get out of the stun (maybe headhunt misses? lulz.. one in a million) or perhaps the sin lags out and is unable to do anything after they hit you from stealth and you somehow survived.

Now your only option is to control the sin while you attack.. because standing there trying to out DD/tank one just isn't going to work. They will kill you every time if you just stand there trying to kill them before they kill you. So lets look at control skills. Your control skills only have a 33% chance to work against a sin with sage tidal protection. Yes.. that means even if you've already somehow survived the first hit, AND you somehow got out of their stun lock (lol sin has to be fkn braindead for that to happen).. you still haven't won. Sleep -> bypass doesn't work. Sleep has a 33% chance to work, and even if it does and their gear sucks so it could normally one shot them.. it will only tick their anti death.. (or you could then hope for another 1/3 chance for the MS stun to work.. gl). Seal works 33% of the time.. and even if you've hit miracle after miracle after miracle.. they still have their own genie skills to give them another chance (or possibly force stealth again).

A sin that knows what he/she is doing will DESTROY you. There is absolutely nothing that can be done against a good sin as a wizard.

LShattered - Heavens Tear

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

Having insta cast would cost more than rank9 (you'd probably be rank9 anyway).. and rank9 sins will one shot you out of stealth.. easily. Especially because you'd be using mdef orns for the -channeling. Oh ya, almost forgot to mention they fixed insta cast with the raging tide's expansion if I remember right.. but that doesn't really matter because you'd never get a hit off anyway.

Identical one shot me at half damage (pdef charm) while I was full buffed (over 10k pdef) before rank9 came out. Identical double sparked in stealth (seen in buffs) frenzy, atk charm, chill, probably glitched power dash for crit (he did crit me) and then used tangling at basically the same instant as he headhunted me (I was recording when Identical did this.. and being that he tangling'd me I got his target for a split second before I died). I knew he was in cube so I used a pdef charm thinking it would save me.. but it obviously didn't.. not to mention he didn't zerk.. so I'd need to more than double my hp to stand a chance. But lets pretend that you somehow survive the first hit and move on.

We first need to agree that a sin has a fkn stupid stun lock. You can not tank a half decent sin for the duration of headhunt + occult + w.e else they use. There is no denying that. Your only option is for them to be stupid and let you do something.. or you use your genie. There are basically 3 genie skills that you can use to protect yourself: domain, faith (probably need to use an ironguard with this), or expel. Badge of courage will sometimes work.. but obviously you need something else to prevent a stun after (badge off headhunt stun and they can still occult you right after). Really it doesn't matter what you use.. they have the option of just going into stealth again and trying again a couple seconds later now that your genie is out of energy. There ain't diddly squat you can do to save yourself without genie energy. Now lets continue and pretend that by some miracle you get out of the stun (maybe headhunt misses? lulz.. one in a million) or perhaps the sin lags out and is unable to do anything after they hit you from stealth and you somehow survived.

Now your only option is to control the sin while you attack.. because standing there trying to out DD/tank one just isn't going to work. They will kill you every time if you just stand there trying to kill them before they kill you. So lets look at control skills. Your control skills only have a 33% chance to work against a sin with sage tidal protection. Yes.. that means even if you've already somehow survived the first hit, AND you somehow got out of their stun lock (lol sin has to be fkn braindead for that to happen).. you still haven't won. Sleep -> bypass doesn't work. Sleep has a 33% chance to work, and even if it does and their gear sucks so it could normally one shot them.. it will only tick their anti death.. (or you could then hope for another 1/3 chance for the MS stun to work.. gl). Seal works 33% of the time.. and even if you've hit miracle after miracle after miracle.. they still have their own genie skills to give them another chance (or possibly force stealth again).

A sin that knows what he/she is doing will DESTROY you. There is absolutely nothing that can be done against a good sin as a wizard.

So why bother being a wizard?

I never heard of the fact that they fixed it in the TB expansion.

One difference to consider is that most of the sins on LC have got that crazy gear. Where as the sins that do pk on HT have ****-medium ok gear. So you would probably live past the first few hits.

Adroit - Lost City

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

So why bother being a wizard?

I never heard of the fact that they fixed it in the TB expansion.

One difference to consider is that most of the sins on LC have got that crazy gear. Where as the sins that do pk on HT have ****-medium ok gear. So you would probably live past the first few hits.

Not much point being a wizard or playing the game in general at this point. Thats why everyone has been complaining in this thread. I'm talking equally geared opponents.. just like saying killing lvl 30 sins isn't impressive, neither is killing one you outgear my hundreds of millions of coins.

The only thing we are still useful for is TW because of our ultis.

Amalliya - Sanctuary

Not quite understanding something here. When i count all the -chan on the gear u show it doesn't reach 98% or 99%, but only 79% ... Am I missing something? Ty

Gargorx - Raging Tide

bit off topic thingy really but, about that channeling.. i feel like our channeling gets slower when wiz uses sutra and cleric is in RB, or is it just me?

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Amalliya - Sanctuary wrote: »

Not quite understanding something here. When i count all the -chan on the gear u show it doesn't reach 98% or 99%, but only 79% ... Am I missing something? Ty

Yes you missing demon spark and demon Wellspring Quaff.

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver

Amalliya - Sanctuary wrote: »

Not quite understanding something here. When i count all the -chan on the gear u show it doesn't reach 98% or 99%, but only 79% ... Am I missing something? Ty

they talk about demon-sparked chan, so add 25% :b
or they talk about the demon -chan buff thingy (wellspring quaff?) that adds -20% chan

Gargorx - Raging Tide wrote: »

bit off topic thingy really but, about that channeling.. i feel like our channeling gets slower when wiz uses sutra and cleric is in RB, or is it just me?

RB has a -chan buff that is being "cast" constantly.
so it will overwrite tha -chan bonus from demon spark
i guess that happens to the sutra buff too.

Ursa - Dreamweaver

LShattered - Heavens Tear wrote: »

So why bother being a wizard?

I never heard of the fact that they fixed it in the TB expansion.

One difference to consider is that most of the sins on LC have got that crazy gear. Where as the sins that do pk on HT have ****-medium ok gear. So you would probably live past the first few hits.

you gotta be ... a bit slow... to say it politely. You have no idea of game mechanics, class skills and you think you know all cause your lvl 50 veno is awesome.
Well, reality check... NO.

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

Having insta cast would cost more than rank9 (you'd probably be rank9 anyway).. and rank9 sins will one shot you out of stealth.. easily.

Let us say your assassin has 600 dexterity and +12 rank 9 daggers, two rings each adding +100 physical damage, and two gems each adding 100 physical damage, using jones blessing, demon throatcut, demon dagger mastery and double sparked, and the assassin manages a crit and succeeds on the damage amp and has demon wolf emblem active and hits you for max damage.

That is 172796 damage.

Divide that by four for pvp
Divide that by 2 because of first hit triggering your damage reduction charm.

That is 21599.6 damage

Now let us say that you have 10k pdef and the assassin is level 105.

That is 6388.6 damage.

Edit: oops, I forgot frenzy, and sage barbarian buff, and 24 diamonds of tiger, and lets throw in another 5 attack levels just for fun (in case I overlooked something minor), and demon chill of the deep: that would be 9351.93 damage from stealth, but if you could get 15k pdef that would take it back down to 6916.53 damage.

Personally, I would think that "easily" means that we cannot assume that the assassin both gets max damage and procs on the 25% damage amp, but they do get maybe a 10% chance for "double damage" which I have not included here (because I am not sure how that stacks with everything else going on here), so lets give them everything else in our estimate of "easily".

Adroit - Lost City

Fleuri - Sanctuary wrote: »

Let us say your assassin has 600 dexterity and +12 rank 9 daggers, two rings each adding +100 physical damage, and two gems each adding 100 physical damage, using jones blessing, demon throatcut, demon dagger mastery and double sparked, and the assassin manages a crit and succeeds on the damage amp and has demon wolf emblem active and hits you for max damage.

That is 172796 damage.

Divide that by four for pvp
Divide that by 2 because of first hit triggering your damage reduction charm.

That is 21599.6 damage

Now let us say that you have 10k pdef and the assassin is level 105.

That is 6388.6 damage.

Edit: oops, I forgot frenzy, and sage barbarian buff, and 24 diamonds of tiger, and lets throw in another 5 attack levels just for fun (in case I overlooked something minor), and demon chill of the deep: that would be 9351.93 damage from stealth, but if you could get 15k pdef that would take it back down to 6916.53 damage.

Personally, I would think that "easily" means that we cannot assume that the assassin both gets max damage and procs on the 25% damage amp, but they do get maybe a 10% chance for "double damage" which I have not included here (because I am not sure how that stacks with everything else going on here), so lets give them everything else in our estimate of "easily".

I'm not going to do the math myself.. so I'll just trust you're accurate. I dunno about you, but I don't have pdef charms up 24/7, and without that its pretty safe to say hitting for 5digits is going to one shot you. If I were a sin and was having trouble with that, I'd probably use a genie skill with physical damage (like celestial sword?) at the same time as the atk to waste the pdef charm. Point is, its perfectly reasonable for a sin to rely on a crit (glitch powerdash) and get every debuff imaginable while in stealth.. and with a good weapon and not being a moron.. it's very likely they'd be able to one shot any robe user.

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Adroit - Lost City wrote: »

I'm not going to do the math myself.. so I'll just trust you're accurate. I dunno about you, but I don't have pdef charms up 24/7, and without that its pretty safe to say hitting for 5digits is going to one shot you. If I were a sin and was having trouble with that, I'd probably use a genie skill with physical damage (like celestial sword?) at the same time as the atk to waste the pdef charm. Point is, its perfectly reasonable for a sin to rely on a crit (glitch powerdash) and get every debuff imaginable while in stealth.. and with a good weapon and not being a moron.. it's very likely they'd be able to one shot any robe user.

If I was an end game pk wizard, I think I would have 50% physical damage reduction charms up most of the time.

And I do not know how celestial sword works (except I know its not 63382530011411470074835160268800 damage for a 100 strength genie), but if you used a guardian charm (do you have anything else to spend your dragon points on?), a two hit combo would only work if one of the hits would one shot you.

Or you could play on harshlands... Or you could be like me and play on a PvE server (which has been where my friends are).