Give us Barbs what we need to compete

Wolfenrix - Sanctuary

Barbs need skills that can compete with the power hungry high damage dealing.

give Barbs Attack level +1 every 5 levels

example:

Level 5 attack lvl +1
Level 10 attack lvl +2
Level 15 attack lvl +3
Level 20 attack lvl +4
Level 25 attack lvl +5
..........etc up to .............
Level 100 attack lvl +20

the sins and bms can tank and deal high damage, they have become arrogant and we barbs need to be able to do the job of tanking that we were intended to do but we cant if we cant deal enough damage to take, keep and hold agro.

Either we barbs get to deal more damage or bms and sins have to max at 3.0-maybe 3.5 atks per secs.

Actually, there is my 2 ideas

1) barbs get attack lvl +1 every 5 lvls
2) Bms, Sins, fist weapon users max out at 3.0-3.5 aps

.........or one other massive great idea

GIVE BARBS THEIR OWN HAIR DESIGNS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lenore - Harshlands

Why do you think barbs should be able to compete in damage against classes that are many times squishier than you? Don't you think that would make barbs too strong, if they can hit as hard as another class but have so much more survivability?

SgtSIaughter - Heavens Tear

Wolfenrix - Sanctuary wrote: »

Barbs need skills that can compete with the power hungry high damage dealing.

give Barbs Attack level +1 every 5 levels

example:

Level 5 attack lvl +1
Level 10 attack lvl +2
Level 15 attack lvl +3
Level 20 attack lvl +4
Level 25 attack lvl +5
..........etc up to .............
Level 100 attack lvl +20

the sins and bms can tank and deal high damage, they have become arrogant and we barbs need to be able to do the job of tanking that we were intended to do but we cant if we cant deal enough damage to take, keep and hold agro.

Either we barbs get to deal more damage or bms and sins have to max at 3.0-maybe 3.5 atks per secs.

Actually, there is my 2 ideas

1) barbs get attack lvl +1 every 5 lvls
2) Bms, Sins, fist weapon users max out at 3.0-3.5 aps

.........or one other massive great idea

GIVE BARBS THEIR OWN HAIR DESIGNS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If they did option 1 then they would have to remove barbs ability to use fist/claws or make the atk level axe/hammer only.

Quilue - Sanctuary

+20 extra attack level armas IJS

volst

Problem is, barbs can generate the same damage, most just don't do it and complain about it instead.

angellicdeity

Wolfenrix - Sanctuary wrote: »

Barbs need skills that can compete with the power hungry high damage dealing.

give Barbs Attack level +1 every 5 levels

example:

Level 5 attack lvl +1
Level 10 attack lvl +2
Level 15 attack lvl +3
Level 20 attack lvl +4
Level 25 attack lvl +5
..........etc up to .............
Level 100 attack lvl +20

the sins and bms can tank and deal high damage, they have become arrogant and we barbs need to be able to do the job of tanking that we were intended to do but we cant if we cant deal enough damage to take, keep and hold agro.

Either we barbs get to deal more damage or bms and sins have to max at 3.0-maybe 3.5 atks per secs.

Actually, there is my 2 ideas

1) barbs get attack lvl +1 every 5 lvls
2) Bms, Sins, fist weapon users max out at 3.0-3.5 aps

.........or one other massive great idea

GIVE BARBS THEIR OWN HAIR DESIGNS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

A) Barbs can get 5 aps too.....




Barbs are already one of the classes with the greatest survivability... They wouldn't add high damage either otherwise it would make other classes useless.



C) If you want 50 attack level get a warsoul.

buttercupcruella

Before a certain MOD comes here, I need to say that this thread should NOT be moved to the barb section. It concerns every class due to the barb being a vital part of the squad. (Yes, I still think so. b:cry)

On topic: other classes will always complain if barbs get more damage... However, with how it is now (fisting everywhereb:chuckle), it is other classes like sins and bms that are a bit OP, or at least, they make it less enjoyable for barbs to be barbs. There always was demand for babrbs, and rather poor supply. Now... people don't see the need to roll a barb (I base this on players' opinions). And for eff's sake, a claw barb??? WTH?!?!?

Soon, the barbarians will be an endangered specie! Wait..., we already are!

Yes, something should be done about it.
Yes, it was mentioned a lot of times.
...

So what now?

peacefulsilence

Sounds like the shoe is finally on the other foot.

For a long time people have grone sick of Barb arrogance. Refusing to put themselves out there for things like BHs until they were offered free wining ect. Now that other classes are starting to build more agressively barbs usefulness is being phased out.

But you know what? Instead of QQing and asking for attack grade? Why not invest some cash like all these DD's you're QQing about and increase the power of your weapon. Sick of seeing dd's with +5 weapons with good gems and barbs with +2 or lower and no gems. And no one seems to realize thats why agro is stolen so easilly. The barbs fail *** weapon.

Asside from that most barbs can't even preform basic mobbing putting the whole squad in jeopardy by putting the cleric at risk when healing an agroed barb whos only attacked one of the monsters.

You already have the tools to compete, stop asking for a free ride like always. b:angry

Longknife - Harshlands

While we're at it, Psychics are waaaay too squishy and we're better at holding aggro than barbs are. I say we get one defense level per 5 levels.

Quilue - Sanctuary

buttercupcruella wrote: »

Before a certain MOD comes here, I need to say that this thread should NOT be moved to the barb section. It concerns every class due to the barb being a vital part of the squad. (Yes, I still think so. b:cry)

On topic: other classes will always complain if barbs get more damage... However, with how it is now (fisting everywhereb:chuckle), it is other classes like sins and bms that are a bit OP, or at least, they make it less enjoyable for barbs to be barbs. There always was demand for babrbs, and rather poor supply. Now... people don't see the need to roll a barb (I base this on players' opinions). And for eff's sake, a claw barb??? WTH?!?!?

Soon, the barbarians will be an endangered specie! Wait..., we already are!

Yes, something should be done about it.
Yes, it was mentioned a lot of times.
...

So what now?

Now barbs are free to tag along and simply DD at some of the easier bosses, isn't that what they've always wanted? None of this "my repairs are so high" anymore, it's now the 5.0s taking the hits and shaving off weapon endurance with every jab they make with those fist/claw/daggers.

Besides, aren't barbs still necessary for buffs and to share aggro? I'm not going to pretend that barbs can hold aggro over a 5.0, but I will assert that barbs can get it back temporarily and take a hit periodically. On some of the harder WBs, that barb really makes a difference when it can spare you a hit before you can triple spark again. I think that still makes barbs important, always someone reliable to fall back on in any hard fight in PvE.

SashaGray - Heavens Tear

free everything for everyone i say, lets make everyone happy all at once. so everyone can feel happily OPd for the next 2 weeks until FW is released *with new and improved DQ price equivalents

Silest - Sanctuary

Lenore - Harshlands wrote: »

Why do you think barbs should be able to compete in damage against classes that are many times squishier than you? Don't you think that would make barbs too strong, if they can hit as hard as another class but have so much more survivability?

Well BMs that are stat'd for tanking still do high damage ~_~, and sins are just broken.

Olbaze - Sanctuary

Wolfenrix - Sanctuary wrote: »

Either we barbs get to deal more damage or bms and sins have to max at 3.0-maybe 3.5 atks per secs.

Tell you what. I got a level 92 Archer. My level 80 Assassin has just about the same DPS as my Archer. And my sin only has 1.54 APS and that's without sparking. So yeah, limiting them to some arbitrary amount won't do jack****, especially since sins can technically permaspark at like 2.86 aps or so.

And besides, barbs can also go with 5 APS. Just stay in human form and slap on some Deicides and you'll be having DPS comparable if not more than a 5 APS Archer, plus better defenses and more life. So stop QQing and evolve with the times.

SilverMinx - Lost City

I made a barb to be a good tanker. With the high dps BMs and Sins my barb is almost useless.

I don't think more damage is needed just better agro skills; for instance if a barb spams roar it should be guaranteed to get and hold agro for a set period of time (eg 15sec) no matter how much dam others are dealing. So if a barb is working to hold agro then he should if he is spamming the skills!

5.0 is way OP'd IMO, a 3.0-3.5 max is plenty deadly if a cap was ever to be implemented LOL

Gromskull - Harshlands

Barbs are not becoming useless. Try doing gv or fc without a barb. Ok maybe high 9X or 100's can do it. But still. All high lvl instances in 83% of times require a barb. Yes an improvement regarding fleshream would be nice so that other classes don't need to hold back on atacks. As far as pvp goes barbs have arma, thats all they ever had anyway

Saiyori - Dreamweaver

When a barb can have 30k hp having a high attack level would make them unkillable and way overpowered. The point of the barb is to take a hit, not deal one. If you want a meelee class that can hit well get a bm or a sin.

ThanosQRt - Dreamweaver

Longknife - Harshlands wrote: »

While we're at it, Psychics are waaaay too squishy and we're better at holding aggro than barbs are. I say we get one defense level per 5 levels.

b:dirty

Heartstone - Dreamweaver

attack lvl +20 wouldnt help against interval.

what they really need to do is an easy fix to flesh ream..

each time u cast flesh xxxx amount of hate is generated, 100 dmg may be xx hate.

i know this may sound insane but why not just make the hate value of flesh ream x1000, no1 would be able to still aggro while spamming flesh.
in no way is it overpowered, doesnt help pvp, as hate value isnt damage.

fix roar so it doesnt only reset hate value to 0. or leave it at 0, but make a lock so for the next 6 seconds mobs will only be on you.


one of the reasons i quitted barb is because its useless, lol. only tag along for buffing.

Miugre - Heavens Tear

You could just, y'know, ask your DDs to not be complete idiots and not go all-out, all the time.

I mean seriously. Am I the only one who remembers a time before event gear? People stole aggro back in those days too, but when it happened, it was the DD who was at fault and it was the DD's dumb self that died as a result. Now we have oracle/hyper noobs playing 5.0 sins and acting amazed when the barb can't hold aggro against their profoundly broken attack speed. Then, like clockwork, they die and they whine.

Flesh Ream wasn't designed to hold aggro against 5.0 characters. Flesh Ream was designed to hold aggro against normal DDing, and if they were to improve it, they'd only succeed in making it impossible for any non-5.0 DD to steal aggro. And that might sound like a good thing, but the fact is that DDs need to learn to practice damage moderation. End of story.

OP: If you're spamming ream to the best of your available chi, you're doing your job. Any DD who steals from you deserves to die.



On a side note... if they were to improve any aggro skill, they should improve the BM's Stream Strike which is at least 99% useless. I say make it comparable to the current Flesh Ream.

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

Pure vit barbs are useless for just about everything except for delta and cata pulling.


IJS, when you need to restat to use an entirely new weapon to tank, something is wrong.

Sounds like the shoe is finally on the other foot.

For a long time people have grone sick of Barb arrogance. Refusing to put themselves out there for things like BHs until they were offered free wining ect. Now that other classes are starting to build more agressively barbs usefulness is being phased out.

But you know what? Instead of QQing and asking for attack grade? Why not invest some cash like all these DD's you're QQing about and increase the power of your weapon. Sick of seeing dd's with +5 weapons with good gems and barbs with +2 or lower and no gems. And no one seems to realize thats why agro is stolen so easilly. The barbs fail *** weapon.

Asside from that most barbs can't even preform basic mobbing putting the whole squad in jeopardy by putting the cleric at risk when healing an agroed barb whos only attacked one of the monsters.

You already have the tools to compete, stop asking for a free ride like always.

That's funny because my weapon is better than most people my level.


It's also funny that you're going to be like "hurr durr you can't take this you need X amount of HP gtfo noob" for whatever instance, and expect your tank to have high refinements on his gear and good shards while most DDs have +2 gear with flawless and then complain because everything that can look at them kills them.

If you're a DD in delta, you're going to get aggro at some point or another, shut up and if you cant take a bit of damage then don't ever complain about a barbs wep.



And the whole "free wine" thing, that's YOUR fault, because you give in to them. You encourage them. I have never asked for free wines when doing bounty hunter. But if I see a world chat for "XXX instance needs a barb, free wines!" then I'm definitely going to take it over paying for it.

Longknife - Harshlands

Heartstone - Dreamweaver wrote: »

attack lvl +20 wouldnt help against interval.

what they really need to do is an easy fix to flesh ream..

each time u cast flesh xxxx amount of hate is generated, 100 dmg may be xx hate.

i know this may sound insane but why not just make the hate value of flesh ream x1000, no1 would be able to still aggro while spamming flesh.
in no way is it overpowered, doesnt help pvp, as hate value isnt damage.

fix roar so it doesnt only reset hate value to 0. or leave it at 0, but make a lock so for the next 6 seconds mobs will only be on you.


one of the reasons i quitted barb is because its useless, lol. only tag along for buffing.

No, someone named an absolutely GENIUS solution to the aggro problem.

Aggro isn't a problem until -interval classes start developing. Until then, only Psys and Archers regularly pull aggro (in my experience) and both are very capable of controlling their damage.

-Interval develops at 90+. So what do we do? Increase the extra effect on both Sage and Demon Flesh Ream so that they hold aggro FAAAAAR better. This wouldn't interfere with JACK. At that level, there's not much chance for an automatic aggro holder to be game-breaking in instances. There are few remaining quest bosses and a lot of the bosses you'd find yourself fighting at level 90+ have random aggro on them anyways.

Seriously, that simple change would fix everything without breaking squat.

Redmenace - Heavens Tear

volst wrote: »

Problem is, barbs can generate the same damage, most just don't do it and complain about it instead.

QFT.

+1 Internets

RedMenace

\demon FTW
\\link

Redmenace - Heavens Tear

SilverMinx - Lost City wrote: »

I made a barb to be a good tanker. With the high dps BMs and Sins my barb is almost useless.

I don't think more damage is needed just better agro skills; for instance if a barb spams roar it should be guaranteed to get and hold agro for a set period of time (eg 15sec) no matter how much dam others are dealing. So if a barb is working to hold agro then he should if he is spamming the skills!

5.0 is way OP'd IMO, a 3.0-3.5 max is plenty deadly if a cap was ever to be implemented LOL

If you're spamming Roar, you're *already* doing it wrong.

Roar resets aggro to 1, FleshReam stacks aggro.

Just crank up FleshReam's aggro, and you'll make a big difference in barb's aggro-holding abilities.

'Just sayin....

RedMenace

\reserved for further irritating statements

buttercupcruella

It's turning out to be another aggro skill thread...

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote: »

Now barbs are free to tag along and simply DD at some of the easier bosses, isn't that what they've always wanted? None of this "my repairs are so high" anymore, it's now the 5.0s taking the hits and shaving off weapon endurance with every jab they make with those fist/claw/daggers.

Besides, aren't barbs still necessary for buffs and to share aggro? I'm not going to pretend that barbs can hold aggro over a 5.0, but I will assert that barbs can get it back temporarily and take a hit periodically. On some of the harder WBs, that barb really makes a difference when it can spare you a hit before you can triple spark again. I think that still makes barbs important, always someone reliable to fall back on in any hard fight in PvE.

I'm glad you still feel the need for barbs. Yes, there are some places in game where barbs are waaay better than any other class (for certain purposes, ofc), but there are a lot of cases when they are not. It is sad, because barbs were made for being awesome.b:victory

You say they are invited to come along... That kinda makes barbs feel useless, if they came from the era where they needed to take care of the boss aggro, maintain the whole squad, etc. Necessary for buffing? Heh, squad leader invites barb, barb buffs, insta kick, inv sin/bm/w/e...

Some1 else in this thread mentioned no more repair bill QQ. Yea.... There are so many better solutions to that then... reducing the size of the stage for the barbs.

Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »

You could just, y'know, ask your DDs to not be complete idiots and not go all-out, all the time.

I mean seriously. Am I the only one who remembers a time before event gear? People stole aggro back in those days too, but when it happened, it was the DD who was at fault and it was the DD's dumb self that died as a result. Now we have oracle/hyper noobs playing 5.0 sins and acting amazed when the barb can't hold aggro against their profoundly broken attack speed. Then, like clockwork, they die and they whine.

Flesh Ream wasn't designed to hold aggro against 5.0 characters. Flesh Ream was designed to hold aggro against normal DDing, and if they were to improve it, they'd only succeed in making it impossible for any non-5.0 DD to steal aggro. And that might sound like a good thing, but the fact is that DDs need to learn to practice damage moderation. End of story.

OP: If you're spamming ream to the best of your available chi, you're doing your job. Any DD who steals from you deserves to die.



On a side note... if they were to improve any aggro skill, they should improve the BM's Stream Strike which is at least 99% useless. I say make it comparable to the current Flesh Ream.

Very good deduction and all.
/inbeforeddswhoqqtheycantgoallout

SilverMinx - Lost City

Redmenace - Heavens Tear wrote: »

If you're spamming Roar, you're *already* doing it wrong.

Roar resets aggro to 1, FleshReam stacks aggro.

Just crank up FleshReam's aggro, and you'll make a big difference in barb's aggro-holding abilities.

'Just sayin....

RedMenace

\reserved for further irritating statements

Oh, right, my bad - experienced a brain **** LOL
It was just an example anyway, I meant for any of the agro getting and holding skills need to ramped up for barbs to be barbs.

I used to love my barb, now don't play it much cause he basically only a buffer, sad commentary

Asterelle - Sanctuary_1381265973

Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »

You could just, y'know, ask your DDs to not be complete idiots and not go all-out, all the time.

I mean seriously. Am I the only one who remembers a time before event gear? People stole aggro back in those days too, but when it happened, it was the DD who was at fault and it was the DD's dumb self that died as a result. Now we have oracle/hyper noobs playing 5.0 sins and acting amazed when the barb can't hold aggro against their profoundly broken attack speed. Then, like clockwork, they die and they whine.

Flesh Ream wasn't designed to hold aggro against 5.0 characters. Flesh Ream was designed to hold aggro against normal DDing, and if they were to improve it, they'd only succeed in making it impossible for any non-5.0 DD to steal aggro. And that might sound like a good thing, but the fact is that DDs need to learn to practice damage moderation. End of story.

OP: If you're spamming ream to the best of your available chi, you're doing your job. Any DD who steals from you deserves to die.



On a side note... if they were to improve any aggro skill, they should improve the BM's Stream Strike which is at least 99% useless. I say make it comparable to the current Flesh Ream.

DD's arent the ones complaining about aggro for the most part. It's the barbs. Most DDs capable of 5.0 have good enough gear to tank, even archers and sins.

SteelStar - Heavens Tear

This is a nice thread, just a reminder to all that have main high lvl barbs on dumb we were for deciding to roll a barb and how much money we wasted on a pretty much useless class. Yay I have a thousand dollar buff machine. Go ME!

Rawrgh - Raging Tide

I still do good with my barb, and I still tank a lot.


But I do it with lunar claws and -interval gears, only time I use axes and true form to tank is delta.


Barbs need to crank up aggro skills, the old idea of barbs being pure vit and tanking in true form is outdated.


Other than cata pulling, pure vit is an outdated build. And, also other than cata pulling, sage is an outdated cultivation path.

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear

Wolfenrix - Sanctuary wrote: »

Barbs need skills that can compete with the power hungry high damage dealing.

give Barbs Attack level +1 every 5 levels

example:

Level 5 attack lvl +1
Level 10 attack lvl +2
Level 15 attack lvl +3
Level 20 attack lvl +4
Level 25 attack lvl +5
..........etc up to .............
Level 100 attack lvl +20

the sins and bms can tank and deal high damage, they have become arrogant and we barbs need to be able to do the job of tanking that we were intended to do but we cant if we cant deal enough damage to take, keep and hold agro.

Either we barbs get to deal more damage or bms and sins have to max at 3.0-maybe 3.5 atks per secs.

Actually, there is my 2 ideas

1) barbs get attack lvl +1 every 5 lvls
2) Bms, Sins, fist weapon users max out at 3.0-3.5 aps

.........or one other massive great idea

GIVE BARBS THEIR OWN HAIR DESIGNS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So... you want the damage to compete with my arch/sin. Then I guess its only fair that I have the hp to compete with you. lets see... end game barb can easily have over 30k hp. I guess that means my arch/sin need to get about 200 hp per level to even come close to that.

EbonyBlood - Heavens Tear

I know I'm a low level BM, but I can steal aggro as often as necessary from barbs up to level 79. The key phrase is 'as necessary'. Necessary would be when the uber weak cleric sets up BB at Glut to keep the barb alive. Spark and Cyclone Heel is all I need. The difference between a squishy DD tanking and a barb tanking is knowing how to use your stuff. Skills and gear.

Omg, I stole aggro on Nob. *dies* Wtf happened?

Might have been the the extra damage on those rings? The blessing? The tome? You might even have a better weapon there. Who knows? Figure it out. To keep from taking aggro, I sit down for 15 seconds, use HF, and don't use Cyclone Heel more than once in an HF Cycle. If I am in the party to DD, I DD. I don't disrespect the tank by making them look bad. I just do my job and help as needed.

On a side note, if I see someone trying to steal aggro, I time my HF to their sparks to see if they can just die for me. It's usually quite amusing.

Fritigern - Lost City

It's getting more annoying now with more sins especially getting up to 9x-10x now.
Barb's IMO have a pretty sparse skill set to begin with.
PVP wise it's ridiculous. With a sin perma-sparking with stun stun stun! b:cry

"just use claws"? LMAO
So we all just use claws and fists now?
Restat my barb so I can use fists/claws and sacrifice VIT to do it I suppose?

A lot of classes need skill revamps.
But I'm not holding my breath. We all know well by now that PWI won't do jack about it.
(Barb agro stone?) b:puzzled 5 gold from the cashshop. One time use. Lasts 20 seconds.

b:bye