Fist Archers

Quilue - Sanctuary

Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »

There's no universal definition of "useful" and "useless" - they're, by nature, opinionated terms. What's useful to me isn't necessarily useful to you, and vice versa.

And even if there were a universal definition of "useful," what if one simply cares about having fun in other ways? Is being "useful" the only way to have fun? Or is fun not the point of video games anymore? :P


1. Okay, I can stand corrected on the reset notes. But in general... before the whole fist craze, wasn't it popular to be full-dex? I distinctly remember someone (I think Devoted) ranting on and on about how you were a fail archer if you were able to equip Helm of Aqua Viciousness before 105. Wouldn't full-dex logic dictate that, if you had all those gears, you'd just keep your base str 31 points lower than necessary to equip your armor (level +4) so that you could channel all possible points into dex?

2. Are we really going to start using Warsouls in our strategies now? Just because one crazy person got one? XD

EDIT: Ah, you probably meant warsoul helm didn't ya. Okay nvm that then. XD But I still wonder about where the full-dex fad went. Does the whole archer board have fad amnesia?

It was popular to be full dex back then because lunar cape, scroll of tome, lunar/frost weapons and funny **** like buying rep wasn't so available.

Killahoe - Harshlands

1. Okay, I can stand corrected on the reset notes. But in general... before the whole fist craze, wasn't it popular to be full-dex? I distinctly remember someone (I think Devoted) ranting on and on about how you were a fail archer if you were able to equip Helm of Aqua Viciousness before 105. Wouldn't full-dex logic dictate that, if you had all those gears, you'd just keep your base str 31 points lower than necessary to equip your armor (level +4) so that you could channel all possible points into dex?

I think you missed the point, you equip different gear when you use the claws.

When i have nirvana helm and leggings i will go for 104 base str and sell the warsoul helm. Maybe even 107 str so i can use my lvl 70 mold claws from time to time b:victory

Killahoe - Harshlands

oops double post

Egaenil - Heavens Tear

b:chuckle and just so you know, you dont miss inside niv, it is 100% hit rate.. so you dont REALLY need lunar ring for the 50% accuracy etc etc, yea I know the 3% cri is nice, but not a great deal.

Another point.. restat costing you 3 gold.. just 3 gold... Im sure you can afford 3 gold, thats like 1.2mil

Miugre - Heavens Tear

Killahoe - Harshlands wrote: »

I think you missed the point, you equip different gear when you use the claws.

When i have nirvana helm and leggings i will go for 104 base str and sell the warsoul helm. Maybe even 107 str so i can use my lvl 70 mold claws from time to time b:victory

So for you in particular, it really is a temporary thing? "Yeah I'd like Nirvana gear, but I want to get it fast, so I'll act like a melee class for awhile because they farm faster?"

So what, exactly, is stopping you from just keeping your FF/Lunar claw (assuming you have one) as your DDing method even after you've acquired the Nirvana gear you want? Would you deliberately "gimp" yourself afterward because you've obtained what you wanted? Somehow I wouldn't expect many "pro" players to do such a thing.

Quilue - Sanctuary wrote:

It was popular to be full dex back then because lunar cape, scroll of tome, lunar/frost weapons and funny **** like buying rep wasn't so available.

Ah, so your angle is "blame the event gear." Well, that's one more thing I can hate Gamble Packs for, then. >_>

I mean, full dex at least made sense from a class standpoint. Before event gear (if we are to blame event gear for everything) it was "pro" to be full dex. Now it's "pro" to ignore the actual name of your class and just pretend you're a BM because you do more damage that way. And then drop all that later once you've farmed the gear you want... allegedly. That still doesn't sound like something any "pro" would do, to me.

truekossy

Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Ah, so your angle is "blame the event gear." Well, that's one more thing I can hate Gamble Packs for, then. >_>

I mean, full dex at least made sense from a class standpoint. Before event gear (if we are to blame event gear for everything) it was "pro" to be full dex. Now it's "pro" to ignore the actual name of your class and just pretend you're a BM because you do more damage that way. And then drop all that later once you've farmed the gear you want... allegedly. That still doesn't sound like something any "pro" would do, to me.

Except that most don't drop it and will, at the very least, keep them for PvE purposes.

Also you have to consider that before event gear, not even actual BMs looked favorably upon fists, as they were considered to be mostly useless and a waste of time to bother with. Then event gear came along and made obtaining the intervals for fists to be useful easy. Plus there's the fact that now pretty much everyone who has fists can easily refine to +6 or higher and toss in high level garnets. Beforehand, someone with a +3 set of gears and G7 shards was considered amazing, and people running around with G8s and +5 stuff were godly. Yet now, that's not even considered as a threat in PK/TW... which sucks for you if you don't have a bow that can purge or that has a high refine to greatly boost your damage. So, in the end, all that's happening by embracing fists is that you become able to keep up with the changing times.

Miugre - Heavens Tear

truekossy wrote: »

Except that most don't drop it and will, at the very least, keep them for PvE purposes.

That's what I'm saying! At least 3 times in this thread I've heard "well, people only use them to farm better / Nirvana gear", etc... implying that they'd drop serious fist usage once they obtain said gear. So you agree with me that that isn't something a "pro" would do?

truekossy wrote: »

Also you have to consider that before event gear, not even actual BMs looked favorably upon fists, as they were considered to be mostly useless and a waste of time to bother with. Then event gear came along and made obtaining the intervals for fists to be useful easy. Plus there's the fact that now pretty much everyone who has fists can easily refine to +6 or higher and toss in high level garnets. Beforehand, someone with a +3 set of gears and G7 shards was considered amazing, and people running around with G8s and +5 stuff were godly. Yet now, that's not even considered as a threat in PK/TW... which sucks for you if you don't have a bow that can purge or that has a high refine to greatly boost your damage. So, in the end, all that's happening by embracing fists is that you become able to keep up with the changing times.

And given all that sad stuff you just mentioned, would it be that strange to not want to "keep up with the times?" To seek fun elsewhere?

Interesting that you mentioned fist BMs, though. I picked up fists on my BM around lv58, which might have been around the time of the first Gamble Packs. Then suddenly fists were popular. XD I didn't really think anything of it at the time; the reasons I picked up fists on my BM were (a) they were better DPS even without -int gear, (b) shadowless kick, and (c) at the time, no one seemed to be using them. Hell, there were BM guides at the time which wrote the fist build off as noobish.

And now, most gear you would need to be considered "decent" involves directly influencing PWE's bottom line by supporting the Gamble Packs. -_-

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide

I knew I should've stuck with magic classes . b:surrender

Miugre - Heavens Tear

TheMagicPimp - Raging Tide wrote: »

I knew I should've stuck with magic classes . b:surrender

brb, making a fist wizard ;]

Brigid - Harshlands

Miugre - Heavens Tear wrote: »

brb, making a fist wizard ;]

Fist wizards have nothing on foxform fist venos. Just saying.