What's with the reliance on charms?

Michael - Harshlands

Barbarians shouldnt need charms for 3-3 or 2-3, I have been tanking both modes for quite a while as a BM unlike most barbs mine makes me tank all 9 bosses as he cant hold aggro from me and we would both take too much damage if the cleric had to keep switching targets so he is just buffs me and debuffs the boss with devour as much as possible. Even when the cleric is slept I dont die to the bosses there and I dont even have turtle so a barb with higher HP should have no isses. I actually hate running instances charmed as it wastes my charm even though I know I wouldnt die without it but sometimes I have left over charm from pvp or TW and I am not going to refuse to run 3-3 just because im charmed ill take the burn and make some coins to buy a new one later.

2 clerics is a waste of 1 DD slot in your squad the only time you should need two clerics is if you have low HP eps for 2-3 (sub 9x eps with under 7k buffed hp) and do belial a single cleric can easily heal the damage the boss deals they just need to have decent gears to tank the damage he dishes out on the random aggro.

Work as a team when your in the instance watch each others hp and use appropriate skills for the situation, when I was 90 I was tanking 2-3 forshura with no issues if I took a little too much damage and my hp started to dip too low the barb would bite once to give me time to regen using pots or just from the BB the same was true when I was a lower level whenever his hp got low I would myriad sword stance to give him time to recover hp.

Joshcja - Sanctuary

Michael - Harshlands wrote: »

Barbarians shouldnt need charms for 3-3 or 2-3, I have been tanking both modes for quite a while as a BM unlike most barbs mine makes me tank all 9 bosses as he cant hold aggro from me and we would both take too much damage if the cleric had to keep switching targets so he is just buffs me and debuffs the boss with devour as much as possible. Even when the cleric is slept I dont die to the bosses there and I dont even have turtle so a barb with higher HP should have no isses. I actually hate running instances charmed as it wastes my charm even though I know I wouldnt die without it but sometimes I have left over charm from pvp or TW and I am not going to refuse to run 3-3 just because im charmed ill take the burn and make some coins to buy a new one later.

2 clerics is a waste of 1 DD slot in your squad the only time you should need two clerics is if you have low HP eps for 2-3 (sub 9x eps with under 7k buffed hp) and do belial a single cleric can easily heal the damage the boss deals they just need to have decent gears to tank the damage he dishes out on the random aggro.

Work as a team when your in the instance watch each others hp and use appropriate skills for the situation, when I was 90 I was tanking 2-3 forshura with no issues if I took a little too much damage and my hp started to dip too low the barb would bite once to give me time to regen using pots or just from the BB the same was true when I was a lower level whenever his hp got low I would myriad sword stance to give him time to recover hp.

only spot a 2nd clerics is worth it is 2-3 doing AE but since most people skip him ...meh

otherwise 1 cleric 1 wizzie/psy is all the healing you need and will not waste the DD spot

with BB and wizzie heals i can tank 2-2 wur at 79 w/o barb buff

srsly if you need a charm to tank all but the hardest bosses with a decent squad as a bm/barb slap yourself and learn your class

CrystalPax - Raging Tide

Its interesting that you say the barb wasn't getting the BB heal. I ran with a squad that had a glitch on soulbanisher 1-2. We ran 1-2 once and all but 3 died on soubanisher (i died myself) but the remaining squad finished the fight then we finished the run ok.
So we do a 2nd run, this time in the last quarter of soulbanisher for some reason BB stops ticking on everybody although it is clearly still up and we all even have the blue ring. Long story short we all wipe and are clueless as to why. His aoe was not going that fast, the random aggro was under control, the BB was up but just stopped working no one was being healed and this did not happen on the other run, so wtf.

Anyways back to this topic, I don't think there was any glitch here I think you might just have a case of fail Barb. My 64 barb has tanked 1-1 several times and it sounds to me like your barb was not healing himself properly while under the BB. Also a good barb can gradually conserve enough chi for an invoke every now and then to sustain himself and buy some healing time. Also watch to see if during the first half of the fight (before aoe starts) that the barb cancels drum's magic attack, its a bad sign if he doesn't.

niajade

One of the main reasons they are saying this, is many do not do a 'kill all mobs' in TT. Instead, they have the Barbarian go tiger form, and run past the mobs, aggro them, and lead the mobs away so the rest of the party can get through portals/doors/etc. In these instances you cannot have the cleric follow you to heal or they will die.

Also, no matter how good a cleric is, these charms are vital for tankers. The aoes can hit so hard, the cleric cannot possibly be depended upon 100% to keep you alive. They need time also to purify you against curses, etc.

Once you begin TT 3's and higher FBs you will see that a charm is required for Barbarians and Clerics. There is just no way around this fact.

TigerLily - Lost City

I never use charm on my barb, he is lvl 94 atm with average gear. I tank 2-3/3-2/3-3/Frost and Lunar without hp-charm.

Only boss i need 2 clerics for is Armageddon in 3-3. Blue Bubble is enough for Wulord/Ape in 2-3 or just 1 cleric spamming Iron Heart.

Its not hard to stay alive as barb when you have Invoke, ToP, event pots, Solid shield, 10% defense from blessing and can cancel attacks.

You dont need charm at all as a tank in pve anymore beside maybe wave 9 in Delta. Any other instance is a waste of coins. Really only nervous/unexperienced new players that thinks a barb needs a charm.

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear

niajade wrote: »

One of the main reasons they are saying this, is many do not do a 'kill all mobs' in TT. Instead, they have the Barbarian go tiger form, and run past the mobs, aggro them, and lead the mobs away so the rest of the party can get through portals/doors/etc. In these instances you cannot have the cleric follow you to heal or they will die.

Also, no matter how good a cleric is, these charms are vital for tankers. The aoes can hit so hard, the cleric cannot possibly be depended upon 100% to keep you alive. They need time also to purify you against curses, etc.

Once you begin TT 3's and higher FBs you will see that a charm is required for Barbarians and Clerics. There is just no way around this fact.

If you are talking about 3-3 and 3-2... you don't even need a barb to do that. I can do it uncharmed and unbarb buffed. Must have some pathetic barb if he NEED to be charmed.

G_ree_n - Sanctuary

I wouldn't "expect" anyone to have a charm for anything, ever. Yeah, they are nice for "harder" bosses, but I sure as hell wouldn't claim to be a "pro" cleric and then drop group because the tank doesn't have a cheat button for me.

I thank everyone who has money to waste on this game, but I'd never expect anyone to do so ... or waste their hard earned gold on them either. My problem with charms is that too many people think having one makes them invincible, so when they get into a group, they don't work as a team.

I've seen far too many groups fail simply because people don't know the value of teamwork. While this is true for every game I've played, it's far worse in this one.

Amarante - Raging Tide

Charmless barbs who don't die are legit b:laugh

HimiInuOni - Dreamweaver

xD im a lvl 94 barb myself and i can tank a dam 3-3 with no charm and 1 cleric!!! if u need a charm for HH yes you are a fail barb, or the cleric is a huge fail, cuz cmon i can solo a 2-1 with no cleric and no charm just ToP and crab meat. so man that must be 1 fail cleric, or your server is just messed up, i can tank any boss in game *i dont know about harpy wraith* with no charm this included 90% of the world boss's the only ones i havent tanked are harpy wraith and dipter, and im a Demon barb

HimiInuOni - Dreamweaver

niajade wrote: »

One of the main reasons they are saying this, is many do not do a 'kill all mobs' in TT. Instead, they have the Barbarian go tiger form, and run past the mobs, aggro them, and lead the mobs away so the rest of the party can get through portals/doors/etc. In these instances you cannot have the cleric follow you to heal or they will die.

Also, no matter how good a cleric is, these charms are vital for tankers. The aoes can hit so hard, the cleric cannot possibly be depended upon 100% to keep you alive. They need time also to purify you against curses, etc.

Once you begin TT 3's and higher FBs you will see that a charm is required for Barbarians and Clerics. There is just no way around this fact.

as to you BUB, i dont need a charm for any thing except a full Delta, if you need a charmed barb for any thing *except a delta or gamma or nirvana* u have a fail barb or a fail cleric

niajade

HimiInuOni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

as to you BUB, i dont need a charm for any thing except a full Delta, if you need a charmed barb for any thing *except a delta or gamma* u have a fail barb or a fail cleric

I am a girl, not a BUB.

I am not sure what a 'delta or a gamma' is - I come from a different version (PW-MY). but for example, the boss General Wurlord, now he is in TT and is usually tanked by a Barb, and his aoe is pretty painful - he hits: Phy - about 14k and Mag - about 17k.

Once you kill the real one, you need to lure the others away from the portal, so they can squeeze in w/o death. You generally do that w/o a cleric following you around.

Then the TT with the balls, usually the barb goes ahead and there are mobs that hit hard and greet him along the way. Same with the mobs later if they want to do a run through to the end.

These are not extremely difficult TT's, since all but Wurlord my Veno (on other version - a level 101) could tank/kill everything in this TT but him solo. (could kill in solo mode).

Then you still have Wang the Jock, just getting to him would require the Barb to be charmed. Front City (not sure if its name here but for us its Frost Walk) and then for the last two fairies you still need GV (Godless Valley) (not sure of name for pwi). IF you even say your uncharmed, they will kick you from party.

Then catas - I am pretty sure when you do TW, they will require all cata pullers to have a charm. And even not being charmed in FB69 (last two bosses) will be really severe on your clerics.

See in my opinion? Tankers being uncharmed means the clerics got to work much harder to heal the tanker, purify the tanker and do party heal when necessary. Meaning they probably need a charm to try to keep their MP full..

TCHP - Lost City

hahahahahaha Not having a charm does not make you fail. But don't expect 1 cleric vs wurlord not asking you to pot a few time or use a genie skill. It all depend on your equipement and your cleric skill. Frankly, that cleric was fail calling him a pro and not having faith in your HP bar.

Anzillu - Raging Tide

the only charm i feel is worth actually using is an MP charm. HP is good if your a tank and the cleric sucks (been there MANY times). on my WB in PW-MY, my heiro ticks all the time, if i didn't have it i'd die because the cleric can't seem to understand what heal spells to use and when, as well as she constantly uses blueball when its not needed or just worsens the situation

Jalice - Raging Tide

The only dungeon that I ve done up to now where I expect some classes to be charmed is gamma and delta. If your not charmed there chance are really high that someone gets 1k and it ends the dungeon since you cant get much further with 1 lacking.

If anyone asks the tank to be charmed for tt I just lol at it and leave the squad, because then the healer needs to learn to heal. I have not tried nirvana/squad lunar or warsong so I cannot speak for those.

Xoria - Sanctuary

I would agree with the others saying that those squad members were 'fail' in not trusting in your abilities and chose to abandon the trip. I've kept many a barb alive, no charm, 12k- ish HP on Wurlord, alone and without him using pots. If that cleric really was "pro," I'm sure he or she could do this as well. This goes for AE as well. Even in TT3-x, I wouldn't say you'd need a charm. Only Rebirth gamma and delta.

Lady_of_rage - Lost City

Lightaine - Dreamweaver wrote: »

You are fail barb for calling it HH, that is all.

um...not, on some servers it is called HH, on others, TT,
Duh, you're fail for not knowingb:bye

HimiInuOni - Dreamweaver

niajade wrote: »

I am a girl, not a BUB.

I am not sure what a 'delta or a gamma' is - I come from a different version (PW-MY). but for example, the boss General Wurlord, now he is in TT and is usually tanked by a Barb, and his aoe is pretty painful - he hits: Phy - about 14k and Mag - about 17k.

Once you kill the real one, you need to lure the others away from the portal, so they can squeeze in w/o death. You generally do that w/o a cleric following you around.

Then the TT with the balls, usually the barb goes ahead and there are mobs that hit hard and greet him along the way. Same with the mobs later if they want to do a run through to the end.

These are not extremely difficult TT's, since all but Wurlord my Veno (on other version - a level 101) could tank/kill everything in this TT but him solo. (could kill in solo mode).

Then you still have Wang the Jock, just getting to him would require the Barb to be charmed. Front City (not sure if its name here but for us its Frost Walk) and then for the last two fairies you still need GV (Godless Valley) (not sure of name for pwi). IF you even say your uncharmed, they will kick you from party.

Then catas - I am pretty sure when you do TW, they will require all cata pullers to have a charm. And even not being charmed in FB69 (last two bosses) will be really severe on your clerics.

See in my opinion? Tankers being uncharmed means the clerics got to work much harder to heal the tanker, purify the tanker and do party heal when necessary. Meaning they probably need a charm to try to keep their MP full..

well man general feng has a very weak aoe all he dose is hp debuff with BB ull live, as for wurlord himself he has no aoe so u take 2 clerics 1 to bb 1 to ih or with a good barb 1 to ih, in solo mode i need no clerics for a 3-3, in squad mode i need no clerics for up to 2-1 2-2 i need one for wurlord, as for charms yea delta/gamma a charm is a must for the reflect and stun waves. and a charm for nirvana is also nice. but id like to add a rumor ive heard that on the asian server that ur charm dosent tick in TW. i dont know if its true but if it is that would mean charms are half worthless becouse there only good for 3 instances and pk.

MrCherry - Raging Tide

Being someone with a low cash flow I don't buy charms... I think i've had two in the entire time i've played (HL and RT) In which i've learnt how to actually tank.

Most of the Barbs I know who Charm themselves for everything can do barely anything without one.

I was once invited for A BH51, at level 70 I could storm through the place and the Cleric was from my faction so I knew I could trust them.
One of the DDs asked if I was charmed, as soon as I said no, all 3 DDs left, in which me and the cleric just soloed the place.

If you think someone needs A charm, Buy it for them, if not... live with it as far as i'm concerned.