What makes wizards so strong?

Amour - Lost City

Myriad_ - Lost City wrote: »

Yes i fully realize Ehee has +11 rank8 and elayne +10 or better nirvana G15.
I just want to know the reasons why they went hell.

Personal preference
Both sage and demon have their good and bad

Personally even if I was rank8+12 I'd love my +30% crit from sage BIDS b:dirty + a ton of chi to use it

Sirrobert - Dreamweaver

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

its ****ing 5%, where did you get 2k extra dmg? how ofter you idot hit 40k dmg to get 2k more from mastery?

3% crit ****, its liek 3rd cv ring, good thing

Are you seriusly?
A demon mastery gives 1% crit in the ELEMENT THE MASTERY IS FROM. So all 3 demon mastery's give a grand total of..... 1% crit
It's been shown, anwserd by a GM (somewhere on this forum is a quote from that), and obviusly if you look at the other version's (more acurate) skil discriptions

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

im demon wizzie, so listen to me k


wizzies suck in general but i find hell wizzies better than heaven, sage dragon is hella overrated, so is chi skill thingy. good skils but, thats just 2... rest of them is just pure suckage,.

inb4 heaven pyro, heaven shrink

hell versions still better


and @ this bullsh1t about how much dmg sage masteries give

learn2fckingcountidiot

its ****ing 5%, where did you get 2k extra dmg? how ofter you idot hit 40k dmg to get 2k more from mastery?

3% crit ****, its liek 3rd cv ring, good thing


roll other class, just dont touch wizard

You just prove how HUGE idiot you are yourself.
Also if You don't hit at your level 40k that's very sad. :-)))
http://www.glowfoto.com/viewimage.php?y=2010&m=03&img=09-153417L&t=jpg&rand=3317&srv=img5

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Cholla - Harshlands wrote: »

2k extra damage would be where a demon does 48k damage a sage does 50k.

Of course if that was not a crit to start with, a demon has an extra 3% chance to do 96k where a sage would do 100k if they managed to crit with their lower crit chance.

But if someone has a weapon doing 3k damage, these damage numbers might actually be a bit low.

Then again, if someone has a weapon doing 3k damage, most people would be one shots for level 1 crown of flame, and a sutra which starts with pyrogram, gush, pitfall would kill most people and leave you with plenty of time left over to finish off most others.

Cholla I sent email directly about demon mastries. No one know if they have +3%. They are two different opinion even from GM. So I sent email directly to PW china. I still waiting for answer.b:sad

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

Myriad_ - Lost City wrote: »

Yes i fully realize Ehee has +11 rank8 and elayne +10 or better nirvana G15.
I just want to know the reasons why they went hell.

because back then the forums were dominated with people saying go demon or you fail.


*thinks back to the dark ages*

pun intended

Brigid - Harshlands

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Cholla I sent email directly about demon mastries. No one know if they have +3%. They are two different opinion even from GM. So I sent email directly to PW china. I still waiting for answer.b:sad

Wasn't there a post where someone used an Eye of Observation on a Demon Wizard with all 3 masteries, and it showed +3% crit over their gear crit?

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver wrote: »

because back then the forums were dominated with people saying go demon or you fail.


*thinks back to the dark ages*

pun intended

Exactly. It was opinion from many people playing on another servers. With another conditions.

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Brigid - Harshlands wrote: »

Wasn't there a post where someone used an Eye of Observation on a Demon Wizard with all 3 masteries, and it showed +3% crit over their gear crit?

Yep it was. It can be same like critical arrow. It shows critical but it doesn't work. I don't believe this game anymore. I wanted final word from dev.
Also thanks to chi and ultimates I can launch ultimates VERY,VERY often it takes my DPT(damage per time) to the sky. ;-)

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Cholla - Harshlands wrote: »

I understand that every bit of evidence we currently have is inconclusive.

However, we do not have any evidence that they only apply to their own element -- ever bit of inconclusive evidence that I have found suggests they stack and demons with all three masteries get a +3% critical chance on their spells.

Also, if I understand how masteries work: with blade tempest, our fire mastery only applies on half of our spell damage, because half is physical and half is fire. But you can not get "half of a critical hit" so demon mastery critical hit bonus can not use the same mechanism that masteries use.

Hopefully they will answer soon. If not I will send it again.b:angry

Lorsis - Lost City

Sirrobert - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Are you seriusly?
A demon mastery gives 1% crit in the ELEMENT THE MASTERY IS FROM. So all 3 demon mastery's give a grand total of..... 1% crit
It's been shown, anwserd by a GM (somewhere on this forum is a quote from that), and obviusly if you look at the other version's (more acurate) skil discriptions

You're an idiot... Lurk moar

Eye od observation show 3% more crit on me, and i did a fkin crit test. Twice. Maybe i'll youtube it some day to shut your whaor mouths.
And being heaven wizard with +12 weapon is just stupid. Sage is for poor fcks who want to deal more than 2 k dmg with one of their spells, while hell is perfect for weapons refined to +10 and higher
Look at all factor wizards on lc, all hell.
Hell>heaven

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

You're an idiot... Lurk moar

Eye od observation show 3% more crit on me, and i did a fkin crit test. Twice. Maybe i'll youtube it some day to shut your whaor mouths.
And being heaven wizard with +12 weapon is just stupid. Sage is for poor fcks who want to deal more than 2 k dmg with one of their spells, while hell is perfect for weapons refined to +10 and higher
Look at all factor wizards on lc, all hell.
Hell>heaven

Shut up kid. Or take some pills for your fever. I just regret I'm not in your server I would kick your **** with pleasure. You who cannot hit more than 50k. Pcha.

Myriad_ - Lost City

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

You're an idiot... Lurk moar

Eye od observation show 3% more crit on me, and i did a fkin crit test. Twice. Maybe i'll youtube it some day to shut your whaor mouths.
And being heaven wizard with +12 weapon is just stupid. Sage is for poor fcks who want to deal more than 2 k dmg with one of their spells, while hell is perfect for weapons refined to +10 and higher
Look at all factor wizards on lc, all hell.
Hell>heaven

Yeah, the only way to know if they stack is to test ourselves like casting a spell 1 million times.

Devs will never tell you if they stack, and if they do the only way to know if something is true, is to demonstrate scientifically, and not to believe the others.

brownflamer

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

You're an idiot... Lurk moar

Eye od observation show 3% more crit on me, and i did a fkin crit test. Twice. Maybe i'll youtube it some day to shut your whaor mouths.
And being heaven wizard with +12 weapon is just stupid. Sage is for poor fcks who want to deal more than 2 k dmg with one of their spells, while hell is perfect for weapons refined to +10 and higher
Look at all factor wizards on lc, all hell.
Hell>heaven

Tell us WHY demon is better...and plz don't answer "more control"

Give us a more detailed desciption of your PK style plz.....cause I'm thinking of going demon...but I'm not exactly sure if I should.......and I've checked ALL sage/demon discussion.....and "more control" Isn't a good answerb:sad

Oh and I've already checked Ecatombb:surrender

Ursa - Dreamweaver

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

im demon wizzie, so listen to me k

*ok, by this point I was already thinking "this is either stupid or really fun" so I start "listening"... my thoughts in red below:

wizzies suck in general (huh? *looks at this guy's lvl ...hmmm) but i find hell wizzies better than heaven, sage dragon is hella overrated (* At this point I start smiling), so is chi skill thingy (*yeah, that blah-blah about sour grapes again). good skils but, thats just 2... rest of them is just pure suckage,(*by this point I was already "hi hi hi").

inb4 heaven pyro, heaven shrink (and between the age of 11 and 13)

hell versions still better (sure, sure, what game are you talking about?)


and @ this bullsh1t about how much dmg sage masteries give

learn2fckingcountidiot (were you looking in the mirror at that moment?)

its ****ing 5%, where did you get 2k extra dmg? how ofter you idot hit 40k dmg to get 2k more from mastery? (often, about 13% of the time on normal mobs, more when sparked or a cleric debuff/undine is in place. Otherwise yeah, let's say the diff is only 1k. And that useless chi skill+ chi gain actually allows me to spark about 5 times to a demon 3 times ... so yeah, read the above comment )

3% crit ****, its liek 3rd cv ring, good thing (no **** Einstein, a CV ring brings also 250 pdef and -6 channel, so no, it's not even close with having a 3rd ring but you really have that overall crit rate?)


roll other class, just dont touch wizard (*rolls another class then sets the char to "Delete". Happy now?)

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

You're an idiot... Lurk moar you're a spelling geniusb:victory

Eye od observation show 3% more crit on me, and i did a fkin crit test. Twice. this is why I say you're a genius. You did it twice, never care to document that? Maybe i'll youtube it some day yeah, maybe, if it's not too much trouble to shut your whaor mouths. yup,I guess same kind of mouth kisses you good night
And being heaven wizard with +12 weapon is just stupid. *hehe,whatever follows must me epic Sage is for poor fcks who want to deal more than 2 k dmg with one of their spells, while hell is perfect for weapons refined to +10 and higher rofl. you have no clue, do you? how was that ... lemme get it: learn2fckingcountidiot? higher refined weapon means that 5% net value increases makind the diff between sage and demon DoT even bigger
Look at all factor wizards on lc, all hell. So far the factor ones I've seen are all Sage, but yeah, in your neighborhood the factor ones might be demons. Still, 'hood =/= server genius
Hell>heaven of course it is, now get back to homework.

/sarcasm

I play this sage wizard here and I tried demon wizard on another account. What you fail to understand is not that one is better than the other, because in the end it really isn't, but the fact that the two paths require a different way to play the same class. Sage is good for a certain type of gameplay, Demon is good for another. They both have strengths that one can rely upon. Failing to understand that is failing at understanding this game.

brownflamer

Exactly....that's all I want to know....how the gameplay is for sage.....and how the gameplay is for demon b:victory

I don't wanna know which one is better than the other(we have all the other sage/demon for that)b:chuckle

But all people say is.."more chi"= sage "more Control skills"=demon b:angry

I just want to know how the gameplay is for eachb:surrender

Ursa - Dreamweaver

Roll on a private server, get the feel of it, then get back here and roll one in the "Real world".
Beside missing undine and sleep, the gameplay is pretty much the same - well, the PvP, because PvE is non-existent there.

No one can tell what gameplay you like, and no one can explain one cultivation gameplay in a few words, because it's just not that simple.

/Groovy/ - Harshlands

brownflamer wrote: »

Exactly....that's all I want to know....how the gameplay is for sage.....and how the gameplay is for demon b:victory

I feel that I can share the experiences of newbie sage ;]

So far I got sage Pyro, Gush and Stone Rain + Chi skill and triple spark.

PvE:
At first, you will need to re-learn controlling aggro. Chi skill + sage Pyro will build your sparks in no-time and you will have to resist temptation to use them - or you might steal aggro on bosses. TT bosses are luxury though - they are [?] so you can't actually steal aggro unless barb is terrible - unleash the fury. You will find that you use much less mana pots in TT while doing better damage.
FC is nicer as well, you won't have to beg veno for sparks anymore, you will always have at least one to open up Dragons Breath. Again - less mana pots usage at bosses.
If you are old-fashioned like me and like to grind, you will love improved slow on Gush and faster channeling on Stone Rain, which actually becomes spammable. No more meditation or pots as well - sparks & sutra provide both extra damage and mana recovery.

PvP:
Chi skill + Elemental shell + Pyrogram proc will allow you to build full chi extremely fast, you will be able to save apoth pots cooldown for pots like antistun or damage immunity. You will save genie energy for amping your damage or improving survivability instead of chi building. Most of the time you will have at least 2 sparks ready.
Gush will annoy melee classes even more due to improved slow effect - nice to use on rushing cata barb, especially if you don't have time to use Glacial Snare.
Stone Rain - my favourite, hits almost as hard as lvl 10 Sandstorm, channels as fast as Pyrogram.


So far I'm really glad I went Sage, it's more fun than I expected


Demon has other advantages, personally I like their shields, Force of Will and Wellspring Quaff, other skills are either evenly matched with Sage versions or not appealing to my gamestyle.



No matter which culti you choose - grats! Patience pays off, fun part starts there b:pleased

Mizuoni - Dreamweaver

/Groovy/ - Harshlands wrote: »

I feel that I can share the experiences of newbie sage ;]

So far I got sage Pyro, Gush and Stone Rain + Chi skill and triple spark.

PvE:
At first, you will need to re-learn controlling aggro. Chi skill + sage Pyro will build your sparks in no-time and you will have to resist temptation to use them - or you might steal aggro on bosses. TT bosses are luxury though - they are [?] so you can't actually steal aggro unless barb is terrible - unleash the fury. You will find that you use much less mana pots in TT while doing better damage.
FC is nicer as well, you won't have to beg veno for sparks anymore, you will always have at least one to open up Dragons Breath. Again - less mana pots usage at bosses.
If you are old-fashioned like me and like to grind, you will love improved slow on Gush and faster channeling on Stone Rain, which actually becomes spammable. No more meditation or pots as well - sparks & sutra provide both extra damage and mana recovery.

PvP:
Chi skill + Elemental shell + Pyrogram proc will allow you to build full chi extremely fast, you will be able to save apoth pots cooldown for pots like antistun or damage immunity. You will save genie energy for amping your damage or improving survivability instead of chi building. Most of the time you will have at least 2 sparks ready.
Gush will annoy melee classes even more due to improved slow effect - nice to use on rushing cata barb, especially if you don't have time to use Glacial Snare.
Stone Rain - my favourite, hits almost as hard as lvl 10 Sandstorm, channels as fast as Pyrogram.


So far I'm really glad I went Sage, it's more fun than I expected


Demon has other advantages, personally I like their shields, Force of Will and Wellspring Quaff, other skills are either evenly matched with Sage versions or not appealing to my gamestyle.



No matter which culti you choose - grats! Patience pays off, fun part starts there b:pleased

just about the same experience with this

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

/Groovy/ - Harshlands wrote: »

I feel that I can share the experiences of newbie sage ;]

So far I got sage Pyro, Gush and Stone Rain + Chi skill and triple spark.

PvE:
At first, you will need to re-learn controlling aggro. Chi skill + sage Pyro will build your sparks in no-time and you will have to resist temptation to use them - or you might steal aggro on bosses. TT bosses are luxury though - they are [?] so you can't actually steal aggro unless barb is terrible - unleash the fury. You will find that you use much less mana pots in TT while doing better damage.
FC is nicer as well, you won't have to beg veno for sparks anymore, you will always have at least one to open up Dragons Breath. Again - less mana pots usage at bosses.
If you are old-fashioned like me and like to grind, you will love improved slow on Gush and faster channeling on Stone Rain, which actually becomes spammable. No more meditation or pots as well - sparks & sutra provide both extra damage and mana recovery.

PvP:
Chi skill + Elemental shell + Pyrogram proc will allow you to build full chi extremely fast, you will be able to save apoth pots cooldown for pots like antistun or damage immunity. You will save genie energy for amping your damage or improving survivability instead of chi building. Most of the time you will have at least 2 sparks ready.
Gush will annoy melee classes even more due to improved slow effect - nice to use on rushing cata barb, especially if you don't have time to use Glacial Snare.
Stone Rain - my favourite, hits almost as hard as lvl 10 Sandstorm, channels as fast as Pyrogram.


So far I'm really glad I went Sage, it's more fun than I expected


Demon has other advantages, personally I like their shields, Force of Will and Wellspring Quaff, other skills are either evenly matched with Sage versions or not appealing to my gamestyle.



No matter which culti you choose - grats! Patience pays off, fun part starts there b:pleased

I have to add some things.
With 99 ultimates you will able launch these ultimates 2x oftten. You can choose if hit VERY hard with BIDS or launch 2 ultimates in lens than 30s. When I use sage BT and it take 1 spark I have ready second spark ready in less that is cooldown of BT. So I can lauch second ultimate extremely fast. With master li technique is in less than 15s.
Also AOE FoW is for me extremely useful. It saved my life few time in RB or if I take aggro of few 100+ mobs.
Is very nice to see sealed bunch of mobs running from you. Then I feel like real master of wizards. :-))

Malord - Heavens Tear

Wish demon had better FoW =/ but oh well love my red spark and squishy tank ablities b:laugh

Haiz - Lost City

Most people make fun or Lorsis on LC, just thought you all should know.

Hi Lorsis.b:bye

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Haiz - Lost City wrote: »

Most people make fun or Lorsis on LC, just thought you all should know.

Hi Lorsis.b:bye

Thanks for giving us know. I knew it that he couldn't have everything in head normal.b:chuckle

Mage_Fizban - Dreamweaver

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Thanks for giving us know. I knew it that he couldn't have everything in head normal.b:chuckle

Thank you Yoda. b:chuckle

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Mage_Fizban - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Thank you Yoda. b:chuckle

Thanksb:victory My powers escalate in game.b:chuckle

brownflamer

/Groovy/ - Harshlands wrote: »

I feel that I can share the experiences of newbie sage ;]

So far I got sage Pyro, Gush and Stone Rain + Chi skill and triple spark.

PvE:
At first, you will need to re-learn controlling aggro. Chi skill + sage Pyro will build your sparks in no-time and you will have to resist temptation to use them - or you might steal aggro on bosses. TT bosses are luxury though - they are [?] so you can't actually steal aggro unless barb is terrible - unleash the fury. You will find that you use much less mana pots in TT while doing better damage.
FC is nicer as well, you won't have to beg veno for sparks anymore, you will always have at least one to open up Dragons Breath. Again - less mana pots usage at bosses.
If you are old-fashioned like me and like to grind, you will love improved slow on Gush and faster channeling on Stone Rain, which actually becomes spammable. No more meditation or pots as well - sparks & sutra provide both extra damage and mana recovery.

PvP:
Chi skill + Elemental shell + Pyrogram proc will allow you to build full chi extremely fast, you will be able to save apoth pots cooldown for pots like antistun or damage immunity. You will save genie energy for amping your damage or improving survivability instead of chi building. Most of the time you will have at least 2 sparks ready.
Gush will annoy melee classes even more due to improved slow effect - nice to use on rushing cata barb, especially if you don't have time to use Glacial Snare.
Stone Rain - my favourite, hits almost as hard as lvl 10 Sandstorm, channels as fast as Pyrogram.


So far I'm really glad I went Sage, it's more fun than I expected


Demon has other advantages, personally I like their shields, Force of Will and Wellspring Quaff, other skills are either evenly matched with Sage versions or not appealing to my gamestyle.



No matter which culti you choose - grats! Patience pays off, fun part starts there b:pleased

Lol sounds amazingb:victory

Gratz on becoming sage and reaching 89+

And thanks for sharing your experiences with sage.....(this was much more informative than those freaking lists of skills ppl usually give me)

and I changed my mind nowb:laugh I'M GOING SAGEb:dirty

Lorsis - Lost City

Haiz - Lost City wrote: »

Most people make fun or Lorsis on LC, just thought you all should know.

Hi Lorsis.b:bye

Hi haiz
Guys this is haiz, sage mage and a reason why i chose hell path. He fail.

Sage mages.... Stop fapping to sage dragon. It's only like 25% for crit overall... 50% chance to proc and increase crit chance by nonfactor number, sounds useless. And lol at chi skill - 2 times hell frostblade. Face it guys, heaven skills are useless.
While hell... Sandstorm - spammable ulti, hell **** rock, range that allows you to hit target in 1k city while standing in archosaur, hell barrier, every single hell skill is great, even tempest, i can interrupt archers zhen with it! Amazing skill. 3 spark anti stun with poison and undine is a ****, -chan boost - only ****** will try to tank 3 sparked hell mage, heaven spark has no -chan so it suck. If you want go heaven, but hell is the way to go. Look at other classes , hell archers, warriors, barbs, venos - pro go pvp, while heaven suck. Same with wizards.
And you carebears from non pvp servers - stfu, noone cares about you. Playing on hell wiz is pretty simple. You don't have to worry about archers cause you have barrier, you don't have to worry when you don't have chi, just sandstorm target and watch it dying. If you're being ganked 3 spark and go afk cause everyone will run anyway. There's no way to lose 1 v 1 as hell wizard, you just have too many badass skills that cause so much badass things to target.

Anyway, wizards suck, roll a sin.

Amour - Lost City

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

Hi haiz
Guys this is haiz, sage mage and a reason why i chose hell path. He fail.

Sage mages.... Stop fapping to sage dragon. It's only like 25% for crit overall... 50% chance to proc and increase crit chance by nonfactor number, sounds useless. And lol at chi skill - 2 times hell frostblade. Face it guys, heaven skills are useless.
While hell... Sandstorm - spammable ulti, hell **** rock, range that allows you to hit target in 1k city while standing in archosaur, hell barrier, every single hell skill is great, even tempest, i can interrupt archers zhen with it! Amazing skill. 3 spark anti stun with poison and undine is a ****, -chan boost - only ****** will try to tank 3 sparked hell mage, heaven spark has no -chan so it suck. If you want go heaven, but hell is the way to go. Look at other classes , hell archers, warriors, barbs, venos - pro go pvp, while heaven suck. Same with wizards.
And you carebears from non pvp servers - stfu, noone cares about you. Playing on hell wiz is pretty simple. You don't have to worry about archers cause you have barrier, you don't have to worry when you don't have chi, just sandstorm target and watch it dying. If you're being ganked 3 spark and go afk cause everyone will run anyway. There's no way to lose 1 v 1 as hell wizard, you just have too many badass skills that cause so much badass things to target.

Anyway, wizards suck, roll a sin.

Wouldn't trade my shrink or heaven BIDS for the world b:cute

Mumintroll - Heavens Tear

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

Hi haiz
Guys this is haiz, sage mage and a reason why i chose hell path. He fail.

****** will try to tank 3 sparked hell mage, heaven spark has no -chan so it suck. If you want go heaven, but hell is the way to go. Look at other classes , hell archers, warriors, barbs, venos - pro go pvp, while heaven suck. Same with wizards.

Anyway, wizards suck, roll a sin.

I would tank it with pleasure. -25% damage received from my spark is especially in PVP HUGE ADVANTAGE. I told you wake up and come to back on earth. I'm happy for you, that you can cancel channeling with BTb:chuckle.
And 50% BIDS is damn huge possibility and you can be sure that in next 10s after at least 1 time I will critic and my critic=you death.b:laugh

Ursa - Dreamweaver

Lorsis - Lost City wrote: »

Hi haiz
Guys this is haiz, sage mage and a reason why i chose hell path. He fail.

Sage mages.... Stop fapping to sage dragon. It's only like 25% for crit overall... 50% chance to proc and increase crit chance by nonfactor number, sounds useless. And lol at chi skill - 2 times hell frostblade. Face it guys, heaven skills are useless.
While hell... Sandstorm - spammable ulti, hell **** rock, range that allows you to hit target in 1k city while standing in archosaur, hell barrier, every single hell skill is great, even tempest, i can interrupt archers zhen with it! Amazing skill. 3 spark anti stun with poison and undine is a ****, -chan boost - only ****** will try to tank 3 sparked hell mage, heaven spark has no -chan so it suck. If you want go heaven, but hell is the way to go. Look at other classes , hell archers, warriors, barbs, venos - pro go pvp, while heaven suck. Same with wizards.
And you carebears from non pvp servers - stfu, noone cares about you. Playing on hell wiz is pretty simple. You don't have to worry about archers cause you have barrier, you don't have to worry when you don't have chi, just sandstorm target and watch it dying. If you're being ganked 3 spark and go afk cause everyone will run anyway. There's no way to lose 1 v 1 as hell wizard, you just have too many badass skills that cause so much badass things to target.

Anyway, wizards suck, roll a sin.

I could almost bet that if you go against a sage wizard, both sparked, your 25% channel increase won't compensate for the 25% dmg reduction and the debuffs from Sage GS and DP will hurt more than the additional dmg you have on your uber-awesome demon skillz.
Demon wiz is indeed powerful, and used the right way can be a menace, but u don't sound like you know how to use it.

Doomm/ker_ - Lost City

Im only 22lvl ( have experience 77lvl) but ill go demon. Why? Because no matter what dveryone will beat me as Ill always beat others. And demon looks cooler to me. Sage is good, demon is not lamer or better too.