Horrible BH

Belgare - Sanctuary

Wow, you've had clerics abandon your squad? Must be a pretty BAD situation to make the cleric take a hike. I've been in squads as a cleric (my main) that have been total misery where no one has any clue what they're doing and I keep getting killed or having to res folks after every fight because the barb doesn't keep agro or the squad doesn't realise they need to pull. It can be pathetic to be a part of, but I have never left people to fend for themselves. Ever.

Samsoul - Lost City

It's the era of the selfish people.

I have a bh QQ thread too! SNAP!

Divine_Death - Dreamweaver

Belgare - Sanctuary wrote: »

Wow, you've had clerics abandon your squad? Must be a pretty BAD situation to make the cleric take a hike. I've been in squads as a cleric (my main) that have been total misery where no one has any clue what they're doing and I keep getting killed or having to res folks after every fight because the barb doesn't keep agro or the squad doesn't realise they need to pull. It can be pathetic to be a part of, but I have never left people to fend for themselves. Ever.

Well, depends on the player. There have been Clerics that repeatedly died in BH with us but toughed it out till the end and there are also Clerics that would ditch the squad for very small or stupid reason. When we were doing weapon token for my Sin and BH for rest of the squad, the Cleric went up to pull (even though both Sins in the squad had Zeal) and aggroed all the poison mobs in FB79. I AoE all the poison mobs to save the squad, stealth to reset them and got poisoned to death while Linus killed her. She towned and then never came back. KoS list ftw.

Samsoul - Lost City

Aw Divine_Death! Much pity for you my dear.

I'm so glad I'm not a cleric though. Even if I was a good one, these BH's lately cause so much bloody stress.

Alliptica - Raging Tide

i think maybe the barbs left bcuz they were embarrassed b:chuckle

DrazoThePsy - Dreamweaver

The frequency of bad BH squads is what has put me off doing BH for now (and it's a real coin-drain especially if you want to keep up with good equipment). There was some good BH experiences and a few great squads I was lucky to land in....but not enough to out-weigh the bad ones. b:surrender

Good FB/BH squads are a dying art....but the player's personality and attitude can still vastly improve or ruin the whole experience.

Airyll - Dreamweaver

Belgare - Sanctuary wrote: »

Wow, you've had clerics abandon your squad? Must be a pretty BAD situation to make the cleric take a hike. I've been in squads as a cleric (my main) that have been total misery where no one has any clue what they're doing and I keep getting killed or having to res folks after every fight because the barb doesn't keep agro or the squad doesn't realise they need to pull. It can be pathetic to be a part of, but I have never left people to fend for themselves. Ever.

Now I'm on the fence here.

If a cleric dies a multitude of times in a fail squad, then they have every right to leave, much like I, as an archer, have every right to leave is I'm in a squad and a tank simply cannot keep aggro, even if I am nerfing my damage to the point I might as well not be doing anything.

Clerics take a lot of assery from other players, especially a frustrated player who just died for something that was their own stupidity. They don't always get thanks for the rez, and while they should carry rez scrolls not all clerics do, and as not all of them carry GS either they lose EXP every time they have to rez because they die.

So, while I agree that some clerics will ditch for the most ridiculous reason ever [including letting the tank die, then letting the DDs who took aggro die while using Wield Thunder or whatever it is on the boss in question, then dropping squad after everybody is dead, without a single rez, and calling us the failures.] there are times when I see a cleric ditch, and I wonder why they hadn't done so sooner.

Alliptica - Raging Tide

If a cleric dies a multitude of times in a fail squad, then THEY are the fail

Granrey - Sanctuary

Tapion_ - Dreamweaver wrote: »

...Well, we somehow reached wyvern. The barb used Zeal to pull the adds and we killed them without no problem...

I dont think you need Zeal to pull those mobs, as long as you hit one of them with a range attack without hitting the boss, the boss will not agro.

Myself, I always pull those mobs with a bow.

Samsoul - Lost City

Now I'm on the fence here.

If a cleric dies a multitude of times in a fail squad, then they have every right to leave, much like I, as an archer, have every right to leave is I'm in a squad and a tank simply cannot keep aggro, even if I am nerfing my damage to the point I might as well not be doing anything.

Clerics take a lot of assery from other players, especially a frustrated player who just died for something that was their own stupidity. They don't always get thanks for the rez, and while they should carry rez scrolls not all clerics do, and as not all of them carry GS either they lose EXP every time they have to rez because they die.

So, while I agree that some clerics will ditch for the most ridiculous reason ever [including letting the tank die, then letting the DDs who took aggro die while using Wield Thunder or whatever it is on the boss in question, then dropping squad after everybody is dead, without a single rez, and calling us the failures.] there are times when I see a cleric ditch, and I wonder why they hadn't done so sooner.

I agree with you here, Airyll.

My best friend's a cleric, and I believe he is a very decent one. He, like me, ditched BH in the early levels (Qingzi borrring) to test out his heals and me my aoes on mobs and things. We have a better idea of what we can take on now.

But he gets so annoyed when DD's aggro for seemingly no reason, and then BOAST about it. He hates it when nobody saves him from dying, and when the tanker doesn't hit every mob.

I made it my personal vendetta to save cleric butts.

Besides, male clerics are so do-able.

....

Darn the clerics that ditch, even though they're not doing their job right. I've had a couple.

Airyll - Dreamweaver

Samsoul - Lost City wrote: »

I agree with you here, Airyll.

My best friend's a cleric, and I believe he is a very decent one. He, like me, ditched BH in the early levels (Qingzi borrring) to test out his heals and me my aoes on mobs and things. We have a better idea of what we can take on now.

But he gets so annoyed when DD's aggro for seemingly no reason, and then BOAST about it. He hates it when nobody saves him from dying, and when the tanker doesn't hit every mob.

I made it my personal vendetta to save cleric butts.

A cleric's main role in the squad is to keep the tank and themselves alive. DDs and anybody else are to be left to fend for themselves if the tank or cleric is in a pinch.

Now I have noticed that if the cleric ends up in trouble and a DD helps take aggro of the mob (or mobs), the cleric is normally decent enough to give heals to the DD in return. Many clerics out there can prioritise well who should get the heals and who should not, and when a situation calls for more than just "IH tank, IH tank, IH tank"

However, there are DDs out there who do not understand the cleric's priorities, and will complain if they do not get heals when they themselves need them because they figure a cleric's job is to keep everybody alive. People need to realise that a cleric's job is as follows:

- Keep the tank alive, and the cleric him/herself alive
- Heal the others if possible if they need it. If this cannot be done, let them die and res them when you have a few spare seconds because the tank and cleric is priority.

It's not just

- Keep everybody alive but yourself

When people start to realise this, fail BHs will decrease in number. Clerics will also not need to drop squad as much because the other party members won't assume they're going to be healed the instant they need them. But we still have the fail clerics and tanks to deal with, the idiots who drop squad blaming everybody else when they probably know very well they were the ones at fault.

Samsoul - Lost City

To be honest, I try to help as much as possible.

For example, my measly lvl 8 bubble of life is good enough to heal between rankar/wyverns aoe's. Since it cools down just in time for the next whack.

I prefer it, it keeps the ranged DDs and cleric close-knit and lets the cleric focus on the tank (or more often than not the BM/Sin that doesn't know how to use pots. >.>;;)

Besiiiides, its SO mp consuming.

Belgare - Sanctuary

Alliptica - Raging Tide wrote: »

If a cleric dies a multitude of times in a fail squad, then THEY are the fail

Yeah, right. You must have got a lot of Clerics killed to have that view... b:pleased

Granrey - Sanctuary

Alliptica - Raging Tide wrote: »

If a cleric dies a multitude of times in a fail squad, then THEY are the fail

Your statement is confusing. If the squad is a fail squad, then is a fail squad.b:laugh

I wish I can mention all the **** ups that "SOME" clerics do on squad but that would be typing too much. BTW, we all **** up (all classes and all players) at some point or in some situations. Its just a matter of time and circunstances.

I will just mention a common one that happens to me often: A bm performing as tank on a squad, it is very different than a barb performing as tank.

For some reason, "SOME" clerics start healing the BM as soon as the boss attacks the BM.

Who do you think the boss is going to attack next?b:chuckle

Then, you hear the cleric say: "that's a fail BM, he/she cant keep agro". When the BM did not even had agro in the first place.

Deceptistar - Sanctuary

Best way to solve it is to avoid BHs all together b:chuckle it didnt kill us back when we didnt have it, so it wont kill you now if you avoid it

Belgare - Sanctuary

Deceptistar - Sanctuary wrote: »

Best way to solve it is to avoid BHs all together b:chuckle it didnt kill us back when we didnt have it, so it wont kill you now if you avoid it

lol. Yeah, I barely ever do a BH. I do 'em if I'm out of quests and really want my next level... more often if a friend wants help on it and I also need it...so like, once every 2 weeks. It's more fun that way.

frankieraye

Airyll - Dreamweaver wrote: »

Correct me if I am wrong, Frankie, but wasn't the OP posted before the forum's second redesign?

Cause you know, if it was... while there wasn't a need for it I can see why it was posted. Really that initial skin with the blinding white background was really bad.

If it was posted after that date, well meh, can't please everybody.

Hah, you're right; okay I'll forgive it b:thanks

Asdadasdasds - Lothranis

frankieraye wrote: »

Hah, you're right; okay I'll forgive it b:thanks

Y U Forgive Gooners!

Xx_BeLLa_xX - Harshlands

orceN\ b:bye

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide

Yippy necro

and

Samsoul - Lost City wrote: »

I made it my personal vendetta to save cleric butts.

Besides, male clerics are so do-able.

You can save me

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

Yippy necro

and



You can save me

Easy there tiger. Keep the stallion in the barn >_>

Darnok - Dreamweaver

I can understand the frustration, in the past week alone I've ran through many fb's, bh's, culti's, etc. and I cant get past the fact that there are a good many players that just simply do not know how to run an instance....lvl 89's and 95's in bh79 not knowing that they shouldn't stand inside the hands....people who have no understanding of their character's skills....people who don't know what aggro is and how it works. I can understand the common new player's that still need to learn a few things but, I'm talking like people who have gone far into their characters lvl's lol. I'm pretty passive when these things occur and it dos'nt really bother me, but i mean common people seriously? What gets me is the ones who claim they already know this and that and blah blah then only to run out and get killed. It's like a re-run of Tommy Boy backing the car up with the door ajar into the gas pump every time i do a random instance lol.

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear

Darnok - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I can understand the frustration, in the past week alone I've ran through many fb's, bh's, culti's, etc. and I cant get past the fact that there are a good many players that just simply do not know how to run an instance....lvl 89's and 95's in bh79 not knowing that they shouldn't stand inside the hands....people who have no understanding of their character's skills....people who don't know what aggro is and how it works. I can understand the common new player's that still need to learn a few things but, I'm talking like people who have gone far into their characters lvl's lol. I'm pretty passive when these things occur and it dos'nt really bother me, but i mean common people seriously? What gets me is the ones who claim they already know this and that and blah blah then only to run out and get killed. It's like a re-run of Tommy Boy backing the car up with the door ajar into the gas pump every time i do a random instance lol.

Large size was uncalled for and painful to attempt to read due to the contrast of text to background at that ratio >_>

Problem : Hyperbabies and the people powerleveling them

Solution : Lock FF out for noobs or set a restriction on Hypers

Probability ? : None.

Darnok - Dreamweaver

b:laugh

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Large size was uncalled for and painful to attempt to read due to the contrast of text to background at that ratio >_>

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide

Darnok - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I can understand the frustration, in the past week alone I've ran through many fb's, bh's, culti's, etc. and I cant get past the fact that there are a good many players that just simply do not know how to run an instance....lvl 89's and 95's in bh79 not knowing that they shouldn't stand inside the hands....people who have no understanding of their character's skills....people who don't know what aggro is and how it works. I can understand the common new player's that still need to learn a few things but, I'm talking like people who have gone far into their characters lvl's lol. I'm pretty passive when these things occur and it dos'nt really bother me, but i mean common people seriously? What gets me is the ones who claim they already know this and that and blah blah then only to run out and get killed. It's like a re-run of Tommy Boy backing the car up with the door ajar into the gas pump every time i do a random instance lol

it could have been worse b:shutup

KawaiiJen - Heavens Tear

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide wrote: »

it could have been worse b:shutup

At that size though the text becomes clusterfked because the forums can't handle it unless it is quoted for some reason.

ZoracGallant - Raging Tide

It makes things so pretty...

but yeah i was hopping for the distortion but qouting fixes it b:surrender

TCHP - Lost City

Tapion_ - Dreamweaver wrote: »

I won't say everything cuz the BH took so much time, the whole story might crash the forums(though I must say that with the new forum look, a crash would be an improvement). I'll just post the really bad parts.

It was a BH51 Wyvern 1st. I know wyvern first is hard but it turned out much harder than it would've been.

It started out okay. 3 Venomancers, 1 Assassin(me), 1 Cleric, and 1 Barbarian. We pulled, immobilized, killed, and repeated all the way to Rankar, skipping Fushma without too much trouble. At Rankar the barb decided he'd attack Rankar even though he knew we were skipping him, and nearly killed us all. He died and left the squad, no he did not dc, he simply thought it was our fault.

So we got another barb and went back to the entrance to help him with the patrols After we were clear to continue the BH, the barb became incredibly rude, complaining that we were going too slow. HE WAS IN ****IN TIGER MODEb:angry How the hell are we supposed to keep up?! A few more times we ran into Rankar, and I had to be the martyr to save the rest of the squad(I didn't mind, thx to the 1st barb I was already at 0%) but they didn't run away, no they stayed close enough to die anyways. Well, we somehow reached wyvern. The barb used Zeal to pull the adds and we killed them without no problem. Then when we were ready the barb got behind wyvern to turn him around, and the cleric started BB. I went up to wyvern and began to DD. The barb complained that he wasn't in BB range. Well I was in BB range, so instead of tanking from inside the BB, he decided to cause a squad wipe. Then he left, he also obviously thinking it was our fault. Well, after that we got a herc veno and the rest if the BH went fine.

2 fail barbs in a row, thanks to those 2 fail barbs, many members of the squad lost half of the reward they got from the BH.

Hum, bb on wyvern, seriously someone has not been to cleric school. On a low lv tank, you need to use purify or he get almost 1 shot if not.

then since the door were removed, if at the 1st boss you go right, instead of going to the 2nd boss room, you can only run in fushma. has it will get you to the passage for Wyvern. it's also faster that way, less mob in the way, less bosses)

also you don't need to use a genie to pull wyvern assist, the normal attack of a caster will call them both for you and the boss don't agroo. Then you had 3 veno also... If you wana use your genie to pull, pull the boss ... maybe !

idk who told you (the barb ) turning the wyvern around did any thing... in 4 year I never eared, or saw people do this. I do know that the damage is higher if your closer from his aoe.

even if the barb, turn the boss around, witch is bad, cause then the casters have to get closer to wyvern and they get to much damage. I think that using BB was the bad decision there. All of this combine, means 1 thing, bad experience people, have bad BH run.

If the players don't know there role they should ask, or get a high lv to teach them a few things.

BH 51 is one of the most annoying bh to do also, imo. Has it's mostly the 1st FB player will start doing alone, not asking for higher lv player. Most bh 19,29,39 are run by high lv friends cause players are still learning. BH 51 has a few surprise for the players.

Lucrecia - Momaganon

TCHP - Lost City wrote: »

Hum, bb on wyvern, seriously someone has not been to cleric school. On a low lv tank, you need to use purify or he get almost 1 shot if not.

the bh-lvl-range is 60-70 and at this lvl a barb can tank him without purify fine. As I remember, on my cleric 60+ I used to bb on wyv too because ALWAYS when someone told us we can keep out of range it didnt work. Any dd got aggro, and died in 2-3 hits if the barb was not fast enough to get it back. I was tired of it (and of archer/wiz stealing aggro, luring him into me and I got nealry 1-shotted)
So i just put up bb. The barb can tank, the dds can get aggro for a few seconds without deaths and i could survive wyverns AoE fine.
At later lvls i began to think "I care for the barb only" and used purify + IH. It ended up with a veno trying to amp the boss = dead. Sin stealing aggro = dead. I should rez the sin, of course, but this is pretty hard when you need to heal the tank + yourself because you ran to rez into AoE range + heal the others because nobody knew what happened and is running around like some chickens, again in AoE-range = Squishys dead too.

I know IH+Purify works fine, but only if youre squad is working with you and not against .



also you don't need to use a genie to pull wyvern assist, the normal attack of a caster will call them both for you and the boss don't agroo. Then you had 3 veno also... If you wana use your genie to pull, pull the boss ... maybe !
These are archer-mobs, so any lower caster might not survive them. And theyre fast, the barb might have problems getting aggro fast enough.

I guess pulling the boss was a joke right? I aggree if the veno doesnt use a herc, let the veno pull those mobs .


idk who told you (the barb ) turning the wyvern around did any thing... in 4 year I never eared, or saw people do this. I do know that the damage is higher if your closer from his aoe.

tried this a few times, never worked ...


If the players don't know there role they should ask, or get a high lv to teach them a few things.

Well they knew their role. If the cleric didnt knew, he wouldnt have used any heal skills. Also, i think in this case it is the others job to tell them if theyre doing something wrong.

The cleric didnt know IH+P is enough, so he didnt know it was a "mistake" to use bb. If the squaddies dont get their mouth open to tell him, how should he know?
Especially when many people are saying the opposite in squad.
Maybe the barb didnt read they wanted to skip rankar and was wondering why nobody attacked him.


BH 51 is one of the most annoying bh to do also, imo. Has it's mostly the 1st FB player will start doing alone, not asking for higher lv player. Most bh 19,29,39 are run by high lv friends cause players are still learning. BH 51 has a few surprise for the players.

there is no bh19 lol. BH 39 is often run by people the same lvl range, it is not diffcult. Players are always learning, and they learn more with a squad on their lvl than with a "high lvl friend" who kills everything for them.

Well I do think bh29 needs a makeover, because
1.A lowbie running trough SP to get there is killed by pkers (dont know if thats possible anymore but still the mobs can be pretty hard for casters under 50)
2. Porting inside = dead because of the glitch at the door to HoD.
3. A lot of AoE mobs that interrupt channeling. Thats the point where most of the squads fail when theyre 40-50.
4. A boss with more damage than the 39er bosses physical, and nearly impossible to tank with a caster at this lvl even if his Magic attack is weaker.

JSXSunny - Sanctuary

Simple solution to all ur problems: (:

It is allowed to play with 2 clients, so:

Roll a Barb and a Cleric at the same time and level them constantly together and simply solo everything u want til level 90 and the higher TTs. Obviously it takes more time, but after all u can keep every drop for urself.

Thats the way I was able to get my gears with absolutly no charging xDD if u have a Partner that could roll a sin and lets say a bm, then u got all buffs and can go smoothly through everything in this game.

Sure thats not the core sense of Multiplayer games...but fail squads did get so frustrating...I just had no other choice I guess then doing it on my own then^^

After All it's just a suggestion. If that sounds good for u then try it out^^

PS: If u're good u can even skip the cleric and go by a wiz instead...That's how me and my gf rolled on Momaganon Server xD A good 80's Barb with a good 80's wiz can easily duo through fc and pv like we did and tbh fc with just 2 is so freaking funny and amazing, especially in that level range, because u have to play nearly perfectly to be succesful.

So u see, that way u can even proof if u are a good player or not because doing things dou and solo that some full squads can't even handle (yeah sad but true) is kinda nice and challenging, besides u learn to play more different classes, though I admit that only the Barb class requires some skill but the others are all fun to play (: