Any veno light armor builds?

Bismark - Lost City
Bismark - Lost City Posts: 8 Arc User
edited March 2012 in Venomancer
Does anyone know a good light armour veno guide plz? or and links for one? ty b:thanks
Post edited by Bismark - Lost City on
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Comments

  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    If you want a guide try the stickies. LA's pretty simple tho; 3 Mag 1 Str 1 Dex. This should cover minimum requirements for mag wep your level and allow you to wear up to date armor. I wouldn't recommend LA tho, as you'll be severely gimping your damage in exchange for mediocre defense. At low and mid levels this will slow you down as kills will take longer and you'll have inferior pet heal. At higher levels you can actually get the same phys res as LA on AA (and cheaper too, since garnets are more affordable than the citrines you'll need for LA). Or you can go HA and have enough phys res on fox form to take on Melee types in PvP and become a decent tank on PvE.

    Any way you look at it LA will loose when compared with either Arcane or Heavy.
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I think of LA as a cheap way to balance mdef and pdef, but more expensive in the long run if you upgrade it with imbues.
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • kenlee
    kenlee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    LA is good at low lvls till 70-80 or probably more since nobody use shards at those lvls.... so its probably the cheapeast way to have a better pdef. then you buy 2 restat scrolls and thats it
  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I'd think the cost of reset notes would outweigh the cost of shards, if you intend to ditch it at 70.

    Anyway, the build is 3magic, 1str, 1 dex. Leaves you no room for vit whilst giving you the low magic of a full-vit build.
    It does give you better melee damage, as well as a higher crit - which is both an advantage and a risk.

    So - it's good for foxform (heavy armour is better of, course, but harder to do.) it's decent for just grinding, and you can switch to arcane armour as needed, so no disadvantage in that direction.
    The low hitpoints is its only real disadvantage, and it IS a disadvantage, later on.
    Early on - does anything hit you, ever?
  • kenlee
    kenlee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    "Early on - does anything hit you, ever? "
    yes, every single player that is not in my guild

    ..and i've used lots of restats scrolls so far just to test every build
  • Vitenka - Dreamweaver
    Vitenka - Dreamweaver Posts: 4,125 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    kenlee wrote: »
    "Early on - does anything hit you, ever? "
    yes, every single player that is not in my guild

    Ah well PVP changes things. A lot. I can see light armour, giving a rounded defence since you WILL be attacked at whatever weak point you have, being a lot more useful there.
    kenlee wrote: »
    ..and i've used lots of restats scrolls so far just to test every build

    Fair do's to you - but using reset scrolls to avoid buying common shards doesn't look like a good tradeoff.
    Buying reset scrolls for other reasons - great!
    But if you can get the same thing by shoving a couple of tens of k worth of garnets in your dress... not so great.

    Of course, following this logic - nothing stops you adding cheap shards to your low-level light armour. I'd probably want citrines though, which are more expensive.
  • Reivi - Sanctuary
    Reivi - Sanctuary Posts: 742 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    try for this build

    with lunar revamp .. its not that unobtainable anymore.

    and refine isnt that high on it.

    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=2149bc4dcd0227c9
    I look at all the trollers, and Pvpers.. and know they wouldnt have lasted 30sec on Camelot.

    Rules= Know your enemy (players and NPCs) gives you more chances to survive.
  • williamwolfen
    williamwolfen Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I play a light armor veno, currently lvl 64. I can safely say that until about lvl 50, LA is completely superior to arcane. You wont notice your HP being low until the damage of enemies jumps up in the 45-50 range. However, the important thing to note is, that while your HP may be low, that robe veno over there has less than 1/4 the physical defense you do. This means that when a physical mob runs up and hits you, percentage of HP wise, you will be just as well off as her, but will need fewer pots or heals to recover, making you a better tank.

    As for vit arcane being better at high and endgame levels, this is most likely the case. i've seen several builds on a build computer that showed that was the case. however, i would like to advise anyone who does that to make sure no buffs are applied, especially fox form, as it skews the physicla defense stats emmensly. I will admit, that at lvl 80, i will get back on that computer and see if its worth my while to restat, but i feel it wont be, due to the increased cost of needing all of my armor to have 3+ sockets (though i might need that with light armor anyway to acheive significant amounts of HP). As i said earlier, i am only lvl 64, and all i have said about high lvl stuff is only my speculatoin.

    All been said, i'm happy with my LA build at this point in time.
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Yes, the extra Dex from LA could be considered an advantage for melee... Except the extra accu/eva won't make up for the gimped damage. IMO you're better off going HA as the extra Str will allow you to actually get something nearing good dps at high levels.
  • tweakz
    tweakz Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Here's the equips I wear most often (pure mag):
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=ea562754e47a3408

    -The cape has +.2m/s and other stats not showing.

    I have survival gear as an option (rarely used):
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=fb3f34f62333e4a4

    Grinding with survival gear on, even one piece makes a noticeable difference. I can't imagine playing the game PvE with 100 or more vit instead of mag or dex instead of mag. I believe I acquire (grind) faster with this, so I can more easily afford better imbues / refines / equips / skills with less grind time. -Something to consider for the non cash shopper / non pvper.
    Be kind: Help the GMs to depopulate the servers.
  • Reivi - Sanctuary
    Reivi - Sanctuary Posts: 742 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yes, the extra Dex from LA could be considered an advantage for melee... Except the extra accu/eva won't make up for the gimped damage.

    accu / eva are only usefull in melee form ...

    LA veno has 20* the accu of a AA, and 4 times the evade

    Edit : did some rapid tests
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=d756587cc0783a57

    HA veno has 1/2 Accu of a LA veno
    I look at all the trollers, and Pvpers.. and know they wouldnt have lasted 30sec on Camelot.

    Rules= Know your enemy (players and NPCs) gives you more chances to survive.
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Reivi - Sanctuary wrote: »
    accu / eva are only usefull in melee form ...

    LA veno has 20* the accu of a AA, and 4 times the evade

    Edit : did some rapid tests
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=d756587cc0783a57

    HA veno has 1/2 Accu of a LA veno

    Yes, there's a reason melee HAs go for misty forest rings and sometimes shard amber. A high level HA can actually deal more damage in fox form than it will as a caster. An LA will never make that claim and it's mag damage will be just as gimped.
  • Plicid - Heavens Tear
    Plicid - Heavens Tear Posts: 257 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    In the end an Arcane Veno can Have higher Phys and Magic Def then a Light Veno. Most PvP Arcane Venos I see go Vit Build, and put Garnet shards in Armor. with normal refines this is the smart way to do things. Personally I am light. A couple of times I have questioned my choices. Yes I am Happy I went light. Not many of the uber Arcane Venos I know that can solo Tank 3-3 Beast, 3-2 Emperor, or use a Heal macro on 3-2 Minister. so yes my Magic attack is fine.

    Light armor is good if you have no money for shards is the normal statement. While this is true it gives you decent Phys def cheaply, that is not the reason I chose it. I chose it for the higher refine rate. Once you get your armor +8 or higher Light has a definate HP advantage, and you can put Vit stones in while not having to worry about Garnet shards. I am not to this point yet. I could have invested a couple grand to do this, but would rather work for my gear. Refining ornaments will make up for the loss of defences.

    It has been proven again and again what keeps you alive in PvP is HP, and Light has the ability to gain more HP than arcane. You say Heavy does it better? possibly, but End game magic users have better spike damage than phys users, and it is easier to get away from a BM than a wiz. Also with Heavy wearing enough -chan ornaments while maintaing stats is an issue.
  • axt57
    axt57 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    My current LA build

    What I hope to be by 101

    Both builds can be reached without cashshopping.

    I would only recommend the LA build for PvP; and even then only if you are willing to take it far enough to build a good crit rate.

    A good vit arcane build has higher HP, higher m.def and p.def if with garnets. The lower crit helps control agro. High crit is a bish in PvE; most people do not see a veno taking agro so have no idea how to react when the boss rushes away from the barb towards me; it happens daily in BHs and eats my charms up unless I gimp myself by taking off my lunar rings. Due to my gears I do not see this "severely gimped magic attack"; quite the opposite.

    Of course in PvP the high crit shines; I 1 shot a lvl97 BM for a sparked 12k crit just a few hours ago, yesterday a barb with 3x my current HP died without me even using nix... and my weapon is only +3
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Plicid - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    In the end an Arcane Veno can Have higher Phys and Magic Def then a Light Veno. Most PvP Arcane Venos I see go Vit Build, and put Garnet shards in Armor. with normal refines this is the smart way to do things. Personally I am light. A couple of times I have questioned my choices. Yes I am Happy I went light. Not many of the uber Arcane Venos I know that can solo Tank 3-3 Beast, 3-2 Emperor, or use a Heal macro on 3-2 Minister. so yes my Magic attack is fine.

    Light armor is good if you have no money for shards is the normal statement. While this is true it gives you decent Phys def cheaply, that is not the reason I chose it. I chose it for the higher refine rate. Once you get your armor +8 or higher Light has a definate HP advantage, and you can put Vit stones in while not having to worry about Garnet shards. I am not to this point yet. I could have invested a couple grand to do this, but would rather work for my gear. Refining ornaments will make up for the loss of defences.

    It has been proven again and again what keeps you alive in PvP is HP, and Light has the ability to gain more HP than arcane. You say Heavy does it better? possibly, but End game magic users have better spike damage than phys users, and it is easier to get away from a BM than a wiz. Also with Heavy wearing enough -chan ornaments while maintaing stats is an issue.

    True enough. I don't consider full vit arcane a good option either but that is beside the point. Both HA and LA can switch to AA when dealing with certain scenarios, and Arcane can raise phys res to the same levels as LA. It's not survivability that i'm using as a standard. Damage output is severely gimped for LA when compared to AA(caster) or HA(foxform).

    Killing fast is just as important as taking hits on PvP, and on this standard LA is severely lacking.

    Edit; How much crit does a high level LA get from stats? 5%? Even adding gear i'm not sure it makes up for lost dps nor that it becomes reliable enough to use on PvP.
  • axt57
    axt57 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Edit; How much crit does a high level LA get from stats? 5%? Even adding gear i'm not sure it makes up for lost dps nor that it becomes reliable enough to use on PvP.

    Depends on gear level; my current lvl96 build gets an extra 7% crit; final build may give 9% from dex/base alone. Do you consider 28-33% crit to be reliable?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • WaffleChan - Sanctuary
    WaffleChan - Sanctuary Posts: 2,897 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Plicid - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    In the end an Arcane Veno can Have higher Phys and Magic Def then a Light Veno. Most PvP Arcane Venos I see go Vit Build, and put Garnet shards in Armor. with normal refines this is the smart way to do things. Personally I am light. A couple of times I have questioned my choices. Yes I am Happy I went light. Not many of the uber Arcane Venos I know that can solo Tank 3-3 Beast, 3-2 Emperor, or use a Heal macro on 3-2 Minister. so yes my Magic attack is fine.

    Light armor is good if you have no money for shards is the normal statement. While this is true it gives you decent Phys def cheaply, that is not the reason I chose it. I chose it for the higher refine rate. Once you get your armor +8 or higher Light has a definate HP advantage, and you can put Vit stones in while not having to worry about Garnet shards. I am not to this point yet. I could have invested a couple grand to do this, but would rather work for my gear. Refining ornaments will make up for the loss of defences.

    It has been proven again and again what keeps you alive in PvP is HP, and Light has the ability to gain more HP than arcane. You say Heavy does it better? possibly, but End game magic users have better spike damage than phys users, and it is easier to get away from a BM than a wiz. Also with Heavy wearing enough -chan ornaments while maintaing stats is an issue.
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=2e76b09ea8cfe279 <- vit arcane
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=e665a1cf6704b79b <- LA

    looks like youre gimping alot of stats for some crit, and not much of a boost in hp.
    vit arcane is pretty win.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    advice to fledgling archers:
    Going sage is like drunken sex, at first she may look good, but when you wake up the next morning; you'll look at her and go WHAT HAVE I DONE.
  • axt57
    axt57 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    WaffleChan - Sanctuary wrote: »
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=2e76b09ea8cfe279 <- vit arcane
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=e665a1cf6704b79b <- LA

    looks like youre gimping alot of stats for some crit, and not much of a boost in hp.
    vit arcane is pretty win.

    You don't wear a hat with LA.

    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=b83f0052527dd859

    Saves money and gets more HP out of it. Socketing a lvl95 event hat to 4 sockets is not a price that even cashshoppers can afford.

    Also general advice: don't +10 a TT99 weapon. Ever.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    axt57 wrote: »
    Depends on gear level; my current lvl96 build gets an extra 7% crit; final build may give 9% from dex/base alone. Do you consider 28-33% crit to be reliable?

    9% from base dex alone? That's at least 180 Dex. Either you armor or most likely your wep isn't at your level. What's the use of near 30% crit if base damage is 20 levels or more below what you should be doing?
  • axt57
    axt57 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    9% from base dex alone? That's at least 180 Dex. Either you armor or most likely your wep isn't at your level. What's the use of near 30% crit if base damage is 20 levels or more below what you should be doing?

    Check my "upcoming" endgame build in one of my previous posts. Its 160 dex + 1% crit you start with.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    axt57 wrote: »
    Check my "upcoming" endgame build in one of my previous posts. Its 160 dex + 1% crit you start with.

    you're right, i forgot that 1% we all get. However you're still talking 30 stat points missing for mag wep (i'm factoring in you're keeping Str at minimum). For 99 LA the requirements are actually 103 for both Str and Dex. Yes, tome may allow you to get away with it but wouldn't it be better used improving something other than crit?

    Edit; I checked your build. We can all make any idea look good with a love up and down and sharding primevals like there's no tomorrow. Have you tried checking equivalent HA or AA builds?
  • axt57
    axt57 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    you're right, i forgot that 1% we all get. However you're still talking 30 stat points missing for mag wep (i'm factoring in you're keeping Str at minimum). For 99 LA the requirements are actually 103 for both Str and Dex. Yes, tome may allow you to get away with it but wouldn't it be better used improving something other than crit?

    What do you mean by missing 30 magic points for weapon?

    And the whole goal of endgame LA is to build crit. Its inferior in defence and HP to other builds; crit is its saving grace - and the more you have the better it pays off.

    Veno's magic is very hard hitting and underrated... a demon ironwood crit on a (demon venomous) wood debuffed target is seriously going to **** anyone over. Now imagine landing every third hit as a crit, factor in nix, extreme poison, and high -channel... you get the idea.

    Its a build to destroy other people, wether it be a barb, an archer or another veno.

    As for other builds; vit arcane can also build up nice crit rates; but it will never match a LA veno's unless they dex up and lose thier HP/def bonus - in which case why go vit arcane... A very good vit arcane build will have much higher HP and def then LA but will lack that 8-9% crit. To many people 8-9% seems like not a lot; but not to me.

    HA - I really don't see this as a viable build in PvP. Other classes get away with it due to high HP from vit points... veno's don't. I can tell you getting hit by a high-end wiz/veno is bad as LA.. as HA it will destroy you over and over again.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    I meant for non uber CS users, you know, as not getting a boatload of stats from tome...

    I agree with you however, crit rate is LA's saving grace.
  • axt57
    axt57 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    MANray_ - Sanctuary wrote: »
    I meant for non uber CS users, you know, as not getting a boatload of stats from tome...

    I agree with you however, crit rate is LA's saving grace.

    I can gurantee that that endgame build can be reached without CS in a reasonable time, (5-6 months - the time it will take me to get to lvl101) - at least from my current equips, probably not from the ground up.

    All about playing the market.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MANray_ - Sanctuary
    MANray_ - Sanctuary Posts: 2,311 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    axt57 wrote: »
    I can gurantee that that endgame build can be reached without CS in a reasonable time, (5-6 months - the time it will take me to get to lvl101) - at least from my current equips, probably not from the ground up.

    All about playing the market.

    By definition most people won't be succesful playing the market...
  • Plicid - Heavens Tear
    Plicid - Heavens Tear Posts: 257 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    here is my 5 year plan. if you were wondering. I know this will take ALOT of work, but it is achievable.
    has a few less points in magic than I do currently to equip helm, but 19% crit makes up for that in PvP. and for PvE yes this is enough to solo 3-2 Bosses.

    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=1988736905381f37

    and here is an Identicle build but Vit Arcane

    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=abc22d77438f608d

    I understand both are above what is currently considered "End Game" The Arcane has more Pdef and Magic Def than the Light, we knew that this was possible comming in. their magic attack is very compairable. If I had got with the 45 vit tome instead the light would still have more HP but would also have higher magic attack. In my opinion the 2k HP will make a larger difference in PvP survival. and the extra 8% crit will actually make the Light more dangerous.
  • Plicid - Heavens Tear
    Plicid - Heavens Tear Posts: 257 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Sorry for double Post but I looked through thread and this bugged me more than it should have.
    WaffleChan - Sanctuary wrote: »
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=2e76b09ea8cfe279 <- vit arcane
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=e665a1cf6704b79b <- LA

    looks like youre gimping alot of stats for some crit, and not much of a boost in hp.
    vit arcane is pretty win.

    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=12da0fcc75ba1c82 <--LA

    Fixed your LA build on same budget(probably saving you some) Event Helm-> aqua Viscous Elite Leather-> Event cape magic neck-> skydemon's pearl
    changed tome for a different lvl 5 tome, one that a light armor would actually wear. this build has same HP and Pdef as yours but a heack of alot more magic. still has more HP and Pdef than your Vit arcane, but still lacking in Magic Def.

    if you want to compare the 2 at least use a good light build plz.
  • kenlee
    kenlee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    except that is not the AA equivalent imo
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=a33cc1b321524494

    there you go, its much closer to the actual LA build. yea now it has only 1k hp difference (from 11k to 12k) but counting that you +10 everything, i would keep that difference away. now its only 5% crit difference not 8%. magic defence is better, like others said magic users hit alot harder.

    now, if you want to play defensive/support role during TW here is another alternative http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=6248dbed75075fad (you can play around with stats)
    this has better hp/pdef/mdef than LA even at +10. you can go lower on mag and get more hp. anyway, downside is, you dont have such high crit for pvp and channeling (but you can still swap gear for pve)

    i also agree with axt57, HA is not viable build for pvp. yea it is superior in PvE but thats it
  • axt57
    axt57 Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    Would like to point out that the endgame LA nirvana armour set has 8% more p.defence then equivalent AA armor. (both have 16% m.def, but LA has 16% p.def, AA has 8% p.def). Note the stats on these 2 items: LA shirt / AA shirt.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • kenlee
    kenlee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2010
    not really, its just a chance to get 8% more pdef.
    20% chance to get 2% more than AA on each item so that will be 8% more in the best case possible. there is also a chance to get -channeling on AA wrist or leggings while LA get -interval
    ..and to have such pdef as AA you have to use pdef neck/belt gimping mdef. probably not much of a problem if you go +10 or more on rings

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