Is this ksing?

Sheikah - Raging Tide

turdstealer wrote: »

Did you READ the OP? It doesn't appear so. From the screenshot, it appears that the other person was close enough to the mob that intent was obvious (He/she says "right next to" the mob, but I assume a bit of exaggeration for effect). For the dessert analogy, let's say slightly to the side of the dessert and reaching for it (the Original Poster DID say she knew that the other guy was after that mob). She used her longer "reach" to snatch the dessert the other guy was reaching for, and she knew what she was doing. In my book, that is rude.



Rude is rude. It's rude to pull into a parking space that someone else has been patiently waiting for with his blinker on simply because you have the opportunity. It's rude to run over to a new checkout lane opening up at WalMart, beating out an old lady with a walker, simply because you're faster. And it's rude to attack a mob that you know someone else has targeted simply because you can. Has nothing to do with whether the other guy thinks it's rude, or wrong, or ksing, and it has nothing to do with arguing over "laying claim" to a monster, or an area, or whatever. Rude is rude.



Let's see. Yep. Flawed.

This would be more akin to two people, both in range, attacking the mob at the same time. Whoever does 51% of the damage gets the kill. Both have equal "claim" on the mob, but one clearly has the ability to out-damage ("out bid" if you will) the other.


And the reason I hate playing the analogy game is that you wind up refining the analogy to the point of absurdity, and the original point of discussion gets lost in the shuffle of "my analogy is better than yours".

Bottom line. She knew the other guy was intending to attack that particular mob. She attacked it anyway, because she could. In my book, that's rude. Apparently it's not in yours. It's obvious that nothing I can say is going to change your mind, and nothing you can say will change mine -- we're simply going to have to agree to disagree on this.

And you fail to see he later admits in the screen shot that he was not close, he just figured he wanted it he's a melee so he should get special treament and have the monster.
So, again I'm sorry but your the one who is wrong. It was not rude nor KSing.
If you have an axe to grind and veno or long range class bashing to do, do it somewhere else please. Also, she did not attack "because she could" she attacked because he was not in range, she was so the monster was hers. And your right apparently I can't fix your flawed logic nor get you to look at all the facts and I'm sorry for that. so I agree to disagree because to put it politely I'm not going to have my character or hers attacked by you any longer, so I'm letting it go.

turdstealer

Sheikah - Raging Tide wrote: »

And you fail to see he later admits in the screen shot that he was not close, he just figured he wanted it he's a melee so he should get special treament and have the monster.
So, again I'm sorry but your the one who is wrong. It was not rude nor KSing.
If you have an axe to grind and veno or long range class bashing to do, do it somewhere else please. Also, she did not attack "because she could" she attacked because he was not in range, she was so the monster was hers. And your right apparently I can't fix your flawed logic nor get you to look at all the facts and I'm sorry for that. so I agree to disagree because to put it politely I'm not going to have my character or hers attacked by you any longer, so I'm letting it go.

Actually, I play a veno as my main. No intention whatsoever to bash venos, ranged toons, or anyone. However, I can say that I have never KNOWINGLY targeted and killed a mob that someone else had targeted (although I'm reasonably confident I've done it by accident, and the tab-targeting has probably made accidents more prevalent).

Again, bottom line -- OP knew the other guy was going for that mob. She killed it knowing that. Rude. Not objectively wrong or right, but rude nonetheless. Doesn't matter what the melee thought. What makes it rude, in my opinion, is the OP's intent. By her own admission, she knew the other guy had that particular mob targeted and was actively moving in to attack it. Knowing that, she attacked and killed it anyway. The intent makes it rude, rather than the actions alone.

As no analogy will be perfect (by definition), they are ALL flawed.

I see your points, I really do. I simply don't agree with them. My moral compass simply has a different heading for North than yours. Doesn't make mine "more right" than yours, nor yours "more right" than mine. Simply different.

There's no logic involved here, and as far as I am concerned the main "fact" in play is that the OP knowingly went after a mob that someone else had targeted. She was well within her rights to do so and violated no game rules. It's not something I would do, as I consider it rude. Apparently you don't. I can't "prove" to you it's rude, and you can't "prove" to me it's not.

I'm not attacking your character or the OP's. Don't really care if you think it's rude or not. Simply answering the OP's question, and responding to your post. Not sure why you're taking this so personally, and I'm sorry if it seemed that I was attacking your character, as that was never my intent.

Iseria - Harshlands

turdstealer wrote: »

blablabla moral ramble and excuses blablabla

really, was there any need to bring those kind of arguments to A GAME?b:bye

turdstealer

Iseria - Harshlands wrote: »

really, was there any need to bring those kind of arguments to A GAME?b:bye

Didn't. Brought opinions to an internet forum for a game, and answered a question by a poster.

When I'm actually IN-GAME, usually too busy having fun to involve myself in discussions like this, but since I'm at work right now (and can't reasonably PLAY the game), this forum is as good a diversion as anything else...

BellaKitsune - Raging Tide

turdstealer wrote: »

1. Did you READ the OP? It doesn't appear so. From the screenshot, it appears that the other person was close enough to the mob that intent was obvious (He/she says "right next to" the mob, but I assume a bit of exaggeration for effect). For the dessert analogy, let's say slightly to the side of the dessert and reaching for it 2.(the Original Poster DID say she knew that the other guy was after that mob). She used her longer "reach" to snatch the dessert the other guy was reaching for, and she knew what she was doing. In my book, that is rude.



3. Rude is rude. It's rude to pull into a parking space that someone else has been patiently waiting for with his blinker on simply because you have the opportunity. It's rude to run over to a new checkout lane opening up at WalMart, beating out an old lady with a walker, simply because you're faster. And it's rude to attack a mob that you know someone else has targeted simply because you can. Has nothing to do with whether the other guy thinks it's rude, or wrong, or ksing, and it has nothing to do with arguing over "laying claim" to a monster, or an area, or whatever. Rude is rude.

1. The person was not close enough to attack just swimming to it, and at least on my screen looked pretty far away, I can't speak for their screen. Also the person admitted they were just heading to it see below:


2. That is not what I said, I said "Now I saw he/she heading for the monster that I will say straight up." No attack had been launched. And on my screen at least there had been no way to know for certain they would attack the mob, Though I assumed that would have been the intention giving they were fighting the same type of monsters, however I have know way of knowing why their fighting or where they are in a quest, they could have just been wanting to pass by it for all I really knew.

3. I already stated I had not intended to be rude and apologized if I came off as so, you can choose to accept that or not, and if you choose not to, then that's your choice, and I feel sorry for you for not believing a sincere apology

turdstealer wrote: »

Yes, there were extenuating circumstances. Did you attempt to explain to the other person why you attacked that particular mob? Did you attempt to defuse the situation, perhaps come to an agreement or squad with the other person? Or did you simply say to yourself "Hmm. QQ. Gonna ignore that"?

And as for explaining why I attacked that mob I didn't really get a chance, The person left shortly after the conversation And I had a mob I had been attacking at that moment, if I'd stopped to explain I'd have been killed. Besides I was a magic class without a pet, so that should have been obvious. Why would I attack an increased status monster when I have no pet to assist with it, that would be suicide.

turdstealer

BellaKitsune - Raging Tide wrote: »

1. The person was not close enough to attack just swimming to it, and at least on my screen looked pretty far away, I can't speak for their screen. Also the person admitted they were just heading to it see below:


2. That is not what I said, I said "Now I saw he/she heading for the monster that I will say straight up." No attack had been launched. And on my screen at least there had been no way to know for certain they would attack the mob, Though I assumed that would have been the intention giving they were fighting the same type of monsters, however I have know way of knowing why their fighting or where they are in a quest, they could have just been wanting to pass by it for all I really knew.

3. I already stated I had not intended to be rude and apologized if I came off as so, you can choose to accept that or not, and if you choose not to, then that's your choice, and I feel sorry for you for not believing a sincere apology



And as for explaining why I attacked that mob I didn't really get a chance, The person left shortly after the conversation And I had a mob I had been attacking at that moment, if I'd stopped to explain I'd have been killed. Besides I was a magic class without a pet, so that should have been obvious. Why would I attack an increased status monster when I have no pet to assist with it, that would be suicide.

No need to feel offended. You asked for opinions on whether what you did should be classified as KSing. I offered my opinion that it was not, but that I felt it was rude.

If you don't, then more power to you. No need to justify your actions to me, unless you honestly care what I think (and I'm pretty sure you don't). Unless you can state that you had no reason to think that the other guy was going after that particular mob, then IN MY OPINION what you did was rude.

One tiny question before I go: If you are so certain that you were completely in the "right" in this situation, then why did you ask the original question?

Sheikah - Raging Tide

turdstealer wrote: »

Actually, I play a veno as my main. No intention whatsoever to bash venos, ranged toons, or anyone. However, I can say that I have never KNOWINGLY targeted and killed a mob that someone else had targeted (although I'm reasonably confident I've done it by accident, and the tab-targeting has probably made accidents more prevalent).

Again, bottom line -- OP knew the other guy was going for that mob. She killed it knowing that. Rude. Not objectively wrong or right, but rude nonetheless. Doesn't matter what the melee thought. What makes it rude, in my opinion, is the OP's intent. By her own admission, she knew the other guy had that particular mob targeted and was actively moving in to attack it. Knowing that, she attacked and killed it anyway. The intent makes it rude, rather than the actions alone.

As no analogy will be perfect (by definition), they are ALL flawed.

I see your points, I really do. I simply don't agree with them. My moral compass simply has a different heading for North than yours. Doesn't make mine "more right" than yours, nor yours "more right" than mine. Simply different.

There's no logic involved here, and as far as I am concerned the main "fact" in play is that the OP knowingly went after a mob that someone else had targeted. She was well within her rights to do so and violated no game rules. It's not something I would do, as I consider it rude. Apparently you don't. I can't "prove" to you it's rude, and you can't "prove" to me it's not.

I'm not attacking your character or the OP's. Don't really care if you think it's rude or not. Simply answering the OP's question, and responding to your post. Not sure why you're taking this so personally, and I'm sorry if it seemed that I was attacking your character, as that was never my intent.

I'm sorry but logic is involved here because logic is what interprets facts. In other words to have an argument you have to use logic to come up with it.
And I am a polite person probably verging on being overly polite so has to almost give up nearly all right or claim I have to something and so no I do not think it rude because I state again running to something with intent to kill it does not give the person running to it any claim over it to call is KSing nor to call it rude. If you read my other posts in replies to other people you would see the reason its unfair to call it that.

Besides if I and another melee are running to a mob both figuring we want that monster and one of us speeds ahead of the other using a skill and kills the monster is that rude? If not neither is what she did.

Also, saying all analogy's are flawed is a wrong and ill logical statement in its self.

But, again as we are not going to agree we should both just let it go.
though in closing, this was technically a yes or no question KSing? yes? or no? not: No, but I think or yes, but I think....and as you stated that you answered she was not KSing to go on and state what you say is just your own book of rules that you apply to your self to bring them up here and take the chance of making her feel guilty for something you said she was not breaking any game rules in doing is unfair and going to far plus out of context for the topic.
Plus, she apologized for if what she did came off rude to continue to bring it up and call it rude ignoring the apology is also not very nice.

BellaKitsune - Raging Tide

turdstealer wrote: »

1. No need to feel offended. You asked for opinions on whether what you did should be classified as KSing. I offered my opinion that it was not, but that I felt it was rude.

2. If you don't, then more power to you. No need to justify your actions to me, unless you honestly care what I think (and I'm pretty sure you don't). Unless you can state that you had no reason to think that the other guy was going after that particular mob, then IN MY OPINION what you did was rude.

3. One tiny question before I go: If you are so certain that you were completely in the "right" in this situation, then why did you ask the original question?

1. The only reason I felt offended is because you you gave me the impression that I was trying to be rude on purpose. I had apologize if it had come off as rude and stated I had not intended to.

2. If the person had been within attack range, and on my screen at least, they were not, then yes I do think it would have been rude, but I can only go by my screen, and on my screen they didn't look that close. And yes I do care about other peoples feelings which is why I try very hard not ks. And in most situations, if someone comes to attack, sometimes even if they ksed me, I just move to another monster, but in this case all the other mobs had increased status, and I can't fight those without a pet.

3. I asked because I had only what people had told me along time ago in another game I had played, what ksing was, I wanted to make sure it was correct.

turdstealer

Sheikah - Raging Tide wrote: »

I'm sorry but logic is involved here because logic is what interprets facts. In other words to have an argument you have to use logic to come up with it.

Except that we happen to be discussing a matter of opinion. Logic is immaterial. Were I trying to sway your opinion, I might be inclined to craft a logically coherent argument. But I really don't care one whit whether you agree with me or not.

Sheikah - Raging Tide wrote: »

And I am a polite person probably verging on being overly polite so has to almost give up nearly all right or claim I have to something and so no I do not think it rude because I state again running to something with intent to kill it does not give the person running to it any claim over it to call is KSing nor to call it rude. If you read my other posts in replies to other people you would see the reason its unfair to call it that.

I happen to be a very polite person myself in most situations. I also happen to think the OP was rude. Not sure why you seem to care what I think of you or your opinion, but I'm sure you are a nice person. We simply disagree on this.

Sheikah - Raging Tide wrote: »

Besides if I and another melee are running to a mob both figuring we want that monster and one of us speeds ahead of the other using a skill and kills the monster is that rude? If not neither is what she did.

Actually, both are rude. Not wrong, but rude. In my opinion, and that's all it is.

Sheikah - Raging Tide wrote: »

Also, saying all analogy's are flawed is a wrong and ill logical statement in its self.

An analogy in this context (philosophy, debate) is a semantic device to emphasize similarities between two things (in this case situations and moral dilemmas) while minimizing differences. For an analogy to be perfect, you'd have to show that there were no differences whatsoever, or at least be able to reasonably infer no differences from the similarities. Since unless you are talking about two identical things (in which case there would be no reason for an analogy) there will always be differences, then it follows there will always be flaws in the analogies. They can be better or worse, but never perfect. I'm sorry, but in this case you are wrong.

Sheikah - Raging Tide wrote: »

But, again as we are not going to agree we should both just let it go.
though in closing, this was technically a yes or no question KSing? yes? or no? not: No, but I think or yes, but I think....and as you stated that you answered she was not KSing to go on and state what you say is just your own book of rules that you apply to your self to bring them up here and take the chance of making her feel guilty for something you said she was not breaking any game rules in doing is unfair and going to far plus out of context for the topic.

Actually, the question I was responding to was "Am I right or are they?" To me, that was really asking more than "Was I technically correct in that I violated no game rules or policies?". I took it as more of a "Did the other person have reasonable cause to be offended by my actions?"

Sheikah - Raging Tide wrote: »

Plus, she apologized for if what she did came off rude to continue to bring it up and call it rude ignoring the apology is also not very nice.

I didn't ignore the apology. It simply had no bearing on whether I thought her actions were rude.

As a matter of fact, if it was a genuine apology, then even the OP must have had at least some indication that she'd done something which warranted an apology. And if it wasn't genuine, then it was nothing more than a meaningless stream of characters on the screen.

Sheikah - Raging Tide

turdstealer wrote: »

Except that we happen to be discussing a matter of opinion. Logic is immaterial. Were I trying to sway your opinion, I might be inclined to craft a logically coherent argument. But I really don't care one whit whether you agree with me or not.



I happen to be a very polite person myself in most situations. I also happen to think the OP was rude. Not sure why you seem to care what I think of you or your opinion, but I'm sure you are a nice person. We simply disagree on this.



Actually, both are rude. Not wrong, but rude. In my opinion, and that's all it is.



An analogy in this context (philosophy, debate) is a semantic device to emphasize similarities between two things (in this case situations and moral dilemmas) while minimizing differences. For an analogy to be perfect, you'd have to show that there were no differences whatsoever, or at least be able to reasonably infer no differences from the similarities. Since unless you are talking about two identical things (in which case there would be no reason for an analogy) there will always be differences, then it follows there will always be flaws in the analogies. They can be better or worse, but never perfect. I'm sorry, but in this case you are wrong.



Actually, the question I was responding to was "Am I right or are they?" To me, that was really asking more than "Was I technically correct in that I violated no game rules or policies?". I took it as more of a "Did the other person have reasonable cause to be offended by my actions?"



I didn't ignore the apology. It simply had no bearing on whether I thought her actions were rude.

As a matter of fact, if it was a genuine apology, then even the OP must have had at least some indication that she'd done something which warranted an apology. And if it wasn't genuine, then it was nothing more than a meaningless stream of characters on the screen.

I'm going to ignore this because:
for 1. your attacking me again for no reason after we both agreed to drop this.

oh yes and 2. you keep trying to beat my opinions and prove my wrong statements ( like on analogy's, logic, etc ) with nonsense arguments you say you don't care if I agree with or not . So, I don't know why you keep replying.

3. saying her apology has no bearing or rather affect to your opinion IS ignoring the apology


So, since we according to you don't care what you think and that you don't care if she apologizes or not and are not going to listen to us nor are we going to listen to what you your self say is nonsense statements. You might as well quit embarrassing your self before I start thinking your almost personal defense of the unknown "Supposed KSed or wronged person" and rebuttal of any statements that prove her innocent of anything leads me to think you could be the other party who was involved.

Besides you've stated your opinion ( way too many time's in fact )and shes done all she can do which is apologize. What exactly do you want? what on earth do you think you can gain from saying your not trying to attack me and will let it go than turning around and not dropping it and trying to out do my opinion in an attempt to prove me wrong?

Axelire - Heavens Tear

BellaKitsune - Raging Tide wrote: »

Now I saw he/she heading for the monster that I will say straight up.

You weren't KSing. You were just inconsiderate.

Herne_Hunter - Sanctuary

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

Yes, it's KS'ing.

Technically I could hop on a lv100 archer and one shot mobs just as a barb/bm runs over to them. He never gets a hit in, so it's perfectly legitimate non-ks, right? See my point. If you were the barb you'd be annoyed.

technically speaking how the hell would she know that the person was going to kill that mob ? it so happens to em at times that there are 2 mobs at the same place side by side or rather a few mobs together and i target one and another ranged can target another one how would we know who is attacking whom until the shots are casted, more over its not a KS, KS= Kill Steal, meaning if am killing a mob and someone comes and starts hitting the mob and end up having Aggro and get credit for the kill and the first person doesnt then its called Kill Steal other than that if u hit first the mobs urs nothing more about it

LeirtA - Lost City

LOLz it's not as if the mobs don't respawn and the mobs do respawn fast enough for everyone. If I have accidentally targetted a mob that someone else is going for, I recall my pet or if my pet has already done damage to the mob, I unsummon it, say sorry and move on. It works EVERYTIME just by taking the initiative to be nice (call me a carebear if you will) and the other party always says its okay, accidents do happen and they let it slide. I usually get a squad invite at the same time along with buffies and help to complete the quests too! I get to make new friends too just by being nice, isn't that wonderful?

Win win situation instead of win lose or lose lose situation for everyone. b:victory[/I]

Saitada - Sanctuary

Technically it is not KS'ing. Also, just because someone is swimming/running/flying in the direction of a mob does not mean they are going to attack it. I have flown/swam/ran past/through a lot of mobs as I headed out after reaching my kill requirements.

Also, an assassin has a ranged attack (knife throw) so they can easily use that attack to pull mobs from a distance (DorkFish does so frequently) so there is no need to try and say that as a melee class assassins have to be right up on the mob to attack it (initially) and gain agro. They can do so from range and then go after the mob once they are in melee range as normal (knife throw is also a nice kiting skill for those exploding mobs... get them down close to death, hit them with 'puncture wound' then run like hell. Let it tick down and throw knives at them. They tick themselves to death and go boom, your safely out of range).

~Saitada

SmilingCooki - Sanctuary

_DarkSeph_ - Sanctuary wrote: »

Yes, it's KS'ing.

Come on, have some manners If someones heading towards a mob with an intention to kill it, you shrug and move to the next. Firing first because you can and adding silly interpretations like "you didn't hit the mob, iz not ks" is simply being rude.

I'm not giving you sympathy, I don't have much respect for rudeness. What you should have said was.... "Oh sorry, accident" and both gone on your way.

Technically I could hop on a lv100 archer and one shot mobs just as a barb/bm runs over to them. He never gets a hit in, so it's perfectly legitimate non-ks, right? See my point. If you were the barb you'd be annoyed.

Just gonna put this out there... But um, most people who don't like to lag out have proxy's on with distance minimized so you can only see someone if like, 2 feet away from you. So, don't complain if they can't see you and attack something that's close to you, in other words, don't judge a book by it's cover >.> not everything appears to be as it is.

Edit: And if you did hop on a Lv100 Archer and 1 hit mobs you DIDN'T need, that would be KSing.