The best mage PVP build

13»

Comments

  • Taoist_Xel - Heavens Tear
    Taoist_Xel - Heavens Tear Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    Yea.. This thread is simply ridiculous. I only play Wiz. My lvl105 and my lvl104 wizards are Hybrid. It's simply the only way to go. (Also Chemistry.. lots and lots of chemistry) Pure deals a lot of damage.. but pfft..where's the fun in that? Yay I one shotted something else... boring. LA is great if you want to look cool in useless armor that cripples you. "Oh I should would love to cast this spell, but darn it all.. this heavy armor is making me not move my hands fast enough but look how cool I look..guys?..hey guys?" and now what I think about it.. probably straight naked is the way to go.. strike that..wait..what?

    So my 2 cents.. go Hybrid.
    And I would have posted this on one of my mains.. but um.. we all know that's simply not how us "smart" players show our superior mastery of this game in these forums.
  • complexx
    complexx Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    Light is cheap and easy

    Just like you hoe.
    b:cute

    Sinnerz Lost City PvP.
  • Piliener - Lost City
    Piliener - Lost City Posts: 589 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    Yea.. This thread is simply ridiculous. I only play Wiz. My lvl105 and my lvl104 wizards are Hybrid. It's simply the only way to go. (Also Chemistry.. lots and lots of chemistry) Pure deals a lot of damage.. but pfft..where's the fun in that? Yay I one shotted something else... boring. LA is great if you want to look cool in useless armor that cripples you. "Oh I should would love to cast this spell, but darn it all.. this heavy armor is making me not move my hands fast enough but look how cool I look..guys?..hey guys?" and now what I think about it.. probably straight naked is the way to go.. strike that..wait..what?

    So my 2 cents.. go Hybrid.
    And I would have posted this on one of my mains.. but um.. we all know that's simply not how us "smart" players show our superior mastery of this game in these forums.

    If you had a lvl104 and 105 you would be ranked
    Spoons you will forever be missed in this community
  • U_got_sniped - Lost City
    U_got_sniped - Lost City Posts: 292 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    hi phillyb:bye
  • DishyWiggles - Harshlands
    DishyWiggles - Harshlands Posts: 130 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    with LA u do 3 mag instead of 4-5 a level so your dmg is over 25% lower
  • Rinnve - Lost City
    Rinnve - Lost City Posts: 473 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    Lolno. 46 wiz with 3 vit/lvl with WoF has max matk 1328, so with gush maximum pure damage is 1328+499+1372.6=3199,6; pure mag wiz has max matk 1792, gush damage is 3663,6. 115% of la/vit damage, not a great deal considering extreme squishiness of pure wiz.
    --
    PWonline.ru, Sirius: Иней, 70 cleric - off.
    PWI, Lost City: Rinnve, 7X wiz (frozen);
    Allods Online, Раскол: Риннве, 2X occultist
  • Taoist_Xel - Heavens Tear
    Taoist_Xel - Heavens Tear Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    I'm going to respond to that by just laughing.
  • Phsyco - Lost City
    Phsyco - Lost City Posts: 327 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    With which spell?

    i think he means in general ur damage is about 25% lower but i havn't noticed that much difference in damage between pure and LA... i am LA and i hit about the same as any pure wiz my level
  • tanglung
    tanglung Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    A few points to ponder:

    1) I have a lvl 83 WB, and a lvl 53 MG; I play both, and while I may not know the higher aspects of a MG's 8x-9x PvP dynamics, I can draw my conclusions from PK and fighting many a lvl 8x-9x MG in LA and Arcane. In the end, I'll look at this argument both from the side of the MG, as well as the point of the WB on the receiving end of the various MG builds.

    2) Either players like Llama, Elayne, Nabmonic, and the rest of the Arcane geared lvl 100 MG's in CQ are just mainstream (like the vast majority of the MG's who go around in arcane), utterly and completely stupid, totally off the mark, and have no clue what the hell they're doing... or the few MG's who go LA, profess the superiority of LA vs. Arcane know something obscure which we dont. Ladies and gentlemen, there IS a reason why higher level MG's go Arcane.

    3) Yes, LA has it's advantages over Arcane... to an extent, and within a certain level range. My view is that, this is far more useful at lower levels, up until 60 or so. After that, I would propend to Arcane. Why lvl 60, or am I just pulling a number out of my ****, arbitrarily?

    a. At level 60, you get your HH gear. While in terms of defence, an Arcane char hasn't the defence (phys) of LA, your damage output receives a MASSIVE increase. Let's not forget, the biggest factor in damage output is your weapon, compounded by your INT. All I have to do is switch to an HH weapon to receive another 1k to my damage attack. And I don't mean from a lvl 30 weapon, either.

    b. In any class you play (and I play all 6, all of which are lvl 4x+), you can get by decently well questing on your own (FB's and bosses excluded) up until lvl 60 or so. After that, the squad context begins to become the predominant fashion in which you play. Your lack of defence is offset by the rest of the party's involvement in the missions / tasks. You will not be tanking, so your LA's increased phys def. will become irrelevant; your primary role of dishing out INSANE damage becomes the priority.

    c. I want to touch up on a very good point made by Llama, of the reason why people play MG. You are a Damage Dealer. Period. Even in LA, your strong point will be your damage output. When you reach lvl 60, you'll be doing much more damage. It pays to realise that up until a point, the classes' differences are NOT that immensely different and relevant - each can quest, do damage, use pots, and so on. I know, a WB has more HP, and has no need to kite. But at the same time, he does far less damage, and grinding is a long-winded process. An EA can range, and usually rely on a crit to save the day (again), whereas a BM has to chase mobs down, to kill them. So in that sense, yes... there are differences. But think back on how you've played, up until a point. In an fb, an EP will be healing a hell of a lot more than he/she would be casting Plume Shot or Razor Feathers. You need to realise that at a certain level, you almost NEVER play alone. And only within the context of a team, do the big differences and main accountabilities really begin to surface. At that point, you really should be doing what you do best.

    d. Sequitur to point c: Do LA WB's tank? No. And as a tank, when you have a PvP Dex build, you will not be nearly as usefull (if AT ALL) when a tank is needed for fb79, or what have you. Given the option of a pure Dex EA, and a LA MG, my option is to take the EA in the party. ALWAYS. He/she is there do damage, and that's what I need you to do.

    e. LA sucks. Period. It's NOT the LA that makes EA's that formidable. It's their damage output, and crit rate. Yes, I know... when you get up close to an EA, they can be squishy... BUT... you have to hit them first. And why do we miss them so much? It's their high Evasion. Where did they get that high evasion from? From their Dex build. NOT the LA. As a MG, you won't ever be putting enough Dex into your build, to have such an evasion, or you'll be an epic failure unable to cast more than 2 Sandstorms before you're out of Mana.

    f. Sequitur to point d: LA really DOES suck. The protection is mediocre, at best. The defences (both phys and mag.) are so highly compromised, that you end up being a "half and half". Yes, you can be killed less easily by a melee class (as a LA build), but by HOW MUCH? A negligible figure, at best... and this is coming from a lvl 83 WB that sometimes has to punish red named MG's... in both LA and Arcane. Conversely, it might take a MG or Cleric 1 hit more to take you out. But don't forget that MG's and Clerics (metal) can - and DO - dish out MASSIVE damage; it won't be your LA that makes a difference. Better to be a master of one, than a jack of all trades. You're a LA MG? Restat at lvl 60. Personally, I'd rather take out a mob / player in 3 hits WITHOUT getting hit, than in 5 hits... while taking a hit myself.

    I find it amusing that people want to get into calculations. Ok, so maybe you may do 300 less damage as a LA MG. But it could be offset by a crit rate. Or you may blast out more attacks due to -channeling. Then one may start considering gear, accessories, and refinements... in addition to stats. Guys, stuff like that is so variable. You can spend all day trying to compute all the various possibilites, and still end up with 6 of one, and half a dozen of the other. Bottom line is: High STR = greater phys. damage / High INT = greater mag. damage. And as I said earlier, the differences in LA will not offset that to a significant degree, since LA is mediocre.

    From a higher level WB's perspective, I have no more of a hard time killing a LA MG, than an Arcane MG. Well, maybe it might take a hit more. But an LA MG will have a harder time killing me, with my 11,5k HP, than a pure stat MG. Often times, though, it will boil down to tactics (much like TW), and how you play your class. Any SMART MG will know to kite a melee class, while sealing, gushing, and doing whatever it takes to keep it away from him/her. And oh, btw... when a MG uses Distance Shrink, figure you're going to be running back and forth while he/she nails you like a shooting gallery. thankfully for the MG, with a melee class's low mag. def, it's over quick... even quicker if the MG is a pure INT build. Against EA, that's a different story (for most everyone), so good luck with that...
  • Rinnve - Lost City
    Rinnve - Lost City Posts: 473 Arc User
    edited May 2009
    What a wall of text b:tired
    Ok, let's begin. Keep in mind that i'll talk about both la and vit builds as they are not unsimilar in their goals: to get some survivability (hp and then def for vit, def and then hp for LA) at the price of lower damage; so, your "arcane" i'll call "pure".
    tanglung wrote: »
    a. At level 60, you get your HH gear. While in terms of defence, an Arcane char hasn't the defence (phys) of LA, your damage output receives a MASSIVE increase.
    Ok, let's look at this massive increase. My current build:
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=321bf1adb678742c
    Same equipment, pure magic build:
    http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=417a51be69131739

    Average magic attack of pure is 736 greater. I hit now about 3-4k (5-6k on water mobs), so it is just another hit or about 15% dps increase. Not bad, but massive? Don't think so. And what pure trades for this +15% dps... Hp is 1.5k. Unacceptable. Let's shard hp stones: http://pwcalc.ru/pwi/?char=f3bff1d8ad4d680d
    Now it is 1.9k. Still low, but bearable. Def is 23% instead of 32% unbuffed, or 37% vs 47% with earth shield, or 48% vs 58% with all buffs. If aoe hits me for 600 and takes 24% of hp, pure will suffer about 750 - it's about 40% of his hp. 24% hp i can back up on my own, with potions and powders or even self-heal; if another aoe hits too soon, i'll be still at 50% hp. 40% requires immediate cleric attention, 'cause another aoe means only 20% hp left. This is the difference between useful damage dealer and dead one. The same goes for pvp. I was rejected from fb teams (which assumed that robe = pure build) for that very reason: "you are wiz, you are too squishy, we do not want you". This is how much they want (pure) wiz, "insane damage dealer".
    tanglung wrote: »
    Your lack of defence is offset by the rest of the party's involvement in the missions / tasks. You will not be tanking, so your LA's increased phys def. will become irrelevant; your primary role of dishing out INSANE damage becomes the priority.
    1. All this additional hp and def is not about tanking. It is about surviving long enough to be useful.
    2. Well, you say that pure can deal insane damage. 85% of insane is too low for you?
    tanglung wrote: »
    e. LA sucks. Period. It's NOT the LA that makes EA's that formidable. It's their damage output, and crit rate.
    But not only that. Archers get more hp per level: pure dex ea gets 2.1k on 80 without any equipment, whereas pure mag wiz gets only 1.6k. Archers have very good evasion, and can use their shield to take some magical hits. Wizards have nothing like that.
    tanglung wrote: »
    Personally, I'd rather take out a mob / player in 3 hits WITHOUT getting hit, than in 5 hits... while taking a hit myself.
    There are many mobs that even pure can not take out with 3-4 hits staying untouched.
    --
    PWonline.ru, Sirius: Иней, 70 cleric - off.
    PWI, Lost City: Rinnve, 7X wiz (frozen);
    Allods Online, Раскол: Риннве, 2X occultist
  • Zeonus - Heavens Tear
    Zeonus - Heavens Tear Posts: 36 Arc User
    edited June 2009
    fiddle wrote: »
    LA (Light Armor) build is the best pvp build for a mage. Now i realize that there is a lot of resistance to this idea but anybody who objects is either ignorant, just plain stupid or a fail. let me explain why. I am not just typing things ive heard, only things iv'e experienced. And ive tested out every build on my mage. (except melee......fail) The only 2 builds that will get you anywhere are pure or LA. I was a pure mage from 3x-7x. You kill mobs fast but any archer, warrior, or barb thats comes by and wants to kill you will no doubt succeed. Even fighting physical mobs sucks if you get more than one on you at the same time. Clerics own you hard with their plume shot and venos will always present a challenge (guarentee dead if they have a pheonix) The only class that you do well against-if you can even call it that-is your own. PVP is hell for pure mages-and if me, an 8x mage cant persuade you of this look at the other high lvl mages that have posted forums telling so. The only good time i ever had as a pure mage in PVP was in mnass PVP where its easy to get away from ppl and assisst attack. But the second i was targeted i was dead. But......there is hope.

    LA mage is a complete turnaround. Ive been LA for a decent time by now and let me tell you, i love pvp now. Ive fought archers, warriors, barbs that completely one shot me the entire time ive known them (all 30+ lvls) and i can kill them now. Clerics still hurt with their magic but i can kill them one on one if im not double teamed (will explain why is a second) As for mages-unless ive been unlucky enough to fight really bad mages-LA completely ownes pure mages (will also explain in a sec)

    But, as a LA mage you have to put in the effort, time, and money to use the build well. A simple LA mage will fail horribly but if you put more effort into your gear to assisst your build you will do great. For instance-go higher crit% or minus channeling or a mix of both. atm i have -21% channeling and 7% crit. Its not bad i get shots off a lot faster and because i get more shots off i crit more. This also helps LA mage have great DPS (damage per second). my DPS is better now than it was when i was a pure mage because of my crit and faster channeling. And in pvp not only do i take damg more but i deal a lot more dmg overall. Not to mention a LA mage with good crit, minus channel or both AND undine strike deals great dmg.....which is what i have. Ive one shot and had long battles with every calss and won so far and all were 8x+. Now as i was saying-clerics.

    LA mage vs. a cleric is a tough fight on our part. we dont really need to worry about plume shot anymore but their magic does some good dmg to us. BUT-we still have the advantage IF you have good minus channel-crit and or undine strike. thing is we have the hp to take it. all my gear is 4 socket w beautifull hp shards and +3 or higher and my hp makes up for my loss in mag resist. Yes they hit me harder but i can take more shots now while they cant. At this point blade tempest pretty much one hits any clerics ive done on and in one on one fight ive killed them all and i didnt have to pot (all were 8x+) As for mages same deal. If i dont crit one shot (which has happened a lot) i can one shot w/ blade tempest. yes they hit me harder than b4 but my hp makes up for it and i can take more hits from them.

    So there it is. a LA mage with good +and socketed/sharded gear plus undine and great minus channel/crit ownes. Its a lot of work but mage itsself is a lot of work. If you dont want to put out the effort go join sanc or other carebear server or get rdy to get beat in a majority of your pvp fights or duels. I wrote this 20 minutes b4 class so im sure there are a lot of spelling/grammer mistakes......get over it. RQ FTW.


    You do realize everything you said, a pure build can obviously never do.

    Robes can't refine.
    Robes can't get -chan gear.
    For some reason we can't use our undine...
    No way in hell we can put shards in our gear.
    And there's no way that the robe's damage is higher than a LA's, to the point to where a small amount of 7% compensates for a lack of DPS, for a DPS class. No way bro.
  • KevinK - Sanctuary
    KevinK - Sanctuary Posts: 145 Arc User
    edited June 2009
    You do realize everything you said, a pure build can obviously never do.

    Robes can't refine.
    Robes can't get -chan gear.
    For some reason we can't use our undine...
    No way in hell we can put shards in our gear.
    And there's no way that the robe's damage is higher than a LA's, to the point to where a small amount of 7% compensates for a lack of DPS, for a DPS class. No way bro.



    The above quoted is being sarcastic for those who didnt know :P
  • Mizuoni - Dreamweaver
    Mizuoni - Dreamweaver Posts: 3,533 Arc User
    edited June 2009
    funny story, this morning i 3 shotted a 7x LA wizard. his SS did 600 on me LOL epic phail.

    Its me mizu, i Pk, and i wear robes. Its not hard just gotta take pride in your armor. The only time i lose is > A: when im talking to someone, B: when the person is lvl 70+ (unless its a LA wiz pffft what a pushover)

    But there is only one LA wizard that i seen that does decent damage. He has cool looking armor too. Think he is 8x now or something like that.
    Sins are Scissors. Psychics are Rocks.
    Archers, Venos, Barbs, Wizards, BMs, Mystics, Seekers are Paper.
    ...and Clerics are Mushrooms.
    Paper beats Rock. Scissors beats Paper. Scissors also happens to beat Rock...until Rock gets 50k+ soulforce at which point Rock becomes an unstoppable killing machine that beats Paper... and would beat Scissors but it can't find Scissors, because Scissors are invisible.
    So Scissors beat Paper and avoids Rock, and that is called BALANCE. -cheze
  • Piliener - Lost City
    Piliener - Lost City Posts: 589 Arc User
    edited June 2009
    i Pk

    Why don't you come to a pvp server if you want to pk?
    Spoons you will forever be missed in this community
  • Kristoph - Lost City
    Kristoph - Lost City Posts: 2,016 Arc User
    edited June 2009
    funny story, this morning i 3 shotted a 7x LA wizard. his SS did 600 on me LOL epic phail.

    Its me mizu, i Pk, and i wear robes. Its not hard just gotta take pride in your armor. The only time i lose is > A: when im talking to someone, B: when the person is lvl 70+ (unless its a LA wiz pffft what a pushover)

    But there is only one LA wizard that i seen that does decent damage. He has cool looking armor too. Think he is 8x now or something like that.
    if BMs/Barbs/Archers/Phoenixes/Clerics don't wreck your crappy 6x arcane wizard, it's just proof that heaven's tear fails.
    Wondering how much longer these **** packs are going to be around.
  • Tyger_Myst - Sanctuary
    Tyger_Myst - Sanctuary Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    b:boredb:infuriated this is madness
    Life is but a game played the shadows of ones
    own destiny.....
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    b:boredb:infuriated this is madness

    b:angry
    necro necro necro necro
    .....
    don't necro dead threads

    also lol at fiddle such a dumb ****.
    xD
    fiddle wrote: »
    This also helps LA mage have great DPS (damage per second). my DPS is better now than it was when i was a pure mage because of my crit and faster channeling.

    last me checked.....Dex (in reference to LA) doesn't give faster channeling lol...
    he probably went light armor demon, was happy for about 2 days, then realized what a horrible mistake he made, and ragequit.
    xD
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ROFLMAOMFG - Lost City
    ROFLMAOMFG - Lost City Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    LA is terrible.

    Don't do it.

    Best? Its not even close. Its the worst.

    Again: Don't do it.

    ^This. Pay attention. This man won PW, incase you forgot.

    Besides that, I'm pure build. Pure build being 1str and 9mag per two levels. With this build, squishiness is almost nonfactor; I.E. I kill **** before it hits me. Period. If something hits me, it's because of 1 of three things (this applies to both pve and pvp)

    1. I f*cked it up.
    2. I f*cked it up, and my target was a higher level.
    3. I was afk.

    So, that being said, there is no point to LA. Wizzies are supposed to kill **** before it gets to them. If you're LA you can't do that. And LA also doesn't provide enough pdef to cover the low hp incase you do get hit. So just...no. You're wrong. Thats that.b:bye

    /Thread.
  • Stickygreen - Heavens Tear
    Stickygreen - Heavens Tear Posts: 2,158 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    ^This. Pay attention. This man won PW, incase you forgot.

    Besides that, I'm pure build. Pure build being 1str and 9mag per two levels. With this build, squishiness is almost nonfactor; I.E. I kill **** before it hits me. Period. If something hits me, it's because of 1 of three things (this applies to both pve and pvp)

    1. I f*cked it up.
    2. I f*cked it up, and my target was a higher level.
    3. I was afk.

    So, that being said, there is no point to LA. Wizzies are supposed to kill **** before it gets to them. If you're LA you can't do that. And LA also doesn't provide enough pdef to cover the low hp incase you do get hit. So just...no. You're wrong. Thats that.b:bye

    /Thread.

    I LOL'ed ....
    Less QQ more Pew Pewb:thanks

    "Don't argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience."

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • MagicHamsta - Lost City
    MagicHamsta - Lost City Posts: 10,466 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    ^This. Pay attention. This man won PW, incase you forgot.

    yesh....
    he has gotten so powerful that his damage be directly proportional to gold prices.
    b:shocked
    his power level...
    It's.....Over......Nine....THOUSAND~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111!!Eleventy!1!!!1!!!1!
    b:angry
    darthpanda16: Firefox crashed on me. Aryannamage: I don't think I am a GM that would be new.
    Hawk:Do this. closing thread
    frankieraye: I'll see if we can replace the woman with a stick figure and the tiger fangs with marshmallows.//Issues like these need to get escalated quickly to minimize the damage.
    Kantorek: Yeah.. you should try it. It's awesome.
    Sihndra: Nope- not currently possible under any circumstances. Sorry.
    LokisDottir: I mean...not haunting the forums, nope nope..
    Konariraiden: You don't know what you are up against. You will lose.
    Waiting for...Hamster Packs!
    58% chance to get tokens
    41% chance to get an all class pet hamster....but they has already been freed by the magic hamster.
    1% chance to get ban hamstered with the message "Hamsters United!"
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ROFLMAOMFG - Lost City
    ROFLMAOMFG - Lost City Posts: 43 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    yesh....
    he has gotten so powerful that his damage be directly proportional to gold prices.
    b:shocked
    his power level...
    It's.....Over......Nine....THOUSAND~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111!!Eleventy!1!!!1!!!1!
    b:angry

    But who knows when his brain could be infested with hamsters b:shocked
  • Falcondance - Heavens Tear
    Falcondance - Heavens Tear Posts: 699 Arc User
    edited December 2009
    b:boredb:infuriated This Is Madness

    This Is SPARTAAAAA!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    "I always thought I'd be the only one doing crazy things for people who would never care enough to do it back or to act like idiots or be entirely vulnerable, and making someone fall in love with you is easy, and flying 3000 miles on four days notice because you can't just sit there and do nothing and breathe into telephones is not everyone's idea of love, but it is the way I can recognize it because that is what I do."
    Sig pic by Nowitsawn