Make your Ranger STAND OUT in PVP

Leaderalan - Lost City

You’re wasting my time and I will be the bigger man.
I am going to stop while you’re behind.
1. Spaming on my thread
2. No trolling & flaming
3. Waste mine and everyone else time.


Quote from rules thread:

“A Note about Respect

We're here to have fun and to share information with each other. With so many different personalities gathered in one place, clashes are bound to happen now and then. But how one conducts oneself during these situations makes all the difference. Don't get us wrong, opinions are valued on the forums, yours and everybody else's. But please remember to respect each other and have discussions and not arguments. If you find yourself disagreeing with another member, think first and then calmly compose your words. Don't be insulting if you happen to disagree with someone, just understand that their views are different than yours. Just really treat each other how you would like to be treated.” Pw rules thread, pg1

Facts:

Take Aim

Range: Long Ranged
Mana: 120
Channel: Charge
Cast: 0.6 seconds
Cooldown: 3.0 seconds
Weapon: Ranged Weapons
Requisite Cultivation: Aware of the Myriad

Charge for up to 3.0 seconds to attack enemy, inflicting base physical damage plus up to 400% of weapon damage.

Requires 1 arrow, bolt or shot.

Sage version always gives 500% of weapon damage
Demon version reduces the charge time required by 0.5 seconds.

Winged blessing

Passive Skill
Requisite Cultivation: Aware of the Myriad

Increases the range of all ranged attacks by 12 meters.

Sage version always gives a 14 meter range increase.


Demon:
Increases the range of all ranged attacks by 10 meters.
Demon version increases accuracy by 10% on ranged targets.
Demon version increases critical hit rate by 1% on ranged targets

Bow Mastery

Passive Skill
Requisite Cultivation: Aware of the Myriad
Increase all ranged weapon attack damage by 75%.
Sage version always gives a 90% increase to ranged weapon attack.

Demon:
Increase all ranged weapon attack damage by 60%.
Demon version increases ranged weapon critical hit rate by 1%.

Deadly shot

Range: Long Ranged
Mana: 370.0
Channel: 3.0 seconds
Cast: 0.6 seconds
Cooldown: 12.0 seconds
Weapon: Ranged Weapons
Requisite Cultivation: Celestial Sage

Fire an intense shot at the enemy, inflicting base physical damage plus 100% of weapon damage plus 5800.0.

Requires 1 arrow, bolt or shot.

Sage version makes nearby enemies take full damage as well.

Demon:

Range: Long Ranged
Mana: 370.0
Channel: 3.0 seconds
Cast: 0.6 seconds
Cooldown: 12.0 seconds
Weapon: Ranged Weapons
Requisite Cultivation: Celestial Demon

Fire an intense shot at the enemy, inflicting base physical damage plus 100% of weapon damage plus 5800.0.

Requires 1 arrow, bolt or shot.

Demon version increases damage by 500 and reduces cooldown to 10 seconds.


Winged Sheald
Mana: 400
Cast: 0.5 seconds
Cooldown: 30.0 seconds
Weapon: No restrictions
Requisite Cultivation: Aware of the Myriad

Focus all of your energy to instantly create a mana shield to absorb up to 1000 damage. Lasts up to 20 seconds and recovers 80 MP every 3 seconds up to 6 times.

Requires 45 Chi.

Sage version absorbs up to a total of 1250 damage.

Demon:
Mana: 238
Cast: 0.5 seconds
Cooldown: 30.0 seconds
Weapon: No restrictions
Requisite Cultivation: Spiritual Adept

Focus all of your energy to instantly create a mana shield to absorb up to 810 damage. Lasts up to 20 seconds and recovers 64 MP every 3 seconds up to 6 times.

Requires 45 Chi.

Sage version absorbs up to a total of 1250 damage.
Demon version increases maximum duration to 30 seconds and maximum absorb times to 10.




"You think studying skills makes you a better expert than those who possess some of them... Or someone who is in a position to actually use them if owned?"


Yes, Because you do not know the %'s.

Ok, I am done.
"

angellicdeity

Leaderalan - Lost City wrote: »

...

Again, thank you for that list, but that still does not make you any sort of expert.

Furthermore, since when I did I post mistaken percentages?


Like I said less speculating more levelling.


As it seems to have gotten lost in your defensive posts which never say too much.

A quick recap:

Leaderalan - Lost City wrote: »

Thats what it is starting to look like.

Sage= Pve
Sage= Teams
Sage= Mana and chi

Demons=Pvp
Demon=Pk
Demon=Solo 1hit killer

Wrong

Already stated, both are equally equipped.

ch2h5oh wrote: »

Sage Vs Demon
Constant damage increase Vs Spike damage rate increase
Magic attack attributes gained Vs A will-never-miss metal arow
Extra passive range Vs Extra critical rate
Defensive spark Vs Offensive spark
Gain 50 chi once every 60 seconds only Vs Burn 50 chi from your target every 30 seconds

As kindly listed

Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Things are just as was said. Sage and demon works in pretty much the same way with any class.

Sage gives high, consistant damage. You KNOW the damage will be there.

Demon gives much higher, very random damage. You HOPE the damage will be there.

Stated again



Again its been clearly stated plenty of times, but you simply dont understand it.



Again, its nothing to do with respect. You, obviously dont understand, that you are completely unqualified to give advice or suggestions about the matter of sage/demon.



With the content presented so far by you, everyone can see, quite clearly, that you are nothing more than speculating.



Its like the whole argument of today's Graduates - yes they know the theory, but that is far different from practice.


Again, to be stated once and for all:

angellicdeity wrote: »

Sages are designed to deal more damage, consistently.

Demons are designed to spike high for a short amount of time.

Cyanea - Lost City

Perhaps some numbers could be fun here?

I made a plausible level 90 archer on ecatomb. If you visit http://www.ecatomb.net/character.php and click "save/import" and enter build: 21s03031s5Xeq081m1m1j1i0f1i1j0m0m you should get an archer with weapon damage 670-1562 and physical attack 3914-7268 and a 22% critical hit chance.

With sage bow mastery, our archer's physical attack would get another 90% of 670-1562 and so would be 4517-8674 and with a 22% critical hit chance our archer's normal attack average damage will be 8046, with demon bow mastery, our archer's physical attack would get another 60% of 670-1562 and so would be 4316-8205 and with a 23% critical hit chance our archer's normal attack average damage will be 7701. Of course demon winged blessing gives another +1% critical chance and a +10% accuracy increase. If we ignore accuracy, our demon average damage climbs to 7763 -- but if we include accuracy things get too complicated for me so I will mistakenly pretend we will never miss (but we will miss except not quite so much if we have demon winged blessing -- so sages get "inconsistent damage"?).

But then consider demon quick shot, perhaps preceded by demon stunning arrow and compare with sage versions...

Mosz - Heavens Tear

angellicdeity yes 16% and 20% make a dif, but venos, which well..will always be there on TTs will have the 20% if sage and of course if they get the book

yes end game farming the skills but still, for a lot of these skills its fb99 last boss only hes got a 10% to drop ONE BOOK, and it can be any of 90 or so books , so yah if you are farmin him thats gonna be a LOOOOOOOOOt of runs, aLOOOOOT of mp charms (good luck gettin clerics that wanna farm it so much)
ive had people go 20 runs no book, so im just saying a lot of those skills arent a very realistic comparison of the sage vs demon arguement because even with a dedicated squad(which granted the cost of the runs, getting the wines and getting the HP and MP charms which also you need coins for) its gonna be quite difficult to farm thebooks and take possibly months, and unless you are sitting on a couple of good friends with very high RL funds that dont get annoyed by a horrible drop rate, monotony, boredom, and pain of farming it, which although is not impossible and i am sure is not unheard of, is not that common

angellicdeity

Cyanea - Lost City wrote: »

But then consider demon quick shot, perhaps preceded by demon stunning arrow and compare with sage versions...

Thats presuming they critical (which should be no problem, however, it is still possible to miss with 3000+ aim)


Furthermore, the attack speed does not decrease the cast time.


I believe you want to use the Demon Sharpened Tooth/Stunning Arrow then the Quick shot - for maximum benefit of the critical rate and the attack speed.


The sage combinations would be their Thunder Shock accompanied by Lightning Strike and or Thunderous Blast. Accompanied with the sage passive skills you get something close to par.


Thunder shock decreasing metal resistance for 10 more seconds, and a Thunderous blast with 1.5 seconds off the total cast/recovery time. Although none of them are a quick release as compared to the demons, I point out that sages deal large quantities over time. Although in PvP you do not have all the time in the world - unless you play your class smartly.



But again, you'll at least do similar amounts of damage as a sage without criticals (not factoring in the sage passives)


Demon is great if you deal 1 on 1. In group situations, both are practically equal in their PvP contributions.

Mosz - Heavens Tear wrote: »

angellicdeity yes 16% and 20% make a dif, but venos, which well..will always be there on TTs will have the 20% if sage and of course if they get the book

yes end game farming the skills but still, for a lot of these skills its fb99 last boss only hes got a 10% to drop ONE BOOK, and it can be any of 90 or so books , so yah if you are farmin him thats gonna be a LOOOOOOOOOt of runs, aLOOOOOT of mp charms (good luck gettin clerics that wanna farm it so much)
ive had people go 20 runs no book, so im just saying a lot of those skills arent a very realistic comparison of the sage vs demon arguement because even with a dedicated squad(which granted the cost of the runs, getting the wines and getting the HP and MP charms which also you need coins for) its gonna be quite difficult to farm thebooks and take possibly months, and unless you are sitting on a couple of good friends with very high RL funds that dont get annoyed by a horrible drop rate, monotony, boredom, and pain of farming it, which although is not impossible and i am sure is not unheard of, is not that common

I never said it wasn't impractical to get all the end-game skill books.


Demon's are very fortunate to have all their skills more easily accessible than sages. Thats a (+2) for them.



Plus if we are truely talking end-game one would choose to use Blood Vow over the Sage Sharpened Tooth.


But then again... there are problems with that too.

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear

I find this thread kinda of funny. Judging by the icons (with the exception of Mosz), none of you guys are even close to 89 cult. And yet are making heated debate regarding demon/sage arch skills.

Leaderalan - Lost City

You got to plain ahead.
b:laugh

Zoe - Heavens Tear

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear wrote: »

I find this thread kinda of funny. Judging by the icons (with the exception of Mosz), none of you guys are even close to 89 cult. And yet are making heated debate regarding demon/sage arch skills.

Guess you didn't see my post then?b:laugh I may not be an archer but I'm still 89.

For my archer I'm not sure which one I would go. Sage again maybe since archers crit enough as it is.

Mosz - Heavens Tear

Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »

Guess you didn't see my post then?b:laugh I may not be an archer but I'm still 89.

For my archer I'm not sure which one I would go. Sage again maybe since archers crit enough as it is.

define enough? in pvp its all about a crit for the win, can always use more crit

Shandelzare - Sanctuary

Leaderalan - Lost City wrote: »

The list that I posted above are not opinions, maybe if you spent some time reading instead of randomly posting you would know this. Study up on skills before you start putting down others about the facts they know.

b:shutup

Facts you know? Really? I doubt a Lv. 3x archer would KNOW any of these facts. KNOWING = Actually using it. I don't give a flying **** what the text says.

Leaderalan - Lost City

Shandelzare - Sanctuary wrote: »

Facts you know? Really? I doubt a Lv. 3x archer would KNOW any of these facts. KNOWING = Actually using it. I don't give a flying **** what the text says.

Funny, when you talk smack and ignore what the facts are.
"I don't give a flying **** what the text says"

"KNOWING = Actually using it"

Thats like saying:
Guess you know nothing about a bazooka.

I know something.

The American Bazooka was a successful - albeit simplistic - anti-armor developed as early as 1933, though not fielded until 1942. The system consisted of a basic tube, wiring and a pistol grip, fore grip and shoulder rest (all three usually of wood) with the rocket loaded from the open rear. While the primary weapons handler aimed and fired the system, a secondary member was charged with connecting the ignition wiring at rear.


Studying=Learning
Yes, grant the fact that you have the skills,” bazooka" you might know more about it.
Point is just because you don’t have something doses not mean you know nothing about it.

Lets get back on topic. plz

How would you make a pking ranger stand out?

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear

Leaderalan - Lost City wrote: »

How would you make a pking ranger stand out?

You don't... archers suck.

Mastrmustard - Sanctuary

OK well judging from this forum people seem to just be discussing Sage vs Demon. In which case I will give my 2 cents, being on the carebear server the decision is easy for me, sage. However consider this gear and equipment can make up the difference in Critical rate between the "almighty demon" to the sage archer. 2 +2% crit rings more than close the gap but you cannot get 15% more attack and 10% fire dmgs (for more than 20s) with your gear. Not to mention you cannot claim that a 4.5s stun in pvp is not a huge advantage, or the fact that you can mana burn (sure only 500pts but either way will help take down the clerics annoying shell) Either way end game archer with a good end game set will have a crit over 30% at that point 1/3 shots will crit, more than enough to pk with.

As for your argument about studying the skills. I say nothing beats experience, I have had many archers and other classes die by my arrows that study the skills, just cause you know what they do doesn't mean you know how to use them in sequence to kill someone.

Now how to the topic of this forum. To make your archer stand out in PvP.
Vs Archers - acc pots
Vs Wiz - Laugh cause they are squishy (yes even LA wiz) but hope they dont hit you more than twice.
Vs Cleric - Stun > deadly shot prevents from heals and annoying sheild. If they get up sheild use lightning skills because it sheild only absorbs physical.
Vs BM - wings of grace > lightning skills
Vs Veno - same as wiz, but watch out for nixs and hercs
Vs Barb - build up chi spark AFTER charm tics and spam lighting skills, hope for crits.

Enjoy

Leaderalan - Lost City

Mastrmustard - Sanctuary wrote: »

OK well judging from this forum people seem to just be discussing Sage vs Demon. In which case I will give my 2 cents, being on the carebear server the decision is easy for me, sage. However consider this gear and equipment can make up the difference in Critical rate between the "almighty demon" to the sage archer. 2 +2% crit rings more than close the gap but you cannot get 15% more attack and 10% fire dmgs (for more than 20s) with your gear. Not to mention you cannot claim that a 4.5s stun in pvp is not a huge advantage, or the fact that you can mana burn (sure only 500pts but either way will help take down the clerics annoying shell) Either way end game archer with a good end game set will have a crit over 30% at that point 1/3 shots will crit, more than enough to pk with.

As for your argument about studying the skills. I say nothing beats experience, I have had many archers and other classes die by my arrows that study the skills, just cause you know what they do doesn't mean you know how to use them in sequence to kill someone.

Now how to the topic of this forum. To make your archer stand out in PvP.
Vs Archers - acc pots
Vs Wiz - Laugh cause they are squishy (yes even LA wiz) but hope they dont hit you more than twice.
Vs Cleric - Stun > deadly shot prevents from heals and annoying sheild. If they get up sheild use lightning skills because it sheild only absorbs physical.
Vs BM - wings of grace > lightning skills
Vs Veno - same as wiz, but watch out for nixs and hercs
Vs Barb - build up chi spark AFTER charm tics and spam lighting skills, hope for crits.

Enjoy

Thank you for this info.
Mind if I copy and paste this on first page?

Chaotiic - Lost City

About obtaining the skills.

First three skills :
Take Aim
Frost Arrow
Blazing Arrow

These are easy to get farmed in fb89.

Generally referred to as 92 skills but some are 99 :
Thunder Shock
Aim Low
Bow Mastery
Stunning Arrow
Serrated Arrow (b:spit)

These are obtainable by participating in the weekly wushu tournament (now removed b:angry) and trading your warsoul tags for old book pages. You can get them quite quickly this way with 9 pages per tournament without winning and 20 needed to make a skill book. The class and sage/demon can be specified however the exact one obtained is random. You can get old book pages by doing advanced cube at 96+. Specific rooms give you book credits 10 of which are needed to make an old book page and a maximum of 9 can be gained each day (i generally get 4 or 6). You can also get old book pages by doing rebirth order lv 85+ with every boss after 4th having a 30%+ chance to drop them (got about 2 per boss after 4th). Farmed in fb99 (Hard)

99 "Ulti" skills:
Barrage of Arrows (zhen)
Sharptooth
Thunderous Blast
Deadly Shot
Stormrage Eagleon (b:spit)

These as most know can be made from pages of fate which you get for completing cube at 90+. You can also craft these with book credits but its a waste tbh. Farmed in fb 109 (not open)

The remaining skills as far as we know must be farmed from fb 99 exclusively so will be very hard to get. So far on LC i think 3-4 books have dropped in fb99 to either BL/Zen (CQ hasnt gotten any we're soo unlucky T_T)

As you can see the skills we thought were impossible are actually obtainable so further discussions on heaven/hell should really consider these skills.

Kiyoshi - Heavens Tear

Of course the skill books are not impossible to get. But from the average players' view point, with the exception of the three 89 books, the rest are improbable enough to be impossible. The majority of the players might not even reach level 89. There are a handful of sage archers on HT and a quiet a bit more demon archers. And almost none of them have their 4th skill.

OOSNOWFOXOo - Sanctuary

dude stop calling it rangerb:angry

Leaderalan - Lost City

Archer that uses ranged attacks b:pleased
lol jk jk

Anyone got some info they would like to share?

d0pey

I am going Demon for SURE.b:victory oh btw, stop using the term Rangers please.

Leaderalan - Lost City

If your looking for a guild check this out.
http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?t=278312

Fleuri - Sanctuary

Mastrmustard - Sanctuary wrote: »

Vs Wiz - Laugh cause they are squishy (yes even LA wiz) but hope they dont hit you more than twice.

Ayano-chan was not squishy?

Leaderalan - Lost City

Edited first page.
Looking for more infomation.
Thank you all.