gm responce only plz

hpmorg
hpmorg Posts: 2 Arc User
edited February 2009 in General Discussion
ok so considering that a gm just told us that the servers WILL be up in 7 hours will there or will there not be a roll back
if you do not know please call your supervisor and ask him. we know the decision was already made to roll back or not we just want to know what was the decision .

and i would like to thank the gm's in advance for there response to this thread and for not just locking it, but actually helping and informing there paying customers. thank you
Post edited by hpmorg on
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Comments

  • whiplashsmile
    whiplashsmile Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    roleback = economy and fair play is restored

    no roleback = some quit, large numbers cease buying Zen

    i think its fair to say, given that they r good on customer support, and that they need to make a profit as well,, we will have a roleback, so suck it up, go grind that very small amout of XP u lost, smile and enjoy a great game
  • hpmorg
    hpmorg Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    #1 i want a roll back
    #2 doesent look like your a gm but thanks for your 2 cents
  • whiplashsmile
    whiplashsmile Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    believe it or not i randomly clicked on ur post, didnt notice ur GM only title, in future i will endevour to keep out of ur private chat room, and be like all other players who have to tiket to get a private response, congrats on ur godly status in the game, and excuse me while i back out, bowing my head, so sorry i didnt read ur title !b:chuckle
  • syrum
    syrum Posts: 168 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    hpmorg wrote: »
    ok so considering that a gm just told us that the servers WILL be up in 7 hours will there or will there not be a roll back
    if you do not know please call your supervisor and ask him. we know the decision was already made to roll back or not we just want to know what was the decision .

    and i would like to thank the gm's in advance for there response to this thread and for not just locking it, but actually helping and informing there paying customers. thank you

    No, I'm not a GM. I just had a question... paying customers? So the people who buy items in cash shop are the only ones worthy of this information?

    This is a F2P game unless you opt to buy something in addition with real world currency. Just pointing out that in general, we're not paying customers.

    b:bye
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    whiplashsmile wrote: »
    roleback = economy and fair play is restored

    no roleback = some quit, large numbers cease buying Zen

    i think its fair to say, given that they r good on customer support, and that they need to make a profit as well,, we will have a roleback, so suck it up, go grind that very small amout of XP u lost, smile and enjoy a great game

    If only it was that simple.

    Do bear in mind that there is real cash involved here with all its legalities and implications.

    And its ROLLBACK not roleback.
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear
    Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    bzbee wrote: »
    If only it was that simple.

    Do bear in mind that there is real cash involved here with all its legalities and implications.

    And its ROLLBACK not roleback.

    No legalities to worry about. Read the ToS.
    Main characters
    Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    No legalities to worry about. Read the ToS.

    Read the dictionary.
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • Daerys - Sanctuary
    Daerys - Sanctuary Posts: 1,022 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Zoe - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    No legalities to worry about. Read the ToS.


    Yup. It ALL belongs to them. They have the right to cancel at any time for whatever reason they feel like. Once you purchase Zen, there is no refund, except perhaps in a case of fraudulent charges. You own absolutely nothing in this game. It's the same for pretty much all games nowadays.
  • Zoe - Heavens Tear
    Zoe - Heavens Tear Posts: 3,814 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    bzbee wrote: »
    Read the dictionary.

    The dictionary has nothing to do with this. PWE can cancel service, ban you, etc at anytime they darn well please for any reason they want and not give you your money back. You agreed to these terms by creating an account. They are quite legally binding.
    Main characters
    Celestial Sage Venomancer Zoe - 100
    Sage Barbarian Malego - 91
  • Daerys - Sanctuary
    Daerys - Sanctuary Posts: 1,022 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    bzbee wrote: »
    Read the dictionary.

    Seriously, read the TOS. It may surprise you.
  • Daerys - Sanctuary
    Daerys - Sanctuary Posts: 1,022 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Because I'm feeling generous, some particularly interesting excerpts:

    Legal Agreement:
    These Terms constitute a legal agreement between you and PWE. Your using this Website or otherwise accessing or downloading any of our Games, shall constitute your agreement to accept and be bound by the terms and conditions appearing in these Terms


    Fees:
    PWE may charge fees to access and acquire certain game items or participate in game activities on the Website and may allow the purchase of in game "points" that may be applied to the purchase of in game items or activities ("Zen") ANY APPLICABLE ZEN, FEES AND OTHER CHARGES ARE PAYABLE IN ADVANCE AND ARE NON REFUNDABLE AND NONTRANSFERABLE, IN WHOLE OR IN PART, FOR ANY REASON. ZEN HAVE NO MONETARY VALUE AND CANNOT BE REDEEMED FOR CASH. PWE may, from time to time, modify, amend, or supplement its fees, billing methods and terms applicable to Zen or to any purchases on the Website, and post those changes in these Terms, in separate Terms of Sale or in other terms or agreements posted on the Website or otherwise provided to you by PWE. Such modifications, amendments, supplements or Terms of Sale shall be effective immediately upon posting on the Website and shall be incorporated by reference into these Terms. If any change is unacceptable to you, you may cancel your account at any time.

    If you claim a chargeback for any reason, we have the right to investigate and dispute such chargeback. If we believe that your chargeback requirement is spurious, unreasonable, or invalid, we may take the dispute to court. If your chargeback is deemed invalid, you agree to pay for all fees and costs resulting from the disputed chargeback, including but is not limited to legal fees and expenses, damages, monies lost due to non-operation, and chargeback fees.

    You may pay for any applicable fees and charges or for Zen by major credit card, PayPal


    User Conduct:
    # (j) Engage in any actions that defraud or attempt to defraud, scam or cheat others out of any items that have been earned through authorized game play;
    # (k) Cheat or utilize unauthorized exploits in connection with the Games or the Service;
    # (l) Using or exploiting any bugs, errors, or design flaws to obtain unauthorized access to the Service or to gain an unfair advantage over other players,
    PWE may take any actions and impose any penalties we deem necessary to discourage and punish any violation of these terms or any other illegal or inappropriate conduct, all without prior notice or warning. The determination as to whether a violation has occurred and who is responsible for such act is solely within PWE's discretion, and is based on what we deem best for the community and the Website. By using the Website, you agree you will be bound by PWE's determination as to whether a violation has occurred and any penalty we choose to implement.
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Daerys - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Seriously, read the TOS. It may surprise you.

    I've read the TOS along with all the TOS of all the games I've played.

    I know PWI basically cover their behinds with TOS.

    I said LEGALITIES.

    I suggest you look up that word, it may surprise you.

    And I say that without malice or offence.
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • Daerys - Sanctuary
    Daerys - Sanctuary Posts: 1,022 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    The legality is that they own everything, and by simply creating an account you are entering into a binding legal agreement to abide by their terms.
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Daerys - Sanctuary wrote: »
    The legality is that they own everything, and by simply creating an account you are entering into a binding legal agreement to abide by their terms.

    Take my suggestion and actually look up that word, then re-read my post.

    Just bear in mind that nothing is every black or white.
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • Daerys - Sanctuary
    Daerys - Sanctuary Posts: 1,022 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    le⋅gal⋅i⋅ty:
    1. the state or quality of being in conformity with the law; lawfulness.
    2. attachment to or observance of law.
    3. Usually, legalities. a duty or obligation imposed by law.


    There are currently no laws in the U.S. specific to virtual goods of this nature. The Netherlands, on the other hand, recently convicted 2 teens of theft for bullying a kid into handing over in game items.

    I do agree that it isn't black and white, but if a court were to rule that the TOS is a legally binding contract then there is no recourse. There is no cash refund for Zen. You agreed to those terms when you made the purchase.
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Sigh.......

    At no point in time did I say that you can get a refund on the cash you have paid.

    I said that there are legalities and its implications involved and so it is not as simple as the guy who posted before me made it out to be.

    We are bound by TOS yes, but even if there are no laws in your country/state with regards to virtual goods, PWI is also bound by the terms of law in general.

    TOS are legally binding but as with all legal documents, a good lawyer can find their way around it. Just because there is the TOS does not mean that PWI can disregard the laws beyond it. They still have to (as I said in my post) consider the legalities and implications of their actions.
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • Methuseleh - Lost City
    Methuseleh - Lost City Posts: 112 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    bzbee wrote: »
    I've read the TOS along with all the TOS of all the games I've played.

    I know PWI basically cover their behinds with TOS.

    I said LEGALITIES.

    I suggest you look up that word, it may surprise you.

    And I say that without malice or offence.

    what was said is that they have no legalities to WORRY about. Not that there arent any. they have nothing to worry about becuz the ToS covers them completely. they can delete everyones account and shut the game down if they want
  • Daerys - Sanctuary
    Daerys - Sanctuary Posts: 1,022 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Yes, a good lawyer can probably find a way around it. I am certain, however, that PWI can afford far better lawyers than the vast majority of gamers can. Short of a large-scale class action suit, in which there may be a good chance of having good lawyers, you would be looking at small individual claims that wouldn't justify getting a lawyer involved in the first place. The only people that spent enough real money today to justify getting a lawyer would be those that partook in the exploit, and their asses would get nailed to the wall by the TOS.
  • LadyofReal - Heavens Tear
    LadyofReal - Heavens Tear Posts: 1,993 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Unnervingly enough, she is right. There is nothing we can do if the GM's choose to do a rollback. So, if that were to happen, build a bridge and get over it, go grind your itty bitty amount of xp back, it's really not that hard.
    Not motivated enough to make another PWI siggy
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Daerys - Sanctuary wrote: »
    Yes, a good lawyer can probably find a way around it. I am certain, however, that PWI can afford far better lawyers than the vast majority of gamers can. Short of a large-scale class action suit, in which there may be a good chance of having good lawyers, you would be looking at small individual claims that wouldn't justify getting a lawyer involved in the first place. The only people that spent enough real money today to justify getting a lawyer would be those that partook in the exploit, and their asses would get nailed to the wall by the TOS.

    But as a company, PWI will not just assume that as the case. They will still need to look into the legalities and implications of how they deal with the situation.

    Also legal complications aside, they have to weigh the options available to them and decide which is the best action to take. Why do you think there is no official word yet on whether there will be a rollback?

    Some people think (as you can see from their posts) that it is as easy as flicking a switch. However, there is so much more going on beyond that and these things take time.
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • ReYVynN - Heavens Tear
    ReYVynN - Heavens Tear Posts: 52 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    I really don't expect a rollback to occur. The GM's have the ability to track down and mete out punishments to those who made use of the exploit. Whether or not they are banned or whatever action is taken, they say everything will be set right. Howzabout we have a little faith in the people behind the scenes...
  • Daerys - Sanctuary
    Daerys - Sanctuary Posts: 1,022 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    bzbee wrote: »
    But as a company, PWI will not just assume that as the case. They will still need to look into the legalities and implications of how they deal with the situation.

    Also legal complications aside, they have to weigh the options available to them and decide which is the best action to take. Why do you think there is no official word yet on whether there will be a rollback?

    Some people think (as you can see from their posts) that it is as easy as flicking a switch. However, there is so much more going on beyond that and these things take time.

    Oh I completely agree. I've been an advocate of "calm down, this takes time" all day. There are a bajillion lines of code and logs to go through. I'm pretty sure I even said at some point that there was no way we would see resolution today. I don't know, I've been fired up all day after watching our brilliant congress pass this !#%!^!#$^!#!#$!# $ spending bill. So if I seems a bit abrasive my apologies =D
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    ReYVynN - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    I really don't expect a rollback to occur. The GM's have the ability to track down and mete out punishments to those who made use of the exploit. Whether or not they are banned or whatever action is taken, they say everything will be set right. Howzabout we have a little faith in the people behind the scenes...

    I have yet to discover what the actual exploit is.

    Some said that it was an item which can be npced for a ridiculously high price of 3mil. The said item keeps changing in the posts I've read.

    One thing I believe though is that those who traded in gold have been mistakenly accused of exploiting a bug. As the GMs have clearly stated, gold trading wasn't bugged.

    So......anyone has the final word on what the actual bug was?
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • shnuggles
    shnuggles Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    hpmorg wrote: »
    ok so considering that a gm just told us that the servers WILL be up in 7 hours will there or will there not be a roll back
    if you do not know please call your supervisor and ask him. we know the decision was already made to roll back or not we just want to know what was the decision .

    and i would like to thank the gm's in advance for there response to this thread and for not just locking it, but actually helping and informing there paying customers. thank you

    Hello bzbee,

    I have made a post in regards to your question and have linked it for you below.

    http://pwi-forum.perfectworld.com/showpost.php?p=1624522&postcount=1802

    Please understand that the player-base is not being ignored, many things are being considered, and not everything can just straight be announced. We would love to answer every single question when we first get to it, but we simply can't always do so. There are many internal things that go on when an issue of this sort comes about. Per policy, we cannot disclose all information at any given time. We will inform at the time we can. If you have questions for us, feel free to contact Customer Service and we will be happy to answer your questions as best we can.

    Thank you in advance,
    -Your friendly neighborhood Shnuggs-
    [PWE Billing]
    Perfect World Entertainment Customer Support System

    "Any man worth his salt will stick up for what he believes right, but it takes a slightly better man to acknowledge instantly and without reservation that he is in error."
    -Andrew Jackson

    Shnuggles [Shh-nugg-ulls]
    -proper noun
    1. He who turns negativity into giddiness.
    2. Has an IRL cat that plays fetch b:victory
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    Thank you for taking the time to reply to us.

    I know your time could have been better spent working on the issue but we appreciate the gesture.

    Now if only I can find out what the bug was...........


    ..........curiousity killed the cat and I'm a cat veno. b:worried
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • shnuggles
    shnuggles Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    bzbee wrote: »
    Thank you for taking the time to reply to us.

    I know your time could have been better spent working on the issue but we appreciate the gesture.

    Now if only I can find out what the bug was...........


    ..........curiousity killed the cat and I'm a cat veno. b:worried

    You are welcome. Am I allowed to have my Friday yet? b:surrender
    -Your friendly neighborhood Shnuggs-
    [PWE Billing]
    Perfect World Entertainment Customer Support System

    "Any man worth his salt will stick up for what he believes right, but it takes a slightly better man to acknowledge instantly and without reservation that he is in error."
    -Andrew Jackson

    Shnuggles [Shh-nugg-ulls]
    -proper noun
    1. He who turns negativity into giddiness.
    2. Has an IRL cat that plays fetch b:victory
  • ReYVynN - Heavens Tear
    ReYVynN - Heavens Tear Posts: 52 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    as best as i heard it, it was a bug with the new mens fashion that somehow allowed you to convert it into enough dyes/pigments that could be npc-ed turning ur 3 zen (300k) investment into 3.1mil. The sudden influx of coins allowed people to buy the auction house out (of gold, 3* items, molds, etc.) causing massive inflation.

    that at least seems to be the most consistent story i've heard as of yet. and you know what they say... if it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...

    yes thank you again gms for ur work in resolving the issue. and yes, shnuggles, enjoy what's left of your friday, and happy <3 day tomorrow
  • shnuggles
    shnuggles Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    ReYVynN - Heavens Tear wrote: »
    as best as i heard it, it was a bug with the new mens fashion that somehow allowed you to convert it into enough dyes/pigments that could be npc-ed turning ur 3 zen (300k) investment into 3.1mil. The sudden influx of coins allowed people to buy the auction house out (of gold, 3* items, molds, etc.) causing massive inflation.

    that at least seems to be the most consistent story i've heard as of yet. and you know what they say... if it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...

    yes thank you again gms for ur work in resolving the issue. and yes, shnuggles, enjoy what's left of your friday, and happy <3 day tomorrow


    Must be a chicken!
    -Your friendly neighborhood Shnuggs-
    [PWE Billing]
    Perfect World Entertainment Customer Support System

    "Any man worth his salt will stick up for what he believes right, but it takes a slightly better man to acknowledge instantly and without reservation that he is in error."
    -Andrew Jackson

    Shnuggles [Shh-nugg-ulls]
    -proper noun
    1. He who turns negativity into giddiness.
    2. Has an IRL cat that plays fetch b:victory
  • bzbee
    bzbee Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    shnuggles wrote: »
    You are welcome. Am I allowed to have my Friday yet? b:surrender

    Friday?! Of course you can't have your Friday. It's over.

    I can give you Saturday though. It's Saturday here now. b:chuckle
    Phoenix plume count: 2450 b:sad

    I want the phoenix because I think its pretty. b:cute
  • Baraiai - Sanctuary
    Baraiai - Sanctuary Posts: 107 Arc User
    edited February 2009
    whiplashsmile wrote: »
    roleback = economy and fair play is restored

    no roleback = some quit, large numbers cease buying Zen

    i think its fair to say, given that they r good on customer support, and that they need to make a profit as well,, we will have a roleback, so suck it up, go grind that very small amout of XP u lost, smile and enjoy a great game

    no offense, but it sounds to me that only YOU would quit/cease to buy zen. Some of us can't afford a rollback because not EVERYONE took advantage of what has been going on. Hell, I never knew of half the bs going on because I never looked at the forums because I was too busy grinding my tail off. If we had a week rollback, I would have no characters at all. Hell, a lot of people who did nothing wrong would be screwed.

    Just ban the idiots who abuse to terms and call it a day. Rollbacks because of morons seems to ruin the game to let the glitchers/abusers run free. They'd just find a way to do it again. I sound like a ***** but no one cares if you got screwed out like the rest of us and I know damn well no one cares what I just said. But hey, opinion is opinion.

    Correction for your terms:

    Rollback = some quit the game

    No Rollback = some STILL quit because they cry about other people.

    No one will be happy either way. But you lose far more people if we rollback every month because of a glitch people were too stupid to leave alone. :/
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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