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Fox shift upcoming changes
js3b
Member Posts: 368 Arc User
The encouter state should touch only once each target.. This is not the case tho, can hit multiple time the same target... Please fix this :cool:
Founder back a week ago, already pissed by cryptic ''no roll back'' decision
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Don't make me dig up the thread that says so.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
Pretty much this. I was going to reply with the same thing similar, but Becky beat me to it.
Thanks a lot for the answer, it is very apreciated!
I understand changing a skill (aka balacing), but you used the word "correctly"
?????
Yeah that kind of put me off too. At its fundamental, the skill worked like a mini Bloodbath. Can hit one target multiple times by itself, or hit multiple targets for each hit. (except in this case only once, or split between if less than 3 at its current)
Correctly is poor phrasing there. It should read (and will be edited to do so) that it will do what the tooltip states. In general we weren't happy with the ability to generate that much burst and time being untargetable without any trade off to be able to do so. So we made the power line up more specifically with what the tooltip and original design had, which had you bouncing across several targets, up to a defined maximum. This power was a really potent single target nuke if the target got caught alone, and it also made you untargetable, which made it super potent. Please note that there are some buffs coming alongside this (Thorn Strike specifically) to open up some different options and make Fox Shift better fit in it's intended role.
What kind of a company constantly goes back on their word?
-Sterling Archer
Are you going to fix deep gash doing damage based on the encounter used too? That's the same kind of issue. It's definitely not doing what the tooltip says.
Great Weapon fighters are also getting looked at (in the same patch if the changes all get picked up) but that isn't relevant to this thread, so lets stay on topic.
CC can easily abort your fox shift and force a cooldown immediately.
The burst is nothing close to a nuke. Against equally geared pvp characters it doesn't even come close to crippling a CW which has no mitigation against you at all. Not to mention a single dodge renders all attacks of fox shift completely worthless.
Please review our DPS as a whole, it's vastly inferior to a CW and with current deep gash broken status even GWFs do more DPS than HRs while also being far more tanky.
Fox shift is the only thing that enables an HR to very slowly reduce a GWF's HP and stand a chance to win after the latest major pvp patch, without it even CWs will kite us to death easily.
Yes and u can still get cc'd while using it... so much about not targetable! You can still interrupt it with any kind of prone or daze, even when the HR is ''NOT'' targetable. Furthermore it is by far the easiest encounter to dodge. The HR himself is invisable, but u can still ''attack or target'' the dark cloud when he uses fox...
When you interrupt fox shift while he was trying to use it, it bugs out -> shows no cd, but you wont be able to use it for 16sec.
And thanks for mentioning, that fox shift is potent when a targets gets caught alone and that is actually true, sadly when there are more than 2 targets, fox shift is awful and with your upcoming changes it will always be like that.
Just to bring a few numbers so you guys actually have an idea how drastic this change is.
Atm fox shift hits for around 3k critical against ppl with 0 DR and 20% tenecity with one out of 4 hits and reduces your range encounters by 4sec if you are specced into agile hunter.(with 5000 power,p vorpal+15% meleedmg)
Overall: ~10k dmg on average and 4sec less cd on range encounters. (with 40% critchance)
After the nerf: ~ 2.5k dmg on average 1sec less cd on range encounters against a single target (with 40%critchance)
Those numbers arent exact but to show u guys an average example on HOW USELESS fox shift will be.
If u consider the cd reduction nerf + the dmg nerf, its around a 80% nerf to fox shift against a single target!
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Fox has good utility in the range form (even though you did take away CC immunity, the only one HRs have) and in the melee form it's comparable DPS to that of other classes level 50 encounters. Take it away and all they got are roots.
I wouldn't be so sure
Fox Shift on one target is comparable to a non crit Lashing Blow from TRs split between multiple attacks.
You can interrupt or dodge or negate some or all of the attacks easily as it is. You can still attack, hit, and target a HR's Fox shift while they are doing it. ( I do it all the time). Stopping them as soon as they use it, only letting them get 1 or 2 hits off.
Really dont see the point seeing this even being bothered with besides a tooltip change to better reflect what it does.
things like the bugged 3rd rank of Forest Meditation (loses upgrades from rank 2) and the only daily that no HR ever uses, ever, Cold Steel Hurricane could be better spent looking at those. Thorn Ward upgrade is nice too, but in no way does Fox Shift need any sort of change.
Hmm...not sure what the basis of that adjustment is, but in pvp matches where there's little disparity in player skill and gear, fox shift as it is, is far from being imbalanced. In fact, it merely tickles GWFs, perma stealth rogues, etc whose ridiculous HP regenerating skills give HRs a hell of a hard time in 1v1 situations while defending nodes. With the upcoming change, fox shift will feel like a waste of encounter slot. Is that intended?
It feels like this change is based on how strong it is vs undergeared PUGs, without considering how it is in fact barely decent vs geared players.
I hope you're also looking at other "OP" skills then. Especially how gwfs can chain prone me, taking chunks of hp out while my character slowly gets back up. Or how TRs can wear down my HP while staying stealthed then finishing me off with hard hitting skills that seem to ignore my 2k defense, 2k deflect, and almost 1k tenacity. Fox shift doesn't seem anywhere as devastating as those, so I'm probably just missing something.
As others have mentioned in this thread:
1. Fox's Shift is barely a burst attack against the resistances that are being sported in PvP at the moment. For some classes, as I mentioned in my earlier post, it barely scratches them. It is our only decent damaging ability that really doesn't need any change.
2. "really potent single target nuke" - In what way is this a nuke? We have no dailies or any other encounters that allow for a "nuke." Not to be rude, but I do not believe your definition of a "nuke" matches our definition of a nuke in the eyes of an avid player of your game.
3. With all do respect, we do not need anymore AOE encounters or any such thing.
thanks.]
Fox shift is the only real DPS an HR can count on at the moment
so if you really must nerf it, you better buff out other skills very well
and thorn strike isn't a fair substitute, it's really hard to land in pvp, and it's damage is <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font>
Off topic, but please respond to the stated bugs on the last post of this thread
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?622971-NEW-PvP-Release-TR-Gimped/page16
TR's need confirmation on whether or not it's working as intended
Fox (current)
Melee - Used primarily as burst damage in the 1v1 and 2v2 scenarios commonly found in pvp.
Melee - Reduces ranged cooldowns by 4 seconds whenever the skill lands, no matter how many opponents the HR faces.
Ranged - Not bad. Protects your allies from 1 hit, can block a poorly timed Shocking Ex or Ice Knife.
Ranged - Many use this skill to activate Bloodthirsty (+15% damage to your next melee attack)
Thorn (upcoming changes)
Melee - untargetable, AoE strike. Sounds like it will deal decent damage if you hit someone with full HP.
Melee - Will reduce ranged cds by up to 1 second
Ranged - Persistent auto-targeting skill that hits enemy nearest to it's center. Hits, but does zero damage to enemies in stealth. Poor damage per strike.
Ranged - Reduces mitigation of enemies hit by the skill by 2% per hit. Stacks last as long as the encounter is up.
Fox Strike (current) damage cuts through regen, giving HRs a chance to end an encounter before people start ticking for 2k.
Thorn Strike (future) Deals less damage as enemy's health decreases, forcing more regen ticks and drawing out fights.
My point: damage at the top end is mostly irrelevant.
This will move HRs from being great home point defenders to some sort of pseudo help-fight-at-point-#2 player without much use.
Time to watch the sun set or roll a gwf like everyone else. Would be nice to see HR's get some love or at least leave us alone.. how about looking at hawkeye, cold steel hurricane, nature spec in general or any of the more important things that should be on your list.
I get hit and cc'd (especially prone) all the time while the fox shift animation is going.
As mouz said, this causes the skill to bug and go on CD while still showing as useable. The animation and audio fx even start. It is really quite annoying.
Who cares, it's a meh power (outside of pve where the enemies dont move out of it) unless it is getting a huge dmg spike and some kind of utlity addition its not going to take the place of Fox in pvp. Nothing will. The class will be gutted and joining the DC's on the bottom of the pvp barrel soon enough.
Id love to have the devs give us a clear vision of what they see HR's doing in the future of this game, all I see in pvp nowadays is halfling GWF's and more gwf's. You arent happy with our ability to create that much burst.. but its ok for other classes to have it, and prone, and stun, and effectively buff or do crowd control. So what is our role now?
Too true, i have been proned out of FS. Unless you are the newest player on the block in PVP, you arent getting 1 shotted by FS.. but I guarantee you will with a number of CW skills.
It's weird, its like they dont want us playing this class... that they just released...
This change is horrible and needs to be scrapped. Keep the thorn strike buff and lose the nerf.
And I haven't even touched my hr in probably 2 months.