arontimesMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited March 2014
There is actually a race change mechanic in D&D, specifically D&D 3.5. The Player's Handbook 2 has a variant rule for when players are unsatisfied with their character building choices. One of the presented options is a full character rebuild, where the player gets to choose the race, gender, class, feats, skills, etc. all over again, and the book recommended that the player character undergo a quest to one of several magical locations which allow for this transformation. This involved a quest to find said magical location, fighting monsters which inevitably infest such places, and then finally go through the transformation.
Hey, there's an idea for a future module! A campaign or dungeon delve where one of the rewards is a character rebuild, or maybe just a race change.
It is pretty obvious that you should be able to respec your race and starting stats, for the same reason other respecs exist.
Balance changes can completely ruin builds and make one race better than the other.
No one is going to want to level their character over again and get max gear and max enchants all over again. They are more likely to just quit the game. Plus, there is a limit of 50 character slots per account.
It is not the players fault if balance changes turn the players good race choices into poor race choices.
Anyone who is against race changes is obviously a racist and should be ignored. ;-)
There is actually a race change mechanic in D&D, specifically D&D 3.5. The Player's Handbook 2 has a variant rule for when players are unsatisfied with their character building choices. One of the presented options is a full character rebuild, where the player gets to choose the race, gender, class, feats, skills, etc. all over again, and the book recommended that the player character undergo a quest to one of several magical locations which allow for this transformation. This involved a quest to find said magical location, fighting monsters which inevitably infest such places, and then finally go through the transformation.
Hey, there's an idea for a future module! A campaign or dungeon delve where one of the rewards is a character rebuild, or maybe just a race change.
This is basically what I said should be done for race/stat resets in the previous thread that covered this.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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jazharaMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
So Devs should put resources to cater to the laziness of players. Why not sell a level 60 token like other MMOs are doing while we are at it. The games life expectancy would plummet.
thats an amusing post, considering the leveling in cryptic games is so mind numbingly fast anyway, why not give people who have already hand leveled 1 toon an option to pay to level later toons to 60.....its not like its fun doing the same stuff over and over and over just to get more toons to 60, at least its not for anybody I know....it would be much more fun to just hit 60, buy some decent gear with AD saved up on your main, and start your grind for better gear from there.
but hey, im not giving PWE anymore money after they refused to give me my **** Stone of Radiance despite the fact i got the email and bought the zen directly from them and transfered it to my NW acct a week before the offer ended....
Anyone who against this must be the one who re leveled a new char of same class just to get the right race he wanted
Since not everyone who just started the game would know that a knight benefits from con more than str even tho the game said str is primary and from other mmo experience, str is more important for a knight
Just to be surprised later that con/dex is better for pvp gwf
i would like to be able to re-roll my racial ability score though.
I think I screwed my Dwarf GWF up and I have already spent 160k AD on Mulhorand gear. . .
PSA: You don't need to grind Spinward Rise for your Elemental artifact main hand if you have some AD lying around. You can craft it via the Tyranny of Dragon's campaign screen.
Well the thing is I rolled a few characters before new races came out. These characters were meant to be the new races but at the time they didn't exist.
It would be nice to have a way to correct this issue without having to re-lvl a character to 60 and loose all the non-recoverable achievements.
silvergryphMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 740Arc User
edited March 2014
My first instinct was to be against this. My first thought is to say, "Roll another character because the ability to have multiple characters is part of the point of an MMO."
HOWEVER, this is no different from the people who have told me, "Why do you play an MMO solo? The whole point of an MMO is to play with other people!"
I love leveling new characters. I love doing the same content again with a different character to get a new perspective on it. But, many players would rather have dental surgery.
Furthermore, there is support for it in D&D. It's called the Reincarnation spell (or ritual in 4th edition).
But, you are basically buying a new character that is automatically leveled to 60, and has all the bound items on your current character transferred to it along with all the acheivements, etc. So, I firmly believe that it should be expensive. I think it goes way beyond what should be part of a standard respec.
My suggestion: Reincarnation Ritual Scroll in the ZEN store for 1000 ZEN. After applying it you log in to the character and are brought to the character creation screen. You choose race, gender, class and initial ability rolls. Then you log in to Protector's Enclave with all power points, feat points, and boons unspent and ready to re-allocate.
Why 1000 ZEN? It's a Retraining Token (300 ZEN) + a Change Appearance Token (200 ZEN) + a gender change (??? ZEN) + an initial ability score reroll (??? ZEN) + it saves you having to spend a ton of AD/ZEN to get back where you were on a new character + it is neither a trivial thing nor an inexpensive thing to do in D&D.
They could even sell more expensive specialty Reincarnation Scrolls that let you play with a nonstandard race model. They could choose races that they already have art for but they are unlikely to want to build a full race option for. The character would be built as a Human or other appropriate player race but using a different character model. For example, a Reincarnation Scroll (Gnoll) for 2000 ZEN that lets you choose a Male or Female Gnoll model with limited or no further appearance customization and using the racial abilities of a Human.
cephaasMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited March 2014
Melodywyr,
/cry... why do you do this to me? what happened to Ruuk? Did it work? What was the favor? YOU ARE WORSE THAN GEORGE R. R. MARTIN!!!
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myles08807Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 409Arc User
edited March 2014
Call it a "Mulligan" token and charge twice the cost of a full respec. I get the feeling that as many folks will do this for aesthetic purposes as for min/maxing.
I without a doubt agree that there should be a stat re-roll token. People have made mistakes making their first toon and out of sheer ignorance didn't roll the stats properly according to their class. To make a new character after putting in so many hours and completing all your achievements on that specific toon just to re-roll your stats is just ridiculous. If it was implemented everyone will go home happy I mean the game Neverwinter will make more money and the players will get what they need. I'm sure all of you would agree.
Race re-rolls are a step too far IMHO. A single stat re-roll in case of newb mistakes, ok, but race re-rolls is too integral a part of the roleplaying element. To put it simply, if they introduced race re-rolls, it would cheapen the idea of "choices have consequences" too much, and it's already on a thin enough thread in this game.
Race re-rolls are a step too far IMHO. A single stat re-roll in case of newb mistakes, ok, but race re-rolls is too integral a part of the roleplaying element. To put it simply, if they introduced race re-rolls, it would cheapen the idea of "choices have consequences" too much, and it's already on a thin enough thread in this game.
D&D allows race changes via re-incarnation, 'Wish', intervention of higher/lower powers, etc, so this isn't an issue.
My suggestion: Reincarnation Ritual Scroll in the ZEN store for 1000 ZEN. After applying it you log in to the character and are brought to the character creation screen. You choose race, gender, class and initial ability rolls. Then you log in to Protector's Enclave with all power points, feat points, and boons unspent and ready to re-allocate.
Why 1000 ZEN? It's a Retraining Token (300 ZEN) + a Change Appearance Token (200 ZEN) + a gender change (??? ZEN) + an initial ability score reroll (??? ZEN) + it saves you having to spend a ton of AD/ZEN to get back where you were on a new character + it is neither a trivial thing nor an inexpensive thing to do in D&D.
This sounds like a very fair deal. Inclusive enough that it's worth the 1000 zen for people who want it, but not so cheap people are changing races like they change their pants.
To put it simply, if they introduced race re-rolls, it would cheapen the idea of "choices have consequences" too much, and it's already on a thin enough thread in this game.
Dude, this is a video game. It's a leisure activity meant to be fun. I have enough "consequences" with my "choices" in real life. Why do I need more when I'm just trying to have a good time?
"Meanwhile in the moderator's lounge..."
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zankardMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited March 2014
Hmmm.. How about this: A Reincarnation token, that will literally reincarnate you to a new race/class/whatever and then you have to start over from level 1. You get keep all of your hard earned gear and boons, but you still have some 'work' to do to reach level 60 again. Saves some in-game lore troubles too.
I will be really if a race/class change token is implemented, but whatever, is a game and people should be able to enjoy it as much as possible, but the 30years DnD player in me will curse you inside... and outside!
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zankardMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
I will be really if a race/class change token is implemented, but whatever, is a game and people should be able to enjoy it as much as possible, but the 30years DnD player in me will curse you inside... and outside!
I have changed race in pen and paper DnD. What's so weird about it?
I will be really if a race/class change token is implemented, but whatever, is a game and people should be able to enjoy it as much as possible, but the 30years DnD player in me will curse you inside... and outside!
D&D allows race changes via re-incarnation, 'Wish', intervention of higher/lower powers, etc, so this isn't an issue.
so if you choose not to use this feature in P&P or an MMO that is, of course, your perogative.
I am very glad though that you made it clear that you feel that people should be able to enjoy themselves as much as possible as it is a game. This is certainly a feature that, although I personally don't plan on using, I do feel will be useful and make other players much happier.
Mconosrep is not a matter of being "possible" but of being "common", do you imagine a world where people can switch species at will? today i'm a dark elf but tomorrow i feel like being a halfing and yet im tired of being short and 2 days later i want to become a huge half-orc... and that not by one character... but thousands!!!
Anyway it will happen eventually so whatever, some minmaxers will switch to halfins to pvp, others will just spend their hard earned money the way they want, i will continue being FrarII son of Frar, and will be an old Dwarf for a few hundred years more.
Mconosrep is not a matter of being "possible" but of being "common", do you imagine a world where people can switch species at will? today i'm a dark elf but tomorrow i feel like being a halfing and yet im tired of being short and 2 days later i want to become a huge half-orc... and that not by one character... but thousands!!!
In a P&P case if you wanted to create a intrinsically persistent world or campaign then you would have a decent point, but here we have an MMO with insane number of adventurers everywhere with some extraordinarily unusual mounts and companions, so the issue of 'common' or not hardly seems applicable.
I can see why someone looking at this from a primarily P&P background might feel a bit uncomfortable, but 'reality' in P&P D&D and online D&D games are very different things.
+1... ive been wanting this ever since i hit 60 and learned more about the game... literally chose the worse possible race for my build / class and simply because i did not know everything about the game when i made my first character, i ended up get gimped at endgame.
also it makes complete sense... its a new currency sink + easily profitable for NW...
the only reason is dont want to start a new character of the same class and right race, is because of the time / money / ingame stuff invested on my character like artifacts, other items and specially mounts / companions / pvp gear etc etc etc...
It only makes sense that this is available since you can change feats / powers / stats / name etc etc..
would make me start playing the game again if this feature was added.
Comments
Hey, there's an idea for a future module! A campaign or dungeon delve where one of the rewards is a character rebuild, or maybe just a race change.
Taking a break from Neverwinter indefinitely...
It is pretty obvious that you should be able to respec your race and starting stats, for the same reason other respecs exist.
Balance changes can completely ruin builds and make one race better than the other.
No one is going to want to level their character over again and get max gear and max enchants all over again. They are more likely to just quit the game. Plus, there is a limit of 50 character slots per account.
It is not the players fault if balance changes turn the players good race choices into poor race choices.
Anyone who is against race changes is obviously a racist and should be ignored. ;-)
thats an amusing post, considering the leveling in cryptic games is so mind numbingly fast anyway, why not give people who have already hand leveled 1 toon an option to pay to level later toons to 60.....its not like its fun doing the same stuff over and over and over just to get more toons to 60, at least its not for anybody I know....it would be much more fun to just hit 60, buy some decent gear with AD saved up on your main, and start your grind for better gear from there.
but hey, im not giving PWE anymore money after they refused to give me my **** Stone of Radiance despite the fact i got the email and bought the zen directly from them and transfered it to my NW acct a week before the offer ended....
Since not everyone who just started the game would know that a knight benefits from con more than str even tho the game said str is primary and from other mmo experience, str is more important for a knight
Just to be surprised later that con/dex is better for pvp gwf
SENT IV GWF - PVP
i would like to be able to re-roll my racial ability score though.
I think I screwed my Dwarf GWF up and I have already spent 160k AD on Mulhorand gear. . .
SENT IV GWF - PVP
It would be nice to have a way to correct this issue without having to re-lvl a character to 60 and loose all the non-recoverable achievements.
HOWEVER, this is no different from the people who have told me, "Why do you play an MMO solo? The whole point of an MMO is to play with other people!"
I love leveling new characters. I love doing the same content again with a different character to get a new perspective on it. But, many players would rather have dental surgery.
Furthermore, there is support for it in D&D. It's called the Reincarnation spell (or ritual in 4th edition).
But, you are basically buying a new character that is automatically leveled to 60, and has all the bound items on your current character transferred to it along with all the acheivements, etc. So, I firmly believe that it should be expensive. I think it goes way beyond what should be part of a standard respec.
My suggestion: Reincarnation Ritual Scroll in the ZEN store for 1000 ZEN. After applying it you log in to the character and are brought to the character creation screen. You choose race, gender, class and initial ability rolls. Then you log in to Protector's Enclave with all power points, feat points, and boons unspent and ready to re-allocate.
Why 1000 ZEN? It's a Retraining Token (300 ZEN) + a Change Appearance Token (200 ZEN) + a gender change (??? ZEN) + an initial ability score reroll (??? ZEN) + it saves you having to spend a ton of AD/ZEN to get back where you were on a new character + it is neither a trivial thing nor an inexpensive thing to do in D&D.
They could even sell more expensive specialty Reincarnation Scrolls that let you play with a nonstandard race model. They could choose races that they already have art for but they are unlikely to want to build a full race option for. The character would be built as a Human or other appropriate player race but using a different character model. For example, a Reincarnation Scroll (Gnoll) for 2000 ZEN that lets you choose a Male or Female Gnoll model with limited or no further appearance customization and using the racial abilities of a Human.
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/cry... why do you do this to me? what happened to Ruuk? Did it work? What was the favor? YOU ARE WORSE THAN GEORGE R. R. MARTIN!!!
maybe i'll make a foundry quest from that story.
Although I wouldn't use them myself, I think Race rerolls are fine since there have been new races introduced since the game came out.
Agree ....
D&D allows race changes via re-incarnation, 'Wish', intervention of higher/lower powers, etc, so this isn't an issue.
How did it go?
This sounds like a very fair deal. Inclusive enough that it's worth the 1000 zen for people who want it, but not so cheap people are changing races like they change their pants.
Dude, this is a video game. It's a leisure activity meant to be fun. I have enough "consequences" with my "choices" in real life. Why do I need more when I'm just trying to have a good time?
I have changed race in pen and paper DnD. What's so weird about it?
As I said before:
so if you choose not to use this feature in P&P or an MMO that is, of course, your perogative.
I am very glad though that you made it clear that you feel that people should be able to enjoy themselves as much as possible as it is a game. This is certainly a feature that, although I personally don't plan on using, I do feel will be useful and make other players much happier.
Anyway it will happen eventually so whatever, some minmaxers will switch to halfins to pvp, others will just spend their hard earned money the way they want, i will continue being FrarII son of Frar, and will be an old Dwarf for a few hundred years more.
In a P&P case if you wanted to create a intrinsically persistent world or campaign then you would have a decent point, but here we have an MMO with insane number of adventurers everywhere with some extraordinarily unusual mounts and companions, so the issue of 'common' or not hardly seems applicable.
I can see why someone looking at this from a primarily P&P background might feel a bit uncomfortable, but 'reality' in P&P D&D and online D&D games are very different things.
also it makes complete sense... its a new currency sink + easily profitable for NW...
the only reason is dont want to start a new character of the same class and right race, is because of the time / money / ingame stuff invested on my character like artifacts, other items and specially mounts / companions / pvp gear etc etc etc...
It only makes sense that this is available since you can change feats / powers / stats / name etc etc..
would make me start playing the game again if this feature was added.