Well this is not entirely correct Shadow, if for any reason you have to use repel or it is on cooldown, you cannot keep a Paly using relentless off of you.
The instant you repel they will relent back to you, and then they can simply Rad to you, and at that point its just rinse and repeat the instance you try to cast anything Templar will go off or force you to shift, while Rad keeps purifying flames on you, and resets Relentless from echo proc's, or coming of cooldown on a 8-7 sec turn.
I have had that tactic used me a ton at 70, only works reliably if repel is available to you at engagement, and you are already out of Rad range.
now if on the 23rd if they implement the Paladin review they released on launch day, that wont work anymore either as it will provide 30% run speed, and smite will be ranged.
Well this is not entirely correct Shadow, if for any reason you have to use repel or it is on cooldown, you cannot keep a Paly using relentless off of you.
The instant you repel they will relent back to you, and then they can simply Rad to you, and at that point its just rinse and repeat the instance you try to cast anything Templar will go off or force you to shift, while Rad keeps purifying flames on you, and resets Relentless from echo proc's, or coming of cooldown on a 8-7 sec turn.
I have had that tactic used me a ton at 70, only works reliably if repel is available to you at engagement, and you are already out of Rad range.
now if on the 23rd if they implement the Paladin review they released on launch day, that wont work anymore either as it will provide 30% run speed, and smite will be ranged.
If you repel then blink away you are outside of Pals any gap closer and if he uses avenger he will rubberband or it won't trigger (this worked for me every time). I go repel, blink, rays to root him and I am totally clear and from this place he lost. If he blocks repel I blink one or two times and take step back (depends if he have avenger or not). If he is still on me, then I try with choke, blink, step back, root. Important thing always take step back when blinking from him, his rad will rubberband, in rad animation he is also vulnerable to CC, all depends on your latency and position here really. You can't expect to absolutely dominate every possible situation. Also if Pal slots avenger, he won't have binding, burning light or cleansing touch, this makes him much more vulnerable against other classes. From my experience avenger is wasted encounter slot. For me burning light, templar's wrath and binding oath work the best and I can totally change match outcome with them. With relentless avenger you run more than fight/ cap node, in 1vs1 against ranged class it's solid choice but in actual dominion or GG it's not that useful.
Truth to be told paladin on review was so much more interesting than this patch up design nightmare we have now. If they give him ranged smite, it will have short range for sure and nerfs for judgement, binding oath, divine protector are a given, maybe Aura of Courage and templar will also take a hit so I wouldn't worry too much.
One of the things that has to happen is let Divine Protector fall off whenever the Paladin gets CC'd. Currently people are abusing this hard with the DC AP bug, but even without 20 (!!) seconds of damage immunity for the whole team is just too much.
This skill alone will make the Paladin mandatory going forward.
One of the things that has to happen is let Divine Protector fall off whenever the Paladin gets CC'd. Currently people are abusing this hard with the DC AP bug, but even without 20 (!!) seconds of damage immunity for the whole team is just too much.
This skill alone will make the Paladin mandatory going forward.
Problem is it's totally impossible to do PvE end game content without this daily, I mean legitimate way, not abusing AP bug. This need severe nerf in PvP, I would go half DR, half duration but for PvE it must stay as it is or with current damage in dungeons and skirmishes only GF will have a chance to tank anything and we know that their numbers are too few. Tanks need some benefits for being tanks, other way nobody will like to play them and this will be much more frustrating for everyone in the long run.
Problem is it's totally impossible to do PvE end game content without this daily, I mean legitimate way, not abusing AP bug. This need severe nerf in PvP, I would go half DR, half duration but for PvE it must stay as it is or with current damage in dungeons and skirmishes only GF will have a chance to tank anything and we know that their numbers are too few. Tanks need some benefits for being tanks, other way nobody will like to play them and this will be much more frustrating for everyone in the long run.
I don't think such a change impacts PVE a lot, because there are not many unavoidable CC from mobs. The only one I can think of are Dragon roars, which can also interrupt KV.
People who complain about Pal being invincible just throw their whole rotation, dailies when he is on protector daily and/or binding oath (happens to me in almost every match, true pvp-ers learned fast and now massacre me on daily basis but others are doing same thing over and over again), you just don't do it cause it's even more stupid than wasting CC encounters on GWF in unstoppable. Some players need to stop mashing buttons and start to time their attacks, it's as simple as that. As I was trying different rotations with Pal in PvP people are even getting caught in full charged 3 sec burning light, it's ridiculous why they won't walk away, dodge or CC while charging. Many TRs against wrath, burning light, radiant aura just start to trash talk where it's so easy to counter, that's elementary example of L2P.
How do I L2P against a class I've never played? It is very easy to say don't do this or don't do that, but the class is two weeks old and something I've never never played and probably won't due to the amount of grinding this game now needs.
I don't know what their powers look like. Yes, sometimes it kills me and I have no clue what it done. All I have figured out is that when I see the blue circle and its shield is up I leave it. When I don't see the blue circle and shield is down I throw all of my CC at it (feated LS, Knee Breaker, Griffons, Bull Charge, etc) and that seems to work. I also don't touch it when I see temp HP, but I have no idea what generates all that temp HP.
And I can tell you right now, if you are not in a good PVP guild that has Paladins, no Paladin is going to tell you how to fight it.
PSA: You don't need to grind Spinward Rise for your Elemental artifact main hand if you have some AD lying around. You can craft it via the Tyranny of Dragon's campaign screen.
How do I L2P against a class I've never played? It is very easy to say don't do this or don't do that, but the class is two weeks old and something I've never never played and probably won't due to the amount of grinding this game now needs.
I don't know what their powers look like. Yes, sometimes it kills me and I have no clue what it done. All I have figured out is that when I see the blue circle and its shield is up I leave it. When I don't see the blue circle and shield is down I throw all of my CC at it (feated LS, Knee Breaker, Griffons, Bull Charge, etc) and that seems to work. I also don't touch it when I see temp HP, but I have no idea what generates all that temp HP.
And I can tell you right now, if you are not in a good PVP guild that has Paladins, no Paladin is going to tell you how to fight it.
On other note, people started learning or read my posts and it's getting harder and harder for Pal in PvP. Yeah, they still throw rotations at binding oath but some learned dodging burning light and divine judgement and that's a big progress. I think it's about time to ditch paladin as lack of mobility is getting too frustrating for me. I've learned what I wanted to learn, will wait for patch to see if they plan to rework anything dramatically but Pal gameplay is just too slow for me.
On other note, people started learning or read my posts and it's getting harder and harder for Pal in PvP. Yeah, they still throw rotations at binding oath but some learned dodging burning light and divine judgement and that's a big progress. I think it's about time to ditch paladin as lack of mobility is getting too frustrating for me. I've learned what I wanted to learn, will wait for patch to see if they plan to rework anything dramatically but Pal gameplay is just too slow for me.
IKR. Paladins are good support with their auras but that's about it. Whereas GFs can be both good support and deal some insane damage. I took a 160k anvil at my face yesterday, for an example.
The lack of mobility and CC powers hurts Paladins in PvP. A lot. Sure, I can get a lucky kill with Burning Light but how many attempts it takes me to fully charge it... And how many times I just waste it all because my target moved away during that 3-4s charge...
And yet people keep crying about divine judgement I find it funny.
IKR. Paladins are good support with their auras but that's about it. Whereas GFs can be both good support and deal some insane damage. I took a 160k anvil at my face yesterday, for an example.
The lack of mobility and CC powers hurts Paladins in PvP. A lot. Sure, I can get a lucky kill with Burning Light but how many attempts it takes me to fully charge it... And how many times I just waste it all because my target moved away during that 3-4s charge...
And yet people keep crying about divine judgement I find it funny.
The difference is, AOD activates at 40% hp... and nobody has 300k hp so even if it does crit for ~150k it does not really matter, since the GF is attacking the remaining ~20k hp... The high numbers is just 'eye candy' tbh. While paladins can just nuke your entire hp from 100% to... whatever you may have left at the end.
I also believe it takes a ton more skill to play a GF, than an OP. Paladins are quite 'idiot proof', at the moment.
The difference is, AOD activates at 40% hp... and nobody has 300k hp so even if it does crit for ~150k it does not really matter, since the GF is attacking the remaining ~20k hp... The high numbers is just 'eye candy' tbh. While paladins can just nuke your entire hp from 100% to... whatever you may have left at the end.
I also believe it takes a ton more skill to play a GF, than an OP. Paladins are quite 'idiot proof', at the moment.
Regards.
AoD was just an example. Fact is, now GF does better damage with at-wills than Paladin does with encounters. And I'm not comparing what takes more skill to play. So put your e-peen back to your e-pants. Okay?
SE and Ice Knife can 1shot till this day and both CW and TRs have great survivability and great damage with encounters and dailies, and at-wills. And now you're joining the bandwagon to nerf the only offensive ability a Paladin has? Really?
AoD was just an example. Fact is, now GF does better damage with at-wills than Paladin does with encounters. And I'm not comparing what takes more skill to play. So put your e-peen back to your e-pants. Okay?
SE and Ice Knife can 1shot till this day and both CW and TRs have great survivability and great damage with encounters and dailies, and at-wills. And now you're joining the bandwagon to nerf the only offensive ability a Paladin has? Really?
Nah, Paladins sure need some tone downs in their survivability (when they take no damage for hours, no clue wth the annoying skill is called) but i did not say that their damage is in any way, too high.
Nah, Paladins sure need some tone downs in their survivability (when they take no damage for hours, no clue wth the annoying skill is called) but i did not say that their damage is in any way, too high.
Who tell you no take damage for hour? Are you even play a paladin? All you guys just troll troll troll, just like the tr compaint threads that dont even know the difference between WK Tr and MI Tr. There is protection paladin n healer paladin, protection one has lots temporary hp via some encounter, thats the one that u fighting at, as playing a healer paladin, he takes damages. Paladin only get 1 damge daily and it can be avoid too. Paladin got short legs that runs slow too, he even not able to catch sw, although and sw won't kill each other. Once paladin face more than 1 player got cc, without teammate assist, he almost dead, thats my experience play paladin when fighting in GG.
If paladin play in supporting/healer role, almost he is not able to slot any damage encounter
most of the posts I read dont know how a palladin plays so:
No we dont know yet if it needs a tone down
No its not immortal
One thing though: the survivability of a palladin does not rely on shift or heal or stuff like that, it relies on temp hp and the only reason some of you do not see damage being done in pvp is because unlike other classes you dont see the temp hp in most cases, i dont know why but it would be nice fo a cw to see that his ice knife actually did some damage, and what amount , instead of guessing.
Plus the palladins that can heal do NOT have Divine protector
Plus the paladins who have divine protectos can NOT heal that much
Plus every serious encounter a Palladin has has an average cooldown of 45 secs lol
STOP WHINING AND ASK A PALLADIN. HELL, ASK ME WHEN I M ONLINE JUST STOP THESE NERF THREADS
Finally one more time : EVERYONE CAN 1v1 A PALLDIN , HOW IS THIS OP....... ?
and finally : THE ONLY TIME you ll have serious trouble with a palladin is if he plays with a DC on a cap
BUT if you place a tr on THAT cap to bleed points , the game is 3v4 --> gg , YOU WON , THE PALLADIN LOST , so what are you all talking about?
thank you for reading you miserable ptw whinning boys
Who tell you no take damage for hour? Are you even play a paladin? All you guys just troll troll troll, just like the tr compaint threads that dont even know the difference between WK Tr and MI Tr. There is protection paladin n healer paladin, protection one has lots temporary hp via some encounter, thats the one that u fighting at, as playing a healer paladin, he takes damages. Paladin only get 1 damge daily and it can be avoid too. Paladin got short legs that runs slow too, he even not able to catch sw, although and sw won't kill each other. Once paladin face more than 1 player got cc, without teammate assist, he almost dead, thats my experience play paladin when fighting in GG.
If paladin play in supporting/healer role, almost he is not able to slot any damage encounter
That sounds more like a palladin than most troll posts here so +1 on this one
I've PvP'd as a Paladin up until the 60-69 range and PvP'd against them at 70 on a TR and SW.
Pre-70, they definitely seem to be a threat. At 60+, it's much less so since most of the people in the 60-69 range are already equipped with Epics and a full array of Enchants + Boons. PvPing on my Pally in this range is hit or miss. I'm either able to defend against CC and hope my heals keep me up or I get ridiculously slaughtered. I'm full Devotion Light spec'd so I do nearly no damage.
Against them at 70, it's hit or miss once again. A team with a DC/OP combination is camping the mid point all day and they're probably not moving. An OP alone, depends on how he's built. I haven't run into any "OMG WTF HES IMMORTAL" OPs that everyone's talking about so far. In Dom and GG, the real drawback is how limited they are in range. You can spam the gapcloser At-Will but anyone with half a brain is CCing you during your charge.
As for the 1-shotting Daily, yea, it 1-shotted me pre-70. After 70, highest I've been hit so far is about 60k. Considering this is the most damaging skill an OP has and it's a daily, I'm not too concerned.
EDIT: Just to expand upon this, OP is a support class. They excel well in this role. I'm not sure whether my stats are ****ty, which they just might be, or if OP has too much team sustain but usually anyone I see getting supported by an OP in PvP is pretty **** hard to kill. Like, blow my whole rotation and watch the OP heal him back to full when I'm done. DC does the same so I'm not sure why everyone's *****ing about OPs.
Broken mechanics, broken class designs, lack of actual content, and over zealous, bronze-age moderation?
scariest two words in the pally build right now,....Divine Judgement. I havent seen this hit for less than 150k and thats with 3 other targets nearby(yes at level 70 with 2.5k tenacity and 3.5k def) I have no doubts that these huge nukes are coming from heavily built Pally's but thats still insane damage for a single button
Not sure how you got 2.5 k Ten and only 3.5k Defense, but if that the case your defense is your weak link, as probably the most pvp available Paly since release, I Spend most of my time in PVP, and have been since release week.
Paly's at 70 against geared players will not hit for 150k, the only time that will occur is if the opposing player is completely ungeared, 60k is about tops on well geared players and if there not a tank build, then it is more likely to be 40k.
Only Paly's that will be immortal, are 2 OP at the same gear level/skill level fighting each other, or a Immortal DC, that's going to be a all day draw.
Sadly enough a OP Paly's best damage skill is actually Shielding Strike, and anyone trying to stand toe to toe, other than another OP Paly, or a well geared Immortal DC will fall short, as Purifying Flames with hit to power mechanic will eventually overcome all other classes.
Comments
The instant you repel they will relent back to you, and then they can simply Rad to you, and at that point its just rinse and repeat the instance you try to cast anything Templar will go off or force you to shift, while Rad keeps purifying flames on you, and resets Relentless from echo proc's, or coming of cooldown on a 8-7 sec turn.
I have had that tactic used me a ton at 70, only works reliably if repel is available to you at engagement, and you are already out of Rad range.
now if on the 23rd if they implement the Paladin review they released on launch day, that wont work anymore either as it will provide 30% run speed, and smite will be ranged.
Truth to be told paladin on review was so much more interesting than this patch up design nightmare we have now. If they give him ranged smite, it will have short range for sure and nerfs for judgement, binding oath, divine protector are a given, maybe Aura of Courage and templar will also take a hit so I wouldn't worry too much.
This skill alone will make the Paladin mandatory going forward.
I don't think such a change impacts PVE a lot, because there are not many unavoidable CC from mobs. The only one I can think of are Dragon roars, which can also interrupt KV.
How do I L2P against a class I've never played? It is very easy to say don't do this or don't do that, but the class is two weeks old and something I've never never played and probably won't due to the amount of grinding this game now needs.
I don't know what their powers look like. Yes, sometimes it kills me and I have no clue what it done. All I have figured out is that when I see the blue circle and its shield is up I leave it. When I don't see the blue circle and shield is down I throw all of my CC at it (feated LS, Knee Breaker, Griffons, Bull Charge, etc) and that seems to work. I also don't touch it when I see temp HP, but I have no idea what generates all that temp HP.
And I can tell you right now, if you are not in a good PVP guild that has Paladins, no Paladin is going to tell you how to fight it.
Read all my posts in this thread, I've explained how to fight and many tips in my post here http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?894551-Paladins&p=10636671&viewfull=1#post10636671
On other note, people started learning or read my posts and it's getting harder and harder for Pal in PvP. Yeah, they still throw rotations at binding oath but some learned dodging burning light and divine judgement and that's a big progress. I think it's about time to ditch paladin as lack of mobility is getting too frustrating for me. I've learned what I wanted to learn, will wait for patch to see if they plan to rework anything dramatically but Pal gameplay is just too slow for me.
The lack of mobility and CC powers hurts Paladins in PvP. A lot. Sure, I can get a lucky kill with Burning Light but how many attempts it takes me to fully charge it... And how many times I just waste it all because my target moved away during that 3-4s charge...
And yet people keep crying about divine judgement
The difference is, AOD activates at 40% hp... and nobody has 300k hp so even if it does crit for ~150k it does not really matter, since the GF is attacking the remaining ~20k hp... The high numbers is just 'eye candy' tbh. While paladins can just nuke your entire hp from 100% to... whatever you may have left at the end.
I also believe it takes a ton more skill to play a GF, than an OP. Paladins are quite 'idiot proof', at the moment.
Regards.
AoD was just an example. Fact is, now GF does better damage with at-wills than Paladin does with encounters. And I'm not comparing what takes more skill to play. So put your e-peen back to your e-pants. Okay?
SE and Ice Knife can 1shot till this day and both CW and TRs have great survivability and great damage with encounters and dailies, and at-wills. And now you're joining the bandwagon to nerf the only offensive ability a Paladin has? Really?
Nah, Paladins sure need some tone downs in their survivability (when they take no damage for hours, no clue wth the annoying skill is called) but i did not say that their damage is in any way, too high.
Who tell you no take damage for hour? Are you even play a paladin? All you guys just troll troll troll, just like the tr compaint threads that dont even know the difference between WK Tr and MI Tr. There is protection paladin n healer paladin, protection one has lots temporary hp via some encounter, thats the one that u fighting at, as playing a healer paladin, he takes damages. Paladin only get 1 damge daily and it can be avoid too. Paladin got short legs that runs slow too, he even not able to catch sw, although and sw won't kill each other. Once paladin face more than 1 player got cc, without teammate assist, he almost dead, thats my experience play paladin when fighting in GG.
If paladin play in supporting/healer role, almost he is not able to slot any damage encounter
No we dont know yet if it needs a tone down
No its not immortal
One thing though: the survivability of a palladin does not rely on shift or heal or stuff like that, it relies on temp hp and the only reason some of you do not see damage being done in pvp is because unlike other classes you dont see the temp hp in most cases, i dont know why but it would be nice fo a cw to see that his ice knife actually did some damage, and what amount , instead of guessing.
Plus the palladins that can heal do NOT have Divine protector
Plus the paladins who have divine protectos can NOT heal that much
Plus every serious encounter a Palladin has has an average cooldown of 45 secs lol
STOP WHINING AND ASK A PALLADIN. HELL, ASK ME WHEN I M ONLINE JUST STOP THESE NERF THREADS
Finally one more time : EVERYONE CAN 1v1 A PALLDIN , HOW IS THIS OP....... ?
and finally : THE ONLY TIME you ll have serious trouble with a palladin is if he plays with a DC on a cap
BUT if you place a tr on THAT cap to bleed points , the game is 3v4 --> gg , YOU WON , THE PALLADIN LOST , so what are you all talking about?
thank you for reading you miserable ptw whinning boys
That sounds more like a palladin than most troll posts here so +1 on this one
Pre-70, they definitely seem to be a threat. At 60+, it's much less so since most of the people in the 60-69 range are already equipped with Epics and a full array of Enchants + Boons. PvPing on my Pally in this range is hit or miss. I'm either able to defend against CC and hope my heals keep me up or I get ridiculously slaughtered. I'm full Devotion Light spec'd so I do nearly no damage.
Against them at 70, it's hit or miss once again. A team with a DC/OP combination is camping the mid point all day and they're probably not moving. An OP alone, depends on how he's built. I haven't run into any "OMG WTF HES IMMORTAL" OPs that everyone's talking about so far. In Dom and GG, the real drawback is how limited they are in range. You can spam the gapcloser At-Will but anyone with half a brain is CCing you during your charge.
As for the 1-shotting Daily, yea, it 1-shotted me pre-70. After 70, highest I've been hit so far is about 60k. Considering this is the most damaging skill an OP has and it's a daily, I'm not too concerned.
EDIT: Just to expand upon this, OP is a support class. They excel well in this role. I'm not sure whether my stats are ****ty, which they just might be, or if OP has too much team sustain but usually anyone I see getting supported by an OP in PvP is pretty **** hard to kill. Like, blow my whole rotation and watch the OP heal him back to full when I'm done. DC does the same so I'm not sure why everyone's *****ing about OPs.
Go Cryptic!
PS - I quit.
Not sure how you got 2.5 k Ten and only 3.5k Defense, but if that the case your defense is your weak link, as probably the most pvp available Paly since release, I Spend most of my time in PVP, and have been since release week.
Paly's at 70 against geared players will not hit for 150k, the only time that will occur is if the opposing player is completely ungeared, 60k is about tops on well geared players and if there not a tank build, then it is more likely to be 40k.
Only Paly's that will be immortal, are 2 OP at the same gear level/skill level fighting each other, or a Immortal DC, that's going to be a all day draw.
Sadly enough a OP Paly's best damage skill is actually Shielding Strike, and anyone trying to stand toe to toe, other than another OP Paly, or a well geared Immortal DC will fall short, as Purifying Flames with hit to power mechanic will eventually overcome all other classes.