I'm confused....how the hell does clicking need give you 100% chance on an item.....I need on everything like everybody else.....am always the only ranger.....and never win anything....hell I win more Greed's on other classes stuff than I do needs on mine. True story. Do I just have that bad of luck?
This discussion was aimed at any piece that is not rings, belts, amulets, enchantments, etc (the items everyone can roll need on) but rather the class specific ones...
And this debate will never end when calling an item drop RNG (though it is), the heart of this debate is that for those in the group to all roll greed on those specific items so that anyone can win not just that class...
A specific case for myself, I have an ion stone and need a cleric OH for it, I ran a ton of pk and it dropped 4 times but each time a cleric rolled need... Now did I lose the RNG battle because that's the item I wanted in the first place or is our loot "etiquette " as a community flawed?
And this debate will never end when calling an item drop RNG (though it is), the heart of this debate is that for those in the group to all roll greed on those specific items so that anyone can win not just that class...
A specific case for myself, I have an ion stone and need a cleric OH for it, I ran a ton of pk and it dropped 4 times but each time a cleric rolled need... Now did I lose the RNG battle because that's the item I wanted in the first place or is our loot "etiquette " as a community flawed?
The debate never ending just because of drop RNG, isn't necessarily true. I understand that it may feel like the system isn't balanced when you consider that youll almost always have a DC with you who is going to be hitting Need on that DC offhand you want for your Ioun Stone. But this is where the auction house comes in as a check and balance point. To stick with your given example, DC offhands are easily and readily available for purchase from the auction house. Now, while it could seem initially unfair to have to buy a DC offhand, upon closer examination you'll realize that this isn't the case. As an example, the Greater Icon of Blue Fire (a T2 DC offhand) sells on the auction house for around 8k, which is equivalent the amount of AD you'd receive from salvaging ANY class's T2 offhand. So that offhand that was for your class that you hit Need on, translates equally into the purchase of a DC offhand.
Member of Look Good Play Good Pup - Level 70 4.2k Buff/Debuff AC DC XBL GT: TehPuppy
I have a belt and a weapon that needs greens. But I do not farm them in a dungeon. And even waiting to kill everything to loot wastes time. Dungeons are long as is. Now you have to wait for some looter to pick everything up so the group can move on, NO. Just, NO. You are in the dungeon for boss loot, seals and the chest at the end. No one goes in to farm greens and blues. If you are, then again, you need to leave.
there are some that acctually use dungeons to farm green\blue gear i do it so i can upgrade my artifact belt\weapon i wait till the fight is over to pick up the loot, i will need on anything i can need on cuz i actually need it
And by that respect is my point as to why the current looting system is flawed in the need everything mentality... If I am or anyone for that matter is running a zone whose to say your class needs that item more then i/we do thus the point that rolling greed on BoE epics is the fairest means
Why should anyone have to buy an item if they want to farm it? So people can loot the same item 5+ times for salvage or to resell? Why is the non class need or want to sell that item any less valuable then the primary? Just because you CAN roll need doesn't mean you should or have to
And by that respect is my point as to why the current looting system is flawed in the need everything mentality... If I am or anyone for that matter is running a zone whose to say your class needs that item more then i/we do thus the point that rolling greed on BoE epics is the fairest means
Why should anyone have to buy an item if they want to farm it? So people can loot the same item 5+ times for salvage or to resell? Why is the non class need or want to sell that item any less valuable then the primary? Just because you CAN roll need doesn't mean you should or have to
If you're looking to farm an item that isn't for your class, then you should be in a premade and doing manual round robin amongst your group. Claiming that it's disrespectful for members of a PUG to Need roll is overly demanding, unfair, and again, very selfish. The non class can either go farm said item with a premade who's already agreed upon "Greed only" runs, OR go farm something that's for their class. It's as simple as that. It's not a matter of respect because any instance in which this sort of scenario might upset you (someone Needing on things) would be if your in a queued PUG and if that's the case, it's disrespectful of you to assume that the person doesn't actually need the item, even if they have a better item in that slot, they could have an alt they want to give the item to. Claiming that it's a broken system because you don't want to use the auction house isn't really a good reason either. Just because you don't want to do something doesn't make the auction house a moot point, it is relevant, and it is there for your use.
Member of Look Good Play Good Pup - Level 70 4.2k Buff/Debuff AC DC XBL GT: TehPuppy
If you're looking to farm an item that isn't for your class, then you should be in a premade and doing manual round robin amongst your group. Claiming that it's disrespectful for members of a PUG to Need roll is overly demanding, unfair, and again, very selfish. The non class can either go farm said item with a premade who's already agreed upon "Greed only" runs, OR go farm something that's for their class. It's as simple as that. It's not a matter of respect because any instance in which this sort of scenario might upset you (someone Needing on things) would be if your in a queued PUG and if that's the case, it's disrespectful of you to assume that the person doesn't actually need the item, even if they have a better item in that slot, they could have an alt they want to give the item to. Claiming that it's a broken system because you don't want to use the auction house isn't really a good reason either. Just because you don't want to do something doesn't make the auction house a moot point, it is relevant, and it is there for your use.
I wouldnt want to use the AH either...have you seen the prices there just on starting bids:( O.o
If you're looking to farm an item that isn't for your class, then you should be in a premade and doing manual round robin amongst your group. Claiming that it's disrespectful for members of a PUG to Need roll is overly demanding, unfair, and again, very selfish. The non class can either go farm said item with a premade who's already agreed upon "Greed only" runs, OR go farm something that's for their class. It's as simple as that. It's not a matter of respect because any instance in which this sort of scenario might upset you (someone Needing on things) would be if your in a queued PUG and if that's the case, it's disrespectful of you to assume that the person doesn't actually need the item, even if they have a better item in that slot, they could have an alt they want to give the item to.
Claiming that it's a broken system because you don't want to use the auction house isn't really a good reason either. Just because you don't want to do something doesn't make the auction house a moot point, it is relevant, and it is there for your use.
And your reaction to my post, if I may say so, is a glaring issue with the current norm for looting and why I said earlier, no matter what evidence or discussion put forth your and most of the Xbox community as a whole, will never change their opinion on this subject is centered purely out of greed and has spiraled into other glaring issues the game has currently. You say my want for people to roll greed instead of need, to paraphrase, is why the auction house exists... So instead of having an EQUAL chance for ALL party members to receive ANY drop in the run, I am in the wrong here.
I'm sorry if I start to get annoyed in sounding but to call the first drop your RNG roll is absurd, the RNG roll for OWNING the item is when you roll need...
Now allow me to diverge from the current issue to elaborate on what I mentioned earlier, the real reason people have an issue que'ing for dungeons in pugs is because out of pure greed people are trying to stack their "NEED" rolls for drops...
This is why I'm even taking the time to try and chang this aspect of the community no matter how vain it may be...
TLDR; greed on class BoE is the true fair loot roll and will also help alleviate the communities problem with dungeon kicks at least to an extent
On a side note, I ask you to actually provide evidence that this need all mentality actually helps the community in any way...
I wouldnt want to use the AH either...have you seen the prices there just on starting bids:( O.o
I've heard several people mention this but am having a hard time understanding where you guys are coming from exactly. If you search for the item you want, sure the first few pages may have some ridiculously priced bid only items, but move over a few pages and you'll find the item at much more reasonable prices. Like, is there just some item that's broken as could be and doesn't work this way? Or do that many people just not know how to navigate the AH? Not intending for that to sound mean, just don't understand the problem there. AH isn't great IMO cause we still ca't filter our search results like PC NW can, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work at all.
Member of Look Good Play Good Pup - Level 70 4.2k Buff/Debuff AC DC XBL GT: TehPuppy
I've heard several people mention this but am having a hard time understanding where you guys are coming from exactly. If you search for the item you want, sure the first few pages may have some ridiculously priced bid only items, but move over a few pages and you'll find the item at much more reasonable prices. Like, is there just some item that's broken as could be and doesn't work this way? Or do that many people just not know how to navigate the AH? Not intending for that to sound mean, just don't understand the problem there. AH isn't great IMO cause we still ca't filter our search results like PC NW can, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work at all.
you can filter results now they fixed that with yesterdays patch
Comments
This discussion was aimed at any piece that is not rings, belts, amulets, enchantments, etc (the items everyone can roll need on) but rather the class specific ones...
And this debate will never end when calling an item drop RNG (though it is), the heart of this debate is that for those in the group to all roll greed on those specific items so that anyone can win not just that class...
A specific case for myself, I have an ion stone and need a cleric OH for it, I ran a ton of pk and it dropped 4 times but each time a cleric rolled need... Now did I lose the RNG battle because that's the item I wanted in the first place or is our loot "etiquette " as a community flawed?
The debate never ending just because of drop RNG, isn't necessarily true. I understand that it may feel like the system isn't balanced when you consider that youll almost always have a DC with you who is going to be hitting Need on that DC offhand you want for your Ioun Stone. But this is where the auction house comes in as a check and balance point. To stick with your given example, DC offhands are easily and readily available for purchase from the auction house. Now, while it could seem initially unfair to have to buy a DC offhand, upon closer examination you'll realize that this isn't the case. As an example, the Greater Icon of Blue Fire (a T2 DC offhand) sells on the auction house for around 8k, which is equivalent the amount of AD you'd receive from salvaging ANY class's T2 offhand. So that offhand that was for your class that you hit Need on, translates equally into the purchase of a DC offhand.
Pup - Level 70 4.2k Buff/Debuff AC DC
XBL GT: TehPuppy
there are some that acctually use dungeons to farm green\blue gear i do it so i can upgrade my artifact belt\weapon i wait till the fight is over to pick up the loot, i will need on anything i can need on cuz i actually need it
Why should anyone have to buy an item if they want to farm it? So people can loot the same item 5+ times for salvage or to resell? Why is the non class need or want to sell that item any less valuable then the primary? Just because you CAN roll need doesn't mean you should or have to
If you're looking to farm an item that isn't for your class, then you should be in a premade and doing manual round robin amongst your group. Claiming that it's disrespectful for members of a PUG to Need roll is overly demanding, unfair, and again, very selfish. The non class can either go farm said item with a premade who's already agreed upon "Greed only" runs, OR go farm something that's for their class. It's as simple as that. It's not a matter of respect because any instance in which this sort of scenario might upset you (someone Needing on things) would be if your in a queued PUG and if that's the case, it's disrespectful of you to assume that the person doesn't actually need the item, even if they have a better item in that slot, they could have an alt they want to give the item to. Claiming that it's a broken system because you don't want to use the auction house isn't really a good reason either. Just because you don't want to do something doesn't make the auction house a moot point, it is relevant, and it is there for your use.
Pup - Level 70 4.2k Buff/Debuff AC DC
XBL GT: TehPuppy
I wouldnt want to use the AH either...have you seen the prices there just on starting bids:( O.o
And your reaction to my post, if I may say so, is a glaring issue with the current norm for looting and why I said earlier, no matter what evidence or discussion put forth your and most of the Xbox community as a whole, will never change their opinion on this subject is centered purely out of greed and has spiraled into other glaring issues the game has currently. You say my want for people to roll greed instead of need, to paraphrase, is why the auction house exists... So instead of having an EQUAL chance for ALL party members to receive ANY drop in the run, I am in the wrong here.
I'm sorry if I start to get annoyed in sounding but to call the first drop your RNG roll is absurd, the RNG roll for OWNING the item is when you roll need...
Now allow me to diverge from the current issue to elaborate on what I mentioned earlier, the real reason people have an issue que'ing for dungeons in pugs is because out of pure greed people are trying to stack their "NEED" rolls for drops...
This is why I'm even taking the time to try and chang this aspect of the community no matter how vain it may be...
TLDR; greed on class BoE is the true fair loot roll and will also help alleviate the communities problem with dungeon kicks at least to an extent
On a side note, I ask you to actually provide evidence that this need all mentality actually helps the community in any way...
I've heard several people mention this but am having a hard time understanding where you guys are coming from exactly. If you search for the item you want, sure the first few pages may have some ridiculously priced bid only items, but move over a few pages and you'll find the item at much more reasonable prices. Like, is there just some item that's broken as could be and doesn't work this way? Or do that many people just not know how to navigate the AH? Not intending for that to sound mean, just don't understand the problem there. AH isn't great IMO cause we still ca't filter our search results like PC NW can, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work at all.
Pup - Level 70 4.2k Buff/Debuff AC DC
XBL GT: TehPuppy
you can filter results now they fixed that with yesterdays patch