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(Ant-Monster) Neverwinter / Module 6 Review
lvl99looter
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 682 Arc User
As we all know Module 6 is on the way, and it's going too bringing some major, and I mean MAJOR changes. Although new content is nice and is wanted in a sense, I and MANY others, both PvE'ers/PvP'ers both agree Module 6 will be the killing blow to a once INCREDIBLE game. But before we discuss Module 6's new upcoming content, and class changes/balances... Let's travel back into the past real quick.
(Q = Question / S = Statement)
Q: How many of you guys remember Module 1?
S: For those who joined Neverwinter ("NW" for short) after Module 1 and played since then. I want you too try your best too think of this game as a VERY simplistic, new player friendly, challenging, exciting, MUCH more balanced, more economically stable, time investments are rewarding (meaning GRINDING paid off), player friendly (meaning NO pressure on players too spend real money) game. Sounds like a beautiful, near perfect game doesn't it? But make no mistake, the game was not perfect. But it was MUCH closer too perfection compared too now. Back in Module 1 the MAIN issues back then were mostly simple class balance requests, and making things cheaper for players, and NEW PvP maps. For example, removing enchantments from epic gear used too cost 100k+ AD, which was a LOT of money.
Other easy too fix issues Module 1 had was the expensive enchantment system, which you guys could have easily tweaked. But for some reason you guys felt the need too notoriously unnecessarily rework the enchantment system into something that pressures players into purchasing ZEN or AD from 3rd party websites, and if you critically think about it. You really can't blame your players, because in the end it's YOUR fault. Now I understand that comes off a bit arrogant, but is it really MY fault that you MAKE me/us(other players) feel this way too even say/think that? Look, EVERYTHING I'm about too say in this thread has a REASON, and has a PURPOSE. I understand that I might come off as an ***hole, but trust me it's ONLY because I want the best for this game. This game once brought me GREAT happiness, and I want others too experience that as well.
Check it out, back in the day. Players used too grind dungeons like CRAZY for good loot too sell for AD. Meaning many players set out too earn their AD righteously! So because of that, that brought a lot of people and friends together too dive into these dungeons man! One of the MOST popular dungeons back then was Dwarf King. Dwarf King was a very fun, challenging, yet simple that brought the community together. My friends and I used too plan for everyone too login at specific times so we could all play together, get some nice loot, sell it, and split it among the group. Because of this dungeon, many players became innovators creating new PvE builds for their specific classes. In other words, that dungeon had such a POSITIVE effect on players it MADE players want too design builds for MAXIMUM performance and efficiency!!
This dungeon was then RUINED by some dude who made a forum post saying Dwarf King was too profitable. What you guys failed too realize was that, he made that forum post about Dwarf King because he was tired of people undercutting him on the auction house; THAT'S IT!! We're all in a depression because of one selfish dude who hated being undercut made a forum post, which ruined the most teamwork rewarding dungeon in the game!
But here's the REASON for that short story. While you guys were launching Preview Shard Dwarf King nerf updates, players were TRYING too warn you NOT too go through with it. Just like when players tried too warn you about godmode GWF's back in Pre-Module 2, or HR's being OP for Module 3, or Perma-Freeze CW's, or about Shadow of Demise, Concussive Strike, or the enchantment/refinement system, or the SIMPLE buffs/nerfs GF's, DC's, TR's, HR's, CW's, or GWF's needed.
Trust me man, I can see where this game is headed. DO NOT go through with all the new enchantment/artifact/level cap changes. Players already have TOO many stats as it is. Players used too have too sacrifice stats in certain areas if they wanted too ahcieve a certain build. Meaning, if someone wanted more DPS, they had too sacrifice survivability. That's balance, that's yin yang baby.
Postpone Module 6 until you've fixed, and balance the game in it's current state, then go from there. Otherwise, whatever is left of this Neverwinter will die =/...
No one wants too dislike this game. We want, too WANT too like the game. But you're make it VERY difficult for us with all these unnecessary changes. We the players have said it many times before, only make changes in SMALL doses, and it things don't work out revert back. Yes it's a lot of work, yes it's easier said than done. But in the end, the quality of the game will improve, and the population will grow, and with that COMES the money you guys want! But you MUST put us FIRST (Players > Money).
_______________________________
Here's a REAL example:
There's this game I used to play called RS (I don't know if I'm allowed to say the full name). RS had a combat system like non-other. It was very weird, everything worked in slow ticks, player's characters look turns hitting each other. Very strange, but what made it work was the INTENSITY. As weird as it sounds, players enjoy getting hit or hitting others really hard (doing high damage). Because it causes excitement or panic, all of which is ENTERTAINMENT! The PvP system in RS was weird, but it worked! The day the company decided to make MAJOR changes to the combat system KILLED the game. Hundreds of players (including myself) made threads warning the company of RS, but they still went through with it. When all they had to do was scrap the idea, and make MINOR adjustments to their perfectly working PvP system. The company of RS didn't listen to the community until it was already too late. After suffering from losing thousands of players (or should I say the player's money for membership), only then did they decide to start working with the community by using polling systems for future content. Which allows the players to vote on what they want, and the company of RS would only accept polls that passed with a 75% 'yes' rate. This happened in 2012, which was NOT long ago. My point is this...
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it." <---- This phrase is EXTREMELY important to remember.
________________________________
We the players are on your side, we're playing for the same team. The first step too improve the quality of this game is to become MORE active ALL OVER the forums instead of just lurking in the preview section. Example; I've NEVER seen a Dev post in the Barracks or Thief's Den forum section before.
(Q = Question / S = Statement)
Q: How many of you guys remember Module 1?
S: For those who joined Neverwinter ("NW" for short) after Module 1 and played since then. I want you too try your best too think of this game as a VERY simplistic, new player friendly, challenging, exciting, MUCH more balanced, more economically stable, time investments are rewarding (meaning GRINDING paid off), player friendly (meaning NO pressure on players too spend real money) game. Sounds like a beautiful, near perfect game doesn't it? But make no mistake, the game was not perfect. But it was MUCH closer too perfection compared too now. Back in Module 1 the MAIN issues back then were mostly simple class balance requests, and making things cheaper for players, and NEW PvP maps. For example, removing enchantments from epic gear used too cost 100k+ AD, which was a LOT of money.
Other easy too fix issues Module 1 had was the expensive enchantment system, which you guys could have easily tweaked. But for some reason you guys felt the need too notoriously unnecessarily rework the enchantment system into something that pressures players into purchasing ZEN or AD from 3rd party websites, and if you critically think about it. You really can't blame your players, because in the end it's YOUR fault. Now I understand that comes off a bit arrogant, but is it really MY fault that you MAKE me/us(other players) feel this way too even say/think that? Look, EVERYTHING I'm about too say in this thread has a REASON, and has a PURPOSE. I understand that I might come off as an ***hole, but trust me it's ONLY because I want the best for this game. This game once brought me GREAT happiness, and I want others too experience that as well.
Check it out, back in the day. Players used too grind dungeons like CRAZY for good loot too sell for AD. Meaning many players set out too earn their AD righteously! So because of that, that brought a lot of people and friends together too dive into these dungeons man! One of the MOST popular dungeons back then was Dwarf King. Dwarf King was a very fun, challenging, yet simple that brought the community together. My friends and I used too plan for everyone too login at specific times so we could all play together, get some nice loot, sell it, and split it among the group. Because of this dungeon, many players became innovators creating new PvE builds for their specific classes. In other words, that dungeon had such a POSITIVE effect on players it MADE players want too design builds for MAXIMUM performance and efficiency!!
This dungeon was then RUINED by some dude who made a forum post saying Dwarf King was too profitable. What you guys failed too realize was that, he made that forum post about Dwarf King because he was tired of people undercutting him on the auction house; THAT'S IT!! We're all in a depression because of one selfish dude who hated being undercut made a forum post, which ruined the most teamwork rewarding dungeon in the game!
But here's the REASON for that short story. While you guys were launching Preview Shard Dwarf King nerf updates, players were TRYING too warn you NOT too go through with it. Just like when players tried too warn you about godmode GWF's back in Pre-Module 2, or HR's being OP for Module 3, or Perma-Freeze CW's, or about Shadow of Demise, Concussive Strike, or the enchantment/refinement system, or the SIMPLE buffs/nerfs GF's, DC's, TR's, HR's, CW's, or GWF's needed.
Trust me man, I can see where this game is headed. DO NOT go through with all the new enchantment/artifact/level cap changes. Players already have TOO many stats as it is. Players used too have too sacrifice stats in certain areas if they wanted too ahcieve a certain build. Meaning, if someone wanted more DPS, they had too sacrifice survivability. That's balance, that's yin yang baby.
Postpone Module 6 until you've fixed, and balance the game in it's current state, then go from there. Otherwise, whatever is left of this Neverwinter will die =/...
No one wants too dislike this game. We want, too WANT too like the game. But you're make it VERY difficult for us with all these unnecessary changes. We the players have said it many times before, only make changes in SMALL doses, and it things don't work out revert back. Yes it's a lot of work, yes it's easier said than done. But in the end, the quality of the game will improve, and the population will grow, and with that COMES the money you guys want! But you MUST put us FIRST (Players > Money).
_______________________________
Here's a REAL example:
There's this game I used to play called RS (I don't know if I'm allowed to say the full name). RS had a combat system like non-other. It was very weird, everything worked in slow ticks, player's characters look turns hitting each other. Very strange, but what made it work was the INTENSITY. As weird as it sounds, players enjoy getting hit or hitting others really hard (doing high damage). Because it causes excitement or panic, all of which is ENTERTAINMENT! The PvP system in RS was weird, but it worked! The day the company decided to make MAJOR changes to the combat system KILLED the game. Hundreds of players (including myself) made threads warning the company of RS, but they still went through with it. When all they had to do was scrap the idea, and make MINOR adjustments to their perfectly working PvP system. The company of RS didn't listen to the community until it was already too late. After suffering from losing thousands of players (or should I say the player's money for membership), only then did they decide to start working with the community by using polling systems for future content. Which allows the players to vote on what they want, and the company of RS would only accept polls that passed with a 75% 'yes' rate. This happened in 2012, which was NOT long ago. My point is this...
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it." <---- This phrase is EXTREMELY important to remember.
________________________________
We the players are on your side, we're playing for the same team. The first step too improve the quality of this game is to become MORE active ALL OVER the forums instead of just lurking in the preview section. Example; I've NEVER seen a Dev post in the Barracks or Thief's Den forum section before.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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This discussion has been closed.
Comments
I can summarise this. lvl99looter says he's been here too long but somehow can't bring himself to leave.
What happens when suits tighten a noose around your neck and tell you to have X finished by X date.
I already know why I haven't left, but that's not the point of this tread. It's about I and many other have predicted MANY things that could have been avoided if they would just listen too us.
I would actually try to work with my beta testers.
The irony is that all these changes have gotten me all depressed and negative about the game, while ESO going free piped my interest.
So much of the testers feedback isn't even noticed. *coughREGENcough*
Myself stopped playing some time ago and on finding out what they are going to do in M6 - most probably I will not come back...
Cryptic will lose tons of money. ESO going free is only part of the problem. Neverwinter turning more and more into a player unfriendly pay-to-win game is the real issue.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
See thats wrong. The most money will come from satisfied customers who not only play but also refer your product, so it is in their best interest to put the customer first. Hell they shoud all learn from Blizzard. <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> graphics, ancient combat but so many are still there, still playing and paying.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
If that was the case, then everything they have done since Mod 4 wouldve been thrown out, because thats when I STOPPED spending money, because there was simply NO reason to.
When things are so out of proportion to return value, then you never bother. Tell me what is worth spending 60 bucks on in this game? RP isnt, because RP has no value and THEY have already shown your RP will not stay, so buying it is the worst sort of situation you can be in.
Simply put, they made some bad decisions and are piling more bad decisions on top of that.
I do not blame the devs, there is someone pushing somewhere that is oblivious to the playberbase feedback, who doesn't care, or wont listen. That is not unusual, and its sad.
I left raiding games ot come to neverwinter, because I was sick of the 20-30 a week grind just to compete at raiding level. Now they want to REINTRODUCE 20-30 hour a week grind , BUT HECK there is no raids to even accomplish, there isnt EVEN a raiding system in this game! The 5 man group stuff that RETURNS value for running them IS small.
The game got boinked in mod 4 with the Solo grinding and ALL they do is add more, WHEN we asked them to TONE down what we already have.
Feedback: Listen to player feedback.
There .
Are the devs even alive? I don't see them commenting on our threads at all.
WTB Class Reroll please
Exactly, but then there's those players who love to min-max everything other than those who prefer having fun, and thus several companies (Perfect World is a perfect example) prey on these players' temptations making the game go from bad to worst, which in this case NW.
same
Hah, so what then? See you all in ESO come March? I'll be there, I already own the game
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
ESO is going free? I thought they only dropped the subscription, turning it into a B2P model a la Guild Wars.
Truer words were never spoken. There is no chance that I would EVER recommend this game to anyone - not even my worst enemy - because the route taken by Cryptic in recent mods has driven the majority of the old playerbase away. And they don't seem to be learning from past mistakes. I totally agree that they should take a page out of Blizzard's books and take their players into consideration. Happy players = money. Unhappy players = dead game. And NW is fast heading that way. Been here 13 months now and it's just a downward spiral.
The most important thing in life is to be yourself. Unless you can be Batman. Always be Batman.
Yes, the initial purchase remains. I got my copy on a sweet Steam deal during the Xmas holidays.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Well, that will probably bring back old players who left TESO and entice some new players from games with payment models similar to Guild Wars, but still the fact that there's an entrance barrier will affect f2p players much less.
Quite frankly, I don't see ESO being that much of a threat to NW until they go completely free to play.
Consider that every time they will expand they will ask money for the expansion as well if they stick to the B2P model.
Bro, you do realize "free-to-play" ends up costing more right? There is no such thing as 'free' in this business. IMO the one thing that really turns some people off is a monthly sub. A buy-to-play is the best model. A buy-to-play gives the devs and publishers some much needed return on investment and allows for a much less cash shop dependent game.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
Look at my join date. I haven't put a dime in this game and pretty much experienced all content it has to offer. All of it. For ZERO euros. Which is infinitely less than any B2P model can offer.
No, I don't buy this story that "free-to-play" costs more. I've played MMOs since Ragnarok Online and Dark Age of Camelot (going through WoW, Lotro and DDO) and so far, Neverwinter is the most cost-effective form of gaming entertainment I ever experienced.
There are now better and more interesting alternatives, I think.
Anyhow, kiss goodbye to this thread now that we're talking about another game, assuming the mods are in circulation. (Anyone else think they have been kinda quiet recently?)
WTB Class Reroll please
I got a friend to join for awhile, gave him over a million dollars in AD stuff for his toon, right before mod 4 hit, then bam, like a week later he said, "man, this game kinda sux, Im not doing all that daily grinding" and left.
Ive had other former guildmates ask whats up, I tell them dont bother coming back, and/or joining this game at this time. ITs just not worth the hassle. Ive been in two guilds with over 300 active players, with all but a handful left in each, yikes. Turnover rate very high in this game. The simply refuse to listen to player feedback , they have made the game too grindy and has left the niche market they once dominated (casual, gamer friendly) to a really bad grindy system, that locks you out of pvp content now.
Not good.
I love these arguments, I really do. How do you think the game stayed online since 2013? Certnainly no thanks to free players. Coming and stating you never spent a dime on this game means nothing, cause if we all did that there would be no game.
PS: Do you really think Cryptic developed this game and keeps working on it so people can enjoy it for free?
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily, Life is but a dream.
No, they don't. But that doesn't mean I'm forced to pay more than B2P or sub games for some reason. There are other players who are paying for my "quota" and they CHOOSE to do so, no one is forcing their hand. On the other hand, the other models force everyone to pay the same amount even if the enjoyment they get out of it is different, that's the beauty of the f2p model imho.
Notice anything similar. It's almost the exact same complaints as you see here. And guess what? Go into ANY MMO forum and you'll see it's exactly the same.
The name of the game and the name of the posters change, but its the same thing everyone always complains about. If you think ESO is going to be some magical wonderland when it goes B2P, think again.
Or any MMO for that matter.
Neverwinter has it's share of problems, and yes, there's been good ideas posted here to help fix some of that, but you guys are pretty ridiculous in your hyperbole sometimes. And this post just takes the cake.
EDIT: And I'm not making this up. Go over to their forums and take a look. I did exactly that a few minutes ago, and this is what I saw. :cool:
When I first played this game it was better than any other I had tried and as a big gamer that is a lot. The game was fun, pvp was great even with it's flaws. Now I haven't been on in a long time, I check in maybe once a month to see if some things change but thats it.
The main issue to me is the power creep and the fact that it's near impossible for a none money spender to gain a maxed char and yes although that is not needed for pve as much but for pvp players it is a huge issue. I liked pve and still would but dungeons are unrewarding, running them for low lvl items and hardly any ad just gets boring. How long will it take for a new player to catch up to old ones ? They never will unless they buy from a 3rd party. It will make the game just a huge grind fest for them, constantly trying to catch up.
I also think a big issue is that there is no way to make decent ad in pvp....as a pvp player I am always poor, I don't like pve in it's current state and I only have 1 char so my only option to make ad is to race for first place in GG and hope that i get a decent item and 70% of the time you don't.
1st, 2nd and 3rd spots in pvp should get ad reward and there should be better daily pvp challenges/contracts to earn ad and items. Pvp is a big community and should be just as important as pve since different players prefer different parts of the game so both should be rewarded.
So yeah for now I will just check in every once in a while in hopes that it gets better, and I really hope it does.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]