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changes for Dc not good for epic skirmishes or dungeons
hoofit
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 122 Arc User
Today I tested the new DC changes level 60 its so hard now to keep people alive without Atsral shield to heal, you have to spam so fast I'm not sure I will have any buttons left and then there are the people who say is astral shield bugged you tell them no that's how it is now they say no its not (not even being a DC) and then tell me it must be bugged they have seen others using Astral shield how it used to be blue circle to heal. And then they try to kick. I found in PvP the new build works very well but a dungeon/skirmish that's epic its not good its pretty bad with out astral shield to heal, I normally don't loose people unless there badly geared but they have to be really badly geared to loose them and now well lets just say its not good. Can we have it back please 
just astral shield to heal, that blue healing circle we all need. I think we are in for a hard time in dungeon now and skirmishes (epic) where people rely on heals. today was the first time my DC has ever had someone try to kick me, they failed.
just astral shield to heal, that blue healing circle we all need. I think we are in for a hard time in dungeon now and skirmishes (epic) where people rely on heals. today was the first time my DC has ever had someone try to kick me, they failed. Post edited by hoofit on
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Well, i didnt say its better..i was suggesting alternaltive since u cant change anything now that they change astral shield in mod 5. We just gotta adapt to the changes. Btw we dun need to use 3 skill to replace blue astral shield but only 2, normal bastion + normal astral will technicaly give the same effect with blue astral. If the heal isnt enough, u can spam divine bastion to heal them. Divine glow is just a backup heal or debuff/dps for me. It also help recharge ur divine bar pretty fast too. I tried them in Karu a few run and my party could practically tank anything, well with an exception if they are not in the circle i placed.
P.s. I suppose they hoped to encourage more DCs to participate in PvP and not feel so gimped in comparison with other classes. We will have to see i suppose how it will work out. And by the end of the day not everyone is interested in PvP.
However this does require people to work with the DC and understand how they heal and buff, which sadly a lot of the time isnt the case, so if you see people charging into enemies alone without you or running off to a corner with enemies chasing after them I wouldn't blame the DC
HR Stormwarden Trapper / Stormwarden Combat
GWF Swordmaster Destroyer
CW Master of Flame Thaumaturge / Spellstorm Oppressor
TR Master Infiltrator Executioner
SW Soulbinder Fury
So it is definitely possible to play healer even without astral shield. Another thing with healing word is that you can use it for more dispersed parties, where most are shooters, you can heal people in three different locations, and for clumped together parties healing word works as well as astral shield.
divine astral shield gives u 5K temp hit points now
(sadly the temp hit point don't stack with itself or with other temp hit point u generate, at least not with anointed holy symbol)
and the empower absorb 3% per stack. it can reach 9% of your max HP!
combine all together, astral shield save your party much more then before
I agree its hard to do healing now. but buff debuff and saving your party is much better
Oh, not being able to gain AP while Hallowed Ground is active is really fubar as far as I'm concerned. Playing the DC isn't fun and enjoyable anymore but maybe that will change.
Was in a Tuern Skirm after the update and was told by another player that I was "useless". I couldn't argue since I felt the same way. Two hours after the update and brand new feats was hardly enough time to get a good grip on what it now takes for the DC. I'll try to keep an eye on this thread in hopes that some kind hearted soul will explain to this grouchy old s o b how to properly play the DC once again.
That is simply an example of a poor community member, which there seems the be a glut of in this game. Don't ever let someone not playing a DC tell you how to play a DC. They should probably learn to dodge, not stand still in a red circle of fire, and that an attack cone (like the one used by Garakas) is larger at the far end than at the base (hence easier to avoid if in melee range).
With the changes, the Devoted Cleric has easily become the most versatile of the classes able to fulfill a myriad of roles, but with that comes complexity. There is not one "go to" loadout for all situations, and you'll have to find your optimum loadouts for each scenario and change accordingly.
I, for one, am glad that in mod 5 I'm not stuck soloing Garakas for a long period of time (with ppl telling me to just wipe - to which I've responded by advising them to solely engage in a pleasurable act) just because some people can't be bothered to dodge or pay attention to the boss' attack patterns. It's nice to finally have something to use against mobs more damaging than just harsh language.
Well i take everything back about AS being useless now, its youre go to skill even more now then ever "cough Op, cough". I am seriously worried we DCs will be hit with a nerfbat soon and pretty hard at that. I did few dungeon runs, nothing overly complicated, just some old T2s, but with pugs. I cant really say if its the new DC healing potential, or i was just exceptionally lucky with my teams. We have not wiped once. Have to test more, later. The way i use it - i just drop none Divine AS on tank, or depending on situation and proceed spamming Divine AS on other party members, who are in need of a heal, Divine AS ads Hit points on top of HoT. Combined with bastion of Health, or Healing Word ( which im still getting used to properly using) and Astral Seal- all in all works like a charm, at some point it just become over heal, im afraid. On down side Sun burst is officially scraped in PvE. The default knock back is Just too much of a bother. Divine Glow How ever lives on my bar now. The skill is just too handy, if only i did not forget to spam it like i should. If anything - healing now is actually easier, i found my self "gasp" having fun with my DC, which i did not in the longest while. I will have to try Castle Never with some pugs-maybe it just the overall GS of players now, which makes it easy.
Slot AS/BOH/DG if you are having problem healing and spam your divine powers it's that simple.
IMO I choose Virtuous for the HOT capabilities it offers. I like a healing DC, the DPS tree is nice if you want to go that way. The other path Righteous is only heal, no HOT/Regen not really so good. AS & FF was Regen/HOT base. Now you can use BOH and DG for the same effect, and boost your HOT capabilities if you choose virtuous.
So basically you got 3 Regen/HOT spells, plus can spam healing and temp hit points in divine mode.
On a side note I have to agree, sunburst has really fallen far from what is was, and just does not have a place on the bar anymore.
I love my DC b4 this Mod 5 & new Paragon feats ..... I like to help people but now I feel I am not a healer so sad when I cant able to heal with Astral shield
Join Now! - Infernal Paragons , The Infernal Alliance
I'm healing much better then I was before and got no problems at all-and I'm righteous buffing/debuffing AC(DO healer before).
DC heals incomparably better, but if you won't adapt to changes and change your encounters, you're deemed to fail.
Evolve or die out.
I haven't seen any comments about HG. Being unable to gain AP while HG is active bites if you ask me.
It would be helpful if you list the encounters you use in dungeons, and how you use them: e.g., nAS/dDG/dBoH/dBoH/eDG -- or whatever. I know it's situational, but I'm sure I'm not the only one still kind of confused about how/when to use normal vs. divine vs. empowered.
I have two end-game Clerics, one was a Faithful Healer who already used BoH and the other was an AC Debuff. Using the exact same encounter rotations, the heal is less and more awkward.
If you feat to heal more as a Faithful, you can produce stronger BoH and stronger HW... but the instances when you need to heal someone back from death (making that good) are few in a T2. What really made BoH so great to use (Linked Spirit- I could hand people 2-3000 more in power on average) is gone. So I can heal a little more, but the run on my Faithful spec is now a little longer. And my HW that had 3,000 more in power behind it was stronger than the new HW- so... the heal IS less.
So it's perfectly legitimate to not like the overall package of these changes (only the Sith deal in absolutes remember).
As for rotations, I haven't actually taken Sunburst off. It's a bit of retraining to learn to cast it only in Divine, but it's currently my favorite way to get up to Empowered.
The other thing I would mention is that if you want to run Daunting Light, the damage from a Divine version is garbage. I have gotten Empowered versions to routinely crit about 50,000.
Dungeon Clearing as Healer: Sunburst-BOH-Astral Shield (Guardian of Faith-Hallowed Ground) * you can switch to Healing Word from either Sunburst or BOH on boss fights as you prefer. I usually drop BOH for HW.
** One thing that is exceedingly annoying about Hallowed Ground is that you can't generate AP while it remains in effect. So your uptime on it has been dropped. BoH will help you get back to HG quite a bit, but if you find yourself casting HG and having the team move on after 5 seconds, and you won't have it again... you can see how it's value can drop. I suspect you will see this Daily less and less. You do gain AP while AA is in effect though, but not for Divine Armor. **
Dungeon Clearing as Debuff: Sunburst- Divine Glow- Daunting Light (Guardian of Faith- Flame Strike) * I then switch Daunting Light to either HW or Astral Sheild or Forgemasters depending on how the team's been doing, and then Flame Strike for AA).
One thing I would point out that if your are using High Prophet gear, you must do damage to apply the gear set's bonus to each mob. So that's something to think about when considering rotations. And you have to hit 3 times each to get the full debuff, otherwise you are wearing really bad T1 gear. And that's a large part of why my Righteous Debuff Cleric still uses Sunburst, and also that it apples a DoT (see farther down the feat tree). The DoT does not add additional stacks of the HP gear debuff.
For PvP, my rotations are basically the same: Sunburst, HW, Astral Sheild (Guardian of Faith- AA or Hallowed Ground). I PvP'd for about 4 hours last night and meet many Clerics trying to kill people with Daunting Light etc. 100% avoidable if you don't listen to music because you can hear it a full second before it goes off. Only TRs killed me all night. Which is a switch from GWFs I suppose. Interestingly, about 5-10% of my kills were to Sunburst, and the bleed does not seem to fall off after death.
Some casual testing in IWD yesterday has completely disenchanted me from Gift of Faith. I don't consider it currently worth the gimp to HW. I have currently respected my Faithful without the capstone to see how I like it.
YEAH! Let's start pissing whole team off with pushing adds away. GREAT IDEA!
I could get mad but I've decided to just have a good laugh.
If you had read my post you'd have gotten to the part where I talk about using Sunburst to get to Empowered, and casting Sunburst only in Divine to do that. So you don't knockback the vast majority of the time.
True it takes a bit of retraining to remember to use Sunburst in the opposite now, only on Divine instead of in normal mode, but you pick it up after a while. Practicing on your Dailies can help to change your habits.
In dungeons I usually do it all at once (3 Divine Sunbursts) and then an Empowered version of one of the other Encounters. And since Divine Sunburst has no CD, it's pretty handy.