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question about plaguefire enchant

zshikarazshikara Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 796 Arc User
edited July 2014 in PvE Discussion
So, plaguefire enchant reads as follows:

"+X% Fire damage. Burn for X% damage per second for 3s and reduce def by X%, can be stacked 3 times. "

My question is: does the reduced defense also stack 3 times? or is it just the dot that stacks 3 times? The wording makes me think the defense reduction also stacks 3 times. Also, does it stack with other people using the same enchant?

Thanks.
Post edited by zshikara on
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Comments

  • ambisinisterrambisinisterr Member, Neverwinter Moderator Posts: 10,462 Community Moderator
    edited July 2014
    As far as I am aware nobody has done the testing on that. At least I have only heard speculation within the guild and forums for a year now...

    The wording definitely makes it sound like defense reduction does stack but 45% defense reduction is...a lot. Wording wise it should but the back of my head is tingling thinking 45% defense reduction is a bit too good to be true.
  • therosadairtherosadair Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I'm pretty sure that it does, and i seem to recall a dev commenting that 45% defense reduction isn't nearly as good as it seems, i think it is something like a 9% reduction compared against the targets total damage mitigation.
  • frishterfrishter Member Posts: 3,522 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    No it doesn't stack with itself but it stacks with terror. If the defence didn't stack 3 times then people would have been wrong to get plaguefire over terror (which people see as being rubbish so should be buffed).
  • zshikarazshikara Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 796 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    Yeah, I went with plague fire over terror. Seemed the better option and I like the dot anyway since I'm a DC.
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  • rlrobrrlrobr Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    zshikara wrote: »
    So, plaguefire enchant reads as follows:

    "+X% Fire damage. Burn for X% damage per second for 3s and reduce def by X%, can be stacked 3 times. "

    My question is: does the reduced defense also stack 3 times? or is it just the dot that stacks 3 times? The wording makes me think the defense reduction also stacks 3 times. Also, does it stack with other people using the same enchant?

    Thanks.

    The debuff stacks 3 times, but it has to be refreshed periodically since each stack lasts for only 3s. Just pay attention that 45% defense reduction (3 stacks of GPF) in PvE means 9% of increased DPS (for the whole party, btw).

    It stacks with any other debuff (Terror, High Prophet, High Vizier, etc), but if there are two or more players using a Plague Fire, the maximum number of stacks is 3 (although they can be refreshed by either players). If the enhancements are of a different level, e.g. normal and greater, only the greater is applied.
  • adamy2004adamy2004 Member Posts: 226 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    rlrobr wrote: »
    The debuff stacks 3 times, but it has to be refreshed periodically since each stack lasts for only 3s. Just pay attention that 45% defense reduction (3 stacks of GPF) in PvE means 9% of increased DPS (for the whole party, btw).

    It stacks with any other debuff (Terror, High Prophet, High Vizier, etc), but if there are two or more players using a Plague Fire, the maximum number of stacks is 3 (although they can be refreshed by either players). If the enhancements are of a different level, e.g. normal and greater, only the greater is applied.

    you are actually wrong on the max stacks, its been bugged since release so it can overstack with encounters similar to old high viziers, also lesser and normal plaguefires stack with the greater.
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  • mconosrepmconosrep Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    adamy2004 wrote: »
    you are actually wrong on the max stacks, its been bugged since release so it can overstack with encounters similar to old high viziers, also lesser and normal plaguefires stack with the greater.

    What do you mean by overstack?

    I didn't realise different levels stack also but it is nice for newer players who can still contribute just by getting a lesser plague-fire.
  • ayrouxayroux Member Posts: 4,271 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    As far as I am aware nobody has done the testing on that. At least I have only heard speculation within the guild and forums for a year now...

    The wording definitely makes it sound like defense reduction does stack but 45% defense reduction is...a lot. Wording wise it should but the back of my head is tingling thinking 45% defense reduction is a bit too good to be true.

    It IS defense reduction and TBH its not too good to be true since new stacks do not refresh old ones. For most situations, you end up with about 2 stacks on with is 30%.

    Note: its NOT 30% -DR but defense, which is a scaling stat. In PVE it works as a 3% per stack debuff. So 9% total debuff.

    For PVP its actual defense, but with diminishing returns, it actually works out to be in the range (MAX) of between 5-9% debuff.

    Biggest drawback to GPF is that stacks dont refresh themselves so to even get max stacks, you have to continually be attacking. For comparison purposes I generally estimate 2 stacks of GPF + weapon damage for my calculations - since thats the majority of attacks - in PVP.
  • ambisinisterrambisinisterr Member, Neverwinter Moderator Posts: 10,462 Community Moderator
    edited July 2014
    frishter wrote: »
    No it doesn't stack with itself but it stacks with terror.

    You are answering the wrong question. One plaguefire effect stacks up to three times as the tooltip says.
    You are referring to multiple plaguefire enchantments stacking with each other in which case they do not.

    A LPF, NPF and GPF can all be applied to one target but a single target can not be effected by multiple GPF.
    Same concept applies for terror enchantments.
    magenubbie wrote: »
    How the hell is a 9% dmg buff the same as 45% def reduction?

    Actually it makes perfect sense. Defense applies and increase to your DR. It is not your DR.

    45% defense reduction does not equate to a 45% DR reduction. It does EXACTLY what it says in the tooltip. Plain as day.

    My only concern was 45% defense reduction sounds too good to be true despite the wording implying it is happens, but if it does it does...and the wording is exactly that.
  • gabrieldourdengabrieldourden Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,212 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    I did some tests parsing Rapid Shot on dummies with and without GPF on my bow (1 minute continuous fire runs). Rapid shot should be able to keep 3 stacks all the time due to the high fire rate.
    Base damage increase was around 10.3% (excluding GPF dots who are extra stuff) so I guess the 9% stated by devs matches reality. The fact that my average was slightly higher is probably within statistical deviation.
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  • tang56tang56 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited July 2014
    My only concern was 45% defense reduction sounds too good to be true despite the wording implying it is happens, but if it does it does...and the wording is exactly that.

    GPF is easily tested. Grab a friend, note their defense stat, then hammer at them with a GPF and monitor the defense stat while doing so. You'll see it works as advertised in PvP. It is however, a damage buff in PvE.
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