Why do they keep changing classes so much ?

green9206 · February 2014

Being a new mmorpg player before i started playing this game i looked around a bit to see which class is the best for a beginner to start with.After reading a few threads saying GF class is the best i rolled a GF class.Turns out the threads i was getting that info from were from august-september 2013 or around that time.I didn't realize that in the later updates according to players the GF class was completely ruined and made useless and now that GWF class was the best one.But in the older threads it said that GWF was the worst class !!So now it seems i am stuck with a class everyone hates and no one wants or cares about.
So back to my question why do they keep changing the classes so much that in one update a particular class is the best and in the next update that class becomes the worst ?Referring to guides is aslo useless since most of them are outdated and do not reflect the current state of the game.So now my option is to either roll a new class which is the best for now which might as well become the worst again in the next update or keep playing with my GF.Am lvl 26 currently and i have no idea what am doing with my char so i may hit a brick wall later on.Here is my charcter stats please provide any help what can i do to improve my current char ?

kallethen · February 2014

Why does the "preferred" class change like the flavor of the month at Baskin Robbins? Because we have constant adjustments for balance reasons. And your min/max power-gamer players like to go with the most powerful so they'll shift their preferences accordingly.

My suggestion: Try out each of the classes, at least through level 10 or so when you get the "Tab" power so you can get a feel for how each class is like. Then pick the class you had the most fun with. Then find a good guild that doesn't focus on gear score or the perfect team for dungeons.

imsmithy · February 2014

This happens when the classes are not equally balanced to start with and as patches are applied overpowered classes get nerfed (made weaker) and the weaker less desirable classes get buffed ( made stronger ) from my experience almost every MMO suffers from this problem , as for rolling a new class , that's entirely up to you , you are only level 26 on your GF so retiring him isn't exactly a big deal but keep in mind that if you roll say a GWF and start to level that there is every chance that class could be severely nerfed at some point in the near future too and the GF buffed then you will be right back where you started , hope that helps xD

pitshade · February 2014

There are two issues here. One is why the Devs keep making changes and the second is whether any class is useless. As to the first, in a system as complex as this, with the split between PVE and PVP, unintended synergy between feats, boons, gear etc..., balance is going to be very hard to achieve. So they keep working at it and working at it.

However, attempting to balance the classes isn't a zero sum game. Buffing the GWF didn't make the GF useless, neither did giving the Iron Vanguard powers as an option for GWF. The GF isn't useless, but due to the dungeon design, they aren't required either. The problem is that a large number of players want to beat the content as fast as they can and to do that, they want massive AOE damage, which only two classes can provide - CW and GWF. Before Module 2 went live and the GWF got buffed, they weren't included in that at all. These min-max parties consisted of as many CWs as they thought they needed, plus a DC and maybe a slot given to another class, as charity.

The thing is, with good players working together you can beat pretty much anything in the game. TRs are another class said to be 'dead' in PVE but I've been in successful parties in Karru with two of them. Even did the first two bosses in CN with my CW and 2 TR, 1 HR, 1 DC. Three manned DK with a GF and a GWF. Beat MC running with a GF. The key? Find good people to run with who aren't going to be elitist and have everyone learn their role and carry it out.

Just because a bunch of very vocal people want to dictate what classes can go to dungeons doesn't mean you have to listen to them.

dr132 · February 2014

^good post. there are multiple builds of every class that are viable and able to assist a group in clearing any content in the game. just play the class you want and play it well and you will find people who appreciate what you do.

mconosrep · February 2014

kallethen wrote: »

Why does the "preferred" class change like the flavor of the month at Baskin Robbins? Because we have constant adjustments for balance reasons. And your min/max power-gamer players like to go with the most powerful so they'll shift their preferences accordingly.

My suggestion: Try out each of the classes, at least through level 10 or so when you get the "Tab" power so you can get a feel for how each class is like. Then pick the class you had the most fun with. Then find a good guild that doesn't focus on gear score or the perfect team for dungeons.

In most MMOs this would be good advice, but at least for Neverwinter if a new player is interested in PvE primarily then Control Wizards is definitely the bst choice as there has never been a time when CWs were not the most in demand class for PvE. So for the OP - if you are interested in PvE definitely go for a CW.

If PvP then its more tricky as the most useful class has changed several times, so really pot luck.

If you are interested in both PvP and PvE, I'd suggest a CW or DC as these are the most nerf -proof classes in PvE and work well in organized PvP teams.

yyrkoonstyphoon · February 2014

mconosrep wrote: »

In most MMOs this would be good advice, but at least for Neverwinter if a new player is interested in PvE primarily then Control Wizards is definitely the bst choice as there has never been a time when CWs were not the most in demand class for PvE. So for the OP - if you are interested in PvE definitely go for a CW.

If PvP then its more tricky as the most useful class has changed several times, so really pot luck.

If you are interested in both PvP and PvE, I'd suggest a CW or DC as these are the most nerf -proof classes in PvE and work well in organized PvP teams.

While everyone loves a cw, it is a very hard space for a new player to work into. I am working on my HV gear on my CW and in greed all dungeons, the flavor you will likely run into when playing with good players, I have never had anyone complain about needing on the t2 piece my DC needs, but i get the 'Hey, that's worth 500K ad' when i ask to need on my CW gear..

So i would say if you want to be a class anyone will take, a DC is the best bet, especially as a newer player because most folks insist on a DC... assuming you are grouping because i think a dc is harder to solo than most the other classes. My GF is still fun and easy to play. I ran 3 dungeons this weekend where we had a rainbow - DC, CW,TR, GF,GWF - was a blast - also did TOS legit as a TR, CW, and a GWF without a DC... which i am seeing more and more - the no DC party.

MMOs will always change. You cannot predict the winds of change and you have to go with the flow. Best advice is to stick with a class till you know how you feel about it. A GF is still fine, and I believe there is a priority given to them when queing... unless they removed that.

schweifer1982 · February 2014

green9206 wrote: »

Being a new mmorpg player before i started playing this game i looked around a bit to see which class is the best for a beginner to start with.After reading a few threads saying GF class is the best i rolled a GF class.Turns out the threads i was getting that info from were from august-september 2013 or around that time.I didn't realize that in the later updates according to players the GF class was completely ruined and made useless and now that GWF class was the best one.But in the older threads it said that GWF was the worst class !!So now it seems i am stuck with a class everyone hates and no one wants or cares about.
So back to my question why do they keep changing the classes so much that in one update a particular class is the best and in the next update that class becomes the worst ?Referring to guides is aslo useless since most of them are outdated and do not reflect the current state of the game.So now my option is to either roll a new class which is the best for now which might as well become the worst again in the next update or keep playing with my GF.Am lvl 26 currently and i have no idea what am doing with my char so i may hit a brick wall later on.Here is my charcter stats please provide any help what can i do to improve my current char ?

Dear Mr.Green if y want to play never changing class the best class is for y DC alway worst class from beta until today .

reiwulf · February 2014

I think people have given very fair advice, play what you have fun playing, not the top class of the moment.
I tried playing CW but it's not my thing, no matter how good or useful they are.
It'll be probably harder to get into high end content dungeons with some classes, but if you have a guild and/or friends that won't be a problem.

mego9500 · February 2014

Play whatever you want to play.

I played GWF back when he was considered garbage and used to get kicked from dungeons all the time. Don't let anything deter you if you enjoy what you're doing.

ckotoc666 · February 2014

schweifer how is it possible a healing class to be the worst class?

drag0nshard · February 2014

From my experience GWF is still the dominant class in PVP, no other class can charge 8-10 other players and stay alive for 20-30 seconds. My GWF almost never dies in PVP and all I do is button mash (no skillz needed!)

If your planning on playing PVE then CW, Its easy to work out what you need to do and the dmg is insane.

mechcount · February 2014

Anyone who thinks TRs are bad PvE needs to stop judging based on GS and pay attention to spec and skill.

Oh, and people need to stop being selfish D-bags. Don't whine about TR damage if you insist they tank, use smoke and dazing strike, keep Wicked up, and use ITC to stay alive because the DC's keeping circles on the CWs.

kolatmaster · February 2014

mego9500 wrote: »

Play whatever you want to play... Don't let anything deter you if you enjoy what you're doing.

Best advice there is.

zebular · February 2014

. . . I play what I enjoy, not what someone else perceives to be some hypothetical "best" class.

chemboy613 · February 2014

Play what you love, point is to have fun.

Gf is not most efficient, but they are useful. Try to find a good gf with gear and skill, and it will be difficult, however if you find one you will appreciate them

jdmills · February 2014

green9206 wrote: »

Being a new mmorpg player before i started playing this game i looked around a bit to see which class is the best for a beginner to start with.After reading a few threads saying GF class is the best i rolled a GF class.Turns out the threads i was getting that info from were from august-september 2013 or around that time.I didn't realize that in the later updates according to players the GF class was completely ruined and made useless and now that GWF class was the best one.But in the older threads it said that GWF was the worst class !!So now it seems i am stuck with a class everyone hates and no one wants or cares about.
So back to my question why do they keep changing the classes so much that in one update a particular class is the best and in the next update that class becomes the worst ?Referring to guides is aslo useless since most of them are outdated and do not reflect the current state of the game.So now my option is to either roll a new class which is the best for now which might as well become the worst again in the next update or keep playing with my GF.Am lvl 26 currently and i have no idea what am doing with my char so i may hit a brick wall later on.Here is my charcter stats please provide any help what can i do to improve my current char ?

I feel the need to point out that you've sunk all of your feat points into all 3 paths. You're going to find a problem when you hit level 30; the paragon paths will be open, but you will not have levelled the lower level feats to the point of being able to put points into them. I would strongly suggest respecing when you get to level 30, and choose the lower level feats carefully; you don't need all of them, but you do need to spread the points around until all 4 levels are used, then the paragon feats will be available to you.

tornnomar · February 2014

The best class is the one you like to play. If you enjoy the GF, keep playing it. True players will appreciate any player that plays any class well.

thesensai · February 2014

Or play one of each. All you need to do, is choose your first class, and play em, lvl up leadership. use the AD to buy zen, use the zen to add additional character slots. New characters need to be lvled to 12ish so they can pray and craft. they can lvl to 60 via prayer, and will themselves become leadership crafters making you even more zen. I waited till character slots were on sale, and got about 17. you can really rack up ad this way. Good luck!

hefisdo · February 2014

There is only 1 thing I don't understand about class balance...

They make 391031 changes, but CW is still OP on PvE and GWF is still OP on PvP.

FYI I'm a CW. It kinda sucks to see 4 CW 1 DC in a PvE group, GWFs outplaying you every single time on PvP and TRs literally in eternal stealth (a.k.a. invencibility).

morsitans · February 2014

jdmills wrote: »

I feel the need to point out that you've sunk all of your feat points into all 3 paths. You're going to find a problem when you hit level 30; the paragon paths will be open, but you will not have levelled the lower level feats to the point of being able to put points into them. I would strongly suggest respecing when you get to level 30, and choose the lower level feats carefully; you don't need all of them, but you do need to spread the points around until all 4 levels are used, then the paragon feats will be available to you.

Not actually true: advancing any heroic feats pushes the bar forward, you don't have to pick X from the first column, Y from the next, if you think the tier 2 feats are trash, you can push past them by just investing in tier 1 feats until tier 3 unlocks, and so on. Once you've picked your max number of heroics, in whichever feats, you open the paragon trees. And you can do the same for paragon feats: taking 10 tier 1 paragon feats allows you to bypass tier 2 feats and jump straight to t3.

It's just that usually the top-tier heroics are the best, so it's worth picking them.

EDIT: Also, OP, level 26 is really not that high. You can get to level 26 in an afternoon if you work at it, and inside a week at the most if you're a casual player. You should have another free char slot, so by all means make another char you like the look of, or stick with the GF if you like the way it plays.

thestaggy · February 2014

Honestly, you've wasted too many feat points early on which will hurt you down the line, so I see two options;

1 - Spend money and buy a respec token.
2 - Delete it and start afresh, spending no money.

I'd go for option 2 for two reasons; 1) You chose Half-Elf, a class not particularly suited to being a tank/melee type and 2) Your level is still low enough so you won't have wasted so much time and you'd save real world money or in-game AD by not having to purchase a respec.

I'd also build a DPS-hybrid tank. It will make your leveling progress much easier and make you more appealing in dungeons.

If you want to use a Half-Elf again, I'd do the following;

Abilities -
Base roll: 18 Constitution, 13 Strength, 13 Dexterity, 10 Intelligence, 10 Wisdom, 8 Charisma.
Half-Elf racial ability bonuses: +2 into Constitution (predefined), +2 into Wisdom (optional)
At level 10: +1 point into Strength and Dexterity
At level 20: +1 point into Strength and Dexterity
At level 40: +1 point into Strength and Dexterity
At level 50: +1 point into Strength and Constitution
Final ability score: 23 Constitution, 19 Strength, 18 Dexterity, the others don't really matter.

Powers and feats, I'd do this;

http://nwcalc.com/gf?b=p9b:27rhe4:1zwtds,13k356i:1pu551:150000:1u0000&h=0&p=ivn

If you don't want to completely re-boot your character, then just purchase a full respec, get your ability scores as close to a Strength/Con balance as possible (don't sacrifice too much CON though, you should stay above 22/23) and just rework your feats and powers.

vortix44 · February 2014

green9206 wrote: »

why do they keep changing the classes so much that in one update a particular class is the best and in the next update that class becomes the worst ?

One theory is, they follow a "try and error" path.
Another theory is, the devs know perfectly the pros and cons of each classes and could balance them all, but by making people abandon their current, suddenly nerfed char to create a new one in another, suddenly improved, class it generates more income for Cryptic.

For your GF, many people in the forum consider that the next balance tweak will make it OP. So, you might as well keep him, raise him in levels and equip him while the GF gear is still way cheaper than other classes' gear

pitshade · February 2014

I wouldn't recommend buying a respec token at such a low level. Frankly, I'd wouldn't respec until you get to level 60 when you have every option available and with some work can earn enough AD to buy the zen in game. Also, unless you aspire to being an expert PVP'r, min maxing your race isn't all that important.

slushpsycho · February 2014

Players who are unexp or causal will always be troubled by matter like this

True gamers just go roll a different toon, or they perfect what they have to make things work, if it doesn't work well go roll another toon.

If you wanna enjoy the game, why care all the changes? If you wanna be something, why are u not even 60?

Why do they keep changing classes so much ?

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