PvP, currently, is a Rock/Paper/Scissors situation (with more variants of course), and people need to realize that you need to use strategy to defeat their opponents. Sentinel GWFs can be defeated/neutralized, how has been explained ad nauseam in the past few weeks...
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Well, I ran into a pre-made with 4 sentinels and 1 DC. Tell me, how are you supposed to neutralize them?
Well, I ran into a pre-made with 4 sentinels and 1 DC. Tell me, how are you supposed to neutralize them?
Were you also a premade? If not, and if you just PvP for the Daily, you could be in a bit of trouble. However...
The advice for how to deal with Sentinel GWFs has been expounded upon many times over the forums during the past few weeks. I am sure you are capable of doing your do diligence and researching it. :cool:
Marks by themselves increase damage by 8%. Powerful Challenge replaces this 8% with 15%. IBS "Kill" mark is broken and even with Powerful Challenge feated, still only receives 8% dmg buff instead of 15%.
Just for the record.
Last time I actually tested it, powerful challenge increased mark damage boost from 8 to 23%. So unless something changed, it is a direct 15% increase.
Mindflayer - Exodus
Daria - Dwarf Sentinel GWF (mistaken for Halfling a lot)
Karia (aka "The Pug") - Human Combat HR
Kayd - Human Conqueror GF - Retired
3. Deep Gash damage is immense now, especially if you invest a little in power (not a lot, just a little). After testing on the preveiw server with a perfect vorpal and 3K power, a 15K IBS adds almost 8-9K damage. Even on live with a greater vorpal and 2600 power, I see a 15K IBS adds about 6000 damage. On preveiw, I could get near 20K IBS with the stars aligning and deep gash ticks for around 2100-2200.
The first tick is immediate, so it adds almost 10%+ damage to the base attack. If my opponent gets away, he can expect to eat another 5K damage or more.
Not denying it's broken. However, seeing as CWs are -still- able to outdps GWFs in PvE (even if only by a little bit), I propose it's better to move Deep Gash farther into the GWF Destroyer tree and leave it as it is. This leaves GWFs in their competitive position in PvE at its current state, but removes the extra damage from sentinels.
Not denying it's broken. However, seeing as CWs are -still- able to outdps GWFs in PvE (even if only by a little bit), I propose it's better to move Deep Gash farther into the GWF Destroyer tree and leave it as it is. This leaves GWFs in their competitive position in PvE at its current state, but removes the extra damage from sentinels.
best suggestion so far, make Deep Gash only exclusive to destroyers, cause nerfing deep gash will also affect PVE players
Not denying it's broken. However, seeing as CWs are -still- able to outdps GWFs in PvE (even if only by a little bit)
Why is every GWF obsessed with being the highest dps class? Is having the most mobility, arguably the most survivability and some of the best abilities in the game not enough? They might as well just make it so GWFs take no damage and oneshot everything they attack since apparently that's what the people who play them think they should be like.
Why is every GWF obsessed with being the highest dps class? Is having the most mobility, arguably the most survivability and some of the best abilities in the game not enough? They might as well just make it so GWFs take no damage and oneshot everything they attack since apparently that's what the people who play them think they should be like.
Your suggestion is based on solid arguments as usal Trapublican, your trolling just dont end does it...
How about for once just once write some suggestion about how to amend the, according to you, imbalance in pvp with some argument based on what to do instead of just writing absolutly nothing of value to anything.
There will always be some class that attracts the whiners becouse of some advantage they dont want/like. Some of them come up with suggestions based on data collected or arguments based on game mechanics etc etc and some just whine adding nothing to adress the changes they want(guess which of them you are).
As I play pvp matches about every day a week i can tell you there is no class that is less represented in teams then dc and gwfs.
Very often in games there is 2-3 cws, hrs or trs in a team making it 4-8 of them in every match.
Lets for the argument agree that gwfs are so almighty as you say and a change would make tr dominate like they once did. Having 4 tr in each match that totally devastated all others would that make you happy?
As long as you dont come up with suggestion but just keep trolling nobody is going to listen to you any way.
As usual you didn't address a single point I made, in fact you completely missed the point of my post since all you do is post drivel full of classless ad hominems.
They might as well just make it so GWFs take no damage and oneshot everything they attack since apparently that's what the people who play them think they should be like.
Yea your point is very well worth adressing well thought out and well argued as usal. Not once not with a single sentence have you suggested what change you want how to fix the so called imbalance in pvp in such a way that it dont kill the class in pve....
Every single post you make is just whining and nothing but whining.
That gwf almost became extinct after last nerf and was the least wanted class in pve for month is left out ofc.
Now lets look at the class distribution in NW gwf is maby 10 % of the total population of that the majority is destroyer leaving less then 4% of the total population sent build gwfs. Of those 4 % left how many do you think is build for pvp with pvp set up that more or less makes them unwanted for pve. Do you even pvp on a regular basis do you even look at how many gws there are in matches compared to other classes? Do you notice that out of 10 gwfs there are 1 that are really good with top gear?
As long as you dont do a reality check and start adding something of value you will be nothing more then the troll you already are...
Why is every GWF obsessed with being the highest dps class? Is having the most mobility, arguably the most survivability and some of the best abilities in the game not enough? They might as well just make it so GWFs take no damage and oneshot everything they attack since apparently that's what the people who play them think they should be like.
I don't see any issue with GWFs being able to compete for DPS. A GWF that does build strictly for PvE DPS is very squishy and is a non factor in pvp because of that. They die before they can really apply that DPS. That is generally how it should be for any class that goes glass cannon.
The issue is that the 3 largest DPS adding feats are easily available to Sentinels. Even Instigators and Destroyers cannot get all 3. They may still eek out Sentinels for DPS if a Sentinel geared himself for strictly DPS, but sentinels gain a lot more survivability then Instigators and Destroyers gain damage over them. This also has the side effect that with the proper build, a Sentinel can still be very survivable and put out some crazy burst damage at the same time.
There are built in rock/paper/scissors counters to GWFs in pvp, so simply stacking them is not generally advisable in a good premade, though 2 GWFs is not uncommon. However, the damage they can put out really upsets the meta because now PvP Sentinels are both tanks and damage beasts. GWFs needed a damage boost in PvP, but it has gone a little too far the other way. I detailed my reasons. Even with the nerfs I suggested, Sentinels would still put out a lot more damage then they did in module 1.
Mindflayer - Exodus
Daria - Dwarf Sentinel GWF (mistaken for Halfling a lot)
Karia (aka "The Pug") - Human Combat HR
Kayd - Human Conqueror GF - Retired
And that is exactly the point I've been making kaylos (the class has no real negative point and excels in too many areas which is why it is unbalanced), I'm glad another sensible person has joined the discussion. So far you've been the only GWF player I've seen who will admit the class needs to be toned down and can manage to grasp the difference between people asking for a class to be balanced instead of asking for a nerf. Some of these other posters could learn a lot from you.
And that is exactly the point I've been making kaylos (the class has no real negative point and excels in too many areas which is why it is unbalanced), I'm glad another sensible person has joined the discussion. So far you've been the only GWF player I've seen who will admit the class needs to be toned down and can manage to grasp the difference between people asking for a class to be balanced instead of asking for a nerf. Some of these other posters could learn a lot from you.
You never made a point you only whined with no argument what so ever. If you bothered to read what other post instead of whining all the time you would have seen that there is alot of suggestion about gwfs from gwfs to balance them in pvp without making them useless in pvp.
I myself have written that among other things threatening rush is making gwfs to mobile in pvp and should not have been implemented to the gwf class.
There are several threads of how to change the unstoppable so it actually depends on hp lost not taken, there are suggestion about how to move some feats so sent cant stack dam the way they do now(and most if not all gwfs agree that destroyers should be given a bit of a the power sent has right now at the cost of sent that is).
But you dont adress things and suggest wheather the are good or bad or come up with own suggestion you just whine in and almost endless flow of whining.
Now that said I will monitor my pvp matches the comming days i will take notes of how many classes there is in each game and how many kills/death each class gets in each match. I will do this in at least 50 matches and further more i will stop as soon as a team has a leaver unless its my team and its an even match.
Let us see whish class is most plenty and whish class dominates the matches for real ......
Easy solution for me:
Switch Deep Gash with Executioner's Style or Disciple of War. Both are minor damage bases for Destroyer, so a switch to feat tier 1 wouldn't break any balance.
Funny how the three main points you suggested for balancing GWFs in yet another awful post of yours are points I've made multiple times. If you actually read and comprehended my posts instead of feeling the need to be a keyboard commando you'd have noticed that already.
Funny how the three main points you suggested for balancing GWFs in yet another awful post of yours are points I've made multiple times. If you actually read and comprehended my posts instead of feeling the need to be a keyboard commando you'd have noticed that already.
I have come up with suggestions as have serval others, you never have and prolly never will.
Every comment on your posts are the same that you are a troll without any vailid points what so ever. If it wasent so sad to see your pathetic whining it would be funny. All you do is whine about gwf whine about others suggestions but fails to post anything even remotly constructive to do something about what you dont like.
Tell me what changes do you want to do to the gwf class, show your intence knowlege about the gwf class and what can be done to balance it in pvp/pve. I and several others cant wait to see your brillant solutions..
Why is every GWF obsessed with being the highest dps class? Is having the most mobility, arguably the most survivability and some of the best abilities in the game not enough? They might as well just make it so GWFs take no damage and oneshot everything they attack since apparently that's what the people who play them think they should be like.
mobility and tankiness doesnt kill stuff, damage does
moving gash deeper into destroyer would ruin instigator
i wouldnt mind them removing or nerfing gash to hell if they balanced with more dmg on wicked/sure strike and gave sure strike back the cone damage(i think it did dmg in cone back in alpha)
mobility and tankiness doesnt kill stuff, damage does
moving gash deeper into destroyer would ruin instigator
i wouldnt mind them removing or nerfing gash to hell if they balanced with more dmg on wicked/sure strike and gave sure strike back the cone damage(i think it did dmg in cone back in alpha)
You also do 0 damage when you're dead so that mobility and tanking ability is needed if you plan on being able to output damage consistently. As it is now you have the best of both worlds and that's not how it should be, the ratio is not properly balanced.
I have come up with suggestions as have serval others, you never have and prolly never will.
Every comment on your posts are the same that you are a troll without any vailid points what so ever. If it wasent so sad to see your pathetic whining it would be funny. All you do is whine about gwf whine about others suggestions but fails to post anything even remotly constructive to do something about what you dont like.
Tell me what changes do you want to do to the gwf class, show your intence knowlege about the gwf class and what can be done to balance it in pvp/pve. I and several others cant wait to see your brillant solutions..
Apparently it's too difficult of a task for you to go through someone's post history and instead you'd rather continue with the ad hominem attacks. This will be the last time I ever bother to reply to yous ince it's glaringly obvious who the troll is.
Apparently it's too difficult of a task for you to go through someone's post history and instead you'd rather continue with the ad hominem attacks. This will be the last time I ever bother to reply to yous ince it's glaringly obvious who the troll is.
Ofc it be the last time as i asked you to actually come with with something beside whining and as you clearly are all about whining and are clueless to figure out any solution there is absolutly nothing you can add - as expected.
Troll is a troll is a troll now go back try to figure out why you are (obviously) having such trubble ingame and try to improve and learn mkay ....
There appears to be far too much posturing and provocation in this thread, so for now, I'm going to close it down. Please guys, try to be nice to each other.
Comments
and sentinel wins critical chance with sure strike (fourth bleed ibs), ie, the dynamics of the sentinel prevents this is a problem in pvp.
Well, I ran into a pre-made with 4 sentinels and 1 DC. Tell me, how are you supposed to neutralize them?
By finding another pvp match, leave them siting there by themselves.
The advice for how to deal with Sentinel GWFs has been expounded upon many times over the forums during the past few weeks. I am sure you are capable of doing your do diligence and researching it. :cool:
Last time I actually tested it, powerful challenge increased mark damage boost from 8 to 23%. So unless something changed, it is a direct 15% increase.
Daria - Dwarf Sentinel GWF (mistaken for Halfling a lot)
Karia (aka "The Pug") - Human Combat HR
Kayd - Human Conqueror GF - Retired
Not denying it's broken. However, seeing as CWs are -still- able to outdps GWFs in PvE (even if only by a little bit), I propose it's better to move Deep Gash farther into the GWF Destroyer tree and leave it as it is. This leaves GWFs in their competitive position in PvE at its current state, but removes the extra damage from sentinels.
best suggestion so far, make Deep Gash only exclusive to destroyers, cause nerfing deep gash will also affect PVE players
Why is every GWF obsessed with being the highest dps class? Is having the most mobility, arguably the most survivability and some of the best abilities in the game not enough? They might as well just make it so GWFs take no damage and oneshot everything they attack since apparently that's what the people who play them think they should be like.
Your suggestion is based on solid arguments as usal Trapublican, your trolling just dont end does it...
How about for once just once write some suggestion about how to amend the, according to you, imbalance in pvp with some argument based on what to do instead of just writing absolutly nothing of value to anything.
There will always be some class that attracts the whiners becouse of some advantage they dont want/like. Some of them come up with suggestions based on data collected or arguments based on game mechanics etc etc and some just whine adding nothing to adress the changes they want(guess which of them you are).
As I play pvp matches about every day a week i can tell you there is no class that is less represented in teams then dc and gwfs.
Very often in games there is 2-3 cws, hrs or trs in a team making it 4-8 of them in every match.
Lets for the argument agree that gwfs are so almighty as you say and a change would make tr dominate like they once did. Having 4 tr in each match that totally devastated all others would that make you happy?
As long as you dont come up with suggestion but just keep trolling nobody is going to listen to you any way.
Yea your point is very well worth adressing well thought out and well argued as usal. Not once not with a single sentence have you suggested what change you want how to fix the so called imbalance in pvp in such a way that it dont kill the class in pve....
Every single post you make is just whining and nothing but whining.
That gwf almost became extinct after last nerf and was the least wanted class in pve for month is left out ofc.
Now lets look at the class distribution in NW gwf is maby 10 % of the total population of that the majority is destroyer leaving less then 4% of the total population sent build gwfs. Of those 4 % left how many do you think is build for pvp with pvp set up that more or less makes them unwanted for pve. Do you even pvp on a regular basis do you even look at how many gws there are in matches compared to other classes? Do you notice that out of 10 gwfs there are 1 that are really good with top gear?
As long as you dont do a reality check and start adding something of value you will be nothing more then the troll you already are...
I don't see any issue with GWFs being able to compete for DPS. A GWF that does build strictly for PvE DPS is very squishy and is a non factor in pvp because of that. They die before they can really apply that DPS. That is generally how it should be for any class that goes glass cannon.
The issue is that the 3 largest DPS adding feats are easily available to Sentinels. Even Instigators and Destroyers cannot get all 3. They may still eek out Sentinels for DPS if a Sentinel geared himself for strictly DPS, but sentinels gain a lot more survivability then Instigators and Destroyers gain damage over them. This also has the side effect that with the proper build, a Sentinel can still be very survivable and put out some crazy burst damage at the same time.
There are built in rock/paper/scissors counters to GWFs in pvp, so simply stacking them is not generally advisable in a good premade, though 2 GWFs is not uncommon. However, the damage they can put out really upsets the meta because now PvP Sentinels are both tanks and damage beasts. GWFs needed a damage boost in PvP, but it has gone a little too far the other way. I detailed my reasons. Even with the nerfs I suggested, Sentinels would still put out a lot more damage then they did in module 1.
Daria - Dwarf Sentinel GWF (mistaken for Halfling a lot)
Karia (aka "The Pug") - Human Combat HR
Kayd - Human Conqueror GF - Retired
You never made a point you only whined with no argument what so ever. If you bothered to read what other post instead of whining all the time you would have seen that there is alot of suggestion about gwfs from gwfs to balance them in pvp without making them useless in pvp.
I myself have written that among other things threatening rush is making gwfs to mobile in pvp and should not have been implemented to the gwf class.
There are several threads of how to change the unstoppable so it actually depends on hp lost not taken, there are suggestion about how to move some feats so sent cant stack dam the way they do now(and most if not all gwfs agree that destroyers should be given a bit of a the power sent has right now at the cost of sent that is).
But you dont adress things and suggest wheather the are good or bad or come up with own suggestion you just whine in and almost endless flow of whining.
Now that said I will monitor my pvp matches the comming days i will take notes of how many classes there is in each game and how many kills/death each class gets in each match. I will do this in at least 50 matches and further more i will stop as soon as a team has a leaver unless its my team and its an even match.
Let us see whish class is most plenty and whish class dominates the matches for real ......
Switch Deep Gash with Executioner's Style or Disciple of War. Both are minor damage bases for Destroyer, so a switch to feat tier 1 wouldn't break any balance.
Funny how the three main points you suggested for balancing GWFs in yet another awful post of yours are points I've made multiple times. If you actually read and comprehended my posts instead of feeling the need to be a keyboard commando you'd have noticed that already.
I have come up with suggestions as have serval others, you never have and prolly never will.
Every comment on your posts are the same that you are a troll without any vailid points what so ever. If it wasent so sad to see your pathetic whining it would be funny. All you do is whine about gwf whine about others suggestions but fails to post anything even remotly constructive to do something about what you dont like.
Tell me what changes do you want to do to the gwf class, show your intence knowlege about the gwf class and what can be done to balance it in pvp/pve. I and several others cant wait to see your brillant solutions..
mobility and tankiness doesnt kill stuff, damage does
moving gash deeper into destroyer would ruin instigator
i wouldnt mind them removing or nerfing gash to hell if they balanced with more dmg on wicked/sure strike and gave sure strike back the cone damage(i think it did dmg in cone back in alpha)
You also do 0 damage when you're dead so that mobility and tanking ability is needed if you plan on being able to output damage consistently. As it is now you have the best of both worlds and that's not how it should be, the ratio is not properly balanced.
Apparently it's too difficult of a task for you to go through someone's post history and instead you'd rather continue with the ad hominem attacks. This will be the last time I ever bother to reply to yous ince it's glaringly obvious who the troll is.
Ofc it be the last time as i asked you to actually come with with something beside whining and as you clearly are all about whining and are clueless to figure out any solution there is absolutly nothing you can add - as expected.
Troll is a troll is a troll now go back try to figure out why you are (obviously) having such trubble ingame and try to improve and learn mkay ....
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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