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Why we need -50% Experience instead of
nurmood
Member Posts: 342 Arc User
double XP?
Im not event - bashing just want to take the event as a kickoff for a topic that has been running through my mind lately.
I know there has been talks about in the Double XP thread
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?532821-Double-XP/page7
but i think one should take the time to think about the xp system out of the context of double xp events.
Opinions from this topic were:
donarrios
pitshade
but there are other opinions too:
evilgenius180
terhikki
Own Opinion
My first impression levelling a DC from level 1 was: "Its soooo easy and very fast". I couldnt trust my eyes how insanely high the quest xp bonus is. I actually stopped to level to do dungeons or skirmishes (old problem). I expected to level up less frequently as i progressed in the level scale as it is in most of the games - i didnt really feel any substantial difference.
As a result i didnt spend time on enchants and equipment because i thought - i will switch armor in 1 or 2 hours again anyways. Farming for blue stuff seemed pointless because you level up and get better greens at the regular vendor or from the massive amount of drops.
The first time i thought that the game is actually challenging and made me think about equipment choices was the grey wulf den. But i got out of the level range while actually doing the dungeon (3 tries on the last boss before everybody left).
I started asking myself why is there an XP Event for Foundries? Thats not motivating me to do it! Or: "Hey lets invoke after login" - LVL UP - dang lvl range for dungeon breached.
In the end i had a lot of fun. Nice sidestories and good quests - you can develop your character in a mulitple ways - enjoyed it a lot. Progress itself is allways nice - it may have to do with the games i played before but in my view its way to fast in this game (so much potential
)
Why an XP (even more than 50% is not unreasoable) reduction makes sence
- People will appreciate equipment and enchantment choices at lower levels
- Why is it that players <50 are not in guilds? Thats a shame!
- People will use dungeons more frequently
- People will play this game longer
- In other games people group up for for example 20% extra XP. I dont even know and never needed to what the real advantages of teaming up are except in dungeons (from a rational standpoint)
- Low level players shouldnt be afraid of doing PVP without accidently leveling out of some lvl caps
- People leveled from 1-60 within a weekend or less - why did Cryptic even create all those nice maps with nice quests when they enable you to rush through all of them in such short period?
Thanky for reading
PS:
As a hint for Cryptic - i didnt even think about buying Zen till i hit lvl 60 because there was simply no need to simplify anything.
Im not event - bashing just want to take the event as a kickoff for a topic that has been running through my mind lately.
I know there has been talks about in the Double XP thread
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?532821-Double-XP/page7
but i think one should take the time to think about the xp system out of the context of double xp events.
Opinions from this topic were:
donarrios
If anything I would hope for a half xp weekend. I hardly see any dungeons as it is because I always level too fast.
Screw endgame, it's the road towards it that counts. Endgame is always boring, in every MMO I played.
So reaching that usually means going elsewhere for me. And I'm sure many others feel the same way.
pitshade
I agree that the leveling is more fun than the endgame.
but there are other opinions too:
evilgenius180
I'm new to the game and I like the current pace of leveling.
terhikki
It's not that I wouldn't like "slower" levelling in this game, it would be appreciated. But when all content is pretty much
same to all characters/classes etc. it's just aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamazingly boring after 1-2 characters.
Own Opinion
My first impression levelling a DC from level 1 was: "Its soooo easy and very fast". I couldnt trust my eyes how insanely high the quest xp bonus is. I actually stopped to level to do dungeons or skirmishes (old problem). I expected to level up less frequently as i progressed in the level scale as it is in most of the games - i didnt really feel any substantial difference.
As a result i didnt spend time on enchants and equipment because i thought - i will switch armor in 1 or 2 hours again anyways. Farming for blue stuff seemed pointless because you level up and get better greens at the regular vendor or from the massive amount of drops.
The first time i thought that the game is actually challenging and made me think about equipment choices was the grey wulf den. But i got out of the level range while actually doing the dungeon (3 tries on the last boss before everybody left).
I started asking myself why is there an XP Event for Foundries? Thats not motivating me to do it! Or: "Hey lets invoke after login" - LVL UP - dang lvl range for dungeon breached.
In the end i had a lot of fun. Nice sidestories and good quests - you can develop your character in a mulitple ways - enjoyed it a lot. Progress itself is allways nice - it may have to do with the games i played before but in my view its way to fast in this game (so much potential
)Why an XP (even more than 50% is not unreasoable) reduction makes sence
- People will appreciate equipment and enchantment choices at lower levels
- Why is it that players <50 are not in guilds? Thats a shame!
- People will use dungeons more frequently
- People will play this game longer
- In other games people group up for for example 20% extra XP. I dont even know and never needed to what the real advantages of teaming up are except in dungeons (from a rational standpoint)
- Low level players shouldnt be afraid of doing PVP without accidently leveling out of some lvl caps
- People leveled from 1-60 within a weekend or less - why did Cryptic even create all those nice maps with nice quests when they enable you to rush through all of them in such short period?
Thanky for reading
PS:
As a hint for Cryptic - i didnt even think about buying Zen till i hit lvl 60 because there was simply no need to simplify anything.
Post edited by nurmood on
0
Comments
If someone finds the leveling experience fun (more than once), then create lots of toons and level them.
Iyon the Dark
The only real concern might be a rash of mid level twinks trying to dominate their level of PVP. But I expect, even that, might balance out in time.
Cutting all xp from quests/mobs by about 25%. Then for that last half a lvl-a full level of each zone before quests can even be accepted for the next zone, you could either mob grind (at lower xp) or run a dungeon.
Each low lvl dungeon should be 100% dungeon delve AND the quest should give something like 2-3x the xp of normal quests that level. Mobs in dungeons should also not hurt you for shared xp but just give everyone xp as if they killed it solo.
Make dungeons the main "level-er" rather than just quest farming...
This would give people BIG reasons to run dungeons (even speed lvlers) and give people who want to enjoy content alot of fun and people to run with.
It wouldnt do much to change the time it takes to level, just give a nice change of pace and actualyl do the content rather than just blitz to 60.
Overall its SUPEr easy to level and double xp weekend should just be like a +25% xp weekend. A DC friend hit 60 in 12 hours with double xp... said it was stupid easy to do...
Not a chance. Dungeons should be something fun to do, but never mandatory or tied to level progression. The moment you bind someones ability to level and progress, to 4 other potential sources of frustration. Is the moment you have killed any desire to level.
as for double xp, this is mainly for people that like to blow through content and for people at level 60 with companions to level up. if you don't want to participate, then run skirmishes or dungeons on double xp weekends.
a lot of the fun begins at level 60. that would include the sharandar area as well as the upcoming dread ring area... so it makes sense that they would plan to have a double xp weekend right before the new module drop.
i think the xp rate is just fine as it is. obviously double xp weekends aren't frequent. forcing a slower xp rate doesn't really make any sense to me.
What I've suggested in the past, unlikely as we are to see it, would be to have four times the number of maps with an option to cut XP by 4, by 2 or leave it alone. A player could change that setting as they please, and run the content at the current rate or slow down as they see fit. It won't happen of course. Cryptic doesn't have the personnel to do it and probably lacks the drive as we who would prefer slower leveling are probably a small minority.
Pretty much sums it up.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
Concerning PVP: 1-59 is where skill matters and where you can have fun, 60 is where only gear, enchants and class matters and where all the fun is gone.
Levelling indeed in this game is a joke. It is so fast, you don't even have to look at the items that drop. Just equip whatever appropriate level gear drops. No matter the stats. You don't have to buy anything with seals or anything off the AH in that level range, all just wasted. No need to apply enchants on your items, too. Just do quests. It is easy. And you also can skip a lot because you level maps out faster anyway. If you don't pay attention you outlevel skirmishes and dungeons so fast that you can't do them in normal versions again. On top of that the questline only gives you 2 items that are really needed in the game, which are the two bags. There is also a profession pack in on quest (which most of the time gives HAMSTER like Eldritch Crystals, so you can forget that, too) and a cloak which makes you invisible but in the end you can kill mobs anyway easily, so no need to sneak invisible past mobs anyway. To sum it up: There is also no reason to do the questline for the items but the bags. Just do them for XP to level.
You could also just roll a lvl 60 char and start with it and forget all the lowlevel experience.
Let me explain, For all others mmos on world, you can only lv up by becoming an old talking woman wich all it does is talking(infinite quest lines and side quest, reallllllyyyyyyyyyyyyy boring), on neverwinter it's a choice, u can be the old talking lady or u can lv up having fun, by killing monster all over the place, or if like some challenge using pvp to lv( i did it), so u can have the lving as u want, I have questing, for me it could be banned forever on any mmo and i realy love lving on neverwinter cause i can just ignore all the quests and just fight my way to the top
Onninho 60 cw xD Stopped playing cause internet and now back, even with CW nevered realy loved it before but it's still fun on dungeons just pvp lost the fun
Ahhh and sorry for bad english BR here...
But still enough at that point to go through the story without being low-leveld at some point...
I just started a GWF (again) to try and get a feel for the play style (again), but when Ranger goes live in a couple of days the GWF is going to take a back seat.
I hate that daily invocations for however many days might take the character out of the level range of the next zone that they are supposed to go to.
Outlevelling skirmishes has been partially resolved by the Call to Arms mini-events, though I would like to see all skirmishes available for everyone all the time.
Just level-adjust everyone like they do for the Call to Arms stuff, only without any special rewards.
They could still have the daily skirmish awards available for whatever skirmish is 'level appropriate', but you would be able to run any skirmish that you chose to, otherwise.
All dungeons are available at endgame, right? I am not in a guild and haven't done any endgame stuff like that, but all of them are available, I think.
In any case, though, you can always just go in and run the regular dungeons to get lore and see what they are like. Even if you are a level 60 soloing the Cloak Tower.
As far as the double XP weekends go, I am sure that some people love them, but I would like to be able to turn the double XP off.
Not saying that we should be able to turn off XP gain as a matter of course, just that when they have double XP weekend I would like to be able to progress normally.
thanks for the explanation - be the old talking lady? What do you mean by that? That women tend to communicate more while playing instead of hardcore levelling? That you will be an old lady in most MMO's before you hit the level cap?
When you can reach lvl 60 in 24 hours without a double xp event nobody is getting old about this for sure... (which is appreciated by a lot of people)
- People will appreciate equipment and enchantment choices at lower levels
- Why is it that players <50 are not in guilds? Thats a shame!
- People will use dungeons more frequently
- People will play this game longer
- In other games people group up for for example 20% extra XP. I dont even know and never needed to what the real advantages of teaming up are except in dungeons (from a rational standpoint)
- Low level players shouldnt be afraid of doing PVP without accidently leveling out of some lvl caps
- People leveled from 1-60 within a weekend or less - why did Cryptic even create all those nice maps with nice quests when they enable you to rush through all of them in such short period?
-Whats the point to enchant and care for your equipment on lower lvls unless you like pvp(twinks anyone?)
-Because they dont ask for one?
-What for?since you can do it in epic mode when you get 60lvl
-Ppl will get bored to kill mobs all the time and run from one map to another for too long
-Games that give bonus exp for team up usually thelvl cap is too high or they have group quests
-The only lower lvls that care for not lvl up in pvp are again twinks
-If you want to see the maps after you did the quest you can still visit them or lvl up more chars.
Also there are players who like to have a lot of alts.Atm i have 5 toons 60lvl and you know why?Because the lvl up in this game never gets boring.
FaceRoller- regen recovery TR (put on the shelf for now) 14k GS
Supreme CHAOS - IV GF (put on the shelf for now) 16k GS
White Khalifa- tene/hp/regen CW (retired) 11k GS (tene)
Death From Above- TANK ranger 16kGS
(all halfling everything)
Proud rank 6 of: <Enemy Team>
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Gear does not equal skill. It amplifies it. Gear and no skill loses to medium gear and a lot of skill. A lot of skill+max gear is unstoppable, which is ideal. Because if you can be unbeatable why not.
FaceRoller- regen recovery TR (put on the shelf for now) 14k GS
Supreme CHAOS - IV GF (put on the shelf for now) 16k GS
White Khalifa- tene/hp/regen CW (retired) 11k GS (tene)
Death From Above- TANK ranger 16kGS
(all halfling everything)
Proud rank 6 of: <Enemy Team>
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
For me, the fun comes in experiencing the dungeons at lvl 60, where I have alot of skills and items to tinker with, and alot of different skills to apply. I played very few dungeons on Spelly leveling. But I played every single one until I knew all the pace-exploits, and had all the gear (much store-bought because I got sick of seeing the same dungeon waiting for the abysmal drop).
Leveling and the repetition of dungeons is what made me a once-in-a-blue-moon forum-gobbler instead of a player. Not the reverse. I have done all those maps, read all that dialogue once. Going back adds nothing.
just my opinion though
mind you, I feel that way sometimes when im grinding sharandar for rank 4 enchantments...
Here are a lot of reasons you are wrong:
1. I like the DND idea that 10 quests = 1 level
2. I like the idea that it takes 1000 xp to reach level 2 ( and levels go up from there)
3. Once you reached NAME level (8 for Clerics, 9 for fighters & Rogues & 10 for Wizards) then you went up by 100,000 xp/level (120,000 for Clerics)
4. Now The level average is over 15,000/level, but this does not take into consideration that each quest goes up per level faster than you can complete the New areas.
5. I now suggest keeping the quest and level and other xp rewards the same, but expanding the level 60 to not a paltry 910,000+ xp, but something A LOT closer to 5,000,000 xp.
6. On Double xp I went from level 1-25 in about 5 hours (and never got past Blackdagger).
7. Slower level advancement would encourage more exploration and give time to do skirmishes, Pvp and several runs on the final Dungeon which I've needed.
You mean I'm wrong for wanting to play the game to test end-game builds?
I'm not sure I understand how these changes would enrich anyone's play experience in NW.
My view on pen-and-paper D&D is that the fun is supposed to be in the creative and social aspects much more so than in any goal of achieving X level. However, in a video game like this, level benchmarks are very important goals. It's not like Cryptic can assign each player a personal DM to engage him or her with customized story-focused encounters and appropriate challenges. Even the Foundry can't really do due to limitations inherent in the technology.
If you want to stop and smell the roses more often as you level, there's nothing stopping you from not accepting or completing quests while you climb hills to take screenshots of sunsets or run around Whispering Caverns to check out the architecture. However, there is no way they can reasonably slow the leveling process without completely overhauling the zone quests. Besides, exactly how many Symbols of Lolth can you loot before you decide you're over it and ready to do epic dungeons and campaigns, at least?
EDIT: Outleveling skirmishes is currently a valid point, but CTA helps cover the gap for title-seekers who missed out the first time. Dungeons are irrelevant. If you want to experience the normal version of a dungeon or just cross it off your list, you can go back at 60 and solo it. Alternatively, plan on running it with an alt (or just stop XPing for a short time) if you must experience it at the intended level.
Contagion - Cleric
Testament - Wizard
Pestilence - Ranger
Dominion - Paladin
NIGHTSWATCH
My point is: I was able to bypass uneeded areas, or bosses/quests who's drops are not worth the effort.
Only one point in my new TR that made me a little upset was in Pirates Skyhold. I wasn't very far from over leveling beyond the Pirate Kings dungeon. So I was at the fire waiting the 2 minutes or so for the DD event to start, then I was going to join the queue and have a cup of coffee while waiting for a group. I was excited, because I never ran Pirate King before. On my first TR, I over-leveled and I didn't want to make that mistake again. I was really close to the cap too, a couple hundred or so. And of course here comes this toon dragging half the map with her making a beeline for the fire and potential help with her Lizard problem. So as I'm a sucker for a damsel in distress ( she was an Orc and I'm not sure if that qualifies as a damsel) too her aid I went. So two things. Chivalry is not dead and I still haven't done Pirate King.
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