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I had a terrible time in Gauntlgrym today.
grubbyhands
Member Posts: 190 Arc User
Did Gauntlgrym with my DC today. Found a Dwarf King(T2) Greed doing group willing to take my 11.4K DC (bless them by the way). Proceeded to contribute to the PvE as much as possible which could had been better if Cryptic implemented a minimum 200 point earned in PvE to qualify for PvP to deter afk-ers. We Delzouns lost the damage buff from PvE by the way. Went into Gauntlgrym PVP had a great time there despite we are on the losing end again. Game client crashed 5 minutes before PvP ends and upon an successful attempt to login again to continue the PvP. I get a message that I had been removed from the map and got booted back to Gauntlgrym Ruins (that did not count for the GG PvP daily which Rhix gives) at about 4 minutes prior to ending the second phase and unsure how to get points to get the Armories of Moradin share which would allow me to enter the Dwarf King Crypt dungeon. I had to settle for doing Fardelver's Crypt. Got into a party that would or could not respond to any party chat which proceeded to aggro every add they can find in T1 (again more time wasted), killed the boss, rolled on the epic T1 loot, lost the roll and immediately came here to get this post in which you are reading right now which I would thank you for the time given to read it. Feeling all bummed out so I had to get this of my chest.
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When I tried approaching the leadership about it they said it was a greed run but I never saw anything about a greed run. I tried to work out some kind of compromise but at the end of they day they wont hand over my chest piece and intend to sell it to buy enchanted keys. So all I can do is put in a ticket and let Cryptic/PWE deal with it. The ticket is pending
To avoid this kind of thing Cryptic needs to disable kicks during a roll for loot and simultaneously enable a greed run setting where everyones need rolls are disabled on everything (however this should require the consent of all group members). This would prevent guilds stealing from non-guild members while simultaneously stopping people from ninjaing in greed runs
if you haven't had a chance to look over the shadowmantle patch notes in the preview shard forums, kicking will require a vote in dungeons in module 2. and i would bet that reports of guild members kicking non-guild members from boss loot rolls is going to be pretty bad for guilds and the participating members. especially repeat offenders.
How would that change anything? They don't care about guild reputation, always they find player or 2 to join up and kick after last boss. Voting would go always 4-1 or sometimes 3-2 and it's a kick, nothing changes. They should atleast add that
1. Greed only could be forced by leader
2. If you are kicked (or vote kicked) atleast you would have time to pick up last loot and if kicked, you would be on roll anyways.
Now I just have my on .txt file where I've put up players & guilds that does things like that. Developers don't care that much of it tbh.
you can make all the assumptions you want. these are the rules we have to go by. i have to trust that when i make a report, that it's going to be assessed and a decision is going to be made. and actionable or not, by playing the game and agreeing to the terms of service, i have agreed to accept their decisions. yeah, bad situations suck. i get that. but if i spend all my time focused on that, then i'd just sit around being angry all the time. that's not the way that i choose to function. so i have to trust in the system in place. i have to play by the rules or i'm just as bad as the people i'm reporting.
Just because someone complains about something doesn’t mean they are angry all the time. There is nothing wrong with someone complaining. Listening to what they have to say may bring about new ways of doing things. A better life for all. Telling people to just shut up and go along with the old outdated rules that make living harsher is no way to go about it. That leads to people not saying anything and going with whatever authority figures tell them, leading to such things like the holocaust and other such travesties.
Was going with that for sig, but changed my mind. Or did I?
While Im happy that the problem of guilds kicking non-guild members will become more easily recognized I still feel theres more that can be done to counteract this behavoir. At the very least month long temporary bans need to go out for the criminals that steal from others in the game. Repeat offenders need to have their accounts banned permanently. Guilds that have wide spread kicking habits need to be disbanded. Only severe penalties will stop this kind of behavoir because greed just overtakes a lot of people.
For what its worth Im happy these systems will be going in place but at the same time I feel it doesnt go far enough to punish thieves. As far as "going along with the system" well yes we did all agree to the TOS and follow the rules. However that doesnt mean we shouldnt discuss the shortcomings of those systems and how to improve them
The best thing I can think of for these systems is 1. Prevent any kind of kicking while loot is being rolled on. 2. Enable a greed setting in the group settings interface where all players must consent before it converts to greed. However I am open to hearing other suggestions
Someone took you to T2 and you smashed it three time
Your claim of ignorance that the run was a greed run crumples under the weight of the information you have provided.
This was the third run you were doing. There were apparently zero need rolls on the two preceding runs. Your claim that you were unaware that this third run was not the same as its predecessors is difficult to accept.
You rolled need on a greed run. You tried to steal from the group. You got what you deserved.
They did not steal from you. They prevented you from stealing from them. The good guys won.
I have the proof that they kicked me from the run after I rolled need on an item (proof that I can not post on the forum due to the naming and shaming policy) that was for my class and that was an upgrade for me. That is in every way a legitimate need roll. They claimed after the fact but never provided any evidence that it was a greed run. You dont get to say after the fact that it was a greed run that has to be said and agreed upon by all 5 members of the group before hand. To be fair I am not omnipotent, I am human so Im willing to admit there may be a possibility, however slim, that I could have missed the "hey this is a greed run" text in party chat (if it was in tells I would have heard the tone that plays to draw my attention to it and I didnt hear that tone at anytime during any phase of GG).
Even IF they did make their intentions clear they NEVER got my consent to a greed run. How could they when I didnt know about it (once again assuming they even said it which I doubt)? Yet they still took me in there, knowing I spoke english and knowing that I wasnt afk. They made no attempt to contact me directly and get my consent for this suppossed greed run. At the end of the day that guild stole from ME, not the other way around and the evidence of that incident supports me
That said, the fixes Ive proposed to this system help in both instances. Instances where people want to do greed runs (and must be agreed upon by all 5 party members) and instances where nothing is said but the guild boots you at the end.
It's sad but most of the playerbase care more about getting more AD then helping peeps "gear up". With that said, it's kind of expected that they'll kick you if you 'need' the loot cuz it's kinda unfair to the party.
Anyway, try not to do GG T2 with peeps from the same random guild cuz chances are they'll kick you even if it's 'greed' runs. (with exception of a few guilds)
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?533641-Some-kicking-issues-that-I-believe-Cryptic-should-and-can-prevent-in-code
I believe there should be an option to set a rule of *automatic* need on shards and greed on epics.
This rule must be accepted at the beginning of the dungeon and after a short prompt explaining what it means.
This way you get one less reason for people to kick in the end of the dungeon.
I also believe kicking should be available only by the consent of the entire party (=4 members) and only until the last camp fire.
If someone was good enough for first 2-3 bosses, there is no right to kick him now (especially with an automatic loot rule).
- Running around in PVE part, collecting boulders and getting killed by Duergars. Keeps me busy but no reward really.
- Waiting for the system to queue me into PvP. Sometimes 5 min before the end, sometimes less than one min before the end.
- Dongeon part, getting the message "The Delzoun won but you did not take part enough, so you are not granted the access to DK"
Waiting 25 min at campfire to get possibly included into a Fardelwer PUG. Nothing to do, nothing to farm, not possible to go AFK, just staring at the screen waiting for a possible PUG po-pup
- Ending up a whole GG PVE-PVP-Crypt session, 3-11 GG coins richer.
I only do GG for the weekly LordNeverEmber bonus.
I believe i heard my guildees raging about such a run. That they were running a greed run T2 GG and some dc rolled need on MH set and they managed to kick him/her before the roll ended. Given the circumstances u had it coming - nobody else needed during all those runs but you (which made you a ninja looter). For what i heard the winner of the roll just split the ad earned with the rest of the party.
The moral here is - nobody needs (even on enchants)... u do not need either or you will get a kick for stealing, simple enough. Why would other people in the party roll greed on their class gear?! Greed is fair for everybody and afaik they were really angry about what u did in the end of the runs.
(I was not there, but i heard enough.)
foundry Call of the Blood - NW-DTAK6CXZ2
campaign Heart of Nature - NWS-DUKNH9PPZ
If its the same run then you only got part of the story. For the record, I go into every run with the assumption that it is a normal run. In a normal run if someone doesnt roll need on a piece of gear it means its not an upgrade for them. Its how we do guild runs, its how I do normal runs, and its how I expect others to operate unless they make other rules known before the run begins. The group I was with did not make this supposed greed run known till after it was over and they never asked me if it was alright with me. They never even made the attempt to contact me via a tell or voice chat
Im afraid I have to wholeheartedly disagree with you though. Need before greed is the best way. It ensures that players who will actually equip and use dropped items continue to grow stronger, providing the community with greater numbers of characters able to handle harder content. Imagine wanting to do the Module 2 dungeon but only a handful of GF's have the gear to handle it due to the greed you say is so much better, it'll be a nightmare. I understand wanting to make money in the game but putting your own monetary gains above the betterment of other players you play with is going to hurt you in the long run.
Oh and just to put the nail in the coffin, kicking someone from a group during a roll is a violation of the terms of service we all agreed to when we joined the game. Eventually thats going to catch up to the people who stole from me because I did report them and I provided every bit of information/screenshots I have. If your guild continues to do these kicks then it will catch up to your guild too
If you already had MH chest or whatever the item was. Does it grey out the "need" option? Nope no it doesnt.
The reason why there is demand in these type of runs for "greed only" is because unfortunate specimens think the "need" option is their preferential greed button.
I'm sorry man, but you're in the wrong here. If you do "need if upgrade" runs within your guild, that's fine. But if you run with other people and it's a greed run, you have to abide by the rules (greed epics). If you didn't, and needed an epic, upgrade or not, your kicking was entirely legit and I would have done the same.
You gotta understand that it is not only you that needs upgrades in this game. We all do. And best way in this game is to get upgrades by greed runs, selling on the AH for AD and buying what you need later on.
So each player has to be careful about their "betterment".
Example: I had to do CN greed runs while I still have GG CW orb/SW offhand equipped. The Ancient orb/offhand dropped from Draco quite a few times, and they were obvious upgrades, but I had to hit greed and sure enough, I lost the rolls. But in the end, I bought my ancients with the AD from other greed rolls I've won. This is how things work in Neverwinter.
You're always free though to make Need groups, people will come with you. Just don't expect geared players to come, they only need AD...
Another advice from me is that if you need for example a T2 piece from somewhere (if you need it to equip it I mean...), when entering a group ask them if they are OK if you need that certain piece if it drops. But you have to make sure you ask from the start. It is how I did my T2 runs before getting my set, and most people understood and still took me with them. But I politely asked from the start, because I respected their need to make AD, which was just as important as my own need to get a T2 piece.
Fox Stevenson - Sandblast
Oh Wonder - Without You
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
- Dylan Thomas
i hope your doulzoun :P
hard to feel sorry for ya when u win 99% of GGs...
If you ever team up with anyone from Tyrs Paladium know that you will not get kicked from a group unless you cause drama or if do something against the whole group that is frowned upon, otherwise we are all there to have fun.