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Should REGEN stat be Reworked?
ayroux
Member Posts: 4,271 Arc User
It seems that with some reflection the Regen Stat is one of the strongest stats for more characters in PVP.
You are seeing Sent GWF builds with 1200-1400 regen getting HP ticks of 1600-2k every 3 seconds.
TR builds stacking regen getting nice ticks while being able to stealth.
CW stacking regen.
Why are all these classes stacking regen? Because its a very strong stat that can make some classes VERY hard to kill.
It is ALSO making the DC class a LITTLE weaker by comparison because players have this "self heal" which can keep them alive in ALOT of situations.
It is a nice stat to have while leveling, and its nice to have in PVE as well as it removes the need of potions some. However in PVP you are having classes running around with BLUE lvl 45 regen rings, you are having players stacking BLUE regen gear at the cost of epic gear. Just because the power of the stat and the effectiveness of it.
One of the reasons I didnt even get the new "T3" Weapon on my GWF was because it had no regen or defensive stats... Because Regen is king.
TRs using the broken +400+ regen rings (seal of the executioner)
I have not played many games where it had a mechanic like Regen where any player could essentially heal themselves even during combat!
2 Options I see:
1) Reduce the effectiveness of the stat (maybe upp the dim returns more severely to prevent stacking)
2) Make it so Regen only applies OUT OF COMBAT. This one, you may want to INCREASE the effectiveness of the stat by some (I like this idea alot!)
Either way it seems a more balance for the game. especially in PVP.
You are seeing Sent GWF builds with 1200-1400 regen getting HP ticks of 1600-2k every 3 seconds.
TR builds stacking regen getting nice ticks while being able to stealth.
CW stacking regen.
Why are all these classes stacking regen? Because its a very strong stat that can make some classes VERY hard to kill.
It is ALSO making the DC class a LITTLE weaker by comparison because players have this "self heal" which can keep them alive in ALOT of situations.
It is a nice stat to have while leveling, and its nice to have in PVE as well as it removes the need of potions some. However in PVP you are having classes running around with BLUE lvl 45 regen rings, you are having players stacking BLUE regen gear at the cost of epic gear. Just because the power of the stat and the effectiveness of it.
One of the reasons I didnt even get the new "T3" Weapon on my GWF was because it had no regen or defensive stats... Because Regen is king.
TRs using the broken +400+ regen rings (seal of the executioner)
I have not played many games where it had a mechanic like Regen where any player could essentially heal themselves even during combat!
2 Options I see:
1) Reduce the effectiveness of the stat (maybe upp the dim returns more severely to prevent stacking)
2) Make it so Regen only applies OUT OF COMBAT. This one, you may want to INCREASE the effectiveness of the stat by some (I like this idea alot!)
Either way it seems a more balance for the game. especially in PVP.
Post edited by Unknown User on
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It's not a case that PvP now is, i would say, restricted to tank builds. Any high level PvPer runs a tank build.
I saw a LS GWF, BOXA, with 33k HP and 1,8k regeneration. And 3.6k defense. And obviously stacked tenes sisnce his base damage was laughable.
Now, as i said in the other thread: i don't see the problem in the ability of GWFs to go unstoppable after eating damage. I see the problem in a build that, on top of going unstoppable, can regenerate health at a rate of 2k every 3 seconds, may be coupled with a good armor enchant, PvP potions and high HP.
I can see how a player facing such opponent, that seems to eat damage barely losing health, to go unstoppable and recover, ask for a nerf.
But asking to nerf Unstoppable for the Whole class is not the way. Nerf the build. In few words, put a limit to regeneration power.
2k per tick on top of high HP is too much. I voted for "Only allow regen to work out of combat.".
Seems a good choice to me.
Reworking the tenebrous enchantment would be a start since regen is important to surviving against players who may use tenebrous. Keep in mind that a player sacrifices stuff like power/critical/recovery and armor penetration to stack regen. Regen is also a part of gear and not found in an enchantment so it can not be stacked easily. Regen also does not work that fast and enough damage can easily be done to make regen useless. I personally do not use regen in my PVP setup because I stack power/critical/armor penetration to kill most targets before regen even is needed. I also carry a supply of PVP health potions if I need to heal quickly.
Here is some info since the OP mentioned the old Seal of Executioner +478 Regen rings. Players of different class can use these rings on augment companions for PVE.:
There are currently four versions of the Seal of Executioner on the Dragon Shard. (Maybe more than four versions.) One does +384 Regen, one does +478 Regen, one does +478 Critical Strike, and the last one does +238 Critical Strike with +72 Recovery.
The +384 Regen version for level 47 can be bought from the "Astral Diamond" Jewelry trader. (For TRs will have to go to the "All Items" menu if you are not a TR.)
The +478 Regen version for level 55 was originally purchasable from the Pegasus Seal Trader. (Can still be found in the AH for 1M AD to 7M AD. )
The +478 Critical Strike version for level 55 replaced the +478 Regen one in the Pegasus Seal Trader. (Basically nerfed it like Stalwart.)
The +238 Critical Strike with +72 Recovery version for level 58 can be located in the AH. (Probably a drop.)
NOTE: The Ring of Preservation purchasable for 7 Pegasus Seals from the Pegasus Seal Trader does +407 Regen and it is for level 49+. On closer inspection it is TR only and bound on pickup. <-Found this out when looking into the regen rings and hopefully this helps.
NOTE: I agree to nerfing a build of a specific class if it is a serious problem, only time I would agree to a nerf, instead of the whole class but nerfing regen will hurt every class that has gear with regen in it.
There is no point to whine for nerfs because you win some and loose some. Crying just makes a player look like a crier and no one, especially the devs, should take them seriously. Have a nice day!:)
Farmville is recruiting. No waiting necessary.
And you must be 1 of the guys abusing of the regen -.- the pvp have a lot of prob. you wont a fair pvp ? do like the other game. When you enter in the pvp zone you will get a armor set for pvp whit no stone or ench. So no more people stack reg, def or power or using uber ench ^^ whit this, you can see what player know how to play proper the class ^^
Nope. Sorry. I play a mage. I have absolutely no issue with any class stacking regen, or deflect, or defense, or tenes, or rank 10's or whatever they wish to stack and play with. Stack all the crit, armor pen, recovery, power, whatever. Simple truth, I can adjust as can anyone else if any particular build causes me a problem.
I shred GWF's defense so my team mates and I can take them down in short time. Notice I said Team mates. yes 5 v 5 is a TEAM effort. When we do internal 5 v 5 matches within just our guild, you learn very quickly who has to die first, what each class is capable of, and strategies needed to be successful. If something isn't working, we shuffle people around until we get the matchups that favor us. Pug groups rarely ever learn this. They have no strategy, or clue how to win together. I call out everyone I debuff, so my team knows who is ripe for the pickens.
Any well balanced, well played group can over come any build out there. What people are complaining about is well geared, well played groups roll stomping low geared pugs, or rookie guild groups. If your premade is getting stomped, change the complement of people. 5 rogues do not guarantee a win. Best groups have a nice mix of classes so u can cater to each strength in dealing with the opposing groups weakness.
Most guild groups we face, leave when they see us. Those how stay, have over the past few months, improved greatly. They continue to stay as that is the best way to learn. u don't learn from roll stomping. u learn from fighting an equal or better group. That we have a ton of experience in.
Only people who have no clue how to play, use strategies, or can develop strategies and adjust on the fly cry they want completely equal pvp. Take the same two classes, equally geared, and the true pvper will win time and time again.
It's just easier to cry nerf to make you feel better about losing. Can't be the other person is simply better, oh no, they need nerfing, or they are hacking, or exploiting, ect ect.
This QQ'ing gets old.
These people asking for nerfs usually don't know how big the impact is on the PvE side. Since cryptic have the PvP and PvE with same code, every time they fix something on PvP it would affect the PvE dramatically. So yes, nerf the regeneration please, make my cleric even weaker in PvE believe it or not, but regeneration is one of the main things that keeps me alive in dungeons on the cleric. But the OP never rolled a cleric, so it is ok for him.
That's really entertaining ^^.
How the heck are you able to assume that just because other character's builds are helping them heal themselves, that DC's are weak?
That's like saying "Since GWF's have high DPS.. TR's are a LITTLE weaker"
Besides... asking to nerf ANYTHING .. man.. what were you... dropped on your head as a baby?? O.o?!!
I don't PvP much (hardly at all really). But if you start calling for them to nerf stats for PvP.. It'll more then likely be carried over to PvE as well and I don't like the idea of them HAMSTER around (yet again) with stat changes. I've just had to recover from the GF's Stalwart Bulwark armor set nerf and that cost me a HAMSTER load of AD to fix.
If you don't like pvp.. don't play it. If you don't like the game.. go play something else. Stop trying to F* it up for the rest of us please.
People that stack Regen/Def/Tenebrous play a specific build. There are counters for this so there is no reason to nerf anything.
Tenebrous IS NOT going to be nerfed. It's a really bad move, nerfing an enchant that makes up for a good part of the money people have been giving to the game.
The game is not "guild based". You have the option to get into a guild. That's why there are options to form random teams for both PvP and PvE.
It's the duty of the game to make these mechanics work to have a balanced experience. And the solution is not "go out there and get yourself a good Group to PvP/ PvE".
The solution is to make separated PvP options for pugs and premades, to make pug PvP auto-scramble teams at the start to balance teams and avoid people forming pugs with all allies/ friends. Also, another thing to add along with the previous ones is to make teams scramble during a match if it's getting too unbalanced. Also, you can make a 1v1 PvP option for all those powerplayers that just care about "who's the strongest". And a must should be to divide PvP into brackets.
I would say that it could make a score based on 3 factors:
- Gear score
- Your guild ranking
- Your personal ranking in PvP ladder
Also, i would make GS calculated including a score for weapon enchants and armor enchants, sicne these things are not included in the calculations. I've seen a GWF from a high ranked guild, with 33k hp, 1,8k regen and full Gtenes stacked along with 3,6k defense and Greater/ perfect weapon/ armor enchants. He got only 11k GS or so, cause he was using blue items for regeneration. If you put such a guy against "normal" 11k GS players, there would be no match. So the PvP brackets should consider how the player is geared overall, and not just the stats.
This to say that it's up to the game to make the game enjoyable for everyone and balanced when it comes to PvP and PvE.
It's NOT the players who must all play hours a day, run a guild or pay money cause else they are put against lifeless powerplayers who'l lsmash them. Quite simple, it's the game that should make the powerplayers play against other powerplayers, and the normal players play against other normal players. For example, TF2: it's a multiplayer game, but to keep the experience balanced and entertaining, the game auto balances the teams if one team is clearly dominating. it's not the players who must form a organized Group or get smashed buy a organized clan.
About hp/regen/tene builds: it's not like it's "a build". It's THE BUILD every each high ranked powerplayer run on ANY character/ class. Just cause the PvP is designed so bad that only tank classes can play it successfully. And tenes are the way to get attack power along with tanky defenses. When only 1 build is allowed to be successful in PvP, something must be corrected if you ask me.
Also: you can let tenes the way they are, cause they bring money. Then people will get easily bored about your mmorpg that allows 1 build (hp/regeneration/tenes) to be THE PvP build everyone uses.
Powerplayers will run for the build, play a bit smashing pugs and nerdgasming on their godly character, then leave and go powerplay on another mmorpg.
I don't see this mmo lasting long like this.
also from a roleplay/teamplay/classes aspect this makes not much sense, too. the healer should be the one that keeps his team alive. if every class can heal up themselves very good then you make healers less important. on the other hand the healer is gimped and doesn't deal as much damage as others can just heal themselves.
yesterday i quit a pvp match because it was just a waste of time. we were hitting constantly a solo gwf with 3-4 people and it took us literally ages until we could kill him and i doubt that all of our gear was so bad. he spammed his unstoppable and healed up due to regen, too. i don't wanna do boss fights in pvp where i have to hit someone 10 minutes until he finally goes down (or people just leave and go to another match).
even the strongest warrior should not survive alone when he is fighting against more players. that makes absolutely no sense from a roleplay point of view and dungeons & dragons is THE roleplay game by far. at least there i would expect some "reality".
Obviously the game doesn't force you to join a guild, and you know premades are not only guild based (although the vast majority is). Having said that, you can't base a whole queuing system based on an algorithm checking for premades only by Guild affiliation, while 5 people from different guilds team up on Skype and wreck face in what seems like a PuG.
The only way to separate PvP into casual and hardcore, is make a ranking system based on teams (not guilds). Season (weekly,monthly,annually whatever) starts, you enroll with a team of 5 people, get matchups with other teams that bothered enlisting and in the end of season, rewards are given based on wins over losses ratio.
This way you also get a very easy way to get an individual PvP ranking.
Meanwhile, unranked maps like the ones we play now still exist and casual players that wouldn't bother for running against bloodthirsty tene users, enjoy their casual runs and still whine on the forums about how lesser Vorpal is better than lesser Plague fire.
There is no end to whining in PvP, but for a game to succeed in this bracket a ranked bracket is needed. A separation between premades and PuGs is easily broken and won't work for more than 1 week before some genius will exploit it.
You should all pause for a minute and say...let's chain stun him and see how he does before we keep feeding his determination for 10 minutes. If he managed to make 4 people play his game, then you should give this guy mad props.
Of course, as a DC, regen is a total lifesaver in PvP because it works in combat. If you're a DC who pugs PvP, you find you spend a stupid amount of time either prone, stunned, dazed, or otherwise CC'd and unable to do anything. Usually you'll have two or three people whaling on you simultaneously because DCs have a reputation for being easy meat in PvP, so hey: free kill.
On a good day, they'll be doing this to you while you're in an astral, and have a HW ticking on yourself (or a divine forgemaster's ticking on one of them), but if you're in cooldown or have been punted out of your shield, regen makes a HUGE difference. Not least because it only really kicks in when you're on low health. DCs don't need out of combat heals, we can happily handle that ourselves. In-combat health recovery that works regardless of control status, and that isn't affected by righteousness? Oh god yes please.
I'm not (it must be said) terribly good at PvP, but I've tested "me wearing T1/T2 purps (2/2 -no miracle healers, sadly)" vs "me wearing regen-stacked blues" and it's a five to tenfold reduction in deaths. I don't heal or damage for as much (per heal/attack) but I heal and damage far far more overall because I don't spend most of the match waiting to respawn.
Regen doesn't "make DCs less useful": it's more useful for DCs than any other class, arguably. And DCs provide far more for the team than just "healz plz": we bring a ton of mitigation and buffs too. Stacking regen lets us (well: me, certainly) survive long enough to provide these things.
The problem with unkillable regen-stacked GWFs is that you're taking entirely the wrong approach. If they don't have a ton of tenebrous enchants, then they've sacrificed damage output for survivability, so...just ignore them. Don't go 4vs1, that's exactly what they want you to do. They're specced to tie up your team entirely, and you're letting them do so. So you can't get them off the point? Let 'em have it, leave 'em there. Go 5v4 the rest of their team. They leave the point because they get bored? (which they will) You can backcap.
If they HAVE stacked tenes, then they'll be unkillable damage monsters, and yes, this might be annoying, but
A) they've probably paid a ton to get to that state, so hey: let em have their fun
It's very rarely that a single player on an enemy team is the sole reason that team wins, unless you play entirely into their hands.
I'm not saying PvP doesn't have balance issues, but I think the regen stat is working just great as is.
If people just took one minute to think about strategies over 'why-this-big-man-isn't falling on my mouse click' approach, then I am sure that PvP would be a place to discuss strategy, rather than a place to counter naive calls for nerfing.
only regen when out of combat (TR and GWF will be the only class that will benefit from regen)
GWF is op bec of their unstoppable not bec of regen if youre a CW just repel them out of pvp nodes dont waste time trying to kill them
GF with BiS equips can still be killed by 2 or 3 players but some GWF needs 4 or 5 to kill them bec of unstoppable, not bec of regen
PvP premade option: you form your team, you check a team list and challenge another premade
PvP pug option: 10 people join, then they get randomly scrambled and distributed between the 2 teams by the game, with balancing based on gear score. Quite simple. If, along the match, one of the team is annihilating the other team (let's say a score difference of 300+), the game auto- scrambles teams based on the score in the current match. Just like in TF2.
This way you have a easier way to arrange premade vs premade, and a balanced pug vs pug with no way to form a previously organized team. Also, would give the opportunity to guildies to challenge each Others when put in 2 different teams.
More fun, more balance, no more complaints.
@trollgre: Unstoppable gets OP only on regeneration sentinel builds. ANY other GWF build is in no way considered OP, and in fact all the complaints you read are about unkillable sentinels. Now, if only one build makes the skill seem OP, what do you think is OP, the skill or the build?
Seriously, this is simple logic. If unstoppable was OP, then you would see ANY GWF build dominating in PvP. Instead, normal destroyer or hybrid builds just are not harder to face than any other class.
This alone should make you understand that the problem is not unstoppable but the combo of unstoppable+ regen tank build. And since nerfing AGAIN unstoppable would make any other GWF build even more useless, i suggest you guys start to look in the direction of the other thing that makes such builds OP: 2k per tick regeneration.
The problem, to me, is that other classes use regeneration builds in PvP, and they want to burn down the sentinel builds without having to sacrifice anything, so they want to burn down the Whole GWF class nerfing unstoppable.
Face it: it's not unstoppable the problem. It's the regeneration build COUPLED with unstoppable. So you should nerf the build, not the Whole class.
Try and actually play a hybrid build in PvP, without regeneration. You won't come back asking for unstoppable nerf.
Or you can keep complaining and asking for another unstoppable nerf till the class is burned to ashes and the only ones left will be sentinel builds in PvP.
To balance 1 build in PvP you will burn down an entire class.
Exactly. I was just commenting on the fact, that Premades can't be identified by the current queue system, because the only way for Devs to do so, is to identify a connection between the players. The only evident is the guild affiliation. So, we all understand that's only theory.
If Cryptic separates the pool between big fish and small fish, then 2 separate communities will emerge and everything will be better. Right now, everyone is on the same bracket because there is virtually no way for hardcore PvPers to PvP, other than joining the same queue that this guy that just dinged 60 joined too.
I mean, you could argue for better ways of discriminating between 5 guildies and 5 randoms who partied up for PvP, but a straight distinction between "this is 5 people already in a party" and "these are 5 randoms queueing up separately" is really easy to make, and would improve matters quite a bit.
A per-person rating system would be even better, obviously (global agenda had this, and it worked quite well: as you got better at playing, you'd start seeing a greater number of 'big names' in your matches), but just filtering premade parties from singles queueing would be a start.
Or it might as well not be. 5 random people want to PvP together because...let's say that they enjoyed the last time they farmed DDelves together. That's not a premade.
If a queue system for premades facing premades needs to be done, the distinction between teams that are willing to compete in there should be made clear.
It's as easy as: Queue your team in Ranked PvP or just join a normal queue.
If you go ranked you should be prepared as of what you expect.
I want it brought back to 100% but only able to use out of combat. To fix the DC PVE issue, and this has been brought up and agreed upon by most, DC shouldnt have reduced healing power on themselves. That was initially brought about because Cryptic didnt want DCs NOT using potions like everyone had to, so they nerfed their healing. Now that Gold is worthless its a moot point and should be changed as well.
I want it nerfed in combat because its a very broken pvp mechanic. Doing this will allow actual combat to not only become more balanced but will STILL allow players to basically full heal out of combat. But DURING combat, a DC should be very key, which right now as a Sent you dont need 1. If you stack enough regen you can live for a very long time if you kite around for ticks.
2) Just because I post for a balance in this game makes me a spoiled brat? Im pretty sure buying the BIS gear for Sent GWFs costs almost nothing. maybe TODAY it costs quite a bit because players are ALL rolling that spec (or most are anyways) The BIS setup is either a reavers edge (dirt cheap) or the ice axe (dirt cheap) the 207 regen rings USED to all cost <10k AD. Regen necks are dirt cheap. Scrappers is dirt cheap and ONLY the two piece titan costs something NOW, its used to be dirt cheap. I got ALL that stuff months and months ago for ALL under 1 mil AD. Throw even a normal lifedrinker on there and a barkshield and GG, try and 1v1 them down...
3) This has everything to do with pvp balance and creating FUN pvp for players. You pointed this out exactly, "Keep in mind that not every of us is a spoiled brat OR exploiter, able to afford ****loads of overpowered HAMSTER." So since your admitting its "overpowered HAMSTER" isnt that a dead giveaway that its not working as intended?
I mean tene was nerfed from 6-8 seconds to 20 seconds.. but is it still OP? Yes.
Regen was nerfed, is it still OP? Yes.
Doesnt it tell you something that MOST Sent GWFs are running lvl 45 BLUE rings over anything else? Why is that? Why are they also using non-tier weapons? Hmmm...
I have lost hope in trying to make this game balanced for the rest of the players. Its clear by the votes that most people have no idea why they get rolled by premades SO easily.
It will be come apparent when the servers merge, I predict ALOT more QQ about pvp because people get rolled and they will blame class imbalance and blame certain builds/setups but when people come on the forums to try and communicate WHY things are broken, they get flame...
Let me ask you this,
Do you think anything in PVP is broken? If yes (which most people admit there are broken things in pvp) How would you try and communicate that to the Devs? Post on the forums? Well GL with that because I have now realized after trying since OB that the only people that typically come on here, have no idea what they are talking about. and boo down any suggestion for a balance.
I will see you all in game once servers merge. We will more than likely be the ones sitting outside your spawn while you whine "P2W" or "I hate they matched us up with premades" or "They need to make GS related Que system" Etc Etc when the problem is that good players find the most broken abilities/feats/specs and use them to wipe the floor with you.
Bring your best bro, because well bring ours, if you win, youll earn my respect, until then, dont talk down to players who you have no idea who they are and what experience they DO have in this game.
Same goes for you dante123pl. Id LOVE to 1v1 you and then have you pst me after asking for advice on how you should spec. Im not saying im the best, but the fact your such a hater to my comments, which most high lvl pvpers I have consulted with or have agreed with the majority of my posts, means you probably dont fall into that category.
Biased poll.
++++++++++++++++
Yes i voite for more buff for regen. (i hope the original poster char will die all t2 instance+ malabog and he nefed regen he will nerf life steal or dc heal and every self heal skill in game)
This game IS D&D and D&D have regeneration ability in combat.
Go and play some shooter game.
Surgeon bands are only for Tene users, otherwise you use greater ring of health. Let's look at GWF when you take tene out of the mix as especially now that no more NM lockboxes are dropping you either have to already have them, or have a fortune sitting around.
GWF's that go full sent and full tank so that they are hard to kill (mine is like that, with no tene's) lack virtually any damage output. It takes me about 45 seconds to 1 minute to kill a good player that constantly CC's me and dodges my flourish/knockdown, and conversely I am nearly unkillable 1v1 except for by the top geared enemies. So my job is to contest an enemy point all by myself, that's my whole role in the PvP match. I am able to contest said point against 1 person very well, but even if they send 2 good players I can be dead in < 20 seconds. Very good players can still 1v1 me as well, TR CW and GF (very heavily geared GF =P) So this is balanced as my entire role is to stay alive and stand in 1 place.
Now Take away my Greater rings of health and my defense slot 575 HP belt to add in Tene's and I lose (with only R7's) ~4k health and a little defense/deflect and my regen is about the same (gain some on rings lose some on belt) So now I my regen ticks for less, I am more susceptible to CW or GF prone + burst, and I can certainly be killed by a TR with SE 1v1. With Tene's it is quite powerful and probably one of the strongest 1v1 builds but it is definitely possible to kill them 1v1 and they do trade some tankiness for damage.
If anything is out of whack here it would be the Tene enchant, but even then I find Tene builds to go down much faster than non tene full defense.
If you put this also in a setting of equal gear and skill the GWF is certainly not OP.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
This is the BEST argument I have heard about keeping regen high. But I am afraid its a bad one. Here is a detailed explanation about how Regen works in D&D.
"Regen tends to be great at heroic but falls off rapidly in usefulness through the tiers. Most sources of regen don't scale nearly well enough to be as relevant in combat as they are at low levels.
Even in heroic, however, it's not going to make that huge a difference in combat, most of the time. It will smooth out the damage spikes to a degree, but it won't save you from getting overrun. Every little bit helps, but sometimes damage spikes will still drop you. Significant regen really can break an encounter, however. Armor of Sudden Recovery, if you get lucky with a large source of ongoing damage, can dramatically swing the tide of a fight. There are several leader dailies that have similarly potent regen sources, some even for the whole party. Those can definitely swing things, and they're valued highly.
Regen's strongest point, however, is not on the encounter-level hitpoint budget but rather on the daily hitpoint budget. Getting any regen at all basically means free surgeless healing after a combat, usually to bloodied but sometimes all the way back to full. Even going just to bloodied can really cut down the number of surges you use. If you're at 1 HP, then it takes four surges to bring you to max. If you have regen-while-bloodied, then you cut that cost in half - regen takes you to bloodied, and surges do the rest."
FURTHER:
On page 260 of the Rules Compendium regeneration is defined as:
"a special form of healing that restores a fixed number of hit points every round"
Which is defined outside of combat as a 6 second duration in the game world, but the RC also states that:
"If a creature has regeneration and at least 1 hit point, it regains a specified number of hit points at the start of its turn."
All of this to say that an MMO an not a game, suffice to say I dont think the intentions of the developers was to give someone a way to regen 2k damage every three seconds.
I would even be happy with 25% effectiveness (half of what it is now) in combat but 100% effective (double what it is now) out of combat.
I also proposed, as people I guess didnt see, that DCs would not have reduced healing on themselves. Which basically null and voids any PVE arguement about how regen is needed. Regen was never intended to be needed as a way to stay alive.
Again see ALL my other comments about this.
1) T2 is easy, regen is not needed IF they bring DC heals back to 100% on self.
2) MC is easy when a coordinated group and regen is not NEEDED
3) Lifesteal is fine as it is WAY less than regen, if anything id be in favor of a buff here.
4) Its only the passive regen combined with high tankiness that breaks PVP, so I dont really care about other self heals...
1600-2k regen every 3 seconds is pretty broken in pvp when you can do things like LOS/Kite/Stealth/Block/Unstoppable and my favorite, SOULDFORGE! To get regen ticks.
I haven o problem healing out of combat, I have no problem WITH self heals, I have problems when classes like TR/GWF can basically live forever BECAUSE of regen.
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regeneration
A creature with this extraordinary ability is difficult to kill. Damage dealt to the creature is treated as nonlethal damage. The creature automatically heals nonlethal damage at a fixed rate per round, as given in the entry (for example, a dread blossom swarm has regeneration 5). Certain attack forms, typically fire and acid, deal lethal damage to the creature, which doesn't go away. The creature's descriptive text describes the details.
A regenerating creature that has been rendered unconscious through nonlethal damage can be killed with a coup de grace (see page 153 of the Player's Handbook). The attack cannot be of a type that automatically converts to nonlethal damage.
Attack forms that don't deal hit point damage (for example, most poisons) ignore regeneration. Regeneration also does not restore hit points lost from starvation, thirst, or suffocation.
Regenerating creatures can regrow lost portions of their bodies and can reattach severed limbs or body parts; details are in the creature's descriptive text. Severed parts that are not reattached wither and die normally.
A creature must have a Constitution score to have the regeneration ability.
4.0
You give the target the regeneration ability that some monsters possess.
Attacks against the creature except fire and acid inflict subdual damage instead of lethal damage.
It heals subdual damage at a rate of 4 points per round.
A regenerating creature that has been rendered unconscious through subdual damage can be killed with a coup de grace.
The attack has to inflict fire or acid damage.
Attack forms that don't inflict hit point damage (for example, most poisons and disintegration) ignore regeneration.
Regeneration also does not restore hit points lost from starvation, thirst, or suffocation.
A regenerating creature can regrow lost portions of its body (although the spell duration is usually not long enough to allow this except for very small portions such as fingers) and can reattach severed limbs as a move-equivalent action.
Severed parts that are not reattached wither and die normally.
When the spell ends, all the creature's subdual damage is converted to normal damage.
The T2 items are magical shame as mostrosus regeneration spel all item in nw are enchanted so ego it can provide regeneration .
What you metioned is regeneration from unconscious to die-ing you don't know what you linked magical ability confused for die-ing procedure.
Sorry for bad eng.
Cool you talk s...t. And absutly not know what are you talk lifesteal with tr can provide ower 1000k(in 3 sec 3k) hp per hit much more in 1 sec then regen 3 sec 1600-2k hp.
No Passive regen exist all we got is from item's MAGICAL ENCHANTED ARMORS RINGS. Each class live longer with regen DC GF CW too. Also i think you main char is CW and you dont have high wizel armor sett .