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Celestial coins and Blessed Profession Packs
poigt
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 89
OK, so it's taken me weeks to manage to log on 5 days in a row and use invocation within the "invoke or lose your coins" timeframe. Yes weeks. Believe it or not, Neverwinter is not my life, and life frequently doesn't afford me the opportunity to log onto my PC every day.
Imagine my excitement when I finally managed to achieve it today and spent my five coins to get... 10 residuum and 2 brightleaf on one character and the same on another (ok it wasn't brightleaf but it was still just 2 green quality consumables).
I was expecting something... more. Like a batch of steel shears or some other, rare consumable. Whereas none of the things in the pack were things I didn't have plenty of just from random drops.
Weaksauce.
I guess this post is just to say - if like me you don't get a lot of time to game, don't bother making the effort to log on every day if one of your goals is to get enough celestial coins to get something you wouldn't be quite likely to get just randomly through a couple of levels worth of questing anyway because... you won't.
...please don't bother replying if you're going to tell me I'm being greedy or entitled or whatever: I'm NOT saying 'HOW DARE YOU GIEF ME BAD DROPS! YOU ARE TEH SUXX0R!', and I'm not demanding the celestial coin rewards be boosted, I mean they want us to buy from the store with Zen, I get that*
I'm just putting this out there for folks who don't have the time but might, like me, consider making the extra effort to get extra stuff. I'm just saying the extra effort isn't worth it, that's all. If you are on every day anyway, this post is not for you, because you're not making any extra effort.
*of course, if the stuff from the store is noticeably better than the stuff you get from the 5 coins, then I won't be buying from the store because I don't like being manipulated - the store should be a convenience option, not the only practical way to proceed with anything except cosmetics. But that's a whole other thread right there. But if the store version grants exactly the same rewards as the 5 coin version, and it's a reasonable price, then I will buy them. If it grants more, or is an unreasonable price, I'll just do without entirely, from either source. Vote with your wallet etc...
Imagine my excitement when I finally managed to achieve it today and spent my five coins to get... 10 residuum and 2 brightleaf on one character and the same on another (ok it wasn't brightleaf but it was still just 2 green quality consumables).
I was expecting something... more. Like a batch of steel shears or some other, rare consumable. Whereas none of the things in the pack were things I didn't have plenty of just from random drops.
Weaksauce.
I guess this post is just to say - if like me you don't get a lot of time to game, don't bother making the effort to log on every day if one of your goals is to get enough celestial coins to get something you wouldn't be quite likely to get just randomly through a couple of levels worth of questing anyway because... you won't.
...please don't bother replying if you're going to tell me I'm being greedy or entitled or whatever: I'm NOT saying 'HOW DARE YOU GIEF ME BAD DROPS! YOU ARE TEH SUXX0R!', and I'm not demanding the celestial coin rewards be boosted, I mean they want us to buy from the store with Zen, I get that*
I'm just putting this out there for folks who don't have the time but might, like me, consider making the extra effort to get extra stuff. I'm just saying the extra effort isn't worth it, that's all. If you are on every day anyway, this post is not for you, because you're not making any extra effort.
*of course, if the stuff from the store is noticeably better than the stuff you get from the 5 coins, then I won't be buying from the store because I don't like being manipulated - the store should be a convenience option, not the only practical way to proceed with anything except cosmetics. But that's a whole other thread right there. But if the store version grants exactly the same rewards as the 5 coin version, and it's a reasonable price, then I will buy them. If it grants more, or is an unreasonable price, I'll just do without entirely, from either source. Vote with your wallet etc...
Post edited by poigt on
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Eh. Expecting a mere 5-day (and yes, that's "mere". It really is) login bonus to give you 40-200k+ AD, generally-from-the-cash-shop-only, profession tools was probably a bit much. Sorry to say.
And yeah, games =/= life. But still.... having 5 minutes each night before going to bed to log in and pray, isn't really a monumental task. It's not like "I don't have the hour+ it'd take to do my dailies", it's just a simple login-pray-logout. Booting your computer takes longer.
Which is why the celestial coin bonuses aren't generally anything huge - the only "big" item is the small chance of the 7-day giving you a Coalescent Ward. And even that's not guaranteed.
edit: oh, for clarity - When the game says "profession resources" it just means crafting ingredients. It needs to say "profession assets" to be tools or workers.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
I didn't realise that's what the store gives you. I don't expect anything like that from the free coins. How much is that in Zen? Is that really the equivalent store version? I was thinking there'd be like a 50 zen bag that would give you more or less what the free coins give you, but that in the first place the free coins might give out about 5x what they actually do give you. So about 100 residuum and 10 of the green items (or 2 of 5 kinds of green item. Or something like that)
RainFeather- Dragonborn DC
Rune Fell- Drow CW
This is very useful info, thanks (and you too, Echokazul)
the zen store only sells a pack that will give you a chance to get epic, blue or green assets. the only place to buy specific assets is in the auction house.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
There a clear line in the different between a profession "resource" and an "asset"
What you were hoping for (steel shears) is not a consumable. It's an asset - assets are just that - assets to your account, they can never be lost or consumed, don't bind, thus are straight value to your account forever.
The resource pack is just that - resources only. Assets can't drop from it.
Steel shears are an extremely rare drop in the 300 zen pack. With enough of them you can earn unlimited ad, thus they are very valuable - they run around 300-400k AD on the dragon AH. They can also be acquired outside of the zen shop - but its sadly only through a 1-per character life shot (prof special pack from a 1 time only reward quest).
So yea, they are not gonna give everyone a free 300k+ AD item every 5 days per character. If they did, the assets values would drop to nothing, thus what you could craft would drop to nothing, thus the entire purpose of leathercrafting would be destroyed if you got what you wanted.
Fact is, if somethings not rare, its not going to have high value. Assets only purpose are to be rare - they do nothing else but function as a gateway to ensure the dedicated few can make a profit. It's one of the things cryptic got right.
I haven't spent a dime of real cash on professions and own somewhere in the 15-20mil range worth of assets - and really that only represents a very small fraction of what ive earned since I never put much focus into it. Some dedication can definetely get you there.
Your best bet AD wise is the 7 day pack. Has around a 5-10% chance at a coal ward (valued at 110-120k ad).
If you can't log in 7 days in a row... Personally I like the 3 day reward - +1 to all stats potion.
-Epic Dread Vault Crushed.
Characters (Dragon): Axer (60 Guardian, Leader of Crush It!), Controller (60 Wizard), Warlocker (60 Warlock)
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
We are definitely dominating, and we are always about to win.
It may. If it does, then I didn't notice before I bought it, and after that it's a bit moot if it says anything on the inventory item, cos you've already bought it. However, if it does say in the purchase screen, then I'm an idiot, plain and simple, no hiding from that
Checked. All it says in the celestial coin purchasing screen is: "This small profession pack has been blessed by one or more of the deities, altering it's contents". That's it. So no, not an idiot. At least, not a complete idiot.
Agreed
are you kidding me? There is practically endless content, just not publisher content. And hey - you can make your own content. It's like, a main selling point of the game. Perhaps you missed it. Complain about the lack of developer content and I could kinda agree with you, but I wouldn't be surprised to find "most" of the game is now player generated, which is what they intended all along, so they don't have to do all that and can sell us vanity items
dont' know enough about them to comment.
not sure what has changed to make that less fun, but I agree progression is a bit fast, I am not interested in End Game.
wow. That's quite a scoop! How did you get access to their sales data? Sorry for the sarcasm but really, if I had a quid for every time someone said that on a game forum of MMOs I've played over the years, even if I only got that quid where the game then went on to fold in the next 12 months... I could make my own **** MMO. You don't know, you can't know. All I know is that there are still dozens to hundreds of instances of protectors enclave, and I see lots of people running about, the forums are pretty busy, the devs and marketing folks are publishing new stuff all the time, more and more foundry content is coming out... That's a healthy game right there, and perhaps if you feel that way, the problem is you're not enjoying it. I suggest playing something else if it upsets you that much. I just thought the rewards for the coins were a little low. I didn't think it was representative of some kind of impending disaster!
I agree Zen prices are a little high for what you get back. But they are a vast improvement than the original plans. In fairness though, I find that the people gouging the most are players, in terms of AD prices on the auction house.
As to whether other games will slay this game... well time will tell. I still think DDO is a better game, but I'm really enjoying Neverwinter so far. Could do with more levelling content though, 1 character to max and I only skipped maybe three zones on the way up which leaves me with just End Grin- er, End Game to do.
For future reference, you can mouse over the pack (or other items) prior to buying it for a more in-depth description. Not in the menu, but when it's selected as though you were about to purchase it, if that makes sense.
Neverwinter Census 2017
All posts pending disapproval by Cecilia
You're correct of course. 2 samples from the RNG does not a case make, usually.
But two packs bought within minutes of each other both contained exactly the same quantities of stuff suggests that the RNG in this case doesn't have very wide range of N, or that the R isn't very R
Oh, and it took weeks, not months, just for accuracy.
Following on from that, I don't really understand what you're getting at with your last sentence, unless you just wanted to summarise a couple of paragraphs from my first post (and god knows I ought to have someone on standby to do that for all my posts, so if that's what you were doing, thankyou): yes, clearly I expected too much from it. That's the point of the whole thread, I thought!
I was highly disappointed in the results, I suggest no-one else bothers with them if the only way they can afford it is to go out of their way. That's all. Yes I've covered what my expectations were, and those expectations are obviously set to a higher bar than the game developers'. If they weren't, I wouldn't have posted that I was disappointed.
i.e. my expectations were dashed because they were too high, and I wanted to warn anyone with similar expectations. I wanted to explain what level of return would have met those expectations (albeit I did it with an ill though through example in my original post which sent folk off on a tangent), or what I (still) feel would be more reasonable given that it just takes one lapse and you lose everything you've built up. That's all. My first post was not some kind of a rage post (which I thought I made clear), it was not an entitlement post (which I thought I made clear)... it was a 'I'm disappointed, don't make the same mistake I have, devs if you're listening I think this could do with a boost' post.
Although the more I think on it, the more I do think that the entire stash of coins completely disappearing if you miss a day is weaksauce. Why couldn't they just evaporate one coin per day missed? I.e. I have four coins, I miss a day, I come back to 3 coins rather than zero. Would that be so unbalancing given the poor returns of the rewards?
i`d love to see such a mmo like this without the need for farming etc.
but that will actualy take work from devs to keep a game fun, so with other words not going to happen in this loot society
I don't have time to log in for five mins every day. This means these mini-games which you have to maintain over time are difficult for me, not doing stuff when I do get online. Neverwinter is excellent for dipping in and out of: it very solo friendly, it's pretty and mindless, quests don't take too long etc etc.
I have learned that this particular mini-game is not worth spending extra time on, I was putting that out there for others like me, is all.
Well, then you don't really have any reason to complain about the rewards that are specifically for people who do have the time to do that. Think of the coins as a "loyalty reward" program - if you qualify, you get something nice - but if you don't...*shrug* well, then you presumably have something else that is more rewarding for you to spend your time on.
It is out of my way to make the effort to: boot the computer, fire up Neverwinter, allow it to patch if it needs to, wait for login, select character, do invoke (and I am parked at an invoke spot on both characters to save as much time as possible), change characters, do invoke and quit. That's about ten minutes time away from whatever I was doing, minimum. "Ten minutes! TEN MINUTES! That's nothing!" I hear you gasp?
Well, true. But because I have a job, my actual window of opportunity for those ten mins all has to be within about a five hour window between getting home (6ish at the earliest mon-fri) and going to bed. And if for any reason I have an evening commitment (each tuesday, wednesday and thursday) then I probably only have a one hour window or so. Either way, in that window I have to pay some attention to my wife, son, cat, do housework etc etc. Never mind going away for weekends. Honestly, Those ten mins ARE out of my way. Not massively, the point is they're ten mins I don't always have, and ten mins I don't always remember about because I'm not playing NWO daily as a rule.
Now, I am NOT suggesting being able to access it via gateway or making it automatic or anything cheesy like that. I'm NOT saying ten minutes out of your day is a lot for most people. I've NOT said that I'm particularly aggrieved... just that I think it's a bit weak as it stands. I've also suggested two rather minor tweaks:
Increase the rewards a bit; or
Change the coin loss to the same rate as they are gained, i.e. one per day.
And so far no-one's argued with those as unreasonable, people just keep going on and on about how I'm expecting too much of the current situation, which, as I've said, is obvious or I wouldn't have posted the thread.
Except you. Thanks! Why do you think I'm suggesting too much? (forget the shears! Please forget I mentioned the chuffing shears!
Which I've also acknowledged. My point on that score is that the gap between what's in game and what you get for zen is monstrously huge, and that means there's room for the free stuff can go up in value a little bit.
Agreed. 5 bucks for bank space, for example, is more than I'm willing to pay for 12 slots, I'll suffer the shortage of space instead. If they'd been a buck though? I'd have bought five lots of it by now, and they'd have made 5 bucks from me on that score instead of nothing. Ditto the profession packs. If they introduced a version that was essentially as per the Celestial bags now with a much lower price (e.g. 50Zen or less for the volumes involved), I'd probably buy loads of them.
/facepalm
who's complaining? I'm explaining, and suggesting. Please stop defending something I'm not attacking in the first place. I love this game too you know, I'm not insulting it or you.
It was not my intention to sounds sarcastic. TO answer your two points:
1) Player created content is potentially the best thing that's happened to MMOs ever (The next will be destructable environments btw if sony manage to pull that off!) but i don't accept this as the solution at the moment because of the limitations on progression. While I think scripting particular character behaviours in player created dungeons would potentially be beyond most, I don't see why loot tablets couldn't be drawn up to reflect difficulty, and allow progression through thoses elements too.
I understnad that people might well abuse it, but Cryptic have been pretty heavy handed with many of the 'exploiters' up until now and it wouldn't take much for htem to eliminate the abusers, and bring forward lgitimate player created content that rewards well also - creating difficult boss fights and prolonged tournaments with epic reqards would I agree improve longevity. And as far as I am conerned the major 'elephant in the room' missing form player created content is PvP mapping and tournament creation.
OK there would have to be a fairly strict selection criteria for a player map to be added to the roster, but there's no reason it couldn't be done based onplayer votes and each month a player created PvP map that tops the player vote chart featured on the rotation for everybody, with access to all thep layer created content via Pre Made groups.
2) Secondly I don't have access to Cryptics R?L turnover information, but I can tell you that the guild I was in with over 200 players online folded within a week of the changes with the vast majority of those players turning elsewhere to play games. These were enthusiastic, long time gamers who played daily on this game. I don't think the danger is due to the coins and perhaps this was the wrong forum to bring it up in, but what the coins illustrate is a skew to the expected Vs Actual progressionin the game.
MMOs have progression in them and at present the progression side of the game islimitted by Developer content. The developer content is small by comparison.
If the focus of hte game is player created fantastic - that ticks all the boxes for longevity but then you need to find a way to allow this to progress the playerbase also and keep them interested.
Like I said It's a shame because of the promise of this game, the cavatar control is good and there's tactical play in all elements of the game but it needs expanding on. Even if some cliche'd type PvP matches couldbe introduced like capture the flag, Team deathmatch and Storm the base type events, where a Boss could be placed at a dungeon and one team is on the side of the DUngeon and one on teh side of th advennturer party - if the Adventurers win, killing teh Boss and defending against the squad before the timer runs out then they get epic rewards, and Vice Versa if the defending team win and kill the adventurers, allowing the boss to win then they can loot some great gear from the adventure party. Theplayer base has the imagination but not access to provide the rewards to make the majority ofplayers do it and I don't think the experience alone, apart from a very, very fiew of theplayer created maps will hold us en mass....