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Regeneration needs to be toned down - blue gear better then purple?
xiphenon
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Regneration gear in form of "... of the youth" is blue gear that is quite common and cost near to nothing at the auction house. T2 armor is currently the best ingame stuff and costs alot effort to collect - or, alternatively, alot of AD.
Nevertheless, if you want to go tanky (or should I say next to invincible?), this blue items of the youth outperforms T2 armor or items by far - mostly because of it's native regeneration stat, but also because it focus on defense as stat in addition.
In fact, if a character like GF, GWF or escpacially DC focus on blue items with regeneration, they can perform in many situations (but mainly PvP) much better than wearinh purple T2 items.
Imho regeneration self heals far too much in comparison with the effectivity of other stats and is next to game breaking if focused on and mixed together with high defense and deflection scores.
Altough it is only a matter of survival, blue items should not outperform the best ingame items available. Because there is no enchantment available that add regeneration stat it is even more worse - it makes blue stuff even more unique compared to purple.
Regeneration has to be brought inline with other stats and reduced in effecitivity in terms of survival.
Nevertheless, if you want to go tanky (or should I say next to invincible?), this blue items of the youth outperforms T2 armor or items by far - mostly because of it's native regeneration stat, but also because it focus on defense as stat in addition.
In fact, if a character like GF, GWF or escpacially DC focus on blue items with regeneration, they can perform in many situations (but mainly PvP) much better than wearinh purple T2 items.
Imho regeneration self heals far too much in comparison with the effectivity of other stats and is next to game breaking if focused on and mixed together with high defense and deflection scores.
Altough it is only a matter of survival, blue items should not outperform the best ingame items available. Because there is no enchantment available that add regeneration stat it is even more worse - it makes blue stuff even more unique compared to purple.
Regeneration has to be brought inline with other stats and reduced in effecitivity in terms of survival.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by xiphenon on
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have you ever tried making a GF with that set and accessories?
"Somethings not as good for one very specific build so make everything worse!"
I'd use your same argument to add additional epic items in the game with regeneration.
Nothing wrong with the stat, it suffers severe diminishing returns like many others, and thus stacking a full set of "youth" gear as you mention is simply not effective like your talking about.
You simply don't know anything about pvp if you think thats the gear people use.
They don't. I helped gear out and figured out what was the best gear for the very first troll gwf build you see with that high regen. You get more then enough simply with jewelry and the small amount on some gwf/gf gear.
The reason it seems relatively stronger is simply because the most common gear doesn't have much of it. One would argue the ame thing about the "Defense" stat if most armor didn't have much of it.
It's a solid stat, but not in any way overpowered.
The GWF build for pvp that relied on it was overpowered because it stacked that with it's other massive heal (feated unstoppable), thats already been dealt with.
-Epic Dread Vault Crushed.
Characters (Dragon): Axer (60 Guardian, Leader of Crush It!), Controller (60 Wizard), Warlocker (60 Warlock)
lol so you face a Deflect/Regen player in PvP and now QQ on forums that's is OP.
Guess what... L2P issue.
Also Epic's are not Best In Slot... The itemization for Epics is generally horrible and why Blues out perform. Just look at the new Gear from Fay with +80 in each stat. CRYPTIC wants players to balance their stats vs. stacking specific when what CRYPTIC should be doing is providing sets with stats to specific builds. Damage, Tank, Healing, etc... with set bonuses that match those specific builds.
No. I play a support cleric so I get pwned in PvP anyway, but it is a matter of time how long it takes. I found out that this time is prolonged by factor 2 if I wear blue set of armor of the youth instead of my T2 miracle healer set, which took me alot of more effort than buying the armor set of youth for below 10 K AD in AH.
Would be fine, too.
Would be also a solution, escpacially if that comes in form of enchantment.
Nevertheless, something needs to be changed regardless of the way it is done.
Youth is DEFLECT / REGENERATION + Defense stats ONLY. As I said this is a DEFLECT/REGEN build and is pure survival. You don't have any recovery, power, crt, arp, etc.... Pure defensive stats and why you survive longer.
If you look at Epic sets they have more stat value but split between more stats.
This is not news to experienced Clerics. It also has nothing to do with Regeneration or "blue" items and much more to do with DC class and design intent in PvP.
===
If you actually had any experience as a PvP Cleric (which you clearly do not), then I would have answered so:
1. Regeneration shares the highest diminishing returns of all stats in the game (the other being movement) by a large margin (*).
2. Pure Regeneration is poor in PvP because it makes almost no difference compared to burst incoming damage.
3. Regeneration + Defense improves survivability only a little because there are so many Resistance Ignored effects. Again, ask any GF or DC who has ever made such a build and played with it for a while.
4. To be noticeable, Regen+Defense items need to occupy a large amount of stats that would be much more efficiently used by other stats for the vast majority of builds on most classes, e.g. Power, Armor Pen, Crit. The opportunity cost is huge, especially for certain classes like CW and DC (that's a lot of missing Power or 4pc bonus).
5. In general PvP, Damage > Survivability. There is no point making yourself a little bit harder to kill, or even almost unkillable (in the case of certain GWFs), but you cannot otherwise help your group. You will just be left till last and then there is no way you can survive 5+ versus 1.
To be effective to the point of making anyone "tanky", Regeneration has to be combined with high HP and Deflection. This rarely occurs except for certain specific builds for GWF, where they have extra survival HP-oriented benefit from gear and feats. As noted already, most of the truly effective survival builds of that class have already been culled.
Some PvP Clerics use Regeneration in Deflection builds, and indeed it makes them much more tanky than the typical DC that dies in three seconds on a battlefield and is the weakest PvP class in general by a mile, but that is due to Deflection plus their various Damage Resistance/bonus healing static spells (from which they can easily be pushed out of or killed when they are down).
Finally, just because some blue items have more Regen or Defense stats on them than some purple items does not make them better! There are blue and green items with more Power or more Crit or Armor Pen etc. than is available on purple items - so what? Purple items have more total stats on them, often have set bonuses and in the case of armor and weapon can be slotted with armor and weapon enhancements.
The game is about finding a balance of stats for builds that are appropriate for your playstyle, no matter where they come from.
(*) See this very accurate NW stat calculator: https://www.desmos.com/calculator/3dqpvhuavj
Loool
Regeneration has been already nerfed !The tooltip say with 2000 regen you gain 13% of you max hp with 30k hp 3900hp per 3 sec but you only gain 1950. Nerfed too hell -50% .
Sorry for bad eng.
Survival > Damage
When you are dead you do 0 damage.
This is why Deflect/Regeneration is KING in PvP. GWF/GF/DC
CW/TR should be glass canons as they are pure Damage classes and can counter the Deflect/Regen builds with very high burst.
You don't need much experience to play Neverwinter PvP, because PvP in Neverwinter is quite easy. The most difficult part is to go to the forums and get the most effective build, then work toward it and hope it is not nerfed until you accomplished.
And if you think you need a special skill to compete, you seem to be a bad PvPer in general. As someone, who played in younger years q3 arena in different leagues, I can say there is not - at least not from my perspective. You need maybe 1/10 of the skill you would need to compete with high level shooter player for Neverwinter PvP to compete with the best. A good chunk of "experience" comes from equip (though there are even some people that can fail with BiS equip).
Dimishing returns don't means the lack of effectivity. It just means, you won't get any much more out of it at a certain level.
Only a moron would go pure regenaration like only a moron would aim for 5000 recovery, armor penetration or any else stat beside power. However, you can easily get a stat of 1000 regeneration, 2000 defense and some deflection by using either armor or jewelery items of youth. The combination at the DR level makes it quite effective. This gives you much more defense than wearing purple items that focus on defensive stats.
Regeneration don't suffer from resistance ignored effects and it scales with HP.
You only need 1000 to 1500 regeneration, 2000 defense and 2000 deflect to cap for DR. That's not "alot".
That's wrong. In PvP burst damage (and that's the only damage that is noticeable) is mostly useless without CC because of dodge ... do you actually dodge? And CC also allows you to completly negate damage dealt by other players. Player that god CCed do not deal damage at all.
I have 2 toons with significant regen.. the regen percentage is true, but it is a percentage of how many HP DOWN you are. If you have a 20k toon with 5% regen when he is reduced to 15k he regens 250 per... at 10k he regens 500 per...the closer to death you get the more it does.
And OP, its not very efficient for many characters or playstyles, but it's there for those of us who want to invest in it. I use it for leveling squishy characters sometimes till they get to a more durable point in their build. The only reason I can see anyone being as against it as you are is it makes some toons harder to kill in PVP. Don't go complaining when your big burst doesn't get you an easy kill, the other guy had to make stat sacrifices to get his regen that will help you, if you are smart enough to figure out how.
I don't get big burst, I'm a support cleric. I'm just frustrated about blue armor topping purple T2 armor in respects of survivability.
Did you actually read my post? I don't complain that I can't kill someone. I don't complain that some killed me. I complain that purple T2 armor is much less effective in terms of survivability then blue reg armor that drops countless like rain.
If there would be reg enchants, there wouldn't be any problem, because you could add reg on your purple gear. However, there is no enchant. So it is unbalanced towards blue items because you can enchant them to give any other stat you want.
Then why make this fail thread in the first place?
Or are you claiming now that you have discovered Regen (as if tens of thousands of players before you have not), you are suddenly not only a PvP god but you understand the deep intricacies of equipment itemization as well as an entire game's statistical systems...?
I invested time to get best armor set in game? Why anyone should if he can get equal or partly better gear for less then 10 K AD in AH?
It would be like epic mounts you buy for Zen being more slow then the 5 G horse - but instead they can glow fancy.
Not in general PvP. In premade vs premade, yes, but I highly doubt the OP is the kind of player that would be in such matches, do you?
No, why I should waste my time doing so? Since the queue is random .. it's quite boring to stamp random groups ... however, some "premade players" apperently can find some satisfaction in it.
I have played premade vs premade e.g. in DAoC. That was quite fun because it was open PvP and you know where you could find intresting fights.
Its actually very simple. It's not my fault you cannot follow even simplest logic. But let me formulate it again for you in a apperently for you more appropriate dialect you might be able to understand:
Rank of equipment in PvP and even PvE for some classes (not for all!!!111oneone):
PvP gear ~ T1 gear < T2 gear < blue reg stuff
Investment of time/money:
blue reg stuff <<<<< PvP gear < T1 gear < T2 gear
F2P MMORPG character development in strenght:
time < more time < even more time < alot of money < game master < producer < CEO
c4n y0u und3rst4nd n0w?
- JailBreak (in development)
Now Get Out & Stay Out
Why I should cry about it, I can simply buy it - as everyone can do - for less AD then one of my character makes daily by using leadership. In fact, I profit from using it.
I only point out that it is unbalanced from the point of logic of gear development - and that's even only my opinion. I don't force anyone agreeing with me.
Hm, nice ... I have to admit that's a good point.
Sorry to burst your bubble of delusion...
Regeneration is health based. How can a character with 23000hp in blue items outperform a character with 37000+ hp in purple items??? 9% of 37k is more effective than 12% of 23k. All that blue items do, is making you become squishy. Again, we are comparing 1.5k defence against 3300 defence. How can 1.5k defence outperform 3.3k defence?
There is a reason, why regen is not an enchant. People like you, let's call them - people who are unable to play the game properly would abuse the hell out of it, for example see: tenebrous enchantments.
The "issues" you've mentioned don't even exist. Makes me wonder which game you're playing, maybe misclicked the proper forums?
People like you, shouldn't be allowed to post, at all.
Regeneration: Heal you with x% amount of your lost hp up to 50% of the max hp every 3s!
I have 30k with 10,3% and i heal between 0-1591. And for the 1591 it doesn't matter if i have only 1 HP left, 10%, 25% or 50%!
You only SUPPORTING what i write .Regen is bugged to hell below 50 % hp you only gain half amount .If you have 30k hp with 10,3% you must gain below 50% 3090 hp insted of 1591.
Incredibly high Constitution or relic items, and should be MORE powerful then what currently exists.
In fact rings of immortality are often just regen rings in most D&D formats.
REGEN IS NOT BUGGED!
The purpose of putting a "CAP" on regeneration was due to it being OVERPOWERED previously.
If a player could heal 100% of missing Health players would become nearly unkillable.
38,000 HP / 11.8% Regen - GF
Max 2242 - Heal Ticks every 3 Seconds
If was 100% would be:
Max 4484 - Heal Ticks every 3 Seconds
That's why there is a CAP of 50% Missing HP. Just like there is a CAP on Reduced Damage & Deflection, etc...
Any class can build regen. It's hilarious you come to the forums QQ'ing.
No doubt when someone tracks your character down, it will show your in <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> gear and don't have a clue about anything.
As was the case the other day!!