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Worst GWF replacement in CN ever!
farfig1337
Member Posts: 108 Bounty Hunter
Thought CN with CW, CW, DC, TR, TR was bad
Thought CN with CW, CW, DC, DC, TR was even Worse
But nothing is more humiliating to GWF and GF when you are told by people you used to Run CN with that they now go. CW, CW, DC, TR + one Mule placeholder so they greater odds on getting loot.
4 Man CN runs.
On The Eve of a GWF nerf that could end the class entirely. Since the biggest nerf is the GWF's Slam power in PvE.
I don't know about all you other GWF players out there. But now I'm on my last legs. The fact the the Devs even Suggested a GWF nerf means they have no intention on making things better for us in PvE. and You all know how we struggle on getting groups.
I think any PVE nerf, Including the Deflection reduction from Master at Arms and Bravery, my 2 passives I use for PvE toughness. Will end the game for me.
Cyrptics kicks the GWF when they are down.
And now if I don't see a buff I'm out.
Thought CN with CW, CW, DC, DC, TR was even Worse
But nothing is more humiliating to GWF and GF when you are told by people you used to Run CN with that they now go. CW, CW, DC, TR + one Mule placeholder so they greater odds on getting loot.
4 Man CN runs.
On The Eve of a GWF nerf that could end the class entirely. Since the biggest nerf is the GWF's Slam power in PvE.
I don't know about all you other GWF players out there. But now I'm on my last legs. The fact the the Devs even Suggested a GWF nerf means they have no intention on making things better for us in PvE. and You all know how we struggle on getting groups.
I think any PVE nerf, Including the Deflection reduction from Master at Arms and Bravery, my 2 passives I use for PvE toughness. Will end the game for me.
Cyrptics kicks the GWF when they are down.
And now if I don't see a buff I'm out.
Post edited by farfig1337 on
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GWF was a class that had the choice of destroyer for dps or sentinel for tank.. Although the dps path was still a very inferior one.. This nerf now demolished the dps path.. Absolutely 0 point being a dps GWF it is dead completely... So u have the tank option.. Which they plan to nerf as well....
So you are left with nothing.. A pile of **IT of a toon that is good at nothing.. With a piece of HAMSTER of a mechanic 15% mitigation that isn't needed anyways...
The question now is whether the description of the GWF from cryptic when u start a toon is fraud or misleading bacause it now is nothing like they describe..
Thanks
It's both.
GWF always was the better tanky fighter.
GF while is the better DPS fighter.
GWF just happened to have massive aggro issues since the beginning.
worse damage(CS, LB and much more)
worse CC(compare smoke bomb with one-target Takedown, or size of singularity with Come and Get It)
worse utility(Roar push distance is laughteble)
no wonder this is not a class that is needed in PvE group, on my alts I take gwf in group only as act of compassion
Good can I have your stuff........ You wont be missed your worthless now and will be worthless when the patch comes out nothing to see move along.
4 man CN runs have been going on for a long time so I wouldnt take it personal as a GWF or GF. I actually love having a GF or GWF for the damage mitigation/buffing/debuffing.
That's not an issue of playing a class that provides less utility in a fight like CN Draco. It is an issue of you associating yourself with a bunch of a$$wipes. I know there are plenty of those around, but you probably need to find better quality and more mature individuals. If certain people can't accommodate others in a Game, imagine how they are like in RL.
LOL, yep. If the OP's so-called friends would ditch him for a 25% boosted chance to get a piece of loot, then either he's not very likeable, or they're giant d-bags. Or maybe both.
Cryptic can't fix either of those issues.
I will say this, though: Cryptic has allowed and in some ways even tacitly encouraged the acrimonious and hyper-greedy culture that surrounds high-end dungeon runs in this game. Fixing the content would go a long way towards making the game more pleasant for all players, of all classes. That's not a game-balance complaint, though.
That won't fix the issue of needing 1 billion AD to trick your ride!
Fixing the content won't fix the greed since you need large sums of AD for enchants.
Truth.
But with a few alterations to the content, we might see a little less bickering about whether or how best to speed run dungeons. Lately I've found that divide to be the biggest obstacle in completing a PuG run (much less enjoying one). If there were fewer ways to game the system, there'd be less of the behavior bemoaned in the OP -- maybe not at the super high end, but that culture's always a little iffy in these games.
Mind you, I'm not judging anyone who prefers speed runs. The term, "speed run," isn't terribly precise, anyway -- encompassing everything from downright exploits to just efficient play. I just think we'd all be happier if players were more-or-less on the same page about how to run dungeons. That means fixing exploits and reducing short cuts, but it also could mean making the so-called default path shorter. It could also entail a limit on the amount of times players can farm a given dungeon on a given day. There are any number of ideas.
For the purpose of this conversation, and based on what I've heard, Malabog Castle is a step in the right direction: Malabog's last boss isn't an add fest and there aren't any ledges, so although I suppose you could bring 3 CWs, there's no obvious reason to believe that it's the best approach.
reduce adds HP, increase their speed
When it will be more quick to AoE adds down then throw over ledges and they will be so fast they eat the CWs, then maybe there will be need of tanks or AoErs
Save the palguefire and get 2 weapons a vorpal and a plaguefire when no one has one.
mostly dps, DCs are getting hammer nerfed, TRs are getting COS, LA, Duelist, and a few other things nerfed
CW are getting a few AOE and dps nerfs.
while slam is getting nerfed...
--The initial cast now interrupts targets, and while slowed, affected targets now deal -15% damage (at max rank).
that's gonna be way more effective in PVP and very effective in pve at taking out spellcasters. so you lost a little dps but you just became INVALUABLE to have in a t2 dungeon!
--Crescendo: This power now grants CC immunity while active.
another change that will make you much more hated in pvp and valuable to a t2 team.
so in short yes you lost some dps, everyone else did too however some of your nerfed powers gained KILLER side effects!
FINALLY someone that actually isn't crying about the small changes, Crescendo CC Immunity is going to be super useful, the Slam -15% dmg is going to be very useful as well and the slows for kiting purposes.
Also as another Poster said, they take a GWF for DEBUFFS
Student of the Sword -45% Def total
Plaguefire Stacks with it
Daring Shout Mark the Target/targets = More damage for you and the team mates than have +Dmg to Marked Targets.
Avalanche of Steel AoE Knockdown Daily, you cannot be hurt while using it.
ALL those things are AoE and help out the Group = making the GWF very useful although some people don't know jack about those things.
Oh and in boss fights if a GWF uses slam while next to boss. He gets spammed by adds and puts the TR's life in danger.
Now lets look at ideal situation where a GWF is hitting the powerful mobs like the Hulks in Spellplague with Slam.
Cw's push the hulks over a cliff before they have a chance to hit anyone... Slam is wasted
Arcane singularity gives more damage mitigation than slam because it literalyy prevents 30+ mobs from attacking for about 5 seconds. While gathering them up next to a cliff to be thrown over.
With all the nerfs why is Arcane Singularity untouched? it is obviously the most powerful skill in PVE. Bar none.
But no the Devs only think about Damage dealt, VS damage received they know nothing of class role, cliff pushing adds, or damage avoidance skills
1) 15% mitigation is 15% mitigation. Why are you comparing to a utility encounter, I have no idea. So you are telling DC to not slot/feat for Foresight. Hec the GWF Slam mitigation is better than a feated Foresight without spending one feat point.
2) Singularity has a 15 target cap.
3) Singularity doesn't offer damage immunity for 5 seconds. Mobs can still attack, cleave, range, AoE cone, and 1 shot you, up until the moment they get sucked in the blackhole.
4) If you think the 15% mitigation is useless because CWs can just gather mobs and toss them, how is the current Slam helping you compete with the CW mob tossing?
And I agree the new slam has almost no value when better options already exist in stacking other classes.. It won't help one bit
And there is no alternative Daily. Slam was more or less ok only because the other dailies are terrible. No other class would pick Slam for their Daily. I mean, the orignal Slam.
If you'r choosing a group, you are better off not choosing a gwf if you have any choice .. I think that is the final point
For those Gwf's out there, I really recomend lvl'ing another class, though having those extra prof. slots is ok if he's already hig lvl.
And it's usable to make a few extra Ad's pr day
Don't get me wrong, You 'can' run epic dungeons, on it..
You think Singularity is a Utility, encounter? you have no idea how much damage that CW daily can actually do, do you.
People would take a GWF if GWFs were doing lobbying on the forums to see exploits fixed, because a GWF in a legit CN run is very handy.
I actually like the added utility, it will be a life saver when a bunch of mobs all do their red thing. Added threat it good too, it's just not so good they had to increase it to compensate for the huge, and imo unnecessary damage nerf.
15% damage mitigation is useless. The 5 mobs that are caught in the slam won't be attacking anyone, maybe just the GWF, if they can even catch up. The other 10+ mobs will just walk through it, still killing teammates, because the GWF can't kite them away.
I much rather would see a 15% defense debuff and the target-cap removed for all of our skills. We're AoE experts that stop doing AoE damage when there are too many mobs, that doesn't make sense.
I don't see why Crescendo would get an immunity, while the longer casting Savage Advance doesn't, even though SA is usually used when there are more mobs around (and no cliffs).
Spinning Strike could be made useful if it did more damage and pulled mobs in like Come and Get It.
The way I play my Destroyer is tanking the adds and gathering them together so the CW has an easier time dealing with them. Due to the target cap though I'm left with picking up the few stragglers that didn't get picked up by singularity, and pushing them into it.
So while Slam may be more useful now, at least with more utility, it's the wrong kind. Nerfing healthgain from Unstoppable is yet another step in the wrong direction, and we already were suffering from skills that don't get us invited into dungeons.
I tell you why i complain - srsly...WTF do GWF extra 15% mitigation? No we dont need survive more, what we need is damage - and that we lost there. Why to out-survive almost every class when you cant seriously hurt your targets? (ofc, with 1000 dolar gear any class can hurt, but the base damages and AoE damage is just laughtable for AoE class)
Umm yea, you should probably attempt to experiment with other dailies before making a statement like that.
No wonder the class is in the state it is in. If you can't "hurt" your targets as a GWF, then you're probably doing something wrong.
How about you ask the Dev to change Unstoppable, Daring Shout, and all the other powers and feats that give you mitigation and ask for even more damage? Oh nevermind, that would make you exactly like a TR with a Two-hander basically. Seriously, it doesn't take long to get a character to 60, so just go and roll a TR.
You definitely don't speak for the majority of GWFs. In fact all of us in this forum combined do not represent the majority of GWFs. It is pathetic to say "we dont need survive more". The 15% is not just for you, it is for your CW who just got hit by the hands at Draco. It's for your DC that's getting clobbered because the CW missed a punt. It's for the countless reasons anyone dies in a dungeon, or the many wipes that occur by your AVERAGE group, who are still struggling at Pirate King.
Wake up man and actually for once step back from your own experience in the game. You keep repeating the same BS as if everyone and their mother is farming CN with 4man. Guess what? If you are farming CN with your group, then you and your group suck if this change will have ANY effect on these runs. Hec start using Avalanche. It may not be better than the current slam, but it sure as hec will do a lot more damage than the new Slam. If you think it is subpar, then start threads about buffing the other Dailies. To freaking spend 4 days crying over the change of ONE daily is beyond pathetic.
Since CWs can build AP so quickly allowing CWs to spam AS, it's pretty much an encounter ability.
PS I am completly disagree with current class mechanics (wanna dps roll rouge etc.) It is wrong, so wrong, all classes should have dps skill tree with same potential.
Also is there way to have target of target, to know who target what ?