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Do you feel guilty if you saw a melee party member being chased by adds?
ianthewizard2012
Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,142 Arc User
Yesterday when my party was dealing with the final boss in a dungeon delve, I saw a GF was nearly zero on his hp and was chased by an add.
We had a DC in the party, but as a Control Wizard, I still felt kinda guilty. I was focusing on damaging and didn't do much controlling. The only presentable control power I used was Arcane Singularity. Other slotted powers were for damaging and self-defense (Shield).
Would you blame yourself if you saw the said situation happened?
P.S. The dungeon delve was Lair of the Pirate King.
We had a DC in the party, but as a Control Wizard, I still felt kinda guilty. I was focusing on damaging and didn't do much controlling. The only presentable control power I used was Arcane Singularity. Other slotted powers were for damaging and self-defense (Shield).
Would you blame yourself if you saw the said situation happened?
P.S. The dungeon delve was Lair of the Pirate King.
Post edited by ianthewizard2012 on
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Besides, isn't being chased by adds the whole point of being a GF (yes, I have one)!
Note. That said, if I can easily peel an add or group of adds harassing someone like a TR on Spellplague endboss, then ofc, I would do that...
Shield is not just "self-defense", it has its many uses one of which is for a situation like that. One shield pulse could have given the GF some breathing room or bought him 2-3 sec for a pot to come off cooldown. Plus, "an add"? As in ONE add? The GF was going to die from one add, and you couldnt spare 2-4 seconds to melt it? :P
I have 3 chars, it opened my eyes on the role everyone has to play in a party. Most of the time, with my DC, is see the CW trying to cover me, even and especially when i don't need that. Most of the times, he gets so much aggro that i end up doing control with sun burst so that he doesn't die. DCs do need a good CW, but sometimes, leaving the DC having his share of aggro is good for the team. He can handle that. That's what i do with my CW, i can almost permastun adds if i want to but i get so much aggro it's completely insane and the DC starts complaining about me losing so much HPs and blinking all the time (that makes me "hard to heal"
I dont think you read the OP. Let me quote: Also, IMO, Figher's Recovery is used when you are running with a PUG or a new 60 DC.
Thanks. I will check if the DC needs help or not before offering help in future dungeon delve runs.
I'm currently lvl 49. So is there a dungeon delve in which you must focus on control instead doing damage otherwise your party members will be unhappy?
and also the featured satirical comedic adventure "A Call for Heroes".
Yeah, pretty much all of them @ 60.
There's really no distinction between a controlling CW and a damaging one, though. Your control powers do good damage. There's a handful of 'staple' controlling powers that you'll more-or-less have to slot to do epic dungeons, among them Steal Time, Shield, and Arcane Singularity. The rest will depend on the particular situation and/or your build and playstyle preferences -- but for certain fights, teammates will expect you to carry a given spell in your Mastery slot. Or they'll expect rapid-fire Singularity spam, which means your best option for the Mastery slot will occasionally be Entangling Force.
There might also be very rare instances in which you'll want to slot primarily for single-target damage, but again, those are rare situations. If you're going into generic dungeon situations with a pure single-target damage loadout, your teammates prolly aren't gonna be happy. The Rogue's got that role covered, generally speaking.
And speaking of Shield, it is useful when soloing general quests, but I'm aware that I didn't use it (to damage) 90% of the time during skirmishes and dungeon delves. Mainly because it pushes mobs away and melee members might be unhappy.
Pretty much all of them.
Shield's pulse and Arcane Singularity go hand-in-hand. If you pulse the shield right before the targets are sucked into the black hole, they'll still get sucked in and emerge in a nice little bundle for your melee friends. Alternatively, if you wait til the black hole bulges, right before it spits the mobs out, a Shield pulse will knock them all over a nearby ledge, if one's present.
You're right that you don't want to use the Shield pulse indiscriminately, but it gets a fair share of use as a control tool. As an added bonus, it has no target limit, so it's one of your best damage tools too.
My first Foundry mission, The Valley of Darkness NW-DG9DOTZLU
My other solo character is a TR who I pretty run between to take down enemy casters and protecting the DC by tumbling past them and using my aoe then pulling them to the meleeists then stealthing away.
Never feel guilty about your build. this is one of the few games where you can use terrain and movement tactics to "control" mobs. If you had not taken DPS powers that GF would have probably had 3 adds chasing him not just one. What was actually the case is the GF wasn't properly blocking. and or your DC probably being destracted by his/her own adds.
Also if he was that low on HP he was probably out of Potions.
Most of them at level 60. Sometimes you'll have to switch to a single target dps build, even if it's vastly inferior to AOE/control, because adds can't be controlled. The first two bosses in caverns of karrundax and the last guy in frozen heart come to my mind. Anyway, your party will expect control from you, not dps. Of course, doing control always do some dps, and it's easy to be #1 on the paingiver board, but it shouldn't be your purpose as a CW.
Good control spells are: steal time, icy terrain, shield. If you want to go for a full chill build, conduit of ice on tab + icy ground is really the best option. Most monsters should be ice statues when you enter a room!
Singularity is a good spell, but sometimes, you want to use ice storm. It's not something you use all the time but it's better to give your team some time to breathe, it does a lot more damage than singularity (like 3 times more), the casting time is shorter, and it's very helpful when you have npcs immune to control. You don't annoy melees since they should focus on immune npcs, do damage, control, and kill small stuff with this spell.
No i remember ice storm having a higher target limit number. Something like 10.
It was a level 45 dungeon delve. Except for the DC being level 60, the rest four of us were at level. It was kinda funny that he didn't take care of the GF.
I didn't say you couldn't do both, but it may happen only if you focus on control. Most of the damage comes from the singularity + shield combo anyway. All other abilities are here for more control, debuff or the look.
My favourite way to do both is : shield to charge the daily, then wait a bit and charge shield again if the CD didn't reset to 0, cast singularity, shield before it starts rolling in the ball, use icy ground before they get down, use steal time + conduit of ice when they aren't frozen anymore, go back to step 1. If you have a high vizier T2 set you will debuff npcs a lot using this, so you should control stuff and do damage. You should be #1 depending on the encounters, dungeon, and tendency to cheat. The last factor is crucial, the more your party use exploits, the less dps you'll do, because they always skip big packs with a lot of HPs requiring control. Cheating isn't fun when you play a CW but it's the plague of this game, and the devs don't do much against this.
Yeah Damage is not the GF's main job. It's to hold the attention of the boss and adds. GWF is all about the damage. Now maybe when the new paragon paths comeout that might change. Meaning there may be a damage path for GF's and a tankish path for GWF's. It'd be a nice thought anyways lol.
My first Foundry mission, The Valley of Darkness NW-DG9DOTZLU
Built right, specced right, both GF and GWF are capable of doing excellent dps and tank/hold aggro at the same time. And with the current content, there isn't a single Boss that requires to be "tanked" by a "Tank"
I happen to agree with you to an extant. I've seen some nice damage output from GF's, though I've never seen a good GWF tank. And as for bosses not needing to be tanked, that is also kind of true too. Many bosses are dealt with by the others as the Add's are being aggroed by the GF.
My first Foundry mission, The Valley of Darkness NW-DG9DOTZLU
That's because at first glance most GWFs will look at the Sentinel tree for tanking thinking that mitigation is more important than threat generation. Survivability is not an issue for GWFs, and generating threat is better done through raw dps instead of those two feats in Sentinel tree. I'll leave it at that as I am definitely derailing this thread.