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What the Dev's Dont Realize About Perma Stealth PVP
ognialo
Member Posts: 11 Arc User
So as one of those pesky perma stealth rouges at first I was like OMG What a nerf... Then it hit me...
I dont have to throw daggers.... and my build is just fine.
Honestly I can just change teneb enchants for more power and armor pen and let path of blades do work for me while stealthed, and in fact it will be easier to harrass nodes. Because without throwing daggers you wont be able to see my enchantment flicker & 99% of the time throwing daggers forcing me to stay still is what gets me caught.
So basically Perma Stealth builds did get hit a bit because I wont be able to CoS + Path, that stinks less killing power. But they in a way they have forced the fact that I can now without throwing CoS be harder to find, and stay in stealth just as long being more annoying than ever.
So what does this actually do? PvP perma stealth no longer CoS from perma stealth, left with just harassing a node being harder to find than before. Sounds good to me.
PvE every rouge and their brother is now getting nerfed hard for all PVE because DF will now pull you out of stealth. Let alone the lurkers nerf.
That is all.
I dont have to throw daggers.... and my build is just fine.
Honestly I can just change teneb enchants for more power and armor pen and let path of blades do work for me while stealthed, and in fact it will be easier to harrass nodes. Because without throwing daggers you wont be able to see my enchantment flicker & 99% of the time throwing daggers forcing me to stay still is what gets me caught.
So basically Perma Stealth builds did get hit a bit because I wont be able to CoS + Path, that stinks less killing power. But they in a way they have forced the fact that I can now without throwing CoS be harder to find, and stay in stealth just as long being more annoying than ever.
So what does this actually do? PvP perma stealth no longer CoS from perma stealth, left with just harassing a node being harder to find than before. Sounds good to me.
PvE every rouge and their brother is now getting nerfed hard for all PVE because DF will now pull you out of stealth. Let alone the lurkers nerf.
That is all.
Post edited by ognialo on
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- JailBreak (in development)
It's pretty obvious they're trying to fix PvP (CoS & stealth nerf) but instead ended up HAMSTER PvE more than they did the PvP.
Nobody thought Duelist Fury was overpowered in PvE at all.
No they havnt but if they were trying in some way to nerf TR in PVE all they have accomplished is completely destroying our ability to solo bosses in record time while everyone else worries about adds. We will still be able to pull it off, but it will take ages and ages and ages. Not to mention that the fact that 99% of the reason TR can even survive adds at all is because of the ability to stealth. So its a matter of do I stay stealth or do I Damage Boss Aka the reason it will take a year and a half to down a boss as a TR. If that was the plan mission accomplished. Other than that they really havnt done anything too major that effects TR pvp, people are still going to QQ about getting lashing + Impact 2 shot From Executioner build Vorpal Teneb & Perma stealths being as annoying as ever on nodes.....
The only thing & I repeat the only thing this patch "Really" does, is nerf the rouge survivability & overall ability to put out single target DPS in PVE back to the stone age, Because in order to stick on adds or bosses, we have to remain stealth its a fundamental fact. Now it will be a choice, do I stay stealth or do I do damage. Is the tank holding aggro on the adds dare I risk coming out of stealth? As well as Dampen the PVP Lurkers 1 shot damage so now players will get 2 shot instead per the normal rouge routines....
Perm stealth is simple to counter. A cw with steal time or a tr with path of blades is all you need to beat one. Once you hit them once in stealth they tend to be screwed as staying stealth permanently requires precise timing.
I dont get how tenes are not getting nerfed as they are the real problem. But you need to spend money to get those, so i guess that explains it. Too bad trs didnt have to buy a stealth increasing kit from zen store for perma stealth to work than it would be nerf proof.
CoS wasn't that bad, unless you were dumb enough to just stand there and let the damage stack up.
LA's potential change is a stupid idea. Yes LA+Stealth+Impact Shot is a nasty combo, but i think they went off base with the change. A fair change would be to reduce the damage to 10/20/30% per point, instead of 20/40/60%.
If this change goes live, I wont mind so much. Since PW/Cryptic loves to listen to all the QQers who most likely don't spend much money supporting their company, they are saving me a ton of cash. My GWF will be 60 tomorrow and now i wont have to spend money to buy some goodies. I can pull my perf vorpal and 4 greater tene's off my rogue now, instead of buying more. At the current prices on my server that is about $800. So thanks for the Nerf PW/Cryptic, you just lost a potential $800, guess i'm off to the strip club tonight.
TSYM Website
Dragon Server
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?418071-What-the-devs-and-whiners-don-t-understand-about-this-Rogue-nerf-is
I'll quote a small portion of 1 of my responses...
Conclusion: Cryptic devs are horrible at balancing and fixing this game.
Its always a dumb idea to have an item, enchant, or ability that increases offense based on defense. There should be a downside to going all out defense. It shouldnt increase your offense as well; it should decrease it. Thats the trade off.
The trs, gfs, and gwfs that people complain about all have one thing in common: tene enchants. Remove them and all these "op" builds go away.
But pwe cant do that b/c people bought these enchants. So instead of fixing the real problem they are scrambling to band-aid it.
Once again, its to bad that will never happen since you have to buy tenes and hurting pwe's bottom lime is is a no no...
Thank you forposting to the devs how theybshould go further and fix the broken mechanics of the class.
We players appreciate it
When they balanced gwf,cw and dc it was all working as intended.
Now you recieve a balance and its they arebcrap at balancing.
tene's have nothing to do with defense. this is a prime example of why things get nerfed. a lot of people are clueless to game mechanics and when they get wasted by a person in pvp they run crying "nerf this and nerf that" on the forums.
buy some tene's for yourself and show support for the game you play. PW is running a business, not a soup kitchen, they have to make money.
TSYM Website
Dragon Server
CoS has been nerfed because of PvP
But: Perma stealth has been fixed because TR was able to kill bosses of epic dungeons ALONE. People which are crying because they think that PvP was the only reason did not realize the potential of perma stealth in PvE.
And here is the reason:
Lol@this^
Yes, please tell me how they balanced gwf, cws and dc's? Lemme explain..
1. GWFs: The only thing they are worried about in pvp is spilling there drool cup. Unstoppable 3-4-5-6 times in a single fight, going from less then a bubble of health to 3/4-100% in a matter of a fiew seconds, while critting you for 10k+, knocking you prone for a good 3-5 seconds, and all while they had a CC on them. and This <---is in ****ty gear, gl fighting one with a big wallet. I dont cry about GWF's in PvP..but balanced? I think not, they gave them a godmode button with zero skill to achieve.
2. CWs:Control.....Wizard.....Yet, they have the absolute worst CC as far as Seconds counted in the game.(In PvP)
3. DC's....Righteousness. -40% self heals inately in pvp, and pve..Why? Because some idiot had pouty pants on and cried that clerics were somehow going to be rich beyond there wildest dreams because they werent spending gold on health pots, and everyone else was.
Its apparent you PvP next to never, or you wouldnt have made such an ignorant comment.
Counters for everyone? All good PvPrs are always going to be good, and find a way around **** to do better. But countering a BiS GWF, with elite skill. There is no counter. Have you ever watched 2 of the same fight each other? Its like watching old people ****, boring and stupid.
Thx come again!
A extremely good point. Everyone always assumes every adjustment to there class is because of PvP. I think that perma stealth was bugged and pretty exploitable for PvE purposes. Of course its annoying in PvP and the class needed adjustments to damage. I think they are working on a PvE big picture and the reason rogues got hit is because they weren't fitting in the way they wanted them too.
I will definitely agree if there were no Bugged Tene's around this game be a lot better. Hope they are gone at some point.
1) They are ONLY good for PVP, so dont expect do do any PVE with them.
2) They take about 15 million AD to make and in PVP you WONT get top kills, WONT get top score, you JUST will be almost unkillable to help your team win a match, but most likely will spend your ENTIRE time just trying to stay alive ON a point, running away ONLY if needed to stay alive. oh and you spent 15 mil AD to do this too...
3) Your encounters probably take the most skill in timing and if you suffer from even a little lag, dont expect to kill anyone because either there is a HUGE build up animation of the encounter OR you have to be standing completely ontop of them for it to work, otherwise hello 12s CD.
4) While TR/DC/CW can blink/roll away and are "immune" to things while doing so, your GWF sprint just takes you from A to B faster with no real benefits other then that.
5) The ONLY reason they are good and viable in pvp is because of Tene enchants... If there were no tene, NOONE would be sent spec cause you do HORRIBLE damage and can only kill something because you can outlast everyone/immune to CC in unstoppable WHITH decent tene damage... Without, you wont do anything...
As to the above, YES tene is OP in PVP but its also HORRIBLE for PVE... Pick your poison... You dont hear PVPers saying RANK 9s are OP in PVE, MUST NERF THEM!!! Because Tene players chose to focus PVP.. Its essentially "pvp gear" or better "pvp enchants". Currently greater tenes are what 2 mil? Well You can buy a rank 9 for that amount right?
While I do agree 1000000% they need to be adjusted, I have a feeling its always gonna be BiS for PVP...
This should be addressed as well. Not for just PvP but also for PvE where rogue can continue to exploit and sneak past trash to solo content. Good work and I hope they fix this as well
If Tene's are always Bis for enchants for PvP and they never get fixed. Then we will never have good PvP which will be a shame. At least my guild and players like myself won't use the bugged enchants. Hope they just do something with them.
You completely missed the context. Go back and read what i said and what the person wrote that i countered. Seems like you dont know the history of the patches. GWF recieved a massive balance/nerf prior to launch.
When they nerfed GWF B4 launch then nerfed CW and DC the rogues said lrn2play.
Now when they balance (nerf) rogues which they needed, all the rogues are complaining the devs dont know how to balance. Yet when other classes got the nerf bat they were totally silent.
Dude learn to read and understand context and there is no way you PVP more than me.
Ive seen your posts b4 in other forums and i dont think your very bright. You should be quiet now.
I also think your butthurt because ur (owning) videos on the CW werent anything special. You state a CW should stay at range but your first two deaths are u running into melee range to get a straggler then turning your back casting on one spot and getting spanked by the repoppers behind you.
Iceknife against an unstoppable GWF dude. I stopped watching after your first two deaths. You said lol this to me and comon man well back at you buddy.
TR's needed the nerf I am glad they got the nerf, and will be happy when there is no longer 4 TR's every single pvp match.
This is league of bruiser, baby. BUT, a great but, besides game balance, permastealth is stupid (sorry). Balance should be achieved with a more sensate and realistic way of represent TR's stealth abilities.
Dude, there are literally thousands of players, a bit more than a fifth are TR. Trust me on this, not every rogue said L2P to everything. It's not necessary to make this into an us vs them.
Rogues and Wizards always seem to attract the most players. Those classes do (or did) very well in pvp so it's only natural that most people take those toons out for a match, instead of bringing their DC to get slaughtered.
And besides, nearly all bots are TR's, and there's an whole army of them out there, doing pvp and kitruns 24/7. Has nothing to do with OPness whatsoever.
TR's need a nerf as much as GF, GWF and CW. Meaning they don't need to be nerfed at all until Cryptic decides to deal with the real problem first, stacking ubergear with uberenchantments.
Dude unlike you forum rogues i dont lie and i dont provide misinformation. I believe this is clearly you saying lrn2play.
I cant believe you are also saying CW need more nerfs. They are getting steamrolled. Seriously this is why i dislike your forum rogues. Your so full of it.
You're just too obvious.
/ignore
He did have a point.. You said CW's were OP which is a huge lie and you are just trying to place something on something that is not just to further your agenda.
Just another rogue proven to lie.
Too easy /ignore
This is why i post like i do. They continue to lie and misinform. One by one they drop off the attack as they are shown the obvious folly of fighting truth with untruth.
Please re-read this sentence and then point out where I said CW's need a nerf.
"TR's need a nerf as much as GF, GWF and CW. Meaning they don't need to be nerfed at all until Cryptic decides to deal with the real problem first, stacking ubergear with uberenchantments. "
How does "meaning they DON'T need to be nerfed" translate into "they need a nerf"?