This is only true until the game isn't new anymore. With a steady player base, more people will be able to make dyes, people making dyes will stockpile huge supplies taking up what limited space there is in this game to store things, and players will flood the AH with more and more dyes undercutting each other constantly. Also if new players coming to the game drops off, you have less and less people in demand with an endless supply being produced.
The wonderful thing about free markets is that the market will adjust accordingly to whatever situation develops, despite that none of these situations, including the possibilities you outline, can be predicted with guaranteed accuracy.
Essentially, any problem that develops will be resolved by market forces, so there are no problems.
Hint: Don't dye stuff that lasts two or three levels. Problem solved.
Indeed. And then, by the time I hit 60, I've developed the habit of never dying anything and am far less inclined to do it ever. Now, if they made it cheaper, one might get into the habit of doing it and be more willing to pay for it (should be like a drug dealer: the first one's always free!).
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chidy1776Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2013
My biggest frustrations are the price of the cooler looking dyes and thier availabilty, but even more so than that is the insane cost of wardrobing an item and the lack of an item preview feature. For me to wardrobe an item it costs close to 70k ad, that is just dumb imo. I dnt think the game shouod restrict access to character customization by putting such a high cost on it. Also to know what item ieven want to get a look from i have to hope a wiki or something has an image, which is surprisingly rare, or get the item and then bind it by trying it on my character. I like the game overall, but these design choices really turn a lot of ppl off like myself, who find character look very important in an rpg. Im just really surprised that a modern mmorpg would lack an item preview feature, and severely limit character customization to how much in game currency you make. Really hope some changes come jn this area sooner rather than later.
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brendan03usMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
m1nuendMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2013
If you can attach any armor piece to your current armor piece to take its appearance, then you could dye that piece and keep it until lvl 60 without it affecting stats.
Edit; I just checked. Changing epic appearance for other epic appearance costs 60 000 ad ._.
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drquinchMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 26Arc User
How does it help the value, If practically no one bothers to dye anything until they cap out? Its not a factor of lost sales if no one is interested in buying it. However, if you make it worthwhile people who wouldnt normally buy, suddenly will.
People are desperate for more color. The number of folks i see in the 4th event colors, is proof of this. But unless you give it away or make it worth doing. No one seems interested in buying. Im simply thinking that a better way might actually encourage sales.
Well until they make the stuff needed to craft those dyes common as muck and move the crafting time down to 5 mins, I doubt you'll see em at the cheap prices you would like
As a crafter I can tell you at the moment most of the craft stuff isn't wanted and the "few" items players do want....well those players do like charging 150K for a Dragon Egg, but them moan things are overpriced it the crafter tries to even charge 100K for a top tier item that they've also managed to score the max 40% crit on for T3 (the T2 crafted stuff they don't want). As a Platesmith the only items I can craft that players want is a measly shirt and pants (the armour items I can craft are outperformed by drops atm). So nope I don't see dyes becoming cheap as chips in the future.
My guess is that the lack of variety with armors is because most of them are looted items, customized for whatever mob you killed... even though said mob can't actually use the armor in question.
*sings* "I like Gammera! He's so neat!!! He is full of turtle meat!!!"
"Hah! You are doomed! You're only armed with that pathetic excuse for a musical instrument!!!" *the Savage Beast moments before Lonnehart the Bard used music to soothe him... then beat him to death with his Fat Lute*
Vanity items in F2P game must be expensive, and will be expensive, I don't see why anybody may have a problem with that. Craft your own dyes, if buying from AH or Zen store is too expensive. Or there's these free dyes for praying, 15 tokens per bottle.
I just don't see anything as a big deal at all during the leveling phase. MMORPGs are all about level cap, not the leveling phase. This is especially true in Cryptic games, which are generally very, very quick leveling games.
Cryptic (not the current devs but the company) built CoH, and that game had the most extensively customizable character appearance system of any game. Ever. It has never been matched.
Cryptic (not the current devs but the company) built CoH, and that game had the most extensively customizable character appearance system of any game. Ever. It has never been matched.
I thought Star Trek Online topped them both, with you being able to customize yourself, your crew, AND your ships...
But back to the subject.
I figure if you want "customized armor" then maybe an Armor/Weaponsmith NPC should be added who will charge AD for any alterations you want. I mean... as this is a Fantasy setting where you wear the armor you loot you can't customize the thing yourself, right?
*sings* "I like Gammera! He's so neat!!! He is full of turtle meat!!!"
"Hah! You are doomed! You're only armed with that pathetic excuse for a musical instrument!!!" *the Savage Beast moments before Lonnehart the Bard used music to soothe him... then beat him to death with his Fat Lute*
I thought Star Trek Online topped them both, with you being able to customize yourself, your crew, AND your ships...
But back to the subject.
That's quite possible. I haven't played STO to know.
I figure if you want "customized armor" then maybe an Armor/Weaponsmith NPC should be added who will charge AD for any alterations you want. I mean... as this is a Fantasy setting where you wear the armor you loot you can't customize the thing yourself, right?
They are coming out with weapon making professions in the future. Perhaps that will allow for some more customization, depending what can be crafted.
Cryptic (not the current devs but the company) built CoH, and that game had the most extensively customizable character appearance system of any game. Ever. It has never been matched.
The Secret World also featured a lot of customization in appearance by making appearance strictly a matter of fashion -- your "gear" was invisible, and your appearance didn't change with gear upgrades (other than weapons, of course). People seemed to like that. Of course, the most interesting looking clothing also cost real money in the store in that game as well, and they had no crafting profession that created clothing for fashion purposes, so it was all going into Funcom's pocket as well there.
No, it shouldn't happen. That would diminish the values of dyes and thus the earning potential of the Alchemy skill. If people want to dye their items every level or two, they can pay the cost of vanity.
I agree. If you're going to use dye, wait until you have level 60 gears or use it on Fashion Items.
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templarknight91Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2013
The Dye System in this game is actually very cool, you can dye Accent, Primary or Secondary after you dye it, you can add another dye in the same spot, different spot and mix and match colors around.. just mess with it before you whine and you'll see
As for gear? buy any piece of gear you want FOR YOUR CLASS and you can Transmute your current gear to look like what you want, you may also dye it. very easy, look around on threads of other's cosmetics they've made up.
You won't see any difference in the cosmetic look of gear until lv..40-60 that's because they've mainly focused on level cap and it would just be a waste of time designing 20 different pieces for lv10,20,30, ect. Blue items have unique pieces also boss items of that area zone (you can get them off the quest bosses OR open a bunch of bounty bags and see if 1 drops)
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brendan03usMember, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 0Arc User
The Dye System in this game is actually very cool, you can dye Accent, Primary or Secondary after you dye it, you can add another dye in the same spot, different spot and mix and match colors around.. just mess with it before you whine and you'll see
As for gear? buy any piece of gear you want FOR YOUR CLASS and you can Transmute your current gear to look like what you want, you may also dye it. very easy, look around on threads of other's cosmetics they've made up.
You won't see any difference in the cosmetic look of gear until lv..40-60 that's because they've mainly focused on level cap and it would just be a waste of time designing 20 different pieces for lv10,20,30, ect. Blue items have unique pieces also boss items of that area zone (you can get them off the quest bosses OR open a bunch of bounty bags and see if 1 drops)
I agree with you on the dye system being pretty good. Most games with this system only allow you to tint the entire piece one color. Separating it into three different colors was a very good move.
What I don't agree with, however, is the decision to focus on higher levels for different equipment. Yes, most of this stuff will get replaced pretty quickly, but seeing the exact same piece of equipment at level 20 from when you started at level 1, with only one or two extra pieces added onto it, is pretty lazy work. I'm not saying that it has to be elaborate, but at the very least, they could vary the base colors up a bit and alter the shapes a little more drastically.
What I don't agree with, however, is the decision to focus on higher levels for different equipment. Yes, most of this stuff will get replaced pretty quickly, but seeing the exact same piece of equipment at level 20 from when you started at level 1, with only one or two extra pieces added onto it, is pretty lazy work. I'm not saying that it has to be elaborate, but at the very least, they could vary the base colors up a bit and alter the shapes a little more drastically.
Considering the amount of time a character spends in those levels, to add any more would be wasted work. The subtle differences are enough to represent progression. They focused their effort in the place of lasting value, which is level 60 at this time, which is exactly where they should.
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fathomfulMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Knight of the Feywild UsersPosts: 207Bounty Hunter
edited July 2013
Wow thanks for this thread.
Honestly i thought i was doing good for having the dye i wanted on my major T2 pieces that i will be rocking for a while. This thread (and links to others within) brought to my attention how cool xmuting function and layered dyes are.
Cant wait for my cleric to start looking as cool as some in the show cleric threads. Tons of options for customization.
They need to re-think the AD costs of changing the appearance of armor pieces. Customization shouldn't have such a high expensive behind it. We are talking about quality of life which translates into player retention.
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greymasqueMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited July 2013
I just wish we'd get dye drops - even basic dyes - from dungeons/bosses/etc. like the game says we should.
Also, I would love the ability to transmute higher-level gear to the appearance of lower-level stuff. As it currently stands, the Mancleavers that were perfect for my TR cannot be used to change the appearance of any higher-level weapon... so I got to enjoy the nice Orcish axes for all of 2 levels before they were useless.
As for the class gear all looking the same: I wouldn't mind seeing different colour schemes for each quality-level. That is, different colour combinations depending on whether an armour piece is Common, Uncommon, Rare, etc. That would also have the added advantage of letting people with higher-quality gear "show off" without having to be Inspected (if that's their thing).
I know neither of these will be implemented, but it's fun to think about.
No it won't. All Alchemists can make now is existing boring Color Packets for the four classes. Some Blues, Browns and several shades of Gray.... The Blues and Browns really shades of gray too. Also, you cannot even change the order of the color packs on the item.
Now, if they made individual colors craftable, and more variety. Reds, Greens, Black, Purples, Pinks, Yellows, Gold, Coppers, Bronze, Silver, and more vivid colors too, then the Alchemists would have markets for their wares.
Best of all, they could have it so, the most desireable colors, purples, blacks, greens, silver and gold are only at higher levels.
In terms of cosmetic clothing, a dyes it really is simple - any game not doing it almost exactly the same as LOTRO is getting it wrong.
The cosmetic gearing in LOTRO is, imo, one of the genre defining features of that game.
All The Best
For those of us who have never played LoTRO. Perhaps you can explain further. Simply saying it is the best, without any additional explanation, offers little to anyone.
Comments
The wonderful thing about free markets is that the market will adjust accordingly to whatever situation develops, despite that none of these situations, including the possibilities you outline, can be predicted with guaranteed accuracy.
Essentially, any problem that develops will be resolved by market forces, so there are no problems.
Hint: Don't dye stuff that lasts two or three levels. Problem solved.
Needed moar protip. FTFY.
Sadly, I'm too old to know what FTFY means.
Indeed. And then, by the time I hit 60, I've developed the habit of never dying anything and am far less inclined to do it ever. Now, if they made it cheaper, one might get into the habit of doing it and be more willing to pay for it (should be like a drug dealer: the first one's always free!).
Rising Star, fun friendly, community focused guild on mindflayer. We strive to help each other and enjoy the game together. Talk to me for info, or feel free to check and join our community at risingstarneverwinter.enjin.com
fixed that for you
Edit; I just checked. Changing epic appearance for other epic appearance costs 60 000 ad ._.
Well until they make the stuff needed to craft those dyes common as muck and move the crafting time down to 5 mins, I doubt you'll see em at the cheap prices you would like
As a crafter I can tell you at the moment most of the craft stuff isn't wanted and the "few" items players do want....well those players do like charging 150K for a Dragon Egg, but them moan things are overpriced it the crafter tries to even charge 100K for a top tier item that they've also managed to score the max 40% crit on for T3 (the T2 crafted stuff they don't want). As a Platesmith the only items I can craft that players want is a measly shirt and pants (the armour items I can craft are outperformed by drops atm). So nope I don't see dyes becoming cheap as chips in the future.
"Hah! You are doomed! You're only armed with that pathetic excuse for a musical instrument!!!" *the Savage Beast moments before Lonnehart the Bard used music to soothe him... then beat him to death with his Fat Lute*
Actually it was transcended, in Champions Online.
I thought Star Trek Online topped them both, with you being able to customize yourself, your crew, AND your ships...
But back to the subject.
I figure if you want "customized armor" then maybe an Armor/Weaponsmith NPC should be added who will charge AD for any alterations you want. I mean... as this is a Fantasy setting where you wear the armor you loot you can't customize the thing yourself, right?
"Hah! You are doomed! You're only armed with that pathetic excuse for a musical instrument!!!" *the Savage Beast moments before Lonnehart the Bard used music to soothe him... then beat him to death with his Fat Lute*
They are coming out with weapon making professions in the future. Perhaps that will allow for some more customization, depending what can be crafted.
The Secret World also featured a lot of customization in appearance by making appearance strictly a matter of fashion -- your "gear" was invisible, and your appearance didn't change with gear upgrades (other than weapons, of course). People seemed to like that. Of course, the most interesting looking clothing also cost real money in the store in that game as well, and they had no crafting profession that created clothing for fashion purposes, so it was all going into Funcom's pocket as well there.
I agree. If you're going to use dye, wait until you have level 60 gears or use it on Fashion Items.
As for gear? buy any piece of gear you want FOR YOUR CLASS and you can Transmute your current gear to look like what you want, you may also dye it. very easy, look around on threads of other's cosmetics they've made up.
You won't see any difference in the cosmetic look of gear until lv..40-60 that's because they've mainly focused on level cap and it would just be a waste of time designing 20 different pieces for lv10,20,30, ect. Blue items have unique pieces also boss items of that area zone (you can get them off the quest bosses OR open a bunch of bounty bags and see if 1 drops)
I agree with you on the dye system being pretty good. Most games with this system only allow you to tint the entire piece one color. Separating it into three different colors was a very good move.
What I don't agree with, however, is the decision to focus on higher levels for different equipment. Yes, most of this stuff will get replaced pretty quickly, but seeing the exact same piece of equipment at level 20 from when you started at level 1, with only one or two extra pieces added onto it, is pretty lazy work. I'm not saying that it has to be elaborate, but at the very least, they could vary the base colors up a bit and alter the shapes a little more drastically.
Considering the amount of time a character spends in those levels, to add any more would be wasted work. The subtle differences are enough to represent progression. They focused their effort in the place of lasting value, which is level 60 at this time, which is exactly where they should.
Honestly i thought i was doing good for having the dye i wanted on my major T2 pieces that i will be rocking for a while. This thread (and links to others within) brought to my attention how cool xmuting function and layered dyes are.
Cant wait for my cleric to start looking as cool as some in the show cleric threads. Tons of options for customization.
The cosmetic gearing in LOTRO is, imo, one of the genre defining features of that game.
All The Best
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Also, I would love the ability to transmute higher-level gear to the appearance of lower-level stuff. As it currently stands, the Mancleavers that were perfect for my TR cannot be used to change the appearance of any higher-level weapon... so I got to enjoy the nice Orcish axes for all of 2 levels before they were useless.
As for the class gear all looking the same: I wouldn't mind seeing different colour schemes for each quality-level. That is, different colour combinations depending on whether an armour piece is Common, Uncommon, Rare, etc. That would also have the added advantage of letting people with higher-quality gear "show off" without having to be Inspected (if that's their thing).
I know neither of these will be implemented, but it's fun to think about.
I know this is belated, but thanks for responding
No it won't. All Alchemists can make now is existing boring Color Packets for the four classes. Some Blues, Browns and several shades of Gray.... The Blues and Browns really shades of gray too. Also, you cannot even change the order of the color packs on the item.
Now, if they made individual colors craftable, and more variety. Reds, Greens, Black, Purples, Pinks, Yellows, Gold, Coppers, Bronze, Silver, and more vivid colors too, then the Alchemists would have markets for their wares.
Best of all, they could have it so, the most desireable colors, purples, blacks, greens, silver and gold are only at higher levels.
AKA Cyber Troll and Euben Hadd
For those of us who have never played LoTRO. Perhaps you can explain further. Simply saying it is the best, without any additional explanation, offers little to anyone.