test content
Logo
What is the Arc Client?
Install Arc
Spider Temple out of Hand
chudovishye
Member Posts: 0 Arc User
Alright, please someone explain this to me. After the exploit fixes, I was running spider temple in groups with way less GS than I have now (10.7 GWF). Absolutely cannot beat this boss anymore. The adds seem overboard, her heals ridiculous, I just don't get it. Please, someone explain to me if I'm missing something or if they ****ed this up and need to adjust the add drop rate or something. Tactics already tried:
1. Out DPSing the boss. This seems like the only one that really works now, but you need at least two TRs to do it. Yesterday, tried this with me, a 10K+ TR, and a 12.5 GS GF. CW and DC doing the usual. Nope. We'd be absolutely destroying her, and then, every time she got to about 3/4 life, the amount of heals she would do were freaking ridiculous. Little spiders way across the room we couldn't get to in time caused her to nearly fully heal? That just shouldn't be.
2. Keeping the CW and DC between the boss and the door, DPS players between the boss and the chest. This works so far as keeping the adds appearing primarily on the DPS, until she moves. If you get her just right, she doesn't teleport properly, but that's mainly luck, there's no strategy to keeping her where she needs to be. As soon as she ports out of your shielding, you're screwed. You have to follow her, otherwise she heals up.
Now, the reason I mention this is I absolutely DO NOT remember any of this right after the exploits were fixed. I ran this a bunch of times with no problems, and after some sort of recent patch fix, this boss has become the bane of my existence. I hate it, it's ridiculous. But it's ridiculous for the wrong reasons. I was in one party that actually just gave up because we were sick of hitting her. The DC was over 12 GS, the CW the same, the TR doing massive damage, and even that didn't matter. It's not challenging, just tedious, and it doesn't need to be that way. That is, of course, unless there's some trick to it I'm missing. For example, first boss on FH was a real pain until I discovered you stay up with the golems while you're crushing the crystals, which controls the add rate (before this I'd run the fight right in the room and at one time there were over 50 adds, still won). Doesn't seem to be anything like that for the ST boss now, and I see less and less people wanting to form parties and hear plenty of complaints from good, geared-up players. Someone enlighten me, please.
1. Out DPSing the boss. This seems like the only one that really works now, but you need at least two TRs to do it. Yesterday, tried this with me, a 10K+ TR, and a 12.5 GS GF. CW and DC doing the usual. Nope. We'd be absolutely destroying her, and then, every time she got to about 3/4 life, the amount of heals she would do were freaking ridiculous. Little spiders way across the room we couldn't get to in time caused her to nearly fully heal? That just shouldn't be.
2. Keeping the CW and DC between the boss and the door, DPS players between the boss and the chest. This works so far as keeping the adds appearing primarily on the DPS, until she moves. If you get her just right, she doesn't teleport properly, but that's mainly luck, there's no strategy to keeping her where she needs to be. As soon as she ports out of your shielding, you're screwed. You have to follow her, otherwise she heals up.
Now, the reason I mention this is I absolutely DO NOT remember any of this right after the exploits were fixed. I ran this a bunch of times with no problems, and after some sort of recent patch fix, this boss has become the bane of my existence. I hate it, it's ridiculous. But it's ridiculous for the wrong reasons. I was in one party that actually just gave up because we were sick of hitting her. The DC was over 12 GS, the CW the same, the TR doing massive damage, and even that didn't matter. It's not challenging, just tedious, and it doesn't need to be that way. That is, of course, unless there's some trick to it I'm missing. For example, first boss on FH was a real pain until I discovered you stay up with the golems while you're crushing the crystals, which controls the add rate (before this I'd run the fight right in the room and at one time there were over 50 adds, still won). Doesn't seem to be anything like that for the ST boss now, and I see less and less people wanting to form parties and hear plenty of complaints from good, geared-up players. Someone enlighten me, please.
Post edited by chudovishye on
0
Comments
The adds has to be controlled all the time via TR's smoke bombs and CW's steal time and Ice Storm.
Always avoid the red AoE circles around her or you will have to wipe.
Make sure that the whole party are staying at the boss, don't separate them..so the CW can attack the boss between the gaps of no-adds.
I don't know what is the role of a GF there, but if he deals decent damage he can definitely replace one of the TRs.
I think best things is try with 2 TRs , 1 CW and 1 DC . I hope this helps.
It's a DPS race. Take a couple of melee DPS, and hope that they aren't rubbish, standing still in the red spamming their at-wills expecting to be healed through their own fail.
I know that sounds harsh, but the difference is night and day. The fight really is that simple. I'd suggest taking one of each class, and trying to ensure that they make some sort of baseline competence level. Have two melee DPS at least on the boss full time, probably the tank too.
Have the CW mastery slot Entangling Force for massive AP gain and singularity spam*. They can cycle master Entangling force, Icy Ground, Arcane Singularity, then pop a Shield Pulse while the singularity is sucking mobs in (for most of the AP refilled). Then as the singularity burps the mobs out again, they drop Steal Time and Icy Ground, recast shield, and then spam chilling cloud (preferably) to get back to the point where they're ready for the next singularity and continuing the cycle. This sounds complex, but it only takes a few seconds, and once you get it down really helps in fights like Spider and Pirate.
Other players can use knockbacks if they feel like it, as it makes life easier sometimes, and the CW will have so much fodder that she will rarely be out of her rotation for long. The TR and GWF need to DPS the absolute ever-loving HAMSTER out of the boss, and the GF can too.
The DC needs to be awake, and if his computer is crappy, needs to turn down everything in graphics options, including combat floaters.. I'm serious. Most of the times that I have failed this fight, it's because a proper CW's effect synergy causes frame rate issues, and the DC dies/fails to do his job in time due to lag. Ludicrous, and you can laugh if you like, but at least remember it.
The DC's job is to keep everyone alive, obvs. This means blue Astral Shield as soon as it's cooled. Non-divine Sunburst to top players off and build divinity/AP faster. Keep Hallowed Ground slotted and drop it as Astral Shield goes down, as those blademasters can insta-kill people otherwise, if you're unlucky. Other powers are up to you- I love dropping divine Forgemaster's Flame on the boss, and tend to spam a lot of seals- keeping one on the boss, and scattering some on mobs to help the CW out, if I am healing this fight. The DC needs to be awake, mobile and paying attention. You need to avoid red stuff, and ready to slide away from mobs (who will probably be slowed by the CW anyway). If you get too much heat on you, go and stand in the CW's AoE.
Whatever else you slot, having Foresight slotted as DC makes like a lot easier. If you specced to improve your Foresight (which is a no-brainer), that is even better. It almost goes without saying that having Moon Touched in your spec makes Hallowed Ground a lot more useful too. Again, people might laugh, but I have come across DCs who have never even tried Foresight, and it makes life so much easier, especially in fights like this.
The tank (if you brought one) might like to pop aggro-generating skills (see my ignorance) when AS drops, if available, just to help the group survive. Those blademasters can hurt a lot. When Astral Shield is up, he should just be beating on the boss too, mostly.
The fight is a dwarfish rogue, short, simple and brutish. If everyone is doing their class job properly, it will work. If people are slacking, being carried, or simply are no good, then the group will be overwhelmed and die to add damage. The key is to keep things under control. Half of this is the CW spamming control effects. The other half comes from the other DPS hitting the boss so hard that she has to keep sacrificing mobs to stay alive. Obviously, the DPS needs to be high enough to outpace the healing that she gets too.
If either the CW or the boss DPS fail at their jobs, the group gets swamped and dies. If the DC fails, the group dies. If people stand in red, either due to their machine being too slow or them just not paying attention, they die, and the group usually dies. The way to win the fight is for everyone to avoid failing too hard, stay alive and do their jobs.
You don't need super-fantastic gear for this fight, as long as everyone makes some effort. If people are slack/rubbish, than they will still fail, even dripping with bought BiS.
Sorry, that was a bit longer than I was intending, but I hope it helps.
Edit:
* Actually, a properly-specced Thaum CW might like to keep Conduit Of Ice on mastery, if they are getting enough AP, as it will boost their damage, and cause a lot more freezing on the mobs, locking them down harder. Either approach is valid, you just need to be able to lay down constant crushing CC though- consistency is everything. An ice-centric thaum is absolutely wonderful for this. If there are no adds up, the CoI can always be dropped on the boss for the debuff.
Yes, it's a DPS check fight, but if you stay out of reds but clumped up for DG buff then ur golden, that's all there's to it.
And btw since patch I feel like TR and GWF is better DPS than 2 TR. Either that or I had luck with the GWFs and bad luck with the TRs.
There's actually a bug with spider if you don't kill her on the first attempt and wipe she stops spawning the advanced waves. Warriors at 60%, blade spiders + spitters at 40% and phase spider + tons of spiders at 20%. Although I suspect if they fix that most pugs won't stand a chance.
Thanks for all the tips, guys, but I've heard them all before. I'm just going to chock this up to my party not being awake enough any time I've done this, because I've been in parties with everything going according to plan exactly as you describe it here, to no avail.
As to your GWF comment, depends what feats they have and what they're armed with. Plague Fire of any form will whittle away at the boss's defense, so it may give the illusion of more DPS of the GWF during the battle. Also, the GWF generally will see higher DPS rates if they're crushing adds. I tend to stay close to her, using wide sweeps that gather damage from adds around her, CW pulling them in close to her. So it makes it seem like I'm doing more damage, because it's in general, not against a single target. Definitely hold my own, and my survival is incredible with the way I built, but I just think this is something that requires the right party and players, and that's all there is to it. It's a shame, because I've done things like solo FH and SP boss when the TR went down, but there's just no workability with the ST boss anymore. If one player dies, it's over, it's that simple.
Well, if you outgear the encounter as much as people spamming /zone prefer, then you can certainly lose a DPS, and still do it, if everyone else brings their "A" game. However, if it's more marginal, it can be harder to carry people.
These days people mostly do Spider runs , not sure what game you're playing right now seriously .
It's kinda funny, one of the few bosses with mechanics slightly more complicated than "kill adds, avoid red stuff," and people are complaining that it's too hard.
I'm sure you were highly popular, giving "expert" "advice" like this. I'm not surprised that your rage and tenuous grasp of the mechanics proved toxic to the the group, even in a dungeon with such easy/light trash as Spider.
The standard non-scrub way to toss is to use properly timed Singularity and Shield Pulse as part of the standard rotation. Shield Pulse is not target capped, and an exceptional AP source. It also avoids having to gimp your other skills in non-pushable areas, so CC and DPS are fast and efficient throughout. It's not the end of Spellplague, there is no need to slot Repel on Spider, unless you need a crutch. Hell, when you get to the last boss, you can unslot mastery Conduit Of Ice for Entangling Force if you want even more ludicrous AP generation for singularities. Even then, with a Singularity, Shield Pulse, Steal Time CoI/EF and Icy Terrain rotation, you will be doing max CC constantly with far more respectable DPS.
So no, you don't seem to have much clue what you're talking about- maybe you play CW sometimes, but if so, it would appear that you do so badly. I am sure that if you'd offered me such stellar insights, I would have ignored you, or possibly invited you to boil your head, depending on how persistent you were being.
The funny thing is that after they patched so you couldn't toss adds they didn't bother adjusting the add spawns themselves.
I.E. Increase time between waves or lower the amount of adds.
A few times we walked in and within 10 seconds of hitting the boss there were 5 blade masters.
We like to try different party comps but it basically requires a CW.
That fight and Pirate are basically playgrounds for CWs, I love both. You can go as crazy as you like, and rarely run out of targets, and the AP flows, how it flows. Because you can't just punt mobs off the side, you have to keep them controlled and burn them down. Rarely do you get an opportunity to go all-out without inconveniencing anyone else like that in such a "target-rich environment".
I often get thanked after these two fights, and I often think "don't thank me, I was just indulging myself".
I wouldn't call it easy, but it's more of like a clinic if that helps.
When she starts the heal channel (you see mobs stopping/red circles appear under them, etc.) push the mobs out of those circles. This will stop her from healing from those mobs. Now while 1 CW can push mobs that are close, you'd usually need 2 CWs to stop all mobs (even those further away). Don't push mobs when they are NOT getting sucked by the boss, as they will simply charge your CWs and kill them.
This simple concept brings the encounter time down below 5 minutes for a decent group. Smoke bombs from TRs to protect the party and debuffs from the DC (who doesn't really need to heal that much here) also help.
*
Smart tactic is smart.
1. If everyone goes left immediately you can clear out both add groups of spiders without aggro-ing the boss.
2. High DPS on boss. We tried to have everyone on her as much as possible.
3. For CW/TR, we timed our Steal Time and Smoke Bombs to when the clerics Astral Shield went down (AS lasts about 10 seconds). Everyone stayed in the AS to the best of our ability. For whatever reason, the mobs never stunned us when it was up.
3.5. No Shield pops. If the Blademasters stay close they don't stun-lock you.
4. Rogues used Bait and Switch, and lots of the adds aggro-ed them instead.
5. I used Oppressive Force, a very under-utilized Daily for CWs. It has a very long stun time. Used this when my Daily was up instead of Steal Time.
Took us a few times to get the timing down, but she went down quick once we learned the rhythm.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
Other then that, dps the boss and youll do fine.
Join Essence of Aggression: PVP-ing Hard Since Beta!
Those red circles are the telegraph for when she corpse explodes them because they're low, absolutely nothing to do with her heal. It's funny seeing all these myths about how she heals, she just simply drains them - you can see the lines going to the mobs.