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  • dianthejokerdianthejoker Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Yeah,actually this makes being a cleric a bit more interesting too.Tagging all the important mobs(skip the trash,which dies in 2 skills at the start of the fight),aiming at them,looking at the reset timer of ASeal etc.I am still a fan of Warding shield,but most of the times boss fights are "hit and run" and constant -shift-ing out of red zones.
    No one stays on one place to be hit from it and benefit at max.

    elahndra took BoH it for the LS procs mostly in my oppinion and just feated it , so its a bit more potent in the mitigation deparment.
    If some1 is willing to do some testing , may be Power of Oppresion will became better than Warding Shield in the long run.

    And btw its not that deep in the Righteous tree - Righteous Rage of Tempus + Divine Advantage and u are good to go :)
  • punisoufflepunisouffle Member Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Which feat is better -- Righteous Rage or Ethereal Boon?

    It seems to me a Sunburst can fill up ~75% of a Divinity bar ... or someone can do more? I might hit too few mobs then ...
    so Righteous Rage would give 7~8% of a bar, if the SB critted ... plus other encounter crits, and a little more from at-will crits.

    While if, say, you use 4 encounters in ~15 seconds, it's a solid 40% of a bar increase.
    (two Sunbursts, Astral Shield and anything else. Marginally more if you don't have AS and go with 10~12 secs cooldown stuffs)

    Of course many builds just use both, but we want Divine Advantage and not digging too deep in?
  • dianthejokerdianthejoker Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    With proper Crit stat Etheral Boon is way weaker in Divinity Gain than Righteous Rage.10% of a bar divine power when Encounter gets off CD?This is what 9 secs for SB?Do the math yourself if SB crits + the ASeal(spam) which i promote.

    Plus have in mind we use AShield in divinity only + Bastion(this is what this build needs).Use one bar to get 10% :\ Dunno but i get like 1 bar divinity from 5-7 crits ASeal in like what...8-10 secs?
  • scozzersscozzers Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 180 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Well what is better then 11% dmg reduction...

    Oh,yes - 16% dmg reduction :)

    grifterec wrote: »
    Wait i am confused why 5 extra % is a problem...

    I didn't say 5% extra was a problem. I said the problem with the feat. And that's per mob tagged not 5% onto the 11% from foresight. Oppression is a nice skill for PVP but in a PVE build it's not worth trying to fit it in.
    Yeah,actually this makes being a cleric a bit more interesting too.Tagging all the important mobs(skip the trash,which dies in 2 skills at the start of the fight),aiming at them,looking at the reset timer of ASeal etc.I am still a fan of Warding shield,but most of the times boss fights are "hit and run" and constant -shift-ing out of red zones.
    No one stays on one place to be hit from it and benefit at max.

    elahndra took BoH it for the LS procs mostly in my oppinion and just feated it , so its a bit more potent in the mitigation deparment.
    If some1 is willing to do some testing , may be Power of Oppresion will became better than Warding Shield in the long run.

    And btw its not that deep in the Righteous tree - Righteous Rage of Tempus + Divine Advantage and u are good to go :)

    Yes, and you lose Linked Spirit or Foresight or Moontouched. It's hard enough tagging as many mobs as you can sometimes anyway. Sometimes people have 10 adds on them. Tag all those quick enough to reduce all their damage by 5%. Personally I'm still not a fan of BoH and Warding Shield wouldn't change that. Linked Spirit either for that matter. Linked Spirit is great, it's just I'd rather just use sunburst to proc that and keep nice things from the middle tree and stick with Forgemasters or Healing Word or Divine Glow or .. etc etc.
  • dianthejokerdianthejoker Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Actually this is how i roll

    http://nwcalc.com/dc?b=ohp:4wq2b:b5ks,13l3314:66000:6zz0u:b0000&h=1

    I absolutely agree with you about Moontouched,Foresight or Linked.I was just commenting and observing the OP`s build.

    AShield,FF and SB as encounters + DA and HG daily - permanent at this state of the game.Linked and Moontouched too.Can some1 test what Moontouched procs?Does it proc LS or any other buffs?

    Btw saw on your post that ASeal procs LS(when u tab into divinty when tagged mob is hitted i guess)...and im just WOW o.0
  • scozzersscozzers Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 180 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Actually this is how i roll

    http://nwcalc.com/dc?b=ohp:4wq2b:b5ks,13l3314:66000:6zz0u:b0000&h=1

    I absolutely agree with you about Moontouched,Foresight or Linked.I was just commenting and observing the OP`s build.

    AShield,FF and SB as encounters + DA and HG daily - permanent at this state of the game.Linked and Moontouched too.Can some1 test what Moontouched procs?Does it proc LS or any other buffs?

    Btw saw on your post that ASeal procs LS(when u tab into divinty when tagged mob is hitted i guess)...and im just WOW o.0

    You aren't using any encounters that proc Divine Advantage. Unless you swap in Healing Word a lot or use Soothing light a lot, I'd put those points elsewhere. Moontouched is a percentage of max HP, not technically a heal really. I haven't seen it proc anything. Not even sure I've seen it crit. I'll check that though in a bit, since I might have missed something.
    Yes, Astral Seal actually has to produce a heal on an ally for Linked Spirit to proc when using the D Mode switch.
  • punisoufflepunisouffle Member Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    With proper Crit stat Etheral Boon is way weaker in Divinity Gain than Righteous Rage.10% of a bar divine power when Encounter gets off CD?This is what 9 secs for SB?Do the math yourself if SB crits + the ASeal(spam) which i promote.

    Plus have in mind we use AShield in divinity only + Bastion(this is what this build needs).Use one bar to get 10% :\ Dunno but i get like 1 bar divinity from 5-7 crits ASeal in like what...8-10 secs?

    With your 1 bar from 8~10 secs ASeal spam, wouldn't that mean you get ~9% "extra" from a normal ~91%
    (Yes it might have been one bar and a bit more, but the extra would still be around 10~11%)
    ASeal animation looks like it takes 1 sec per swing? how do you get crit so high to reliably have 5~7 crit hits out of 10, I'm curious.
    \(o x o )?/

    Since Ashield is a power that doesn't crit, you cast it in divine mode (use up 1 bar) and spam for 8~10 secs (to get 10% back...)
    That plus let's say another 10% from a critted SB, say our crit chance is 50% and count it as 5% extra. Plus another critted encounter, though using them takes a little time away from ASeal spamming... maybe 2~3 swings, perhaps. And Bastion has longer cooldown, so a crit from it would be... ~2.5% in 10 secs?
    Ungrounded guesswork here, I don't have Bastion nor Divine Fortune, if that's what give Divinity from pure healing.
    That'd be ~17.5% extra unless you're born under lucky star and crit more often than this unlucky me ~~/(_^_")\

    While for Ethereal Boon in 20 secs you'd get off one AShield, one Bastion, and two SB.
    My SB is at 8 secs hence I bended them to 15 secs in earlier post, but 20 is good too since there's room for dashing in before bursting stuffs up.
    Roughly that'd be ~20% extra in 10 secs, the minus side is you're not getting them al at the same time, and you're not getting them now. Though you eliminate the need to stand rooted and spam ASeal, so in rare occasion you can kite with it...

    If there's something maddeningly wrong with how I see things, please educate me! m(=A= m)"
    But that's with just ASeal. I wonder how Righteous Rage would give out more extra Divinity, if used with at-wills that already make fast Divinity themselves -- Sacred Flame or Brand of the Sun.
  • freehugs9freehugs9 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 201 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Elahndra I have a question about your build. Given that you're sharing your stats with other players, what stats are you taking? Have you been spreading your stats into things you might not otherwise have considered, like Deflection/Regeneration/Life Steal?
    How much of each stat do you really end up sharing?
  • snake0ilsnake0il Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Yeah,actually this makes being a cleric a bit more interesting too.Tagging all the important mobs(skip the trash,which dies in 2 skills at the start of the fight),aiming at them,looking at the reset timer of ASeal etc.I am still a fan of Warding shield,but most of the times boss fights are "hit and run" and constant -shift-ing out of red zones.
    No one stays on one place to be hit from it and benefit at max.

    elahndra took BoH it for the LS procs mostly in my oppinion and just feated it , so its a bit more potent in the mitigation deparment.
    If some1 is willing to do some testing , may be Power of Oppresion will became better than Warding Shield in the long run.

    And btw its not that deep in the Righteous tree - Righteous Rage of Tempus + Divine Advantage and u are good to go :)

    LOL no. Someone trying to use Power of Oppression to mitigate damage from 20 odd mobs (which all hit like trucks) in CN is going to get pasted in a hurry.

    The challenge now as a cleric is to provide a combination of damage reduction and healing that will keep your group alive for the ~5 seconds or so in between AS casts. The CW isn't always going to have that singularity ready to bail you out and right now the best way to fill that gap is a SB to proc LS along with BoH for another LS proc +10% dr along with +11% dr from foresight, and if need be another +15% dr from DA. And hopefully you had the chance to throw out a few casts of SF before all of that for the temp hit points so that your group benefits from Deepstone.

    With everything going on in your typical CN pull getting a seal on more than a couple of mobs is a luxury, and purposefully going out of your way to put a seal on everything to reduce their damage by 5% is good way to get your group killed.
  • elahndraelahndra Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    snake0il wrote: »

    With everything going on in your typical CN pull getting a seal on more than a couple of mobs is a luxury, and purposefully going out of your way to put a seal on everything to reduce their damage by 5% is good way to get your group killed.

    This is my only issue with power of oppression. Instead of healing you have to spam cast astral seal on as many targets as you can. While in theory the 5% reduction seems nice on many enemies; in practice it can be quite risky. Now if it applied an aura effect in a small radius it may be worth it to invest(say 5 feet or "the closest n number"). I can't see myself not healing to debuff something that may or may not kill your teammate while you're trying to debuff. Let the skill work off sunburst and call it blinding light or something so you can potentially hit more than one. For a cleric free time is a luxury and I already feel kinda lucky squeezing 2 or 3 in as is.
  • elahndraelahndra Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    freehugs9 wrote: »
    Elahndra I have a question about your build. Given that you're sharing your stats with other players, what stats are you taking? Have you been spreading your stats into things you might not otherwise have considered, like Deflection/Regeneration/Life Steal?
    How much of each stat do you really end up sharing?

    100% this man. I have stats rolling out my eyeballs. Investing into some non-traditional cleric stats at this point may prove to be far more beneficial then sticking with something that is being reduced highly by a cap. I have wanted to get stats in other areas I just have not had time to swap things around atm. Busy past few days. I would absolutely see this being the new norm with the build tho; as with 100% uptime on LS and targets generally being plentiful adding substantial gains in all areas. It's a 5% bonus for "each target you heal" however, it also stacks a 5% extra on there for each target you damage; making it a powerhouse when used with SB.
  • xiphenonxiphenon Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    This will be nerfed soom(tm) ...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • elahndraelahndra Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    xiphenon wrote: »
    This will be nerfed soom(tm) ...

    yea that is obvious as stated 10 times in prior posts in this thread. However, the build will still remain viable once it is fixed so yea...
  • baqqarabaqqara Member Posts: 41
    edited June 2013
    So wait a second... i wanna know if im getting this right:

    SB and BoH can proc Linked Spirit, but only in DMode or in that weird "switch to D Mode while casting things"? Cant I just go into Divine and cast that BoH when it is needed? Also: that SB Knockback isnt that bad, singularity get's those mobs back anyway..

    Another thing: Divine Advantage?! Really? That one has pvp written all over it, why the should I take that over Etheral Boon? Actually i would much prefer this:

    http://nwcalc.com/dc?b=cn4:2hwcg:5m9s,1fl3315:66000:b5u00:6z500&h=1

    (note, that i used human racial, as i play a human)
  • elahndraelahndra Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    baqqara wrote: »
    So wait a second... i wanna know if im getting this right:

    SB and BoH can proc Linked Spirit, but only in DMode or in that weird "switch to D Mode while casting things"? Cant I just go into Divine and cast that BoH when it is needed? Also: that SB Knockback isnt that bad, singularity get's those mobs back anyway..

    Another thing: Divine Advantage?! Really? That one has pvp written all over it, why the should I take that over Etheral Boon? Actually i would much prefer this:

    http://nwcalc.com/dc?b=cn4:2hwcg:5m9s,1fl3315:66000:b5u00:6z500&h=1

    (note, that i used human racial, as i play a human)

    Ethereal boon is ok but I don't need it at all. You may and that is fine if you tweak whatever as I'm not playing your character. Dgain is fine without it in this build. Divine advantage because...not only pvpers get combat advantage. Sb procs LS when you swap it. It's not that the knockback is bad. You just need to be conscious of what your CW is up to. Bastion has to be cast from divine mode to make it worth slotting over anything else as stated earlier. When you do the divine swap it doesn't actually increase the spell-effect of whatever you're casting as it would if you actually cast the spell in divine mode. It only satisfies the requirement for LS to proc. Solo-healed draco earlier today just fine with this build. I'm pretty comfortable with it. Most of my other feat choices were explained earlier in this thread either by me or someone else.
  • baqqarabaqqara Member Posts: 41
    edited June 2013
    Well then. I gave it a try and i have to say, it seems to be a nice build. But it really doesnt shine in Divinty production. I miss Etheral Boon. Also if I think about the fact, that I dont use divinity pips on BoH and SB, because of that glitch. Divinty seems to be an even bigger problem with this build once it gets fixed, and it will.

    So... apart from being a nice build, I depends too much on obvious glichtes. I definetly will change my spec again, but im not sure to what yet. It is kind of fun though.


    Edit: testet in both pve and pvp.

    Edit 2: also... SB cast in divinty mode (without that trick) doesnt trigger LS. So in future we are looking at an uptime of 6sec out of 18sec. That's 33% not counting hectic fights with a widespread group. The shining crumbles...
  • imanrsholimanrshol Member Posts: 35
    edited June 2013
    kiralia wrote: »
    Am pretty sure the sb switch to div thing that is all the rage atm is a gimmick that will soon be fixed...if not I would love to hear something from 1 of the devs stating that is an intended function of linked spirit and sb.

    True. However, if that does happen, the easiest fix I can think of is putting one point into Invigorated Healing. Cast SB, BoH or AS and be sure to be channeling divinity 6 seconds later. This would also help with the Power of Oppression idea as the Invigorated Heal should make maintaining up-time on Foresight a non-issue.

    In fact, I'd be tempted to make that adjustment now as you'd effectively add 6 six seconds to buff up-time using the SB switch trick.

    I.e. SB (Divinity switch) procs buffs ... 6 sec ... Invigorated Heal (with Divinity on) procs buffs ...

    EDIT: While on the topic of how to get Linked Spirit to proc, be aware that a Divine FF doesn't proc it. However any heals off of an Astral Seal (generated from damage by you or someone else) does so a FF (Divine or otherwise) onto a Sealed target will achieve the desired effect.
  • neckdemonneckdemon Member Posts: 12 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    baqqara wrote: »
    Well then. I gave it a try and i have to say, it seems to be a nice build. But it really doesnt shine in Divinty production. I miss Etheral Boon. Also if I think about the fact, that I dont use divinity pips on BoH and SB, because of that glitch. Divinty seems to be an even bigger problem with this build once it gets fixed, and it will.

    So... apart from being a nice build, I depends too much on obvious glichtes. I definetly will change my spec again, but im not sure to what yet. It is kind of fun though.


    Edit: testet in both pve and pvp.

    Edit 2: also... SB cast in divinty mode (without that trick) doesnt trigger LS. So in future we are looking at an uptime of 6sec out of 18sec. That's 33% not counting hectic fights with a widespread group. The shining crumbles...

    casting SB in divinity sure does proc LS so i'm not sure what you are doing wrong. i run a similar build to this but i don't use BoH or DA. i take moontouched and ethereal boon.
  • snake0ilsnake0il Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    baqqara wrote: »
    Well then. I gave it a try and i have to say, it seems to be a nice build. But it really doesnt shine in Divinty production. I miss Etheral Boon. Also if I think about the fact, that I dont use divinity pips on BoH and SB, because of that glitch. Divinty seems to be an even bigger problem with this build once it gets fixed, and it will.

    So... apart from being a nice build, I depends too much on obvious glichtes. I definetly will change my spec again, but im not sure to what yet. It is kind of fun though.


    Edit: testet in both pve and pvp.

    Edit 2: also... SB cast in divinty mode (without that trick) doesnt trigger LS. So in future we are looking at an uptime of 6sec out of 18sec. That's 33% not counting hectic fights with a widespread group. The shining crumbles...

    I have absolutely no problem at all getting enough divinity to power astral shield and bastion (and if you're not casting bastion on divinity, you're doing it wrong). Also, a divine cast sb absolutely procs linked spirit.
  • baqqarabaqqara Member Posts: 41
    edited June 2013
    haha, no i switch to D while casting BoH.

    I have to say, I didnt give this build enough credit. I payed attention to my stats a little, while on a cushy pirate-run with a good group. My powerstat more than doubled with LS fully procced. Also, healing starts to feel waaaaay easy again. Even Damagespikes are easily heald up again.

    Still, the D-gain "problem" persists. Although it is not really a problem, it just feels not perfect.

    Little note on SB in Dmode: Shouldnt I get LS when i cast that spell in Dmode? Well... I tried that couple times in the city, and I DONT get that buff :/ when i do that switcheroo-thing, I get the buff. Not sure what I do wrong.

    In the end: still feels wrong. It is nice to be a Buffing/mitigation-bastion, but honestly... it begins to bore me :/
  • reonhato99reonhato99 Member Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    So I have been using a build similar to this, although I go all the way through faithful paragon feats with 3 in invigorated healing and 5 in moon touched and mark of mending and the 4th pip , I find you get more then enough divinity with just the 15% from bountiful fortune and I would rather the extra healing + power then the 6 seconds of 10% resist.

    Although I feel it is only a matter of time until they fix the linked spirit feat, I am going to keep using it because its the only thing that makes clerics something other then a healbot and at least gives me the feeling of helping in PvP, assuming I can live for more then 3 seconds.

    Anyway a fun picture that is in no way possible in a dungeon but meh, still looks cool. dZ5aaIS.jpg
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