No, this is not happend. PPls with gear will not do anymore dungeons, even with DD. All que for t2 dungeons will be from VERY WEAK players (if not buy real money), because they cant buy cat or stone, because they will have pvp gear or t1 gear. With this group, you even cant finished the dungeon, will be huge waste of time. Hehehe. Good luck in this ****y game
Because geared people will be fighting Gaunt battles and instances. See how it goes? Its the natural cycle of life in mmo. And I assume you'd still like to get enchantment shards instead of buying them off AH, so there, you have one hell of a good reason to go there. And they didn't say ALL the gear will be BoP, so stop crying that river out. And feel free to go to another game, do you think it will be any different then this? Well, you can hope, but the answer is no.
And you don't even know what new groups will do, for all we know, they probably won't exploit their butts off to save 30 seconds of run.
Oh and first NC clear was with people with minimal GS needed, not 11k+ioun stone group, so GS doesn't matter that much and people will wipe and learn, just like they did in the past in all other games.
0
thecainMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
I liked the idea of people being able to play the fighting game or the market game, rather than it just being a fighting game. When I got to end game, I bought some of my gear from the AH. I had built up a lot of AD just playing the game. I ended up with half a set of arena gear, and played for the rest of it. Now I can do content, though the content is still hard, and dumb, as hell. I hope this means that they're changing bosses from a DPS zergfest into interesting fights. I haven't played for over a week, only returning today to look at my character's skill sheet to see what needed changing. This is because bosses are frelling boring, and Pugs can't do T2 very well, if at all.
Meanwhile, I can farm all day without a hitch fighting bosses with various skills and attack patterns in Marvel Heroes Online. Decisions decisions...
Because geared people will be fighting Gaunt battles and instances. See how it goes? Its the natural cycle of life in mmo. And I assume you'd still like to get enchantment shards instead of buying them off AH, so there, you have one hell of a good reason to go there. And they didn't say ALL the gear will be BoP, so stop crying that river out. And feel free to go to another game, do you think it will be any different then this? Well, you can hope, but the answer is no.
And you don't even know what new groups will do, for all we know, they probably won't exploit their butts off to save 30 seconds of run.
Oh and first NC clear was with people with minimal GS needed, not 11k+ioun stone group, so GS doesn't matter that much and people will wipe and learn, just like they did in the past in all other games.
I can agree with everything, exept ONE. I open 60 nightmare boxes for 10 mins, no mount. In all mine time in the game i open 75, NOTHING. This is ...heheheheehe .I am old player on pc games and mmo games, more than 30 years, never see soo stupid game. Good luck with this misunderstanding, calling himslef mmorpg game . HAHAHAHAHAHA
The game won't die but it will definitely lose some of the good reasons to play it. It's definitely not an innovative MMO, the mechanics are very traditional although the combat ones are fun. But at least there's a healthy trade house, and it makes the F2P model easier to accept. If they make most drops, including set items, bind on pickup, it's just going to be yet another boring and grindy MMO. When i play a game, i like trading stuff. If i can't trade with other players to get what i want, it makes the game really less attractive.
PuGs are already terrible enough, full of awfully lowly geared and unskilled players. Queues can take up to 30 mins to pop. Don't make me quit doing dungeons.
I can agree with everything, exept ONE. I open 60 nightmare boxes for 10 mins, no mount. In all mine time in the game i open 75, NOTHING. This is ...heheheheehe .I am old player on pc games and mmo games, more than 30 years, never see soo stupid game. Good luck with this misunderstanding, calling himslef mmorpg game . HAHAHAHAHAHA
And what would your posts purpose exactly be, except complaining that you didn't won lottery money sink that no sane person does?
If they keep these good changes coming I might start playing again. Changing rolling to need before greed for class specifics and changing blues to BoP are two great changes. Right now, as a hardcore MMO player I can't really justify playing, but keep the good stuff coming and you might lure a bunch of us back.
Join responsible gamers and boycott the Xbox One Don't be a fool, Open Beta with working cash shop=Live Release
0
natural40Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 3Arc User
No, you will quite it fast. But since its F2P, 10 new players will come in your place. They will quit as well and new players will join.
Thats how F2P games work. You either enjoy it and play hardcore/invest money or quit for another.
Many of the Epic quality items in dungeons, seal vendors, and PvP stores have been updated to become Bind on Pickup instead of Bind on Equip. (Unbound items currently held by players will remain Bind on Equip.)
Predicted results:
-less people running dungeons because gear can't be sold on AH.
-increased queue times as a result.
-astral diamonds becoming worthless as you can no longer save up to buy the gear you want.
-current gear on AH will skyrocket in value as they will remain BoE.
-new level 60s will get destroyed in PvP against fully geared opponents.
-Game dies a horrible agonising death?
you might have forgotten the:
once you have a set you have nothing left to do... only end game content is the content to get the end game sets, no "open world sandbox"
nothing but foundries to do, and with those being so restricted, and no way to know if you can even make enough to pay for pots used while doing them...
there is NOTHING to sell on AH except Z-store items, and no content to keep players active unless it produces something they can sell in AH.
__________
I blame the economy, if the economy in NW was made WITH THE GAME, instead of pieced togeather, a few months before open beta, the prices, and drop rates, and bind or not binds would have been tested correctly.
AFter the changes, when I run a dungeon and don't get the item I want, I will get some HAMSTER BoP item to throw at teh vendor.
Before this change, when I run a dungeon and don't get the item I want, I usualliy get something worth at least 8k from the delve chest. After doing this enough times, if I still don't get the item I want, I can buy it instead of grinding my life away.
Poor move imo.
0
bastadMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 20Arc User
To me as a casual player, this is no big deal. I have a few toons, none above 30. I care about playing Foundries, PVE, working up my toons, enjoying the game. Grinding for end-game gear, in any form, is just boring for me - why would I do that?
At 60, I'll run a few instances to experience them, start some alts to play, wait for them to raise the level cap, and so forth (or play another game and just work professions through the Gateway for a while). What is all this great gear for, anyway, if you don't PVP? It's just a way of "perfecting" at the end. I'm mostly interested in the fun part, which never involves grinding. The players that are complaining bitterly about how they'll earn their eighth million AD or whatever - they'll all be gone in another month or two, anyway.
This will help the economy, though. Over time, it will take the end-game gear out of it, and make it something you get for your character in dungeons, though coins, or the like. The value of AD is going to go up as less is in the system, and the economy, due to the steps they're taking, will slow down.
They aren't shoving anyone towards Zen, just shaping it to be the F2P model that they intended: one based on paying for convenience right away, or waiting... yes (*gasp*) even weeks or a month or two!
I don't normally post but to the guy about never winter taking no space? What where you on when you typed this? And my question has nothing to do with it taking any space. But I am not sure you backed up your argument enough by just saying "When I look at where my files are it looks like i do not even have it installed?"
Clearly you see the files so it looks like it is installed??
I am not trying to flame but really people??? Just take a step back before blurting randomness lol
there is NOTHING to sell on AH except Z-store items
Enchants, which you can get from dungeons, some of the crafted items, BoE drops, crafting materials, etc.
I have mixed feelings about the BoE/BoP issue, and I see advantages and disadvantages for either approach (all of which have been mentioned in this thread). I sort of like the economical meta game in MMOs (and gearing up my alts, which I am willing to spend AD/money on), but I also understand the attraction of BoP gear in terms of "meaning" and achievement.
Perhaps it could be mixed up? Half the set items could be BoP, half BoE? Weapons always BoP, probably.
Many of the Epic quality items in dungeons, seal vendors, and PvP stores have been updated to become Bind on Pickup instead of Bind on Equip. (Unbound items currently held by players will remain Bind on Equip.)
Predicted results:
-less people running dungeons because gear can't be sold on AH.
-increased queue times as a result.
-astral diamonds becoming worthless as you can no longer save up to buy the gear you want.
-current gear on AH will skyrocket in value as they will remain BoE.
-new level 60s will get destroyed in PvP against fully geared opponents.
-Game dies a horrible agonising death?
Pretty much this, as the only reason most of the people I know in guild run content after they have their own sets and gear is to sell what drops for AD. This will definitely see many more people finish their gear and then lose interest. Why does it seem like Cryptic is destined with this game to make all the wrong choices. If there is a good choice and a game breaking, please do not do this choice, then they will implement the latter for sure. What has happened to that studio?? These can't be the same guys who made CoH.
-less people running dungeons because gear can't be sold on AH.
Depends what exactly is BoP and what is not. Castle Never is a given (No worries though, there are tons of those items floating around and will be for quite some time), but T2 armor is what makes the most money overall in ease of moving the item. They lock down those drops and then I could see a lot less people running the dungeons, but not enough that it would kill the system or anything. With how easy they have now made tanking and healing, I expect to see a much larger number of those classes rolled as people look for dungeon shortcuts through the queue system, so I'd bet it will more than balance it out.
-astral diamonds becoming worthless as you can no longer save up to buy the gear you want.
Enchants, keys, dyes, and all those side items will probably still sell well. The value of astral will probably go down, but I wouldn't say worthless. As long as they keep releasing Zen store items people want, Astral will still have a use.
-current gear on AH will skyrocket in value as they will remain BoE.
Agreed, but not horribly uncommon. Most MMO's reach a point where a lot of the profitable gear are items people want to twink their alts with.
-new level 60s will get destroyed in PvP against fully geared opponents.
PvP is a horrible mess right now anyways without a shred of balance. I don't think they will notice much of a difference.
-Game dies a horrible agonising death?
True test for that will be when an actual fresh MMO launches and not some re-tread going F2P, or a niche game landing.
TL;DR
Everyone who can think of why this could be bad should just learn2play.
Stupidest statement of the year, or just really stupid statement? I've cleared every scrap of content in many a game, and I'm not unique in this. Thousands of people learned how to play a decade ago, true noobs are rare as hens teeth(jerks....yeah, there's still plenty of those). Anyone who thinks everyone who might want to simply buy optimal gear and experience content hasn't learned to play a goodly long time ago is an idiot.
A are a couple of good reasons. The game started with BoE. The economy is structured around it, many(most?) dungeon participation is structured around it, and astral diamond income is structured around it. Without gear to buy, there is much less need for AD. This means there isn't much need for dailies, or crafting.
The only thing left worth buying on the AH would be enchants, but with no reason to chase the AD, the ability to purchase them will be limited. There will be little AD for the zen exchange to handle, with less interest in AD.
People that have geared through dungeons and already seen them ad-nauseum will now be stagnant, quitting until the next content patch since they've nothing to do. People with no interest in dungeons will just plain quit. PvP won't save this, because it is imbalanced, broken, and the gear is junk--at current you can do better than the PvP set with about 20k AD, less than a days worth of dailies and significantly less than you've acquired by leveling.
If the game was made around the premise of BoP dungeon gear, sure, it'd be a good way to keep dungeon runners unique. It wasn't, and it's not. What it will do instead is gut virtually everything except dungeons, and they'll take a big hit as well.
-less people running dungeons because gear can't be sold on AH.
Depends what exactly is BoP and what is not. Castle Never is a given (No worries though, there are tons of those items floating around and will be for quite some time), but T2 armor is what makes the most money overall in ease of moving the item. They lock down those drops and then I could see a lot less people running the dungeons, but not enough that it would kill the system or anything. With how easy they have now made tanking and healing, I expect to see a much larger number of those classes rolled as people look for dungeon shortcuts through the queue system, so I'd bet it will more than balance it out.
-astral diamonds becoming worthless as you can no longer save up to buy the gear you want.
Enchants, keys, dyes, and all those side items will probably still sell well. The value of astral will probably go down, but I wouldn't say worthless. As long as they keep releasing Zen store items people want, Astral will still have a use.
-current gear on AH will skyrocket in value as they will remain BoE.
Agreed, but not horribly uncommon. Most MMO's reach a point where a lot of the profitable gear are items people want to twink their alts with.
Everything including PVP gear is intended to be BoP. Only exceptions is one "set" for each class, as an example murderous jester set for TR, which does not have a set bonus. Even seal items will be BoP with proposed changes. Profession gear that comes from upgrading Bind-on-Pickup boss drops will be BoP.
Everything including PVP gear is intended to be BoP. Only exceptions is one "set" for each class, as an example murderous jester set for TR, which does not have a set bonus. Even seal items will be BoP with proposed changes. Profession gear that comes from upgrading Bind-on-Pickup boss drops will be BoP.
Ooo, I didn't realize it was going to be basically every heroic drop. Well, time to stockpile then while everyone is burning their astral and zen on this sale.
The urge to buy up the AH is large, but they might still not do this in which case i'll have wasted tons of dosh.
Dang.
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behemondMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited June 2013
As a player who spend like 3 hours a day on this game and who want to pvp more than doing dungeons it's far from a good idea. Forcing people to farm dungeons to get their top gears on every character it's not a solution of what happened in the game from the open beta release till now. Doing 10 runs and not getting something valuable will make people abandon of doing dungeons or even leave the game because they cant get the gear to compete in pvp. Isn't enough cause now it's so hard to finish those dungeons with good gear on you, they make the players job even harder. What chances have those players without t1-t2 and not being able to get that sets even if they try.
With this move zen will go up to 500ad/1zen, who has zen don't need more AD because diamonds are going to be almost useless, and those who have AD will not be able to buy zen.
With this move zen will go up to 500ad/1zen, who has zen don't need more AD because diamonds are going to be almost useless, and those who have AD will not be able to buy zen.
Your most likely wrong about this for the short term. Reason being, people are going to stockpile BoE items, and they are going to sell for tons of AD after everything goes BoP. Thus, the value of AD will actually increase until the stockpile is depleted, which might take a while since some people will probably wait till 1 t2 item is selling for 5 million ad, etc.
After all the currrent BoE t2 and CN items are depleted, AD will be worthless, and yes it will be pushed to close to 500 ad/zen ratio unless other changes are made.
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czarkazmMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
HAMSTER change is HAMSTER. Wtf. Really. Who asked for that HAMSTER?!?!
Lots of people were asking for it a few days ago because they were crying about how people were need rolling on everything. Is this your first time on the forums?
Your most likely wrong about this for the short term. Reason being, people are going to stockpile BoE items, and they are going to sell for tons of AD after everything goes BoP. Thus, the value of AD will actually increase until the stockpile is depleted, which might take a while since some people will probably wait till 1 t2 item is selling for 5 million ad, etc.
After all the currrent BoE t2 and CN items are depleted, AD will be worthless, and yes it will be pushed to close to 500 ad/zen ratio unless other changes are made.
Smart players who expect this change to go live will get as much AD as they can and buy Zen as cheap as they can to sit on for the inevitable release of amazing companions/mounts on the zen store.
Use the <removed exploit lead-in> to interact with the auction vendor.
Yea in a dungeon I do agree everything should be BoP. I mean dungeons are for finding gear for you to USE not SELL. If you want to buy enchants or make AD farm. Don't farm dungeons to list stuff on the AH. This only makes sense. Content is only for gearing out your toon. Not to get rich selling stuff you don't need on the AH.
Yea in a dungeon I do agree everything should be BoP. I mean dungeons are for finding gear for you to USE not SELL. If you want to buy enchants or make AD farm. Don't farm dungeons to list stuff on the AH. This only makes sense. Content is only for gearing out your toon. Not to get rich selling stuff you don't need on the AH.
Look at you imposing your definition of dungeon on everyone else. Cute.
I'd tell you that dungeons are for broadly defined profit but then it would just make me a hypocrite.
Use the <removed exploit lead-in> to interact with the auction vendor.
This, combined with class only need is going to INCREASE the amount of time I play dungeons, because I don't have to compete with 5 people who are needing on my classes loot to sell it rather than allowing me to upgrade my gear set. Where before Id be farming AD to buy the gear, now I will be running the dungeon to obtain it.
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mallonslefrMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited June 2013
Doing that will just give more impact to the profession, bots, prayers, currently useless dailies, and AD sellers.
This, combined with class only need is going to INCREASE the amount of time I play dungeons, because I don't have to compete with 5 people who are needing on my classes loot to sell it rather than allowing me to upgrade my gear set. Where before Id be farming AD to buy the gear, now I will be running the dungeon to obtain it.
Point me to the dungeon that drops wards, mounts, and decent companions.
Use the <removed exploit lead-in> to interact with the auction vendor.
Comments
Because geared people will be fighting Gaunt battles and instances. See how it goes? Its the natural cycle of life in mmo. And I assume you'd still like to get enchantment shards instead of buying them off AH, so there, you have one hell of a good reason to go there. And they didn't say ALL the gear will be BoP, so stop crying that river out. And feel free to go to another game, do you think it will be any different then this? Well, you can hope, but the answer is no.
And you don't even know what new groups will do, for all we know, they probably won't exploit their butts off to save 30 seconds of run.
Oh and first NC clear was with people with minimal GS needed, not 11k+ioun stone group, so GS doesn't matter that much and people will wipe and learn, just like they did in the past in all other games.
Meanwhile, I can farm all day without a hitch fighting bosses with various skills and attack patterns in Marvel Heroes Online. Decisions decisions...
I can agree with everything, exept ONE. I open 60 nightmare boxes for 10 mins, no mount. In all mine time in the game i open 75, NOTHING. This is ...heheheheehe .I am old player on pc games and mmo games, more than 30 years, never see soo stupid game. Good luck with this misunderstanding, calling himslef mmorpg game
PuGs are already terrible enough, full of awfully lowly geared and unskilled players. Queues can take up to 30 mins to pop. Don't make me quit doing dungeons.
And what would your posts purpose exactly be, except complaining that you didn't won lottery money sink that no sane person does?
Don't be a fool, Open Beta with working cash shop=Live Release
Thats how F2P games work. You either enjoy it and play hardcore/invest money or quit for another.
you might have forgotten the:
once you have a set you have nothing left to do... only end game content is the content to get the end game sets, no "open world sandbox"
nothing but foundries to do, and with those being so restricted, and no way to know if you can even make enough to pay for pots used while doing them...
there is NOTHING to sell on AH except Z-store items, and no content to keep players active unless it produces something they can sell in AH.
__________
I blame the economy, if the economy in NW was made WITH THE GAME, instead of pieced togeather, a few months before open beta, the prices, and drop rates, and bind or not binds would have been tested correctly.
AFter the changes, when I run a dungeon and don't get the item I want, I will get some HAMSTER BoP item to throw at teh vendor.
Before this change, when I run a dungeon and don't get the item I want, I usualliy get something worth at least 8k from the delve chest. After doing this enough times, if I still don't get the item I want, I can buy it instead of grinding my life away.
Poor move imo.
At 60, I'll run a few instances to experience them, start some alts to play, wait for them to raise the level cap, and so forth (or play another game and just work professions through the Gateway for a while). What is all this great gear for, anyway, if you don't PVP? It's just a way of "perfecting" at the end. I'm mostly interested in the fun part, which never involves grinding. The players that are complaining bitterly about how they'll earn their eighth million AD or whatever - they'll all be gone in another month or two, anyway.
This will help the economy, though. Over time, it will take the end-game gear out of it, and make it something you get for your character in dungeons, though coins, or the like. The value of AD is going to go up as less is in the system, and the economy, due to the steps they're taking, will slow down.
They aren't shoving anyone towards Zen, just shaping it to be the F2P model that they intended: one based on paying for convenience right away, or waiting... yes (*gasp*) even weeks or a month or two!
Sarcasm is hard.
Enchants, which you can get from dungeons, some of the crafted items, BoE drops, crafting materials, etc.
I have mixed feelings about the BoE/BoP issue, and I see advantages and disadvantages for either approach (all of which have been mentioned in this thread). I sort of like the economical meta game in MMOs (and gearing up my alts, which I am willing to spend AD/money on), but I also understand the attraction of BoP gear in terms of "meaning" and achievement.
Perhaps it could be mixed up? Half the set items could be BoP, half BoE? Weapons always BoP, probably.
Pretty much this, as the only reason most of the people I know in guild run content after they have their own sets and gear is to sell what drops for AD. This will definitely see many more people finish their gear and then lose interest. Why does it seem like Cryptic is destined with this game to make all the wrong choices. If there is a good choice and a game breaking, please do not do this choice, then they will implement the latter for sure. What has happened to that studio?? These can't be the same guys who made CoH.
Depends what exactly is BoP and what is not. Castle Never is a given (No worries though, there are tons of those items floating around and will be for quite some time), but T2 armor is what makes the most money overall in ease of moving the item. They lock down those drops and then I could see a lot less people running the dungeons, but not enough that it would kill the system or anything. With how easy they have now made tanking and healing, I expect to see a much larger number of those classes rolled as people look for dungeon shortcuts through the queue system, so I'd bet it will more than balance it out.
-astral diamonds becoming worthless as you can no longer save up to buy the gear you want.
Enchants, keys, dyes, and all those side items will probably still sell well. The value of astral will probably go down, but I wouldn't say worthless. As long as they keep releasing Zen store items people want, Astral will still have a use.
-current gear on AH will skyrocket in value as they will remain BoE.
Agreed, but not horribly uncommon. Most MMO's reach a point where a lot of the profitable gear are items people want to twink their alts with.
-new level 60s will get destroyed in PvP against fully geared opponents.
PvP is a horrible mess right now anyways without a shred of balance. I don't think they will notice much of a difference.
-Game dies a horrible agonising death?
True test for that will be when an actual fresh MMO launches and not some re-tread going F2P, or a niche game landing.
Stupidest statement of the year, or just really stupid statement? I've cleared every scrap of content in many a game, and I'm not unique in this. Thousands of people learned how to play a decade ago, true noobs are rare as hens teeth(jerks....yeah, there's still plenty of those). Anyone who thinks everyone who might want to simply buy optimal gear and experience content hasn't learned to play a goodly long time ago is an idiot.
A are a couple of good reasons. The game started with BoE. The economy is structured around it, many(most?) dungeon participation is structured around it, and astral diamond income is structured around it. Without gear to buy, there is much less need for AD. This means there isn't much need for dailies, or crafting.
The only thing left worth buying on the AH would be enchants, but with no reason to chase the AD, the ability to purchase them will be limited. There will be little AD for the zen exchange to handle, with less interest in AD.
People that have geared through dungeons and already seen them ad-nauseum will now be stagnant, quitting until the next content patch since they've nothing to do. People with no interest in dungeons will just plain quit. PvP won't save this, because it is imbalanced, broken, and the gear is junk--at current you can do better than the PvP set with about 20k AD, less than a days worth of dailies and significantly less than you've acquired by leveling.
If the game was made around the premise of BoP dungeon gear, sure, it'd be a good way to keep dungeon runners unique. It wasn't, and it's not. What it will do instead is gut virtually everything except dungeons, and they'll take a big hit as well.
Everything including PVP gear is intended to be BoP. Only exceptions is one "set" for each class, as an example murderous jester set for TR, which does not have a set bonus. Even seal items will be BoP with proposed changes. Profession gear that comes from upgrading Bind-on-Pickup boss drops will be BoP.
Level 1-59 purples will still be BoE apparently.
http://nw-forum.perfectworld.com/showthread.php?350242-End-Game-Loot-System-Changes-Ready-for-Testing-Soon!
Ooo, I didn't realize it was going to be basically every heroic drop. Well, time to stockpile then while everyone is burning their astral and zen on this sale.
Dang.
With this move zen will go up to 500ad/1zen, who has zen don't need more AD because diamonds are going to be almost useless, and those who have AD will not be able to buy zen.
Your most likely wrong about this for the short term. Reason being, people are going to stockpile BoE items, and they are going to sell for tons of AD after everything goes BoP. Thus, the value of AD will actually increase until the stockpile is depleted, which might take a while since some people will probably wait till 1 t2 item is selling for 5 million ad, etc.
After all the currrent BoE t2 and CN items are depleted, AD will be worthless, and yes it will be pushed to close to 500 ad/zen ratio unless other changes are made.
Lots of people were asking for it a few days ago because they were crying about how people were need rolling on everything. Is this your first time on the forums?
Smart players who expect this change to go live will get as much AD as they can and buy Zen as cheap as they can to sit on for the inevitable release of amazing companions/mounts on the zen store.
Look at you imposing your definition of dungeon on everyone else. Cute.
I'd tell you that dungeons are for broadly defined profit but then it would just make me a hypocrite.
"The harder the game, the better."
Point me to the dungeon that drops wards, mounts, and decent companions.