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Forums > Home› Class Forums› The Militia Barracks

GF Cleave and Tide of Iron damage nerfed in patch NW.3.20130529d.6

blitz686blitz686 Member Posts: 5 Arc User
edited June 2013 in The Militia Barracks
My cleave and Tide of Iron damage is down by nearly 300 pts (in tooltip and as displayed in floating combat text) as a result of the latest patch, anyone else noticing this?

This was not mentioned in the patch notes, I'm wondering why this is happening. It may be an inadvertent result of some of the changes...
Post edited by blitz686 on

Comments

  • terrorshardterrorshard Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    That would suck...:(
  • kidbskidbs Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 294
    edited June 2013
    Do you have a plaguefire enchant equipped? If so that's why. That enchant got nerfed.
  • sfxer001sfxer001 Member Posts: 118 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Did you respec and remember to re-apply all your attribute points?
  • blitz686blitz686 Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    No respecs, no item changes, nothing. Tooltip used to read about 1200 max now reads less than 1000 max... More than a 15% loss in dmg to my cleave. Plaguefire enchant nerf cannot possible come close to causing that much dmg loss on cleave, I'm still at a loss as to why its down so much in damage.
  • cairbrepateuscairbrepateus Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 36
    edited June 2013
    Yeah I noticed the cleave when fighting some trash mobs and was hitting for around 300 less. Lol woot
  • sfxer001sfxer001 Member Posts: 118 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    The patch notes did say that Wrathful Warrior feat was reduced to match the listed tooltip damage. Perhaps it was overperforming before and this is the resultant decrease.
  • charmand0rcharmand0r Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    yep can confirm that the tool tip def has alot less dmg, maybe they broke the feats, hope they fix this fast
  • granville7482granville7482 Member Posts: 191 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Plaguefire is nerfed and after some testing Wrathful Warrior seemed to be giving some pretty high increases Pre-nerf, so the combination of the two may be it.
  • blitz686blitz686 Member Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    granville7482 wrote: »
    Plaguefire is nerfed and after some testing Wrathful Warrior seemed to be giving some pretty high increases Pre-nerf, so the combination of the two may be it.

    Wrathful Warrior only increases damage when the GF has temp. HP; the damage reduction to cleave and tide of iron is a different matter entirely. We do less damage during temp. HP as a result of the change to Wrathful Warrior, but that does not account for the almost 20% drop in cleave damage at all times. And as I said before the plaguefire nerf was not a significant enough of a nerf to account for that drastic of a change to our damage either.
  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Cleave dmg lower by quite a bit.
    Still not figured out if it's a feat not working right or just a straight up nerf to cleave.
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  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Delete this please.
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    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
  • sfxer001sfxer001 Member Posts: 118 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Oh, okay. Editting out my previous reply.
  • sfxer001sfxer001 Member Posts: 118 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    It's more likely to be one of the Feats that gives +10% to At Will's or something of that nature, assuming encounters are not suffering some loss and only the at-will's are.

    Cruel Cut Style (Conqueror Feat) gives +15% damage to Cleave, but not to Tide of Iron...

    Powerful Attack (Heroic Feat) gives +10% to At Will's, but also +10% to Encounters, too...
  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    Just a question.
    Were all the guardians that feel the dmg nerf to cleave using Plague Fire Enchant?
    Or is anyone noticing the lower cleave dmg even without Plague Fire.

    Just to see if this is the issue or not.
    Snow's Melee Arena: NW-DMT7STJ9E
    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
  • freehugs9freehugs9 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 201 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Try taking off all your gear and passives and post the damage of Cleave and how much power, Strength and feats (powerful attack and cruel cut style) you have.
    Ferret09 posted that data pre-patch so it will at least give us a starting point.
    See Neverwinter math and mechanics HERE
  • etherealjetherealj Member Posts: 1,091 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    snowballo wrote: »
    Just a question.
    Were all the guardians that feel the dmg nerf to cleave using Plague Fire Enchant?
    Or is anyone noticing the lower cleave dmg even without Plague Fire.

    Just to see if this is the issue or not.

    It sounds like people are looking at the tooltip and seeing a difference.
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  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    freehugs9 wrote: »
    Try taking off all your gear and passives and post the damage of Cleave and how much power, Strength and feats (powerful attack and cruel cut style) you have.
    Ferret09 posted that data pre-patch so it will at least give us a starting point.

    Fully naked character.
    With: Cruel Cut and Powerful Attack feats.
    100-100 cleave 22str
    101-101 cleave 23str
    Snow's Melee Arena: NW-DMT7STJ9E
    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
  • mhblis1mhblis1 Member Posts: 167 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    Just tested my Cleave after I first logged on after patch. After 30 attacks on the dummy my DPS is right where I was before the patch. I did not have any enchants on my weapons for the record.

    I haven't respeced yet so that may cause the issue later down the track
  • cihuacoatlcihuacoatl Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    snowballo wrote: »
    Fully naked character.
    With: Cruel Cut and Powerful Attack feats.
    100-100 cleave 22str
    101-101 cleave 23str

    That is correct....
    +1 Str is 1% damage increase
    1% of 100 is 1 damage

    FYI I noticed no change in damage to cleave.
  • freehugs9freehugs9 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 201 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    snowballo wrote: »
    Fully naked character.
    With: Cruel Cut and Powerful Attack feats.
    100-100 cleave 22str
    101-101 cleave 23str

    Well the base damage is still the same. Now stack on some power (no weapon) and give me the power amount and the tooltip damage.
    You should get about 0.035 damage per point of Power.
    See Neverwinter math and mechanics HERE
  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    freehugs9 wrote: »
    Well the base damage is still the same. Now stack on some power (no weapon) and give me the power amount and the tooltip damage.

    22 Str. No weapon. Base 100-100

    250 power 108-108
    500 power 117-117
    800 power 128-128
    954 power 133-133
    1108 power 139-139
    1594 power 156-156
    2152 power 175-175
    2710 power 195-195
    3268 power 215-215
    4135 power 245-245
    5408 power 290-290
    Snow's Melee Arena: NW-DMT7STJ9E
    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
  • freehugs9freehugs9 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 201 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    So the scaling from power is also the same. Ferret09 didn't provide me with the weapon scaling so we can't compare that. You could put your passives back and see how they affect the damage (I assume you use the +15% damage one from Conq) but aside from that I'm out of ideas. :)
    See Neverwinter math and mechanics HERE
  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    freehugs9 wrote: »
    So the scaling from power is also the same. Ferret09 didn't provide me with the weapon scaling so we can't compare that. You could put your passives back and see how they affect the damage (I assume you use the +15% damage one from Conq) but aside from that I'm out of ideas. :)

    Already tried that, it's the 1st thing that came up in me after hitting dummies and not seeing the debuff.
    But the actual dmg increase from the passive was still there despite the icon missing.

    It really might have been the hard nerf to Plague Fire.
    As I really don't remember my tooltip dmg, just the amount of dmg I used to do to the dummies, which was quite a bit higher.

    Or if Wrathful Warrior used to grant its buff without the bonus hp before, it could explain some of it too.
    Snow's Melee Arena: NW-DMT7STJ9E
    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
  • mhblis1mhblis1 Member Posts: 167 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    See I have the same feats as you and see no difference having now tested it a second time. I don;t have Plague Fire and from taling in guild many of the TR's are saying they get about the same drop in DPS as you did.

    That enchant got the a kicking.
  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    mhblis1 wrote: »
    See I have the same feats as you and see no difference having now tested it a second time. I don;t have Plague Fire and from taling in guild many of the TR's are saying they get about the same drop in DPS as you did.

    That enchant got the a kicking.

    Yes, I'm suspecting the dmg drop to be (partly/entirely) from the Plaguefire nerf.
    I use the greater version of it, so that could explain the bigger dmg drop I'm seeing compared to others.
    Snow's Melee Arena: NW-DMT7STJ9E
    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
  • kyuubiilkyuubiil Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 59
    edited June 2013
    snowballo wrote: »
    Yes, I'm suspecting the dmg drop to be (partly/entirely) from the Plaguefire nerf.
    I use the greater version of it, so that could explain the bigger dmg drop I'm seeing compared to others.

    It is, essentially, from the dev posts, plaguefire was reducing DAMAGE RESISTANCe, not defense by the number listed, so instead of -45% defense or what have you, it was just -45% DR flat. (less, in the case of normal/lesser plaguefire, obviously) It now does Defense, and at a reduced rate. It got spat on hard.
  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    kyuubiil wrote: »
    It is, essentially, from the dev posts, plaguefire was reducing DAMAGE RESISTANCe, not defense by the number listed, so instead of -45% defense or what have you, it was just -45% DR flat. (less, in the case of normal/lesser plaguefire, obviously) It now does Defense, and at a reduced rate. It got spat on hard.

    It didn't stack the DR 3x before
    So in the case of greater it was 15% not 45%

    It does stack to 3 times now, but yes it's defense reduction now rather than DR.

    Still it's not clear if the numbers we'r seeing r purely based of Plague Fire nerf or something else involved on top.
    Snow's Melee Arena: NW-DMT7STJ9E
    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
  • sfxer001sfxer001 Member Posts: 118 Bounty Hunter
    edited June 2013
    The latest patch notes (.8) say that they fixed CON not increasing armor pen for GWF's, and that they fixed DEX not increasing armor pen for GF's. This may have something to do with the drop as well, perhaps.
  • penpenstarpenpenstar Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    my cleave and tide is perfectly same as before
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  • snowballosnowballo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited June 2013
    sfxer001 wrote: »
    The latest patch notes (.8) say that they fixed CON not increasing armor pen for GWF's, and that they fixed DEX not increasing armor pen for GF's. This may have something to do with the drop as well, perhaps.

    This patch isn't live yet (or at least wasn't when we wrote this) I haven't had the chance to log on today yet to see if it's live yet.
    On top of that, the patch says that those 2 stats will now >Increase< and not decrease armor penetration.

    The dmg drop we are feeling most likely comes due to the Plague Fire nerf.
    Snow's Melee Arena: NW-DMT7STJ9E
    Combat arena. Adjustable challenge.
    Difficulty: Adjustable easy - very hard
    Duration: Adjustable 1 - 25min
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