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Basic Ranger and Warlock education for all you non-4th ed players
ledmonson
Member Posts: 26 Arc User
Rangers: the build of ranger Neverwinter is implementing is Archer, so it will be a ranged striker. The Archer build does not have an extra pet. Rangers in 4th ed are said to be using the Martial power source like Fighter, Rogue, Warlord (not Primal or Divine).
Warlocks: builds of warlocks are called Pacts (they sale their souls to higher powers to get their own powers). They are also ranged strikers. Warlocks do Not summon for more companions. Their power source is Arcane. Warlocks will not replace wizards because warlocks do not control (much).
I will be watching this thread to answer any more questions or you could just go download some pdf's of some 4th ed books. I do welcome corrective criticism from other 4th ed dungeon masters as this post was off the top of my head and I'm at work right now not able to access my many books.
Warlocks: builds of warlocks are called Pacts (they sale their souls to higher powers to get their own powers). They are also ranged strikers. Warlocks do Not summon for more companions. Their power source is Arcane. Warlocks will not replace wizards because warlocks do not control (much).
I will be watching this thread to answer any more questions or you could just go download some pdf's of some 4th ed books. I do welcome corrective criticism from other 4th ed dungeon masters as this post was off the top of my head and I'm at work right now not able to access my many books.
Post edited by ledmonson on
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For archers, would you describe them as using a lot of trick/gimmick arrows, or more along the lines of mainly damage while having some attacks that perhaps slow enemies, (like by shooting their legs or something).
For warlocks - you mention that the "sell their soul for power" - wouldn't this make them inherently evil, or is it more of an obligatory servitude in exchange for power, where the entity they are bound to may not necessarily be evil?
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
*loosely* is putting it mildly. Ive spent hours looking in my 4e PHB and DMG. Little to nothing matches up with what is in this game. I would even say that calling it D&D or 4e is nothing more then trying to get the hardcore D&D community to give this game a look as it doesn't resemble either one in any case.
The evil thing on warlocks is more of a roleplaying thing. Considering they sold their soul, the closest you could probably get to a good warlock would be an anti-hero type. At least that is my opinion.
I have a hard time playing out a scenario in my mind where a good entity wants to buy your soul.
Ammon Jerro would like to have a word with you. Meet him in the Sword Mountains on the Plane of Shadows.
Well, the 'Ranger' is an established D&D character type. I suppose they could be included under the umbrella of "rogue", but they tend to be more outdoorsy and less grabby with items that aren't theirs.
The Warlock is most definitely an arcane character, though in a way they could be closer to a cleric - since their powers are granted by a higher entity.
"Is it better to be feared or respected? I say, is it too much to ask for both?" -Tony Stark
Official NW_Legit_Community Forums
Also, the Warlock can pack with more neutral / elemental forces. You don't need to be selling your soul off to the devil and what not.
What I was getting at is they could easily include both Archer Ranger as well as Two Weapon Fighting Ranger.
Also, I seriously hope Resurrection is added to clerics as a level 60 Daily Power. I can understand the rez scrolls for general players, but I really hope Cryptic doesn't try to 'break' the holy trinity like every other MMO is trying to do. D&D is where holy trinity's SHOULD exist. I don't like healing classes just being minor shielding and mitigation (Such as Guild Wars 2).
Outside of different graphics, there are only so many ways to make a melee or ranged character unique, especially with the limited amount of skills on your bar at a time.
For instance the two weapon fighting ranger. How would you go about making this class unique from TR and GWF? Of course their equipped weapons would look different, but I mean actual gameplay differences.
once they have an archer type and a nuker type, it is going to start getting harder and harder to make classes gameplay unique.
Fun Fact: Ranger was originally a Fighter subclass.
You're still forgetting all the other base classes, not just 'variants'. Bard, Druid, Monk, etc...... and hopefully vampire. Oh god please Cryptic. I need a striker who nukes, curses, and lifedrains.
Ignore the trolls dude, great info. What makes a warlock unique? In the sense are they strictly ranged dps, or do they focus on dots? What would make them unique to this game. Thanks!
that is very true.
some classes will be easier than others. for instance it would not be hard to make a paladin unique from the current melee classes.
others would be tougher.
I just read in another thread that cryptic is supposed to continually add a new class every couple months for the next 3 years. I am intrigued to see how they keep them unique. I am not saying it is impossible, I am just saying it will quickly become difficult.
you also have to take balance into account. like with your vampire who nukes, curses, and lifedrains. that could easily be overpowered in comparison to the current classes, so it could end up doing many things at a much weaker level than you wish for.
I made this thread because there were comments in other threads that were getting it wrong.
I don't think anyone is trolling. I've also been giving out factual information. And, as the 4e Scourge Warlock (The variant we are getting), they're more direct nuking. Minimal control spells, if in fact they get any at all in Neverwinter's reimagining. Warlocks are more tanky. Higher constitution, leather armor, and will quite possibly have a melee at will. (Unless they make Eldritch Blast their default left click. Who knows)
I wasn't referring to you as a troll, but thank you for the information, I really appreciate it. Can you elaborate a bit on their skills? Like control wizard is arcane and ice, what are the 4e scourge warlock? fire, or the etc? Thanks!
Direct arcane nukes called Eldritch Blasts. Eldritch Blast is a spell that can be cast a variety of ways. It can be range increased, turned into an AOE, cause the target to be debuffed, or even channel Hellfire into the blast for extra damage. Using Hellfire, however usually causes a warlock personal damage as it weakens their body to cast it. It will be arcane but most likely look like an energy bolt similar to a reddish lightning bolt as it's usually depicted in D&D artwork and games. Hellfire abilities will be shown as mundane fire, of course as the tease already showed us. The Hellfire/Brimstone spells that Scourge warlock might possible be a DOT after an initial nuke. They might also have buffing/shielding capabilities, but not sure if their utility was put in 4e. Sorry rather rambling.
While it is cool to day dream I cannot see any of this happening anytime soon.
"If" they release? You realize both these classes are already confirmed and one of them is being released in Live or soon after right? They were confirmed for already done/almost done a few weeks ago.
if i were to guess they have separate teams working on those.
balancing classes and fixing abilities is mostly behind the scenes fiddling with numbers and code.
making a new class is mostly graphical design and creating abilities. once they are done it probably gets handed to the balancing team to bring all the numbers in line.
i dont really know how cryptic operates, but it would make sense.
Thank you for the response, I appreciate your insight. Very helpful.
4E Warlocks can have pacts with different sources for their power, the exact extent of the Warlock's obligatory part of the pact is never mentioned. The only thing concrete is the mechanical part of the Warlock, each pact starting with different powers/abilities and being better with certain new powers as they advance.
4E classes tend to have one primary stat which affects base attack and damage and each variant of a class uses one secondary stat to determine bonus effects on abilities. All warlocks use Intelligence as their primary stat. There are 3 eldritch pacts available in the core rulebook to warlocks, these are fey, infernal, and star (Cthulhuish knowledge). Fey uses Charisma while Infernal and Star use Constitution.
There are two suggested ways to play a Warlock, one is Deceptive and the other is Scourge. Regardless of suggested play style all Warlocks are Strikers (DPS). Deceptive works best with the Fey pact and is a combination of trickery, stealth, teleports, and some control powers. Scourge works best with Infernal or Star and is based on brute magic force to take things down.
As far as NW goes, their NW Scourge Warlock will likely be an Infernal pact Warlock with INT primary and CHA and CON as secondary attributes. Strikers aren't usually as AOE oriented as controllers are, but Warlocks have enough AOE attacks available that they will likely get a decent mix of single target and AOE abilities. Warlock abilities tend to not hit quite as hard as other strikers up front, and are often considered the weakest striker as far as damage output goes. To make up for the lower damage output Warlock powers often have other components mixed in, like conditional secondary hits, control effects, and life drains. Infernal Warlocks also tend to be very durable, partially through having a decent CON score and partially from defensive abilities that can grant them temporary hit points and life drains.