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So what is the point in playing a GWF?
finalwinter
Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
1. GWF have the slowest activation skill times (any class is faster when it comes to using the skills and who hits who first).
2. Any class does more damage than the GWF if played well.
3. GWF have no skills whatsoever that could be useful in a Dungeon.
4. CW do much more damage than a GWF. (CW = Control Wizard...yes a CC class has more damage than a pure melee class).
5. GWF is an "AoE" class...than why does a CC class do more damage?
6. GWF has higher defense than the TR/CW... then why does your HP deplete so much faster?
7. GWF has no chance to dodge a daily.
Bug fixes: Tab option glitches (cannot activate it) and stamina does not regenerate.
The classes in these game are obviously unbalanced. There is absolutely no role to play for the GWF in this game. If there is anyone that can come up with 1 single good use for the GWF that the CW/TR/GF or DC can't do better please by all means let me know.
I write this not to rage on my favorite class, but to let Cryptic know that they have done an extremely poor job on the development of this class. I want changes and improvements and I am 100% sure most of you guys playing a GWF do so as well.
I play this class because everything becomes 10x more challenging. PvP actually gets exciting when you kill TR's and CW's 1 vs. 1 with this class. You actually have to try and put an effort into what you are doing and not just stand there and press 3 keys to kill your enemies.
I am not hating on the CC or the TR. I love both classes and find them extremely fun to play. I only want my class to actually have a role to play in both Dungeons and PvP and not be the useless and utterly weak class that Cryptic has made it to be.
I have the best gear + best accessories in the game. Have OK enchantments and plenty of experience both on PvP and PvE. I have been playing since the 1st Beta and know everything there is to know about the GWF. This is not some random **** raging about his class because he lost a PvP fight against a squishy Wizard. Please be respectful and mature when posting your comments. Feedback would be greatly appreciated.
2. Any class does more damage than the GWF if played well.
3. GWF have no skills whatsoever that could be useful in a Dungeon.
4. CW do much more damage than a GWF. (CW = Control Wizard...yes a CC class has more damage than a pure melee class).
5. GWF is an "AoE" class...than why does a CC class do more damage?
6. GWF has higher defense than the TR/CW... then why does your HP deplete so much faster?
7. GWF has no chance to dodge a daily.
Bug fixes: Tab option glitches (cannot activate it) and stamina does not regenerate.
The classes in these game are obviously unbalanced. There is absolutely no role to play for the GWF in this game. If there is anyone that can come up with 1 single good use for the GWF that the CW/TR/GF or DC can't do better please by all means let me know.
I write this not to rage on my favorite class, but to let Cryptic know that they have done an extremely poor job on the development of this class. I want changes and improvements and I am 100% sure most of you guys playing a GWF do so as well.
I play this class because everything becomes 10x more challenging. PvP actually gets exciting when you kill TR's and CW's 1 vs. 1 with this class. You actually have to try and put an effort into what you are doing and not just stand there and press 3 keys to kill your enemies.
I am not hating on the CC or the TR. I love both classes and find them extremely fun to play. I only want my class to actually have a role to play in both Dungeons and PvP and not be the useless and utterly weak class that Cryptic has made it to be.
I have the best gear + best accessories in the game. Have OK enchantments and plenty of experience both on PvP and PvE. I have been playing since the 1st Beta and know everything there is to know about the GWF. This is not some random **** raging about his class because he lost a PvP fight against a squishy Wizard. Please be respectful and mature when posting your comments. Feedback would be greatly appreciated.
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
Post edited by finalwinter on
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i'm a dc - i give my group the choice to swap me or the gwf out.
most times, i get to stay.
My main is a Tiefling GWF with a 10.3k gear score. He has nowhere near the top gear score, yet consistently scores second or third on the Most Damage Done scoreboard, and first or second on the Most Kills scoreboard. He isn't in a guild and only does random queuing and advertising in Zone. He has never been kicked from a group, and actually has been complimented on a job well done.
Having a GWF who knows what he's doing in your group doesn't make anybody else's game any harder. Using your "my class is more necessary than yours" card is a kick in the nuts to anyone who plays the game to have fun rather than play spreadsheets to see which group composition gets the most deeps.
You sound like a real fun guy and not a colossal tool at all.
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Also they make the best BBQ pork, so they are defenetly an adition to any dungeon, TR and CW have no BBQ skills.
Are they the worst thing ever and always gimped and never do anything in PvP or PvE like everyone thinks and tries to make it sound?
No.
If you are not doing well in either setting its on you. Either its just a giant lack of gear, feats wrong, powers wrong, "rotation" is wrong. GWF do really good, people just dont give the class a chance.
From what I've seen, going full AOE allows you to do great things for your team. Using Weapon Masters Strike, Weapon Mastery, Steel Blitz, and the Slam Daily, you're able to do outright massive total damage to any mob you fight. Combine it with Student of the Sword Paragon Feat and Destroyer Feats to further increase your potential. With 10% lifesteal this makes you considerably hard to kill. GWF is highly invaluable against any large mobs of squishy enemies, since they can't swarm your DC or TR(Ex: Zombies, Goblins, Lizards).
If anything, GWF is the jack of all trades, but only the master of AOE damage.
-He can deal good damage when built right, but can't DPS like a good TR
-He's decently tanky, but is no GF.
-He has at least two decent CC encounters, but obviously doesn't CC as hard as a CW.
-He can make good use of lifesteal and Restoring Strike to sustain himself, but can't heal like a DC.
THIS
I HATE people that only worry about being top of the damage charts. Those that only care about being awesome for themselvs is the most annoying thing ever. There are 5 of you. Screw YOUR damage if what you do brings the groups damage up then you are doing your job right?
I am a pure PvP stun-lock build... my feats are perfect and my powers are perfect. In PvP I demolish almost anyone in 1 vs 1 and with a cleric in the middle I am almost unstoppable. My gear is all T-2 set + Ancient accessories. Reason why I lack in PvE damage is because of my build. Regardless of all of that... The GWF is still lacking in every single area. I have a few YouTube videos under Great Weapon Fighter Snow that shows my play style + Feats and Powers. I love the class and is tons of fun but the poor fella needs some work, hence the reason why I write this post.
- GWF do very high damages in PVE, if well built and well played.
- GWF are terrible in PVP and far harder to kill than a CW or TR (if well built and played).
- GWF are a powerfull class, not easy to handle but very interesting for a "normal" group.
- Most of peoples complaining about their class (GWF or other) usually got a fail build or something like. I don't say it's your case, but it's very often. That's, for exemple, the reason why some TR or CW (and basically any classes) make hell in PVP, while others sux hard and give freekills.
You are absolutely right. But what is the use of any of that if it doesn't fully tab into the source. You might have all of that, but what good is it if you can't fully utilize it? Yea GWF has everything, but everything is very ineffective if you aren't specialized. Who is going to be more effective? A GWF with +10 on everything or a GWF with +8 on everything and +20 Strength?
I completely agree with you. The build and the person behind the toon is extremely important.
The reason you pick a jack of all/many trades is to at least partially fill two roles or to further strengthen two roles that you have.
Ex: You have a dungeon party consisting of 2 DCs, 1 TR, and a CW. Now you could pick a GF to finish your party, but then your TR is almost your only source of damage. That's when you realize the GWF, being somewhat tanky and damaging, could somewhat fill the role of the tanky initiator as well as provide your party with more DPS than a GF can provide you.
It baffles me when I hear how much people complain about GWF being beyond weak, after reading what the Paragon Feat Student of the Sword does for you. I'm not sure if it works for EVERY critical strike(Slam Daily crits) or just every At Will and Encounter, but being able to lower an entire mob's defense by up to 45% for 5 seconds is downright insane.
haha. a 8.3k cleric who constantly throws down astral circle > 10.3k gs who knows how to play
it's really simple.
i'll take heals over gwf
i'll take cw with [tab]repel over gwf ; let me see a gwf kill faster than a cw knocking multiple mobs off
or perform better at aoe & cc
i'll take tr over gwf - tr with HAMSTER gear is still useful with smokebomb
hell i'll even take gf over gwf
most damage - *snort*
much rather have a near 0 dmg cw know what he's doing and keeping me alive
than a consistently 2nd/3rd place damage gwf
i'm a reasonable person thoug, i'll group with gwfs if i ever get bis for everthing
oh my, you know the weakest class at launch for all the games you play
how delightfully smart!
have a cookie.
Cool story bro. Where are the aliens?
(*READ* not easily replaced by EVERY other class in the game and the replacement is better for the group!)
the people with the best gear in the game do decent.... I say decent, put another class with same gear and your runs will be smoother 100% of the time.
Your cool bro! This is why all the community's in MMO's are full of HAMSTER players...
GWF's had there ups and downs while leveling but I was able to solo 90% of all the content. Yes I had to use HP pots but big deal. Most of the encounters if you step left/right/back forward you could avoid most of the DMG. I was killing +2 level mobs / mini boss's higher than me easy.
In 10+yrs of MMO's I've never played a healer / caster / tank regardless if they were the "BEST". I play what fit's my play style and enjoy but very few community's accept that. So saying you have yet to play another class is a asinine comment.
I can personally say I've yet to be kicked from a group run or not been picked up for DD speed runs. "DPS / Kills /GS" mean NOTHING. What means something is you bring the player not the class because before all this we need double DC/CW/TR there were groups running Tank/DPS/Healers and killing content just fine. May have not been a speed run but it was getting completed in a decent time frame.
I've been in plenty of groups(PuG's) where we kicked a CW/TR and not myself or just let them stay dead because they didn't understand boss fight mechanics and were just making it hard on everyone else.
I'd much rather take the Player Skill > Class any day of the week.
There are very few guilds/people out there that can relate to this but look hard enough and you will find them.
The simple point is that GWF are not needed or wanted, yes you could go to an instance, but the group would be better off with ANY other class than yours. You stated skill.... put someone of equal skill in a different class and the dungeon will run 100% smoother. The whole point isnt that ohh look GWF can hurt stuff a little in a perfect storm scenario. Ohh yeah btw DPS means a hell of a lot for a class that supposed to be DPS first tank second. Especially if its AOE dps they should top the charts in every dungeon but because of the pathetic damage they might *MIGHT* be a distant second if noone else is dps or third.
Mob has 100 hp, TR hits mob for 100 hp.. mob dead. GWF hits 5 mobs for 20 damage to first and progressively lower each mob after the first. TR kills 5 mobs in 5 hits... GWF kills 5 mobs in 8 - 10 hits meanwhile those mobs that are not dead but say 10% hp still do FULL damage... the TR drops em one at a time and thats 1 less mob for damage or running around stunning people or anything. CW takes those same 5 mobs and can do either nuke them in 2 -3 shots so basically 33.3 damage or 50 damage. with NO dropoff for hitting multiple mobs, or hell they can knock them around CC them or just toss them off a cliff. I use the 5 mob example because GWF seems hard capped to only hit 5 at a time and the hits are random within those mobs. so again. Equal skill why would you ever bring a GWF vs anything else?
Gwf has some feats+passive+unstopable which will apply 92% DR:
here calculations:
deflect for gwf armour is 50%, so if deflect successfull we will have 50% dr.
The feats+passive (Bravery) on gwf gives you 15+15+5 = 35% deflect base + your deflect stat = cca 45% to have 50%dr.
Unstopable = 50dr, shout power if full stacks = 50dr
so in total DR, under these conditions (base dr (mine is 37%), unstoppable, shout full stacks, full stacks of feated weapon master+feat(which gives you 5%deflect), bravery(15% deflect)):
0.5 * 0.5 * 0.5 * (1-0.37) = 0.083 % Damage taken or 92.7% Damage Reduction.
With shout + roar I can maintain unstopable most of the time.
In dungeons I tank much more than GF, and get killed ALLWAYS LAST.
Pretty fun when you almost immortal
Don't forget life steal for threat generation.
What is the point of playing a GWF?
Erm.....I thought the point of doing anything in a video game was to have fun. But maybe I'm just old-fashioned and don't understand this newfangled elitism amongst people playing a freaking video game.
People who go to a lot of effort to figure out how to spend the least amount of time possible actually playing the game, have (in my opinion at least) completely missed the point of playing the game in the first place.
Oh, having a GWF along slows things down? My bad, I didn't realize getting through things as quickly as possible was the goal of playing a game meant for entertainment. It's not a freaking job, people.
Fun?
That's why I play one. Every dog has it's day. Today's gimp class is tomorrow's ZOMGNURFNAO!
That pretty much sums it up for me. The GWF archetype is the only class I play in every MMO. Give me a big 2hander and take me to Cleaveland and I'm one happy camper. I will play the GWF when it's the underpowered wet noodle that it is now. I will play it when it's the next Flavor of the Month class. Nerfed or buffed, it's the only class that will ever be my main.
Will I stop advocating for improvements? No. I want to see my favorite class brought up to the same level as the other classes. I want to see my fellow players not sigh every time I join their group. I want to see zone chat no longer trolling GWF's looking for groups. Every class should have its equal place in a well balanced group. If GWF's were fine and everyone was crapping on TR's, I'd want TR's to get buffed too. It's not just about our favorite classes but the meta game as a whole. One class sucking this much compared to the others is not good for the game, regardless of what class it is.