Go to Webster's and look up the definition of "fair."
Everyone rolling is fair. It may not be efficient, but it's fair.
Class-based Need is only fair if the instance drops equally attractive loot for all classes, which the current instances do not. So while you're hurling insults around, realize that you want to force an unfair loot distribution scheme on the playerbase.
Maybe you need to check Webster's again. It is anything but fair to be one rolling against 4 other people who cant use the item. your chances of winning an item you will use are nil. Just so that they can force you to pay them for it on the auction house later "greed"
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vatashaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
"If you want to play the game and have fun, join a guild or be punished for not joining one!"
That sounds like a fun game with an awesome community. Welcome to Neverwinter!
The point the OP is trying to make is that new players are going to get a horrible impression of this system the moment they queue up for a dungeon, are the only one of their class in the party, and their items get ninja'd from them to be sold on the auction house because of the awful greed induced system that is currently in place (and won't ever go away). The only people who will be playing this game by October will be our brave northern heroes of the white knight's roundtable because they'll be too swollen with pride over that luxurious $200 they spent and they'll be here, wondering where everyone went.
The problem isn't with the game but with selfish players and the best way to deal with that is to play with people you can trust. I am sure the company will redo the loot system just like they did the foundry.
The problem isn't with the game but with selfish players and the best way to deal with that is to play with people you can trust. I am sure the company will redo the loot system just like they did the foundry.
You think the players are to blame for taking part in what the company intended for them to do?
Maybe you need to check Webster's again. It is anything but fair to be one rolling against 4 other people who cant use the item. your chances of winning an item you will use are nil. Just so that they can force you to pay them for it on the auction house later "greed"
No, your chance of winning the item is exactly the same as everyone else's in the party. That is fair.
Fair means "free from bias."
Awarding loot based on the class you are playing is biased.
"Participation in PVP-related activities is so low on an hourly, daily, weekly, and monthly basis that we could in fact just completely take it out of STO and it would not impact the overall number of people [who] log in to the game and play in any significant way." -Gozer, Cryptic PvP Dev
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vatashaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
You think the players are to blame for taking part in what the company intended for them to do?
There is nothing preventing you from passing on loot you don't need...it is the polite and right thing to do. You report bugs not exploit them and the nicer people are to each other the better a game gets.
Here is what really happens to a game. Nice players end up forming guilds and working together to enjoy a game. The Dbags, Ninjas and trolls end up fighting and belly aching until whatever new game comes out.
There is nothing preventing you from passing on loot you don't need...it is the polite and right thing to do. You report bugs not exploit them and the nicer people are to each other the better a game gets.
Here is what really happens to a game. Nice players end up forming guilds and working together to enjoy a game. The Dbags, Ninjas and trolls end up fighting and belly aching until whatever new game comes out.
How is this company's implementation of the Zen to AD system a bug? They know what they were doing when they made endgame gear bind on equip.
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vatashaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
How is this company's implementation of the Zen to AD system a bug? They know what they were doing when they made endgame gear bind on equip.
Again wouldn't be a problem if people were polite and nice to each other would it? Again the problem is with selfish players not the game. Tho I am sure the game will fix it so that the kiddies cannot exploit it.
Again wouldn't be a problem if people were polite and nice to each other would it? Again the problem is with selfish players not the game. Tho I am sure the game will fix it so that the kiddies cannot exploit it.
I have been trying to tell you this whole time, it's not something that they're going to fix and it's not an exploit.
When you throw free money into a crowd of people, those people are going to scramble for it and you get to watch them and laugh at how HAMSTER they look in doing so. That is what PWE is doing here, laughing and banking off people giving them money to buy BoE gear off the auction house. I've explained this very clearly, how do you keep suggesting it's a bug when it's so obvious what they're doing here?
If they made the gear BoP, they'd be losing money. They're not going to do that, ever.
Join a guild and only do runs with them...your que times will disappear your ninja looters will disappear....you see where I am going with this? I never understood why people don't want to make friends and join guilds in mmo's...that is what they are about after all.
I genuinely feel bad for those who think that the roll system isn't working as intended. It is set up this way so that PWE can make money off people converting Zen into AD. That is the reason why anyone can roll need on anything; it isn't because this is a "beta" and that it's broken. They did it because they know they will cash out on people buying Zen, converting it to AD and purchasing the top tier endgame gear off the auction house.
Exactly. It seems to be the sad truth that this game was designed from the ground up just to get people to list items on the auction house, which will result in people buying zen to covert to AD to buy items. It's truly absurd that the top tier of gear isn't BoP. I'm struggling to find aspects of this game which *aren't* pay-for-power nonsense.
Personally, I feel this entire need/greed garbage needs to simply go away. its old school and past its time. Id much prefer the system to distribute loot automatically and privately so none of this loot jealously would happen. And so that everyone can still come out with something. But you don't see me crying in every thread about it. Nor do I honestly expect it to ever happen.
This is a great idea, if you run premade you just change the loot option but for pugs this is a pretty fair system
This is a great idea, if you run premade you just change the loot option but for pugs this is a pretty fair system
As others mentioned earlier. It is a system that already exists in another Cryptic game, STO. Why they didnt go this way here baffles me. But from how they implemented the system to their silence about the various complaints. Its not a system that is changing. With that understanding, the only real fair way is to need on everything. But some folks are hard to understand change.
You think the players are to blame for taking part in what the company intended for them to do?
Yes...100% of the time that a particular player consciously chooses to participate in this kind of behavior. It's the same reason that we have NGP rolling systems in the first place...because player's can't be trusted to make correct choices most of the time. Unfortunately, no system put in place can circumvent what human nature will invariably do.
If an item is rolled NEED it should be character bound.
You should not be able to roll need on unidentified items, if there is a wizard in the group, their arcane abilities should identify the item for the group.
Also if an item is class specific it should only be able to be rolled need by that class.
Lieutenant Johnathan "Seven" Abradax Liberated Borg -Captain USS Solstice Member of Starfleet Borg Task Force - Tactical Unit
Lets bypass the fact that dungeon queue is so long about to 1 hour for anything.
Lets bypass the fact that trash/bosses are made for blind console players and require no skill at all but since they are so big you need 40mins to finish them anyway..
Lets just lose every item for our class because everyone can roll on everything and then the winner simply mocks you are the end with "Gg **** you noobs, thanks for the AD".
Oh i know..NEW OFFER, 10.000 ZEN, BLOCK OTHERS FROM ROLLING ON YOUR CLASS GEAR, NOW ONLY ON THE ZEN STORE!
I dont really see the reason to play this game when the rolling system is like this.
If you queue for a PUG you are asking for this. While I do agree that I wish the roll system were more like Rift (if it is not an upgrade for your current character you can;t need on it), even in that game I would never PUG. I leave that to the PvP folks. For PvE it is much more enjoyable to queue up as a team with your friends and/or Guild - people you know and have no issue fighting beside and sharing the same honor system with. Heck, I am an antisocial and I still keep enough friends around to team with. Trust me, it's worth it to steer clear and "Just say NO to Pugging".
Comments
Maybe you need to check Webster's again. It is anything but fair to be one rolling against 4 other people who cant use the item. your chances of winning an item you will use are nil. Just so that they can force you to pay them for it on the auction house later "greed"
The problem isn't with the game but with selfish players and the best way to deal with that is to play with people you can trust. I am sure the company will redo the loot system just like they did the foundry.
You think the players are to blame for taking part in what the company intended for them to do?
No, your chance of winning the item is exactly the same as everyone else's in the party. That is fair.
Fair means "free from bias."
Awarding loot based on the class you are playing is biased.
There is nothing preventing you from passing on loot you don't need...it is the polite and right thing to do. You report bugs not exploit them and the nicer people are to each other the better a game gets.
Here is what really happens to a game. Nice players end up forming guilds and working together to enjoy a game. The Dbags, Ninjas and trolls end up fighting and belly aching until whatever new game comes out.
How is this company's implementation of the Zen to AD system a bug? They know what they were doing when they made endgame gear bind on equip.
Again wouldn't be a problem if people were polite and nice to each other would it? Again the problem is with selfish players not the game. Tho I am sure the game will fix it so that the kiddies cannot exploit it.
I have been trying to tell you this whole time, it's not something that they're going to fix and it's not an exploit.
When you throw free money into a crowd of people, those people are going to scramble for it and you get to watch them and laugh at how HAMSTER they look in doing so. That is what PWE is doing here, laughing and banking off people giving them money to buy BoE gear off the auction house. I've explained this very clearly, how do you keep suggesting it's a bug when it's so obvious what they're doing here?
If they made the gear BoP, they'd be losing money. They're not going to do that, ever.
^ this, This, THIS.
Exactly. It seems to be the sad truth that this game was designed from the ground up just to get people to list items on the auction house, which will result in people buying zen to covert to AD to buy items. It's truly absurd that the top tier of gear isn't BoP. I'm struggling to find aspects of this game which *aren't* pay-for-power nonsense.
This is a great idea, if you run premade you just change the loot option but for pugs this is a pretty fair system
As others mentioned earlier. It is a system that already exists in another Cryptic game, STO. Why they didnt go this way here baffles me. But from how they implemented the system to their silence about the various complaints. Its not a system that is changing. With that understanding, the only real fair way is to need on everything. But some folks are hard to understand change.
Yes...100% of the time that a particular player consciously chooses to participate in this kind of behavior. It's the same reason that we have NGP rolling systems in the first place...because player's can't be trusted to make correct choices most of the time. Unfortunately, no system put in place can circumvent what human nature will invariably do.
I'm pretty sure this has been broken since before open beta even started
If an item is rolled NEED it should be character bound.
You should not be able to roll need on unidentified items, if there is a wizard in the group, their arcane abilities should identify the item for the group.
Also if an item is class specific it should only be able to be rolled need by that class.
Liberated Borg -Captain USS Solstice
Member of Starfleet Borg Task Force - Tactical Unit
If you queue for a PUG you are asking for this. While I do agree that I wish the roll system were more like Rift (if it is not an upgrade for your current character you can;t need on it), even in that game I would never PUG. I leave that to the PvP folks. For PvE it is much more enjoyable to queue up as a team with your friends and/or Guild - people you know and have no issue fighting beside and sharing the same honor system with. Heck, I am an antisocial and I still keep enough friends around to team with. Trust me, it's worth it to steer clear and "Just say NO to Pugging".
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]