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Why this great game sadly will fail

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    darkjeffdarkjeff Member Posts: 2,590 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    cleanor wrote: »
    Purchased it on the 6th.

    It's the 8th now, and I'm assuming it's your first purchase of Zen with a CC. It'll take at least a week, if the stories I've heard are anything to go by.

    Subsequent purchases should be much, much faster.
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    xmastervellesxxmastervellesx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    joeamaxin wrote: »
    Now I would not mind the bag being part of the store if there was an in game way to get bags...

    You can get bags for free by doing the main quest lines as you level.
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    runicfirunicfi Member Posts: 269 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    I had a Zen issue, I made a support ticket from the top of the website. It was answered to and resolved after one day of waiting without issues.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    widowmakirwidowmakir Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 5 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Main Point of this thread is the cash OP lost when attempting to make the Zen Purchase.

    Secondary Point would be the poor customer service. If I spent the time making 51 calls to customer service I would be ranting and raving right now, luckily all of my purchases have gone through.

    As far as needing to spend real money to be able to make purchases in this game? Not true, you can buy anything you want and never spend a solitary dollar. How? Use your professions, level up leadership and farm AD. Use AD to Purchase Zen. Will it be quick ? Not a chance. But that is not the point. The point is it can be done. It is all about instant gratification, everyone wants it right now.
    Myself included which is why I spent the money I spent.

    Now my challenge with this game is not the usual I have with most games. What is the best gear , highest level, etc, instead is how fast can I farm the most AD in a day. Sure you can only refine 24K per day, but that is per character.

    This game , I agree will not be the WoW killer, but it is not exactly mediocre either. It fits in its own little niche and will be around for a long time to come.Why? Because it will always make money. People are all about instant gratification and this game gives that to them. If there is a game killer here it will be because of your 2 main points.

    Inability to fully complete transactions will lead to distrust of service, which will lead to game failure due to No one using an unreliable system.
    Inability to contact customer service in a reliable manner leads to game failure , no one wants to spend money and get nothing in return for it and when problems occur we all want to feel we are being heard. When we feel we are ignored, we generally take our business elsewhere, again it is all about instant gratification.
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    hkiewahkiewa Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 379 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    joeamaxin wrote: »
    This game will fail because the Zen store is going to drive all the casual players away, all the people who do not have a disposable income away, and all the people who do not want to spend $10 for a freaking bag.
    Now I would not mind the bag being part of the store if there was an in game way to get bags or even expand your tiny bank storage.
    Dont get me wrong I like the game, I like the gameplay, the graphics, the general helpfulness of the community but what I dont like and will leave the game for is how I would need to pay money for basic in game items that cannot be obtained any other way than through the zen store. And dont tell me its because its in beta or that the devs need the money to make content because look at warframe. Its in beta, it has a micro transaction store (Side note: the zen store is not micro transactions, some stuff is like buying a full AAA game) and the devs support the game with weekly updates without selling items on the cash shop that should be basic pick ups in game.

    This is nonsense. Casual players are precisely the market for games like this
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    lymprechtlymprecht Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 44
    edited May 2013
    cleanor wrote: »
    This is a very fun game, kudos to the developers for their hard work in creating something special. Many of us that had been looking forward to Neverwinter Online launching, feel you have exceeded our expectations.

    The problem for you as a developer is that this game is not going to make it. Here is why:

    The economic profitability of the game is driven off of micro-transactions, specifically the purchase of Zen. Like it or hate it (personally I like it) this is how this game is structured. The issue is that the behind the scenes infrastructure is not in place to handle the purchase and distribution of Zen, and when there are issues, there is no support system to handle billing issues.

    Dozens of us, including myself, have paid for Zen over the past few days with credit cards, and had emails from Perfect World Inc. and Visa stating the purchase occurred. However the Zen never shows up at all. It's not in the Zen wallet, and no record of anything in the Purchase History (Zen Transactions). We cannot progress to the next step of committing our Zen to a game and server. There is just nothing there.

    Every company can have issues with their systems, but when you are taking people's money, especially for the first time, you better have your ducks in a row, all of them. You only get one chance to make a first impression. At a minimum shut down your purchase system until it is fixed, or post a warning that there is an issue. If there is some reason you are deliberately delaying giving your paying customers the Zen that they purchased, please tell us that when we are buying it.

    I was told by a moderator on this forum to contact customer service, so today I did, well tried to.

    I got the number for Perfect World Inc.'s billing customer service area in Northern California. When I called, I got the standard recording saying that there were a lot of people calling, they were sorry, but please hold. No problem, I realize I am not the only one that has this issue. After two minutes I get transferred to another recording that says I should call back in a few moments, then it hangs up on me...

    So I called back. 51 times today, and 51 times their machine hung up on me after 10 seconds to three minutes of hold time.

    Devs I love your game, I want to support you financially, but taking your customers' money without giving them the Zen they bought, then having no customer support to help us resolve it, is the death knell of any business. Unless this is addressed and fixed immediately, all of your hard work was for nothing.

    For every guy like me that cares enough about what you have created to post here to help you, there are 100 others that just said forget it in frustration and will never come back.

    Fix this ASAP, and at the very least please communicate with us and acknowledge that there is an issue. I badly want to see NWO succeed, as things stand now it will not.

    Well, I won't be buying any Zen now.
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    cleanorcleanor Member Posts: 40
    edited May 2013
    darkjeff wrote: »
    It's the 8th now, and I'm assuming it's your first purchase of Zen with a CC. It'll take at least a week, if the stories I've heard are anything to go by.

    Subsequent purchases should be much, much faster.

    I put in an email ticket and have heard nothing back yet, they said 3-4 business days so waiting now.

    I spent some more time thinking about this issue, and while I am very disappointed with complete lack of recourse we as paying customers have, meaning zero support on the PWE side, I do care about this game's success.

    I was contacted by other players in game about this issue happening to them, and there was a lot of /zone talk about people getting nothing on Zen purchases. It seemed that like me, those affected mostly bought Zen on May 6th, but not everyone.

    So last night I tried again, just $5, which is meaningless. Same Visa and it went through immediately, 500 Zen. Another guy tried again and it worked this time for him as well.

    While this is good news, the fact that so many of us have missing money outstanding while PWE has done nothing about it, and has no billing customer service in place, means they have serious problems.

    I am not trying to hate on the game, I want to see it succeed. At the same time I'd like the developers to acknowledge and rectify the situation, and perhaps compensate those of us that got hosed.
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    xixtisxixtis Member Posts: 7 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    widowmakir wrote: »
    As far as needing to spend real money to be able to make purchases in this game? Not true, you can buy anything you want and never spend a solitary dollar. How? Use your professions, level up leadership and farm AD. Use AD to Purchase Zen. Will it be quick ? Not a chance. But that is not the point. The point is it can be done. It is all about instant gratification, everyone wants it right now.
    Myself included which is why I spent the money I spent.

    Now my challenge with this game is not the usual I have with most games. What is the best gear , highest level, etc, instead is how fast can I farm the most AD in a day. Sure you can only refine 24K per day, but that is per character.

    But then, you'll be hard pressed to refine 24K per day with any character, much less several.
    widowmakir wrote: »
    This game , I agree will not be the WoW killer, but it is not exactly mediocre either. It fits in its own little niche and will be around for a long time to come.Why? Because it will always make money. People are all about instant gratification and this game gives that to them. If there is a game killer here it will be because of your 2 main points.

    The game will be around as long as Cryptic/PWE can milk people for their money.

    Just like "it's still beta!" dismissals, there isn't a lot of room for the "you just want to now!" argument here. If prices were reasonable, and there's no sane metric by which they are, you might have something. $160, or roughly three months of hard grinding per character and just for enchantments, is not reasonable by any stretch of the imagination, and if you think it is, seek help. And then, we haven't even considered the grind and/or money spent for mounts, for respecs, or whatever else. And about that grind for AD? See above response.

    Yes, if you so desire, you can do everything in this game completely free of charge, but there is a break point between what can be reasonably done, and what is effectively gated to wear you down so you'll open your wallet. The issue is not that anyone isn't willing to put in the time, or that they're too cheap. The issue is that there is virtually zero value to be found in the cash shop.
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    archaicsealarchaicseal Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 22 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    aislingi wrote: »
    This game won't fail. However, it will never be a huge success either.

    This game, like all of Cryptic's games, will forever be a mediocre filler game. That is, a game people play for a few months between real game releases.

    why?

    1. Apathy
    Cryptic has never cared about players, ignoring feedback and criticism. While providing rock bottom support.
    Take NWO's closed beta period. A few weekends done for publicity sake. No NDA, no real time to test anything. This alone proved they don't give a ****.

    Notice how the CM's here never communicate with the player base? Community managers are here to act as a go between from players and developers, but since neither Cryptic nor PWE care about customers, that line is effectively cut. Marvel Heroes CM Rockjaw, listens to players and literally spends his time working with the devs to make the game better for the community. Its because of him mediating that the random super hero token system was removed in favor of direct purchases, due to overwhelming feedback.

    You'll never see a Cryptic employee ever reconsider an action, or compromise.

    2. Mediocrity
    Cryptic is a mediocre developer house. They know, everyone else knows it. They are content to rush out a piece of good, but not great software, and then let it rot. Look at Champions, first month everything nerfed into the ground. STO? Klingon faction. Don't be fooled Cryptic may pretend to be attentive with NWO, but in a month they won't be doing anything.

    This game will be "Cryptic MMO #3" and it will never achieve the level of success it could, because Cryptic is run on nepotism and managers that don't know how to do their jobs. It takes a really bad group of developers to make a super hero game where no one feels super heroic, but taking a quarter health bar from a convict's thrown bottle is what you get.

    What you see now is what you get. Bugs will remain untouched for months or even years. CO still has a bug that renders action bars inert until you reload your UI and that's been around since launch.

    3. Greed
    Everyone rejoiced when Jack Emmert and Cryptic left CoH. Its because they are greedy and inept. Even Champions opened with a sub and cash shop. STO too, and STO was so awful and such an insult to Roddenberry's vision, that they had to hold "Come back to Us" enticement offers literally three months after release.

    NWO continue this tradition with respec fees costing one dollar over the minimal zen package, thus forcing a ten dollar purchase to respec, 1% success rate on end game enchants, ten dollar single purchase bags, 30 dollar dresses, and forty dollar mounts.

    Yes they need to make money. No they don't have to be greedy pigs about it.


    So yeah this game will not fail. But it will NEVER be as good as it could have been, because Cryptic aims at the middle, and never higher. Because they just don't care.

    You hit it dead on man. I started in STO long ago when it first came out. I lasted three months and felt dirty afterwards, like I had just walked out of an orgy I never realized was going on until the end of my stay. Then NWO was making news, all the hype and I was between MMOs so I have been playing it, but spending very little since I knew they wouldnt drop cash shop prices and everything is a con. So I will be in NWO on and off until ESO comes out, then I am gone (as will many others I understand.)

    Cryptic and PWE are the absolute worst. Like STO, nothing will ever be done to make it better. Prices will never come down and bugs will stay as they are. The game will always be cut throat and in the end, the free player base that remains will be mostly scum who will try and take all they can (think the peeps rolling need constantly now is bad wait till the majority of us leave.)

    No, NWO will continue to exist as a small, measely server with the same ole die hard freebie players, much like STO is now. And then cryptic will hype the hell out of a new MMO and people will plop fortunes on founders packs for it and get all excited from the closed betas because they believe: hey its a beta they will eventually fix those bugs and problems but MAN was that combat fun!!! Some will even spend money early on to buy bags and stuff that is betond being overpriced and they will LOVE it... Until they catch on to what is happening and they will hate themselves in the end.

    No. I wont buy into Cryptic and PWEs <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> anymore. After STO and now NWO, no more.
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    tyestortyestor Member Posts: 57 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    aislingi wrote: »
    This game won't fail. However, it will never be a huge success either.

    This game, like all of Cryptic's games, will forever be a mediocre filler game. That is, a game people play for a few months between real game releases.

    why?

    1. Apathy
    Cryptic has never cared about players, ignoring feedback and criticism. While providing rock bottom support.
    Take NWO's closed beta period. A few weekends done for publicity sake. No NDA, no real time to test anything. This alone proved they don't give a ****.

    Notice how the CM's here never communicate with the player base? Community managers are here to act as a go between from players and developers, but since neither Cryptic nor PWE care about customers, that line is effectively cut. Marvel Heroes CM Rockjaw, listens to players and literally spends his time working with the devs to make the game better for the community. Its because of him mediating that the random super hero token system was removed in favor of direct purchases, due to overwhelming feedback.

    You'll never see a Cryptic employee ever reconsider an action, or compromise.

    2. Mediocrity
    Cryptic is a mediocre developer house. They know, everyone else knows it. They are content to rush out a piece of good, but not great software, and then let it rot. Look at Champions, first month everything nerfed into the ground. STO? Klingon faction. Don't be fooled Cryptic may pretend to be attentive with NWO, but in a month they won't be doing anything.

    This game will be "Cryptic MMO #3" and it will never achieve the level of success it could, because Cryptic is run on nepotism and managers that don't know how to do their jobs. It takes a really bad group of developers to make a super hero game where no one feels super heroic, but taking a quarter health bar from a convict's thrown bottle is what you get.

    What you see now is what you get. Bugs will remain untouched for months or even years. CO still has a bug that renders action bars inert until you reload your UI and that's been around since launch.

    3. Greed
    Everyone rejoiced when Jack Emmert and Cryptic left CoH. Its because they are greedy and inept. Even Champions opened with a sub and cash shop. STO too, and STO was so awful and such an insult to Roddenberry's vision, that they had to hold "Come back to Us" enticement offers literally three months after release.

    NWO continue this tradition with respec fees costing one dollar over the minimal zen package, thus forcing a ten dollar purchase to respec, 1% success rate on end game enchants, ten dollar single purchase bags, 30 dollar dresses, and forty dollar mounts.

    Yes they need to make money. No they don't have to be greedy pigs about it.


    So yeah this game will not fail. But it will NEVER be as good as it could have been, because Cryptic aims at the middle, and never higher. Because they just don't care.

    Very well put, my thoughts exactly. The game is fun but its the multitude of little things that ruin it for me. I can't believe I spent $60 on this tripe.
    xixtis wrote: »
    Was that a joke? They don't translate well on the web, you know.

    The combat in Tera is miles ahead of this. Granted, if it wasn't free, I probably wouldn't play - take away the fancy graphics and combat system, there's virtually nothing there. Still, it certainly has Neverwinter trumped both graphically and functionally, and take away the foundry, the content is about as light. The real kicker here, is that Cryptic (or PWE, pick your poison) wants to charge you twice what En Masse is asking for similar items, and they're doing this while asking you to design your own stuff to do, and marketing it as a feature.

    On a secondary note, it blows me away that people are so crazy about the Foundry. It was in CoH and STO has it, and they weren't particularly exciting in either of those... But I digress.

    At least Tera is fully aware of what it is. Neverwinter is a county fair masquerading as a major theme park.

    Good lord, its like I've met my doppelgangers in this thread.
    Tyestor - Great Weapon Fighter - Mindflayer
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    vylkervylker Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 133 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    Try Paypal, it works great
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    dracuasdracuas Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I'm honestly quite surprised how many people ***** about the microtransactions in a F2P model. You actually can have a great time in this game and achieve 'almost' everything you would need to be competitive without paying a dime.

    - Want extra bags = Do quests. quite a few drop bags.
    - Want nifty companions = Farm AD or gold and buy them.
    - Do bounty quests for Seals = better stuff.

    The only problem I have is that you should be able to earn respec coins. Sucks having to pay $6 if you want to respec.

    Cryptic wasn't lying when they said this game was 100% F2P. I have done all content on a GF and a DC without fancy Enchantments or Scrolls of Mass Life. However, I fear that a few weeks down the road, players who have paid vast amounts of money will have an incredibly unfair advantage in PvP, including the Gauntlgrym content they have yet to release. And while it is true that you can always buy Zen with Astral Diamonds, simply doing quests/professions/skirmishes is nowhere enough to realistically sustain yourself. I have tried and it is far too difficult to reach 24,000 rough astral diamonds on a daily basis. On Mindflayer, it currently costs 435,000 Astral Diamonds for 10 dollars worth of Zen. I'm sure the market will stabilize soon, but even then it will take non-paying players to take upwards of two weeks to upgrade a single Enchantment.

    think on that for a little bit, from reddit.

    As for zen problems I had to wait 3 days on one transaction, 4 days on a different transaction, contacted both paypal and credit company transaction went thru instant it is something on perfect worlds side and contacting them is nigh impossible and then you get a automated email response and have to wait even longer, this has nothing to do with anyone else but perfect world anyone saying otherwise is lying....
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