I kind wish some of their powers had faster start up time... Gloaming cut is pretty slow to execute, and its range is kinda HAMSTER... I was kind of expecting it to let me dodge out of the way then hit Gloaming Cut to slide back into melee range with a slash... But it falls short about 10'.
Blade Flurry, while really cool looking, takes too long to execute as well, and makes me feel like a sitting duck when attacking a group.
Path of Blade - Same thing... Takes too long to start up... And its damage is pretty poor.
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xylonezMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 2Arc User
I find Bloodbath to be much more effective against single targets than groups. I've seen it take half a boss's health by itself. As AoE it's pretty weak, especially in the early game when you don't have any other AoE's to finish off the damaged mobs.
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velleriandMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited March 2013
I'm late to the thread, but I loved your post.
My thoughts on Stealth:
In every MMO I've played, which is most of them, my favorite Stealth mechanic is still EQ1. It was a skill you had to train and get better at, you had to play it smart, sneak and hide behind your targets, avoid lines of sight, don't get too close, etc.
While I loved my Rogue in WoW, the Stealth was rather boring, aside from PvP. There were a lot of ways to get revealed or spotted in PvP and it made it a little exciting, sneaking through a battlefield, trying to get behind someone without being spotted or knocked into view by a AoE spell.
EQ2 and SW:ToR: Stealth was pretty boring and you could have it on all the bloody time.
DDO: They did a pretty good job with stealth, I thought. It was very hard to sneak near mobs, and you could still be heard from pretty far. They accounted for everything you would in a P&P game. Armor, skill bonus, enemies listen skill, enemies spot, and even lighting. I enjoyed it, it was fun and challenging. You also had to be picky with when to use it, as it made you rather slow, and your party would run off ahead of you.
I would like to see maybe a longer lasting version of stealth, with the possibility of sneaking past mobs/players, with any number of variables determining success or failure. I am not terribly familiar with 4ED, so I have no idea how skills or abilities like stealth work.
I only played my Trickster Rogue to level 9. I very much enjoyed him, as I did the Control Wizard and Devoted Cleric. I have only spent a very little time with the tank, but the block feature seemed interesting.
I hesitate to play too much now. I'd really like some surprises during the headstart.
I kind wish some of their powers had faster start up time... Gloaming cut is pretty slow to execute, and its range is kinda HAMSTER... I was kind of expecting it to let me dodge out of the way then hit Gloaming Cut to slide back into melee range with a slash... But it falls short about 10'.
Blade Flurry, while really cool looking, takes too long to execute as well, and makes me feel like a sitting duck when attacking a group.
Path of Blade - Same thing... Takes too long to start up... And its damage is pretty poor.
I have to agree with this. Path of Blades takes to long, and the animation looks like you're a Cleric of the Blade god or something. Not bad really, but it doesn't seem to fit thematically. Duelists Flurry's second strike could be shortened by half a second also if it needs any startup at all. You still take damage while it's being executed so I don't think it even needs an extra .5th of a second.
I haven't hit 30 yet to comment on Gloaming Cut.
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psyt2Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 22Arc User
edited March 2013
Duelist Flurry I agree needs the windup lowered. Especially for group dungeons. Things die so fast or the boss moves around so much that its a dps loss to use it since the windup takes so long.
Not specifically related to this one class but I would like more weapon type options. Maces, longswords/shortswords on rogues and fighters. Short sword, quarterstaff for priests and wizards.
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ethanloveMember, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 4Arc User
edited March 2013
2) High single-target SUSTAINED damage: Stealth -> Lashing Blade -> Dazing Strike -> Impact Shot
i find this pretty disappointing after lower levels because of the long cooldown and also the damage output on impact shot, it would be more fit to tactical uses instead of single target
the latter i would go would be
Dazing Strike -> Sly Flourish until daze over -> Stealth -> Bait and Switch -> Lashing Blade -> Sly Flourish -> (chip damage or get away) Dazing strike should be in around 3 sec -> Dazing Strike -> Sly Flourish
Bait & Switch is around 11 sec and Lashing around 9 sec with Dazzle at 6-5 sec of CD
It's also useful to note that Shadow Strike also refills your stealth meter WHILE in stealth and does not remove you from stealth.
My personal setup was Sly Flourish/Cloud of Steel -- Lashing Blade/Bait and Switch/Shadow Strike -- Lurker's Assault
Rotation: Start off Sly Flourish in to Stealth -> Flourish till low stealth, then Bait and Switch to refill stealth --> Flourish until low again, then Shadow Strike to refill stealth --> Flourish until low, then finish with Lashing Blade. Rinse and Repeat.
This setup lets be in stealth almost 100% of the time. I pretty much dominated the damage charts against other rogues.
It's also useful to note that Shadow Strike also refills your stealth meter WHILE in stealth and does not remove you from stealth.
My personal setup was Sly Flourish/Cloud of Steel -- Lashing Blade/Bait and Switch/Shadow Strike -- Lurker's Assault
Rotation: Start off Sly Flourish in to Stealth -> Flourish till low stealth, then Bait and Switch to refill stealth --> Flourish until low again, then Shadow Strike to refill stealth --> Flourish until low, then finish with Lashing Blade. Rinse and Repeat.
This setup lets be in stealth almost 100% of the time. I pretty much dominated the damage charts against other rogues.
So my build is a bit different but took major advantage of long lasting stealth I had for my encounters Path of the Blade, Bait n Switch, a and Shadow strike for my at wills (after 30) Glooming cut and Sly flourish, ((duelist Flurry is awesome but for Boss battles they like to jump constantly around the battle field making it very difficult to get off, or great on paper hard to use in practicality))
As I run into battle I would Path of blade> Stealth> get near targets, Bait N switch, Start Executing lowest HP mobs with glooming cut letting Path of blades soften up everyone else, Specced for stealth you can swing glooming cut 3 times before running out of stealth and if GC killed it refills your stealth bar if I got low, I would Shadow strike to refill. Often times in battle i would have all my encounters back before Running out of stealth,
ps Glooming cut is abit slow but it Lunges you towards your target and Hits really hard for an at will.
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papi032Member, Neverwinter Beta UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited March 2013
Reading the thread i think i'm one of the few that didn't use Bait n switch. I found the "shadow clone" to die very quickly and not offer me much except for the stealth refill. Don't get me wrong, the refill is great, i just play differently. My "rotation" was: Stealth>Duelist Flurry>Lashing Blade(from stealth)>Shadow Strike>Stealth>Duelist Flurry>Dazing Strike>Duelist Flurry. When fighting a lot of weak mobs i would just use Sly Flourish 1 or 2 hits then kill the target with Gloaming Cut, you can basically stay invisible all the time.. The thing that is making me consider if i'm going to play was the rooting in place on abilities, even at-wills. Mobs move and hit, while you can't. Imagine in a pvp setting, say a duel vs any class, if you don't use Dazing Strike from stealth you won't hit anybody with it. The 3 secs it takes to "channel" it, any opponent with some pvp knowledge would just move and you'd hit the ground, which is stupid. Other abilities that are close to instant execution time are ok, but at-wills HAVE to be root-free. If a player is kiting you, you can't keep up with him and hit him with at-wills at the same time. I see this as a disadvantage. There doesn't have to be a run and cast system, but for auto attacks it does, or make channeling spells not being able to miss if the target moves or something similar. Some may think it takes away the "skill" aspect of hitting somebody but it really doesn't. I'd pay money for a rogue to hit a moving player with Dazing Strike. Same goes for other classes accordingly.
My trickster i got to level 40 on beta 2 weekend, was critting over 10k damage. The biggest damage boost for trickster rogues is to sustain damage in stealth and right when the meter is going to deplete, use a finishing move to get the last benefit of the damage boost. Melee'ing while in stealth does not break it, allowing you to maximize your damage, while using finishing moves to increase your damage as the finishing attack, only then to replenish stealth. My upkeep of stealth is almost 90% for an entire dungeon during combat. Master that and your damage will be huge.
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til3m0verMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 9Arc User
edited March 2013
This thread makes me more excited for the next beta weekend. I played my Trickster Rogue to 30 last weekend. Can't wait to get him even further this time. And now I'm a Guardian too. Great write-up!
Guys, i'm new to game, but i'd used to understand combat mechanics (played WoW for a long years).
I've noticed, thatn when i hit one target with Sly Flourish for a long time damage getts buffed dramaticly (from 40 at beginning to 1000-1500 when mob dies).
I have fairy questions.
WTF is that? where can i see that buff? When does it falls and is it applied to me or to my target?
Guys, i'm new to game, but i'd used to understand combat mechanics (played WoW for a long years).
I've noticed, thatn when i hit one target with Sly Flourish for a long time damage getts buffed dramaticly (from 40 at beginning to 1000-1500 when mob dies).
I have fairy questions.
WTF is that? where can i see that buff? When does it falls and is it applied to me or to my target?
The game keeps a tally on how much damage you chain on consecutive hits.
IF you deal, 130 hit, 156 hit, 154 hit. then stop, you will see a 440 total shown.
This helps you keep track of total damage you are doing. especially when using something like duelist furry which chains a ton of hits quickly, or blades of steel.
The game keeps a tally on how much damage you chain on consecutive hits.
IF you deal, 130 hit, 156 hit, 154 hit. then stop, you will see a 440 total shown.
This helps you keep track of total damage you are doing. especially when using something like duelist furry which chains a ton of hits quickly, or blades of steel.
Thanks.
So rogue have just 5 stacks of attack speed, like mage have arcane stacks. But rogues don't have visual buff. Too bad for them
Comments
Blade Flurry, while really cool looking, takes too long to execute as well, and makes me feel like a sitting duck when attacking a group.
Path of Blade - Same thing... Takes too long to start up... And its damage is pretty poor.
My thoughts on Stealth:
In every MMO I've played, which is most of them, my favorite Stealth mechanic is still EQ1. It was a skill you had to train and get better at, you had to play it smart, sneak and hide behind your targets, avoid lines of sight, don't get too close, etc.
While I loved my Rogue in WoW, the Stealth was rather boring, aside from PvP. There were a lot of ways to get revealed or spotted in PvP and it made it a little exciting, sneaking through a battlefield, trying to get behind someone without being spotted or knocked into view by a AoE spell.
EQ2 and SW:ToR: Stealth was pretty boring and you could have it on all the bloody time.
DDO: They did a pretty good job with stealth, I thought. It was very hard to sneak near mobs, and you could still be heard from pretty far. They accounted for everything you would in a P&P game. Armor, skill bonus, enemies listen skill, enemies spot, and even lighting. I enjoyed it, it was fun and challenging. You also had to be picky with when to use it, as it made you rather slow, and your party would run off ahead of you.
I would like to see maybe a longer lasting version of stealth, with the possibility of sneaking past mobs/players, with any number of variables determining success or failure. I am not terribly familiar with 4ED, so I have no idea how skills or abilities like stealth work.
I only played my Trickster Rogue to level 9. I very much enjoyed him, as I did the Control Wizard and Devoted Cleric. I have only spent a very little time with the tank, but the block feature seemed interesting.
I hesitate to play too much now. I'd really like some surprises during the headstart.
Kain - Guardian Fighter
I have to agree with this. Path of Blades takes to long, and the animation looks like you're a Cleric of the Blade god or something. Not bad really, but it doesn't seem to fit thematically. Duelists Flurry's second strike could be shortened by half a second also if it needs any startup at all. You still take damage while it's being executed so I don't think it even needs an extra .5th of a second.
I haven't hit 30 yet to comment on Gloaming Cut.
Not specifically related to this one class but I would like more weapon type options. Maces, longswords/shortswords on rogues and fighters. Short sword, quarterstaff for priests and wizards.
i find this pretty disappointing after lower levels because of the long cooldown and also the damage output on impact shot, it would be more fit to tactical uses instead of single target
the latter i would go would be
Dazing Strike -> Sly Flourish until daze over -> Stealth -> Bait and Switch -> Lashing Blade -> Sly Flourish -> (chip damage or get away) Dazing strike should be in around 3 sec -> Dazing Strike -> Sly Flourish
Bait & Switch is around 11 sec and Lashing around 9 sec with Dazzle at 6-5 sec of CD
My personal setup was Sly Flourish/Cloud of Steel -- Lashing Blade/Bait and Switch/Shadow Strike -- Lurker's Assault
Rotation: Start off Sly Flourish in to Stealth -> Flourish till low stealth, then Bait and Switch to refill stealth --> Flourish until low again, then Shadow Strike to refill stealth --> Flourish until low, then finish with Lashing Blade. Rinse and Repeat.
This setup lets be in stealth almost 100% of the time. I pretty much dominated the damage charts against other rogues.
Nice I did the same, super easy and effective.
As I run into battle I would Path of blade> Stealth> get near targets, Bait N switch, Start Executing lowest HP mobs with glooming cut letting Path of blades soften up everyone else, Specced for stealth you can swing glooming cut 3 times before running out of stealth and if GC killed it refills your stealth bar if I got low, I would Shadow strike to refill. Often times in battle i would have all my encounters back before Running out of stealth,
ps Glooming cut is abit slow but it Lunges you towards your target and Hits really hard for an at will.
I've noticed, thatn when i hit one target with Sly Flourish for a long time damage getts buffed dramaticly (from 40 at beginning to 1000-1500 when mob dies).
I have fairy questions.
WTF is that? where can i see that buff? When does it falls and is it applied to me or to my target?
The game keeps a tally on how much damage you chain on consecutive hits.
IF you deal, 130 hit, 156 hit, 154 hit. then stop, you will see a 440 total shown.
This helps you keep track of total damage you are doing. especially when using something like duelist furry which chains a ton of hits quickly, or blades of steel.
Thanks.
So rogue have just 5 stacks of attack speed, like mage have arcane stacks. But rogues don't have visual buff. Too bad for them