This is how I feel. I paid 60 for founders pack as I'm totally fine paying 60 for a good game. Starting in June I'm going to buy 15 worth of zen. I hope this is enough to keep my characters in bags and enchants and such, sort of making my own sub based model. I'm starting to think it won't be enough, but I hope it will.
Ive been thinking the same, i havnt felt like im missing out or struggling because i havnt used zen and because im enjoying the game im going to spend 10-15 on zen each month. I did it for WoW just to play so if i do it for neverwinter and get to spend the 'sub' on mounts and stuff i feel pretty good about it. 'as long as i dont get forced to spend zen'
Install the other 2 Cryptic/PWE games and rotate between the three you will still be able to talk to ur pals (same chat server ) and you will never get bored ^__^
I ran some STO mishes with my Neverwinter pals and I've ran Neverwinter mishes with mah STO pals and logged into CO for the Grond jokes. Its win win win.
Are you on some kind of crusade or something? For someone that claims to know so much about PW and Cryptic and how they are perceived by millions of players, you sure spend a lot off time on their forums.
As for LoL, you can't compare the pricing model of a AAA F2P MMO and a F2P moba game. That's just silly.
Unless you're going to elaborate on those reasons, well aside from the appeal to ridicule, you took a perfectly valid post and attacked it for no reason. <_< Maybe he/she IS on a crusade, it would be nice to know I'm not the only one that see's the issue he/she highlights in their post, that it's NOT the developers, they're just being pushed into it by these churn and burn publishers/financiers who then monetize the game so that it gouges and burns itself out to all but the "whales" as they're known.
Are you on some kind of crusade or something? For someone that claims to know so much about PW and Cryptic and how they are perceived by millions of players, you sure spend a lot off time on their forums.
As for LoL, you can't compare the pricing model of a AAA F2P MMO and a F2P moba game. That's just silly.
Also, you have to buy champions in LoL, and the 6k IP point ones can take a week each of ranked matches to grind out. It isn't completely cosmetic when your ability to counter play your opponents hinges on you owning a vast swathe of the champion select pool and take is very time consuming (I played for almost an entire year and only had 2/3 the champions in mid 2012 when I stopped).
Dota 2, by comparison, is completely 100% cosmetic. Even Team Fortress 2 is risky with the rarity of some special weapons that aren't achievement perks that you need to get as random drops.
NW isn't the worst I've seen - it does reasonably better than most. It just has a Diablo 3 auction house going on (in an indirect way, and you can't get money out of it).
What would they add with a subscription ? You can do EVERY thing in this game for FREE . No fee for added levels , no fee to raid , no fee to use mail ect .
If you play 7 days in a row you can get a free ruin combiner , from the celestial coin vendor . I already see a bunch on the auction house for only 100000 AD .
You get bags following the quest line .
And you don't NEED one of the ' takes no damage ' companions , even though I'm guessing they will help at level 60 dungeons .
not everything is free you cant make a guild unless u donate money which is huge in mmorpgs
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vatashaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
Here is a simple idea that will help you with this game. Once a month buy about 15 bucks worth of zen......same price as a sub and with grinding zen you will have your stuff in a few months time just like if you had a sub in the game
Here is a simple idea that will help you with this game. Once a month buy about 15 bucks worth of zen......same price as a sub and with grinding zen you will have your stuff in a few months time just like if you had a sub in the game
except with a sub game you'd have had pretty much all those benefits from the word go..so its only really the same in the mind of deluded apologists who burned 200 dollars on one of PWE's ****hole products and has to justofy it to themselves.
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vatashaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
except with a sub game you'd have had pretty much all those benefits from the word go..so its only really the same in the mind of deluded apologists who burned 200 dollars on one of PWE's ****hole products and has to justofy it to themselves.
No, you don't get those benefits. try out wow and see how long it takes you to get big bags. So please stop with the entitle kiddy cry and either move on to other games or learn to manage your money. You could also get a good job that allows you to have some spending money. If you want any everything is free game then you are going to have to make it kiddo
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geist333xMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 1Arc User
edited May 2013
If you are complaining about a cash shop, maybe you shouldn't be playing a f2p game... They do need to make money to pay for their maintenance staff, to pay for their creative staff generating more content, and to pay for their hardware to actually run the game. But I would agree with what Vatasha said; set yourself a "monthly subscription rate" and purchase zen. $5, $10, or even $15 a month and you'll have plenty of zen for all of your end game needs.
btw, some people will tell you that you can convert ADs to Zen by playing the game
dont listen to them, they are idiots. even if you play every single day of the week, every single week of the month, and always always always cap your 24k ADs per day, it will take you 20 days for each 1000 zen item that you need. and beieve me, just for the wards your gonan need LOTs of them.
if you consider than not every day you can play, and that not everyday you will get the 24k (actually I doubt the average casual player makes more than 10k per day) your looking, at the very least, at double that time.
last but not least, factor in much better companions, bag/bank space/ respecs and mounts all for AD, and you have in front of you a multi-year grind
if you dont have ANY money nor will to spend it, and you like this game, yep, go ahead and keep playing. not like you have many other options
if you have money and are willing to spend it, but are concerned about getting the best bang for your bucks, this game is an all around bad deal in all fronts.
unless you are dying to play this and only this, there are plenty other games out there that will make you feel your getting your money's worth
1000 zen is $10 usd. You're also forgetting that the price of zen/ad will go down so you'll be able to get more zen with less. It's just expensive at the moment because all the founders have millions of AD and want zen. Thats why you see 450-500ad per zen.
Here is a simple idea that will help you with this game. Once a month buy about 15 bucks worth of zen......same price as a sub and with grinding zen you will have your stuff in a few months time just like if you had a sub in the game
Yeah except $15 will only buy you like a bag...
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hoistalldaybroMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 10Arc User
edited May 2013
Im not even level 60 yet and i've make 600k AD from selling on the AH. lol you are no where near limited to 24k a day. People are expecting the game to just hand them currency. Get to the AH, find out what is being sold (they could use a smoother AH, i'll say that), and play the market. This game actually allows for you to do a lot without having to pay. At this rate i'll have over 1M AD and i didnt spend a dime for any of it. Everyone is putting AD on a glorified throne when its actually quite easy to get.
Honestly the only thing that bothers me right now about this game is the companion issue.
...and not that there are some linked to the cash shop. The fact that there is no way currently to level the ones we can purchase from the vendor past rank 15. I don't even care if it costs AD myself for the tomes but not still having those implemented yet is fairly weak imo and they won't even comment on the matter.
Gonna be a serious pain in the *** to try and level those companions up considering many are starting to outlevel those companions.
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vatashaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
So? it will take you time to get yourself the stuff you want just like a sub mmo. The problem is the gimme now!! folk out there who cannot wait to have everything they think they need to play a game. Again manage your time and money and in 6 months time you will have all you need and likely have gotten it all a lot cheaper than the gimme now folks who got bored and moved to whatever the new game is, where they belly ache about how costly that game is
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hoistalldaybroMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 10Arc User
edited May 2013
Yea but once you get the higher levels and you can start selling good stuff you should be able to sell stuff in the AH for AD. There are some things in the game that people are always going to need and you can just make money off that. The people who can't just buy their way through can make AD off the people who do.
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coredump777Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 1Arc User
If you compare GW2 and Neverwinter's Cash-Shops you realize that Neverwinter got more important stuff in their Cash-Shop than what GW2 had.
But then you have to remember that GW2 cost $$$$$ to buy, but free to play.
Neverwinter is free to buy and free to play! (right? or will it cost money to buy the game after launch?)
SO ofc they have to put more important stuff in the shop... right or wrong.. oh well thats the turn MMOs are taking right now so if you dont like it you might have to consider leaving the MMOs and find some other thing to do?
This thread brings up a topic that I have really been hoping to discuss, so I hope you don't mind if I hijack your thread, kind sir.
I've played a number of Perfect World games, like Forsaken World and Perfect World International. All of these games are F2P, and if you're only interested in PvE, you will probably have a great time. Perfect World games usually feature large and beautiful worlds, and Neverwinter is certainly no disappointment. Unfortunately, Perfect World Entertainment seems to be somewhat of a scurrilous company that usually turns their cash shops into a pay-to-win enterprise. I fear that soon we will begin to undergo constant, if oh so subtle, encouragement to improve upon gear, mounts, and other things you cannot earn in-game. This has made PvP in previous Perfect World games almost impossible, because once the usual horde of cash shoppers arrives, players that are F2P don't stand a chance.
What I would like to know is what measures are the Moderators and Devs of the game taking to make sure that such a large rift in power is not opened between players who pay and players who don't. I hope I have an admin response.
F2P models are killing themselves on currency exchange the more it costs to develop. Neverwinter is the worst exchange rate I have ever seen, and I won't be spending any further money on this game.
I expect a shelf life of 6 months or so depending on how my guild progresses and whether we jump ship for ESO. Ultimately I don't think consumers can expect a decent subscription business model MMO until Blizzard's Project Titan is out in 2015.
So? it will take you time to get yourself the stuff you want just like a sub mmo. The problem is the gimme now!! folk out there who cannot wait to have everything they think they need to play a game. Again manage your time and money and in 6 months time you will have all you need and likely have gotten it all a lot cheaper than the gimme now folks who got bored and moved to whatever the new game is, where they belly ache about how costly that game is
You just don't get it though, $15 for a bag is not acceptable, it's not about 'gimme everything now' it's the unreasonable costs.
Also to what you said earlier about WoW and seeing how long it takes you to get 'big bags' it takes less than an hour to get a decent set of bags (Go mine some copper ore, smelt it and sell the stacks then buy some 16 slot bags, it's bloody quick).
Gimme gear is one thing, gimme a bag is another.
If you're that ****ing hollow in the head to defend this kind of micro transaction then you need a good look at yourself.
Yea but once you get the higher levels and you can start selling good stuff you should be able to sell stuff in the AH for AD. There are some things in the game that people are always going to need and you can just make money off that. The people who can't just buy their way through can make AD off the people who do.
PROBLEM: Free To Play + High playercount + limited slots for characters = saturation of high level players which then leads to?
An abundance of drops, which then moves on to further saturation in the market of those BOE drops, so if you think that the short term workable economy right now allowing you to sell epics you need spam on will sustain itself...
Yeah.... I don't need to actually continue do I?
There may be a few developmental changes, that will help in some abstract ways, and YES FOLKS, we ARE aware this is a business... thanks for reminding. For the billionth time. But the simple fact is shortsighted-ness is JUST as bad as hyperbole.
you can convert ad into zen like other cryptic games. unlike other cryptic games its imposable to earn good ad in this game and the cash shop unlike their other games i ridiculous I think this game was put out just to make them money to satisfy investors and was never ment to be a long term game.
This thread brings up a topic that I have really been hoping to discuss, so I hope you don't mind if I hijack your thread, kind sir.
I've played a number of Perfect World games, like Forsaken World and Perfect World International. All of these games are F2P, and if you're only interested in PvE, you will probably have a great time. Perfect World games usually feature large and beautiful worlds, and Neverwinter is certainly no disappointment. Unfortunately, Perfect World Entertainment seems to be somewhat of a scurrilous company that usually turns their cash shops into a pay-to-win enterprise. I fear that soon we will begin to undergo constant, if oh so subtle, encouragement to improve upon gear, mounts, and other things you cannot earn in-game. This has made PvP in previous Perfect World games almost impossible, because once the usual horde of cash shoppers arrives, players that are F2P don't stand a chance.
What I would like to know is what measures are the Moderators and Devs of the game taking to make sure that such a large rift in power is not opened between players who pay and players who don't. I hope I have an admin response.
You're better off making a new thread about this, but do make sure that you construct it in a manner that is NOT going to violate their TOS and just get banned and don't make any false assumptions etc in it.
Only thing I paid for was a mount because I wanted one. Thats the only advantage ud be able to p2w PVP wise.
So no this game isnt p2w, maybe 50/50 for PvE but who really cares about that?
Not everyone in game is going to spend cash idk what world you QQ live in?
movement speed in a pvp mode where capturing points is important, is in FACT a huge advantage and cannot be denied, they only need limit mount speeds to even it out a little to balance it.
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vatashaMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero UsersPosts: 0Arc User
You just don't get it though, $15 for a bag is not acceptable, it's not about 'gimme everything now' it's the unreasonable costs.
Also to what you said earlier about WoW and seeing how long it takes you to get 'big bags' it takes less than an hour to get a decent set of bags (Go mine some copper ore, smelt it and sell the stacks then buy some 16 slot bags, it's bloody quick).
Gimme gear is one thing, gimme a bag is another.
If you're that ****ing hollow in the head to defend this kind of micro transaction then you need a good look at yourself.
Then don't buy a bag. You can and will get them in game. Again learn to manage your money and your wants and needs. I am sorry that you are poor and feel this game is to costly for you but that is how these games work kiddo. Either you adapt or you don't. Also you are an idiot if you think mining copper for an hour will buy you anything more than a 8 slot bag in wow. I would have to be hollow headed to believe that tall tale
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exshinMember, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian UsersPosts: 0Arc User
edited May 2013
"Oh hey I don't mind spending $15 a month on a game but make me spend $10 for something in a free game and **** is ****ing ridiculous."
Seems people in this thread don't remember the grind required for the spell cloth / moon cloth bags in WoW.
You want a 24 slot bag(biggest available in the game) readily available for purchase at an NPC for your liking?
Let's say they did make bags craftable for, oh, level 20 tailors. And it required the same amount of effort to not only level your tailoring to 20. But wait! There is a 48hr CD to make the one of the 6 said items required to make said bag. 12 days is suitable to you to make a 24slot bag? Mind you this doesn't include the days spent to get your tailoring to 20. Nor the time you spend kitting yourself out with a 24slot bag for each bag slot.
I assure you, these bags would cost far more AD than the simple conversion of 1k Zen -> 500k AD. But hey, you don't want to pay 500K for the bag right? So naturally you exchange your AD either for Zen or to buy a bag from someone who supported the game to give you the opportunity to own said 'precious'[enter smeagle monologue here].
So this is the point where you read my post and then exclaim 'BUT WE WANT OPTIONS!!!' I say to you, suck it up. If you do your dailies, and refine 24k AD a day, you'll have your precious bag in no time flat. Best part is? You didn't have to foot a penny.
Comments
Ive been thinking the same, i havnt felt like im missing out or struggling because i havnt used zen and because im enjoying the game im going to spend 10-15 on zen each month. I did it for WoW just to play so if i do it for neverwinter and get to spend the 'sub' on mounts and stuff i feel pretty good about it. 'as long as i dont get forced to spend zen'
I ran some STO mishes with my Neverwinter pals and I've ran Neverwinter mishes with mah STO pals and logged into CO for the Grond jokes. Its win win win.
Nepht and Dr Deflecto on primus
Unless you're going to elaborate on those reasons, well aside from the appeal to ridicule, you took a perfectly valid post and attacked it for no reason. <_< Maybe he/she IS on a crusade, it would be nice to know I'm not the only one that see's the issue he/she highlights in their post, that it's NOT the developers, they're just being pushed into it by these churn and burn publishers/financiers who then monetize the game so that it gouges and burns itself out to all but the "whales" as they're known.
Also, you have to buy champions in LoL, and the 6k IP point ones can take a week each of ranked matches to grind out. It isn't completely cosmetic when your ability to counter play your opponents hinges on you owning a vast swathe of the champion select pool and take is very time consuming (I played for almost an entire year and only had 2/3 the champions in mid 2012 when I stopped).
Dota 2, by comparison, is completely 100% cosmetic. Even Team Fortress 2 is risky with the rarity of some special weapons that aren't achievement perks that you need to get as random drops.
NW isn't the worst I've seen - it does reasonably better than most. It just has a Diablo 3 auction house going on (in an indirect way, and you can't get money out of it).
not everything is free you cant make a guild unless u donate money which is huge in mmorpgs
except with a sub game you'd have had pretty much all those benefits from the word go..so its only really the same in the mind of deluded apologists who burned 200 dollars on one of PWE's ****hole products and has to justofy it to themselves.
No, you don't get those benefits. try out wow and see how long it takes you to get big bags. So please stop with the entitle kiddy cry and either move on to other games or learn to manage your money. You could also get a good job that allows you to have some spending money. If you want any everything is free game then you are going to have to make it kiddo
1000 zen is $10 usd. You're also forgetting that the price of zen/ad will go down so you'll be able to get more zen with less. It's just expensive at the moment because all the founders have millions of AD and want zen. Thats why you see 450-500ad per zen.
Yeah except $15 will only buy you like a bag...
...and not that there are some linked to the cash shop. The fact that there is no way currently to level the ones we can purchase from the vendor past rank 15. I don't even care if it costs AD myself for the tomes but not still having those implemented yet is fairly weak imo and they won't even comment on the matter.
Gonna be a serious pain in the *** to try and level those companions up considering many are starting to outlevel those companions.
So? it will take you time to get yourself the stuff you want just like a sub mmo. The problem is the gimme now!! folk out there who cannot wait to have everything they think they need to play a game. Again manage your time and money and in 6 months time you will have all you need and likely have gotten it all a lot cheaper than the gimme now folks who got bored and moved to whatever the new game is, where they belly ache about how costly that game is
But then you have to remember that GW2 cost $$$$$ to buy, but free to play.
Neverwinter is free to buy and free to play! (right? or will it cost money to buy the game after launch?)
SO ofc they have to put more important stuff in the shop... right or wrong.. oh well thats the turn MMOs are taking right now so if you dont like it you might have to consider leaving the MMOs and find some other thing to do?
I've played a number of Perfect World games, like Forsaken World and Perfect World International. All of these games are F2P, and if you're only interested in PvE, you will probably have a great time. Perfect World games usually feature large and beautiful worlds, and Neverwinter is certainly no disappointment. Unfortunately, Perfect World Entertainment seems to be somewhat of a scurrilous company that usually turns their cash shops into a pay-to-win enterprise. I fear that soon we will begin to undergo constant, if oh so subtle, encouragement to improve upon gear, mounts, and other things you cannot earn in-game. This has made PvP in previous Perfect World games almost impossible, because once the usual horde of cash shoppers arrives, players that are F2P don't stand a chance.
What I would like to know is what measures are the Moderators and Devs of the game taking to make sure that such a large rift in power is not opened between players who pay and players who don't. I hope I have an admin response.
Join Us|Officer of The Noore|Nyan Cat
F2P models are killing themselves on currency exchange the more it costs to develop. Neverwinter is the worst exchange rate I have ever seen, and I won't be spending any further money on this game.
I expect a shelf life of 6 months or so depending on how my guild progresses and whether we jump ship for ESO. Ultimately I don't think consumers can expect a decent subscription business model MMO until Blizzard's Project Titan is out in 2015.
+1 for this....
Let me pay you $60 at front and $15 a month after that, but remove the chash shop from my account. Thank you.
You just don't get it though, $15 for a bag is not acceptable, it's not about 'gimme everything now' it's the unreasonable costs.
Also to what you said earlier about WoW and seeing how long it takes you to get 'big bags' it takes less than an hour to get a decent set of bags (Go mine some copper ore, smelt it and sell the stacks then buy some 16 slot bags, it's bloody quick).
Gimme gear is one thing, gimme a bag is another.
If you're that ****ing hollow in the head to defend this kind of micro transaction then you need a good look at yourself.
PROBLEM: Free To Play + High playercount + limited slots for characters = saturation of high level players which then leads to?
An abundance of drops, which then moves on to further saturation in the market of those BOE drops, so if you think that the short term workable economy right now allowing you to sell epics you need spam on will sustain itself...
Yeah.... I don't need to actually continue do I?
There may be a few developmental changes, that will help in some abstract ways, and YES FOLKS, we ARE aware this is a business... thanks for reminding. For the billionth time. But the simple fact is shortsighted-ness is JUST as bad as hyperbole.
So no this game isnt p2w, maybe 50/50 for PvE but who really cares about that?
Not everyone in game is going to spend cash idk what world you QQ live in?
You're better off making a new thread about this, but do make sure that you construct it in a manner that is NOT going to violate their TOS and just get banned and don't make any false assumptions etc in it.
movement speed in a pvp mode where capturing points is important, is in FACT a huge advantage and cannot be denied, they only need limit mount speeds to even it out a little to balance it.
Then don't buy a bag. You can and will get them in game. Again learn to manage your money and your wants and needs. I am sorry that you are poor and feel this game is to costly for you but that is how these games work kiddo. Either you adapt or you don't. Also you are an idiot if you think mining copper for an hour will buy you anything more than a 8 slot bag in wow. I would have to be hollow headed to believe that tall tale
Seriously? >.>
You want a 24 slot bag(biggest available in the game) readily available for purchase at an NPC for your liking?
Let's say they did make bags craftable for, oh, level 20 tailors. And it required the same amount of effort to not only level your tailoring to 20. But wait! There is a 48hr CD to make the one of the 6 said items required to make said bag. 12 days is suitable to you to make a 24slot bag? Mind you this doesn't include the days spent to get your tailoring to 20. Nor the time you spend kitting yourself out with a 24slot bag for each bag slot.
I assure you, these bags would cost far more AD than the simple conversion of 1k Zen -> 500k AD. But hey, you don't want to pay 500K for the bag right? So naturally you exchange your AD either for Zen or to buy a bag from someone who supported the game to give you the opportunity to own said 'precious'[enter smeagle monologue here].
So this is the point where you read my post and then exclaim 'BUT WE WANT OPTIONS!!!' I say to you, suck it up. If you do your dailies, and refine 24k AD a day, you'll have your precious bag in no time flat. Best part is? You didn't have to foot a penny.