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Do something about CC please.

giantsnygiantsny Member Posts: 0 Arc User
edited May 2013 in PvE Discussion
There needs to be diminishing returns on CC in pvp, a wizard can CC someone to death while the whole team beats on you without you having a chance to run or fight back.
Post edited by giantsny on
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Comments

  • wygrathwygrath Member Posts: 9 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    You do realize that the whole class revolves around crowd control right? If you take that away Control Wizards (See? It's right there in the name of the class.) will just be bait for anyone to waltz up to and beat down.
  • aevlomaevlom Member Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Using your reasoning then, there needs to be diminishing returns on GF's using shield block. First block is normal, then each after soaks up less damage, until it's useless. And while they're at it, there should be diminishing returns on rogues' dagger attacks, each attack in succession should decrease exponentially until damage hits 1 per hit.
  • maxpoweryomaxpoweryo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 20 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    You are right, perma cc from wizards is totally broken. Anyone with some experience in pvp and a bit of common sense understands that. Its actually really funny that some ppl try to defend it. From what ive seen most of the community realizes that its broken. Hopefully Cryptic will fix it soon.
  • supjeremiahsupjeremiah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 569 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    aevlom wrote: »
    Using your reasoning then, there needs to be diminishing returns on GF's using shield block. First block is normal, then each after soaks up less damage, until it's useless. And while they're at it, there should be diminishing returns on rogues' dagger attacks, each attack in succession should decrease exponentially until damage hits 1 per hit.

    It's not quite the same. There is no counterplay to wizard cc. With a GF you can burn through their block, or hit them from behind. With a Rogue, you can have high defense / health. With a wizard you can eat CC until you die.
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  • novathelegendnovathelegend Member Posts: 13 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    The best way to counter a wizard in PvP is another wizard, or group up. I play a wizard, and yes 1 v 1 I can be dangerous, if I'm not stunlocked by a rogue constantly, but it definitely can be countered with team work. CC is subpar in PvE as it is, so I hope it's not nerfed for the sake of PvP.
    Commanding Officer of Task Force Midnight
  • mattkrueg1mattkrueg1 Member Posts: 46
    edited May 2013
    aevlom wrote: »
    Using your reasoning then, there needs to be diminishing returns on GF's using shield block. First block is normal, then each after soaks up less damage, until it's useless. And while they're at it, there should be diminishing returns on rogues' dagger attacks, each attack in succession should decrease exponentially until damage hits 1 per hit.

    GF can't block forever. There IS diminishing returns, but we have abilities that can slow that down. After a certain amount of damage has been done, we can't block for something like 10 seconds.
    TEMPUS
  • dboss777dboss777 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users Posts: 37
    edited May 2013
    Put pressure on the wizard then, make him D up and dodge or do other things other than allowing him to free cast on you. This same argument is used by people who say NERF ROGUE because they just let Rogues train them with out using countermeasures. Play the game and stop crying.
  • aevlomaevlom Member Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    mattkrueg1 wrote: »
    GF can't block forever. There IS diminishing returns, but we have abilities that can slow that down. After a certain amount of damage has been done, we can't block for something like 10 seconds.

    And wizard encounters and dailies have cooldowns as well.
  • dirtydicknastydirtydicknasty Member Posts: 11 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    LOL, the game has only been launched for a day and a half, relax. Just like every single MMO they will come around to class fixes, i rather them work on the wrold fixes and crashes first before anyhting
  • aevlomaevlom Member Posts: 117 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    supjeremiah wrote: »
    It's not quite the same. There is no counterplay to wizard cc. With a GF you can burn through their block, or hit them from behind. With a Rogue, you can have high defense / health. With a wizard you can eat CC until you die.

    To avoid wizard CC, using your examples, you dodge/sprint/roll to avoid the spell, and hit the wizard when all of his dailies and encounters are on cooldown. Alternatively, hit him/her from behind.
    It is the same. Rogues have no cooldowns on their at-will massive dps. Are you suggesting they need at-will attack diminishing returns? After all, they spam at-wills until you die.
  • kentiahkentiah Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 2 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    aevlom wrote: »
    To avoid wizard CC, using your examples, you dodge/sprint/roll to avoid the spell, and hit the wizard when all of his dailies and encounters are on cooldown. Alternatively, hit him/her from behind.
    It is the same. Rogues have no cooldowns on their at-will massive dps. Are you suggesting they need at-will attack diminishing returns? After all, they spam at-wills until you die.

    You can't really "sprint" the majority of CW CCs. Sprint offers absolutely no invulnerability.
  • drekorsilverfangdrekorsilverfang Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 18 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I just go immune to CC and then chain CC the control wizard, makes for some good fun :)
  • gomok72gomok72 Member Posts: 616 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Same with a Rogue.

    If they start nerfing abilities for PvP (and I like PvP) I would be done with this game before it starts. They should leave everything as is, I would suggest to you, learn how to optimize them to counter control wizards.
    Rogues do damage and have a lot of utility for burning down "all" classes in this game especially wizards.
    I may not be considered by most the BEST PVP Warlock on the server but, I am the most HATED amongst them.

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  • gomok72gomok72 Member Posts: 616 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    maxpoweryo wrote: »
    You are right, perma cc from wizards is totally broken. Anyone with some experience in pvp and a bit of common sense understands that. Its actually really funny that some ppl try to defend it. From what ive seen most of the community realizes that its broken. Hopefully Cryptic will fix it soon.


    You do realize this is a PvE focused game, right?

    PvP is a straight novelty to help people level and get decently geared for level 60. On a note also, I don't understand why people whine and cry about "control" wizards "controlling" them. You guys will really cry once scourge Warlocks and rangers (ranged strikers) are in the game pvping.
    I may not be considered by most the BEST PVP Warlock on the server but, I am the most HATED amongst them.

    -Kymos
  • pyrosarashipyrosarashi Member, Neverwinter Beta Users Posts: 15 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    gomok72 wrote: »
    You do realize this is a PvE focused game, right?

    PvP is a straight novelty to help people level and get decently geared for level 60. On a note also, I don't understand why people whine and cry about "control" wizards "controlling" them. You guys will really cry once scourge Warlocks and rangers (ranged strikers) are in the game pvping.

    Agree on the PvE game stuff, but it's generally commonplace nowadays to have diminishing returns or similar mechanics. It's not so bad when it's one wizard, but with the right feats, you can have 3wizards chaining their daily, the one that pulls you then throws you in the air. That basically prevents any melee from doing anything, and because of the duration of the daily if you have the feats to get AP on controlled targets and on crits, you can just chain it if there's another wizard around, all the while spamming aoes in the bunch. It's absolutely stupid and there is no counter.

    As a CW myself I think the class is definitely fairly stupid in pvp, but yeah didn't expect much anyway about pvp. I can generally fight 1vs2 and win against melees, because of the constant slows/stuns/knockbacks/dodges. Also the damage is pretty good. Obviously can't win against a CW+something else unless they're terrible or speced badly and clerics tend to make the fights too long so there's always some sort of reinforcement anyway.
  • derresshderressh Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    Counters to CW:

    GF block makes you immune to CC
    GWF Unstoppable makes you immune to CC
    TR stealth + Impossible To Catch Encounter power
  • bejita231bejita231 Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 18 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    CC is their to counter overpowered rogues and is the only counter to them, nerf rogues then you can nerf CW CC
  • anglachel87anglachel87 Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    I was wondering if there was a diminishing return mechanic on them because even at lvl 6 I saw that you can potentially lock a target forever (if dummy target).

    But, you should have a team too which can blast the hell out of the CW and as some other ppl said there are enough counters to CCs and spells. Seeing as this game works you need more awarness.
  • imivoimivo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1,682 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    What level is that at? My CC (wizard) doesn't last nearly long enough to kill someone. Sure, if it is 5 on 1, but then you should not survive that. If you did, something would be wrong. I notice I often get ignored in PvP and can free-cast, so this is more of a player issue than one of game balance.
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  • imivoimivo Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Hero Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 1,682 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    anglachel87 wrote: »
    I was wondering if there was a diminishing return mechanic on them because even at lvl 6 I saw that you can potentially lock a target forever (if dummy target).

    CC in PvP lasts only a fraction of what it does in PvE. You cannot chain CC anyone by yourself.
    Unsure about skills and feats? Check the Master List of Class Builds!
  • massytalkmassytalk Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 10 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    giantsny wrote: »
    There needs to be diminishing returns on CC in pvp, a wizard can CC someone to death while the whole team beats on you without you having a chance to run or fight back.

    Typical Rogue Town Cryer... Lets nerf Paper because Rock beats Scissors...
  • stereoblindxstereoblindx Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 246 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    CC is fine. There's nothing they can do aside from giving each class like %5 stamina regen buffs in PvP that wouldn't render one class or the other less useful. It's your team composition that is keeping you stunlocked and getting you killed, not just one class.
  • besharpebesharpe Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    You can't chain someone by yourself. Plus that CC is the only way I stand a chance against a Thief. The main issue is people let you free cast. I am constantly number 1 because no one bothers to attack me, except, a smart rogue or 2. They tend to focus healers if anything, however, most of the time I sit back laugh as they try to kill the tanks and let me free cast on them the whole game.

    It's just the beginning stop your complaining at wait for PVP at Cap Level and when people actually try and play well. Then come back in and list your constructive list of improvements.
  • anglachel87anglachel87 Member Posts: 23 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    besharpe wrote: »
    It's just the beginning stop your complaining at wait for PVP at Cap Level and when people actually try and play well.

    QFT

    And btw it looks like the way you can customize a class can refine the basic gameplay a lot so that's probably a minor factor as the game polishes up.
  • davvindavvin Member Posts: 3 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    imivo wrote: »
    CC in PvP lasts only a fraction of what it does in PvE. You cannot chain CC anyone by yourself.

    Doesn't help when the other team has 3 control wizards.
  • spellwardenspellwarden Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 357 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    agreed. l2p and stop crying. I have alot of patience, and trust me, it has been tried to the edge these past days with people complaining without actually trying a different tactic.

    Shut up about nerfs because you suck.
    I aint aiming to be accomodating. And if it is such a problem, then roll a wiz, 3 days and you are lvl 60 ffs!
  • eros1986eros1986 Member Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    maxpoweryo wrote: »
    You are right, perma cc from wizards is totally broken. Anyone with some experience in pvp and a bit of common sense understands that. Its actually really funny that some ppl try to defend it. From what ive seen most of the community realizes that its broken. Hopefully Cryptic will fix it soon.

    expect no balance in pvp, and a strong opposition by the community, NW fans are generally more pve orientedn and too much attached to a pen and paper thing to understand MMO mechanics.
    If I where you i will stay away of pvp for a looong time..or simply roll a CW for it, everyone and their dogs know that CC win pvp
  • darqiondarqion Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 0 Arc User
    edited May 2013
    eros1986 wrote: »
    expect no balance in pvp, and a strong opposition by the community, NW fans are generally more pve orientedn and too much attached to a pen and paper thing to understand MMO mechanics.
    If I where you i will stay away of pvp for a looong time..or simply roll a CW for it, everyone and their dogs know that CC win pvp

    You know enough NW fans to make generalized claims? MMo mechanics.. dont make me laugh.
    Yeah CC breaks pvp and its hard to balance well without crippling the other side. Still, the larger part of people only just started playing, and got most their experience from PVE encounters where thinking is not required (in the earlier lvls atleast)
  • kittledorfkittledorf Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 126 Bounty Hunter
    edited May 2013
    Sure nerf CC but then increase CW damage, im kinda sick of the CW. It's like we got CC but thats it, the damage is freaking low. Went CW right away cuz i thought even tho it's D&D they have to think "mmorpg", but no no.. they went full CC. It's the only thing i can do in both PVE and PVP, in lategame i cant even compete with others on the dpsmeter.

    I will reroll Warlock right away when it comes, and i bet 99% of the CWs will do the same by then. Goodjob Cryptic!

    Sure CC is needed lategame... if you lack DPS and that you do once you get a CW in the group :O.
  • xevvxevv Member, Neverwinter Beta Users, Neverwinter Guardian Users Posts: 33
    edited May 2013
    davvin wrote: »
    Doesn't help when the other team has 3 control wizards.


    So youre crying that you cant win against 3 ppl by yourself?
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