Please, we need time, the changes are not on preview yet. When they come, we must do more than hit the PE dummy with the build we had on live. We must build 2-3 builds of each paragon, test it on INSTANCES. Thaum was not behind arcanist ST after last changes, in fact it was enough above to force us all to respec. Please wait for changes to be uploaded tomorrow on preview and test during weekend.
If you can provide them I'd be interested to see "bis" damage vs a dummy to see Thauma > Arcanist. I'm unable to on preview, but at 80% bis I wasn't able to outduel the capstone Arcanist build.
I don't know if it's correct to put this here but someone has reported or mentioned that there is a bug with Entangling Force that if you use it from Spell Mastery it's supposed to have an area effect, but it only affects a single target
> @rachot#2239 said: > I don't know if it's correct to put this here but someone has reported or mentioned that there is a bug with Entangling Force that if you use it from Spell Mastery it's supposed to have an area effect, but it only affects a single target Entangling Force with AoE on spell mastery was before the rework of module 16.
“He raised his staff. There was a roll of thunder. The sunlight was blotted out from the eastern windows; the whole hall became suddenly dark as night. The fire faded to sullen embers. Only Gandalf could be seen, standing white and tall before the blackened hearth.” ― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Two Towers
Update: I just checked in the fix to make Arcane Empowerment %-based rather than a flat 1s per tick. That change may or not make the build with the other changes. (I added a "they" to the tooltip just so there was a visible difference for anyone testing, since otherwise it's a fairly subtle change.)
Million dollar question @rgutscheradev, what % per second will you set it at to start with?
I'd rather have the ability to fire encounters at a faster rate (say 33%), but without the AE damage buff, than wait around for 4-5s between encounters. Purely from a playstyle perspective, AE with long cooldowns is a bit dull and wastes the feature.
Alternatively, add a simple skill element to it that boosts the % while AE is active. For example, the closer you get to activating the power as soon as it comes off cooldown, the higher the % cooldown reduction you get. Probably out of scope, but I like the idea.
> @rachot#2239 said: > I don't know if it's correct to put this here but someone has reported or mentioned that there is a bug with Entangling Force that if you use it from Spell Mastery it's supposed to have an area effect, but it only affects a single target Entangling Force with AoE on spell mastery was before the rework of module 16.
Well, they never removed it from the description of power. How bad I would have liked to use it the Wizard has little AoE control powers
I was discussing this with some random kids I got on my overwatch 2 match and some guy called "asmonbronze" suggested turning Arcane Empowerment into a class feature which I think seems like a fair idea worthy of being considered, just saying.
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
I was discussing this with some random kids I got on my overwatch 2 match and some guy called "asmonbronze" suggested turning Arcane Empowerment into a class feature which I think seems like a fair idea worthy of being considered, just saying.
I hope you aren't considering this solely because some guy who may or may not be a celebrity streamer said so. I think it would be a terrible idea, why not just reduce the CDs to 2-3 seconds max at that point? If it's a passive selectable, everyone would pick it and anyone who didn't pick it would be significantly worse off because of it.
Personally I would rather the power just be removed entirely, although I understand that some like the playstyle and build variety it can provide and that it makes the Arcanist unique and different from most other dps slotting a ST daily and an AOE daily. No, AE is fine as it is, except maybe providing %/sec proposed.
Million dollar question @rgutscheradev, what % per second will you set it at to start with?
I tried to pick a number that made it neither stronger nor weaker than before this change. It was giving 1 sec/tick (after the original changes), I looked at all the Thaum. powers and averaged their cooldowns, and that came out to ~13, so I set it to be (1/13)% per tick. So 1 sec/tick on average.
Everyone please do give me feedback on this version of the power. I am absolutely willing to revert back to the pure cooldown reduction version.
Pros of this version: * Allows for % based cooldown (meaning you can feel better about taking high cooldown spells with AE, and you don't have to just pick your 4 lowest cooldown Encounters). * Better feedback when it wears off (the "jumps" and false readiness Encounters would sometimes show with the old AE, especially in the presence of lag).
Cons of this version: * Uglier under normal use. Time shown of 15s doesn't mean 15s; instead it is counting down the time faster, so that you see the 15s count faster, reaching 0 in (say) 5s.
I'll be honest, I'm not at all sure it's a net win. I think I prefer the "faster recharge speed" version to the "counts down faster" on balance. But I'm willing to go either way on this one, if there's a strong preference.
Note both version are, afaik, equal in power level (what that power level is was discussed in great detail above, so I won't go into that again).
Personally I would rather the power just be removed entirely.
I've been testing Arcane Empowerment on both live and preview and it doesn't even deal damage... if we got rid of imprisonment I don't see why we shouldn't do the same with AE.
If you can provide them I'd be interested to see "bis" damage vs a dummy to see Thauma > Arcanist. I'm unable to on preview, but at 80% bis I wasn't able to outduel the capstone Arcanist build.
I do not use your arcanist build, or your thaum build. I do not know the order after the new changes.
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
edited October 2022
I really don't like the idea of removing something from the game. I mostly said to remove AE in jest.
As for how to balance the power, would adding and removing charges be possible? For example when an Arcanist uses AE, it gives all your equipped encounter powers an additional 2 charges of use that are expended when used and do not get added back until AE is cast again (and resets any unused charges so that we can't stack AE uses).
just been 7 mods why remove agro bug! The new etos boss will have fun in teh hallways if not fixed!!!!
There are more than BIS players in this game RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ???? FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)
Well, someone had to have the courage to address Arcane Empowerment. The decreased recharge speed it is a very logical step given the reality of everyday gameplay. -In reality most of us could not benefit fully from Arcane Empowerment because of server/client route.- That is why we had false cooldowns. And that is why some wizards outperformed others wizards in ST. Some might not like to hear it, but is true. We all have the same ST build since mod 16. There is no extra skill involved, is just the connection speed. If the exploit of 2 Alliance Battlehorns ap gain use could be address will be nice too. And if the animation would be cut in half I would be ecstatic. . rgutscheradev- If it was a- Courage- achievement I would vote for you to receive it. You not only took the correct step, but had the stomach to put it in reality.
Sadly some Wizards were using different builds, trusting tooltips... Also some refused to move with the times and adjust builds/playing styles to be competitive.
Not all players are BIS or want to be BIS so builds for non bis is vastly different than bis. E.G. you don't use buff/defub arti's since you need arti's for stats. Sadly these changes will only help bis players and punish non bis as it looks so far!!!
There are more than BIS players in this game RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ???? FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)
If you can provide them I'd be interested to see "bis" damage vs a dummy to see Thauma > Arcanist. I'm unable to on preview, but at 80% bis I wasn't able to outduel the capstone Arcanist build.
I do not use your arcanist build, or your thaum build. I do not know the order after the new changes.
Then how did you come to a conclusion that "Thaum was not behind arcanist ST after last changes, in fact it was enough above to force us all to respec." ? If you can't back up these claims with raw data please consider not posting this stuff at all as it might interfere with the work others are doing here.
As for how to balance the power, would adding and removing charges be possible? For example when an Arcanist uses AE, it gives all your equipped encounter powers an additional 2 charges of use that are expended when used and do not get added back until AE is cast again (and resets any unused charges so that we can't stack AE uses).
I think you might be on to something. I've been thinking along similar lines.
Whilst I believe the ultimate answer would be to re-make the paragon so that it is built around the concept of empowerment (not a feat, class feat or a daily), that's clearly not feasible at the moment. It also seems the devs don't want any one daily to be significantly more powerful than any other, making the old version of AE problematic. What's left it to re-imagine the use of a "faster encounters" daily, within those constraints (such as your 'charges' concept).
Having seem @rgutscheradev's note above on the experimental version and pros vs cons, I suspect another approach may be needed (but I will happily test it first). If it is, here's an idea I was thinking about, focused on a much shorter AE window:
- Activate daily - Enables temporary 20% damage buff, but no longer blocks AP gain - Shortened/sped-up animation to "empower" - First round of encounters available as soon as the animation is complete - Flat 3s cooldown for all slotted encounters - Second round of encounters available to use - Encounters go back to regular cooldown time
When I asked you- Are you sure about thaum needing more buffs , you called me a troll and end the discussion. Thank you for making me consider not posting, you are right, let me not interfere.
When I asked you- Are you sure about thaum needing more buffs , you called me a troll and end the discussion. Thank you for making me consider not posting, you are right, let me not interfere.
You posted a closemouthed one-liner that I misread as troll post because you come across as very confrontational so far in this thread. I however apologized so if you can't get over it that's on you.
I must say it's very hard to follow your reasonong and line of thinking the way you post. Might be a language-barrier, but your posts do not seem very connected, you seem very rude towards others that don't agree, and you offer no insight as to how you're coming to certain conclusions. That's not a great basis for a constructive discussion. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I was interested in some data that can backup your claim about Thaum > Arcanist, because that directly contradict what I'm seeing on preview (obviously unable to test the latest changes before tonight).
You follow up with "I do not use your arcanist build, or your thaum build.". Seriously, what is that even supposed to mean? I'm sorry but if you're unable to offer more insight then yeah, might be better to stay away from this thread.
What use-case are you imagining for Arcane Bolt? In comparison to Magic Missile it just doesn't stack up.
* Magic Missile hits 5 times every 2.0s, and 3 of those hits proc weapon enchants. * Arcane Bolt hits 4 times every 3.7s, and all 4 proc weapon enchants.
Both powers grant an arcane stack with every hit.
Magic Missile will now do 375 magnitude (including Poison Thorn) every 2.0s = 187.50 MPS Arcane Bolt will now do 580 (with Poison Thorn) every 3.7s = 156.76 MPS
So even though AB kicks out more damage from weapon enchants per second, it's too far behind MM to make up the difference. Am I missing something?
Second question is regarding Directed Flames, in it's current state. Is it intended that it will only trigger if you've done no damage for 1s? (It's actually more than one second, because Icy Terrain ticks every second and only triggers DF on the first hit.) As of right now on Preview it's pretty terrible.
I'll be honest, I'm not at all sure it's a net win. I think I prefer the "faster recharge speed" version to the "counts down faster" on balance. But I'm willing to go either way on this one, if there's a strong preference.
Note both version are, afaik, equal in power level (what that power level is was discussed in great detail above, so I won't go into that again).
Feedback Suggestion Please leave AE as faster recharge speed. It is very useful when needing to use CC powers in quick succession and maintain control of highly dense mobs.
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mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
Are you gonna patch preview today? we need to test the changes
I am a totally arcane Wizard and a problem that I have more are his feats and the issue of the possibilities for them to be activated
Assailing Force: 10% and testing against dummies to see how much the effect activates, it usually activates on round 4 or 5 of powers
Chaos Magi: Barely 5% increased to 7%, there comes a point where I forget that I have this feat active since it barely activates
Nightmare Wizardry: 10% usually activates more often when I use Steal Time since it has more radius and therefore it does damage to more enemies but the wizard at least mine does not have as much critical although I focus more on raising that stat (My percentage critical rate is 58%)
Sorry if there is something wrong with some words I use translator.
I was wondering when the Wizard Changes are coming, seems they all are missing several they described aren't shown as stated earlier in thread...
Latest proposed changes will likely go on preview the next time they patch the server. Rgutscheradev is likely telling us the changes as soon as he gives those in charge of patches the changelog.
So a lot of ideas that I would really like to do (like totally revamp Lightning Bolt and Fireball) are beyond what's possible in this particular revamp. (I hope someday! I too am not happy with where Lightning Bolt and Fireball are. I have been poking the artists. :P)
I'm fine with how Lighting looks, me and many others love an improvement; just don't use Fireball, and most won't even see 'fireball' itself render, just the small spiral flame that wraps it at first.
Alright, so his comments make sense, yet they need to fix visual not rendering problem for 'most' with Fireball. It likely help if they made far more visible, if that initial spiral is now the fireball, it also very quickly disapears!
Fireball visual is gone since rework, it's supposed to look like the fireball power of Red Wizard of Thay or the Shores of Tuern boss
Shield goes on cooldown immediately instead of being re-activatable
That is another person saying it's gone, and I've confirmed with many. Someone in the thread below thought they saw it, yet it's just the embers that glow around it, because it's a bright red ball that's obvious and clearly missing. He did catch one screenshot with it shown, as did I, yet never seen on screen like it was prior to M18.
Fireball Never - the casting animation is awful and the dmg
You can actually remove most of the skills and people will not miss them because they don't have any utility or usefulness.
Honestly the vast majority don't even see the Fireball being cast, let alone see it being thrown; since (around) Mod 18 rework of Fireball it's appeared most invisible for the vast majority. Some with higher end video card's may see this mostly like RTX 3xxx Series may, yet several Mid-Range cards like RTX 2xxx or 16xx - 1200 or less won't.
Smolder no longer shows visually in enemies buff bar, when using Scorching Burst, Fanning The Flame, Fireball, Furious Immolation. ACT logs confirm Smolder still being applied
I'm not sure if this has been brought up in the past, but why doesn't controlling a target enable combat advantage? If a target is frozen in a block of ice or is dangling in mid air by an invisible hand unable to attack, it seems pretty natural that you would have an advantage in combat over that opponent. Instead, if you are an arcanist, if you critically strike a target--without hindering their ability to either strike you or defend themselves--you somehow have an opportunity (10% chance) to gain the upper hand on them. (Warlocks and Rogues pretty much get auto CA without *any* control effects.)
Tying combat advantage to control and control duration would make the control bonus stat at least meaningful. It would also go a long way towards closing the gap between wizards and the top tier DPS (both of whom get built in CA).
Good evening/Hello, thanks for the efforts to fix the mage bugs. I heard + check that the control bonus increases the power of your control power bug however I don't know if the bonus was blocked at 50% or completely bug, please fix it. (I used The living silver vine + 4% constant control boons = 66% bonus but my damage AE not changed )I apologize in advance if I have mistakes (spelling) because I use google translation.
Comments
> I don't know if it's correct to put this here but someone has reported or mentioned that there is a bug with Entangling Force that if you use it from Spell Mastery it's supposed to have an area effect, but it only affects a single target
Entangling Force with AoE on spell mastery was before the rework of module 16.
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Two Towers
I'd rather have the ability to fire encounters at a faster rate (say 33%), but without the AE damage buff, than wait around for 4-5s between encounters. Purely from a playstyle perspective, AE with long cooldowns is a bit dull and wastes the feature.
Alternatively, add a simple skill element to it that boosts the % while AE is active. For example, the closer you get to activating the power as soon as it comes off cooldown, the higher the % cooldown reduction you get. Probably out of scope, but I like the idea.
Just something to keep it fun to use.
Personally I would rather the power just be removed entirely, although I understand that some like the playstyle and build variety it can provide and that it makes the Arcanist unique and different from most other dps slotting a ST daily and an AOE daily. No, AE is fine as it is, except maybe providing %/sec proposed.
Everyone please do give me feedback on this version of the power. I am absolutely willing to revert back to the pure cooldown reduction version.
Pros of this version:
* Allows for % based cooldown (meaning you can feel better about taking high cooldown spells with AE, and you don't have to just pick your 4 lowest cooldown Encounters).
* Better feedback when it wears off (the "jumps" and false readiness Encounters would sometimes show with the old AE, especially in the presence of lag).
Cons of this version:
* Uglier under normal use. Time shown of 15s doesn't mean 15s; instead it is counting down the time faster, so that you see the 15s count faster, reaching 0 in (say) 5s.
I'll be honest, I'm not at all sure it's a net win. I think I prefer the "faster recharge speed" version to the "counts down faster" on balance. But I'm willing to go either way on this one, if there's a strong preference.
Note both version are, afaik, equal in power level (what that power level is was discussed in great detail above, so I won't go into that again).
I do not know the order after the new changes.
As for how to balance the power, would adding and removing charges be possible? For example when an Arcanist uses AE, it gives all your equipped encounter powers an additional 2 charges of use that are expended when used and do not get added back until AE is cast again (and resets any unused charges so that we can't stack AE uses).
RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ????
FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base
Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)
RIP Real Tiamat, RIP Real Demogorgon RIP real Temple of the spider. Why remove non bis content to give to bis players ????
FORCING the majority of your player base to play 4 mod old dungeons and trial will have a bad result on player base
Changes are getting so bad i would rather prefer no new changes (RIP ICE FISHING in winter fest)
Whilst I believe the ultimate answer would be to re-make the paragon so that it is built around the concept of empowerment (not a feat, class feat or a daily), that's clearly not feasible at the moment. It also seems the devs don't want any one daily to be significantly more powerful than any other, making the old version of AE problematic. What's left it to re-imagine the use of a "faster encounters" daily, within those constraints (such as your 'charges' concept).
Having seem @rgutscheradev's note above on the experimental version and pros vs cons, I suspect another approach may be needed (but I will happily test it first). If it is, here's an idea I was thinking about, focused on a much shorter AE window:
- Activate daily
- Enables temporary 20% damage buff, but no longer blocks AP gain
- Shortened/sped-up animation to "empower"
- First round of encounters available as soon as the animation is complete
- Flat 3s cooldown for all slotted encounters
- Second round of encounters available to use
- Encounters go back to regular cooldown time
Thank you for making me consider not posting, you are right, let me not interfere.
I must say it's very hard to follow your reasonong and line of thinking the way you post. Might be a language-barrier, but your posts do not seem very connected, you seem very rude towards others that don't agree, and you offer no insight as to how you're coming to certain conclusions. That's not a great basis for a constructive discussion. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I was interested in some data that can backup your claim about Thaum > Arcanist, because that directly contradict what I'm seeing on preview (obviously unable to test the latest changes before tonight).
You follow up with "I do not use your arcanist build, or your thaum build.". Seriously, what is that even supposed to mean? I'm sorry but if you're unable to offer more insight then yeah, might be better to stay away from this thread.
What use-case are you imagining for Arcane Bolt? In comparison to Magic Missile it just doesn't stack up.
* Magic Missile hits 5 times every 2.0s, and 3 of those hits proc weapon enchants.
* Arcane Bolt hits 4 times every 3.7s, and all 4 proc weapon enchants.
Both powers grant an arcane stack with every hit.
Magic Missile will now do 375 magnitude (including Poison Thorn) every 2.0s = 187.50 MPS
Arcane Bolt will now do 580 (with Poison Thorn) every 3.7s = 156.76 MPS
So even though AB kicks out more damage from weapon enchants per second, it's too far behind MM to make up the difference. Am I missing something?
Second question is regarding Directed Flames, in it's current state. Is it intended that it will only trigger if you've done no damage for 1s? (It's actually more than one second, because Icy Terrain ticks every second and only triggers DF on the first hit.) As of right now on Preview it's pretty terrible.
Please leave AE as faster recharge speed. It is very useful when needing to use CC powers in quick succession and maintain control of highly dense mobs.
Assailing Force: 10% and testing against dummies to see how much the effect activates, it usually activates on round 4 or 5 of powers
Chaos Magi: Barely 5% increased to 7%, there comes a point where I forget that I have this feat active since it barely activates
Nightmare Wizardry: 10% usually activates more often when I use Steal Time since it has more radius and therefore it does damage to more enemies but the wizard at least mine does not have as much critical although I focus more on raising that stat (My percentage critical rate is 58%)
Sorry if there is something wrong with some words I use translator.
Alright, so his comments make sense, yet they need to fix visual not rendering problem for 'most' with Fireball. It likely help if they made far more visible, if that initial spiral is now the fireball, it also very quickly disapears!
https://www.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1265340/known-wizard-bugs
╘ Note there is reference to unseen fireball by most in there, it started around M18 or earlier when they updated it.
This is why now most don't even use Fireball today! Most only see the Flames burning enemy afterward, not the Fireball itself. That is another person saying it's gone, and I've confirmed with many. Someone in the thread below thought they saw it, yet it's just the embers that glow around it, because it's a bright red ball that's obvious and clearly missing. He did catch one screenshot with it shown, as did I, yet never seen on screen like it was prior to M18.
https://account.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1265327/thaumaturge-missing-fx-for-fireball-it-seems
https://account.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1265342/ray-of-enfeeblement-duration-bug
―
https://account.arcgames.com/en/forums/neverwinter/#/discussion/1265378/wizard-ice-knife-not-shown-since-m23-june-14th-in-dragon-hunts
There were several other listed bugs in that thread above, that they are hopefully also fixing. Honestly the vast majority don't even see the Fireball being cast, let alone see it being thrown; since (around) Mod 18 rework of Fireball it's appeared most invisible for the vast majority. Some with higher end video card's may see this mostly like RTX 3xxx Series may, yet several Mid-Range cards like RTX 2xxx or 16xx - 1200 or less won't. They should try and fix that for sure!
Tying combat advantage to control and control duration would make the control bonus stat at least meaningful. It would also go a long way towards closing the gap between wizards and the top tier DPS (both of whom get built in CA).