One of them is two years old, the other is a year old. What should endgame players do? Do nothing for another year and hope that something interesting will come out? For casual players, a redesigned Demogorgon has recently been released. And before that the Vault of the Stars. Where's the justice?
One of them is two years old, the other is a year old. What should endgame players do? Do nothing for another year and hope that something interesting will come out? For casual players, a redesigned Demogorgon has recently been released. And before that the Vault of the Stars. Where's the justice?
Endgamer? You mean someone that likes to run TOMM/Zariel? And that's it...to each their own. I'd rather not have content, where 1-2 groups only in game are running, and end result is running with a bunch of people over and over, and usually they have elitist attitudes. Difficult doesn't mean it has to be impossible, so you can have bragging rights.
> @stark760 said: > Endgamer? You mean someone that likes to run TOMM/Zariel? And that's it...to each their own. I'd rather not have content, where 1-2 groups only in game are running, and end result is running with a bunch of people over and over, and usually they have elitist attitudes. Difficult doesn't mean it has to be impossible, so you can have bragging rights.
I think you're missing the point. There needs to be some form of 'end game'. There is lots for the casual players to still do like Bishop mentioned, tomm and zc are significantly easier now and those players can work towards those or vault of stars. However, for that small minority of the community that are completely end game and have done all that content a thousand times over, what are we supposed to do? We are at the point of 1 rotating halaster and zariel whilst running vos naked for fun. As I mentioned earlier there is currently no reason at all to actually gear up a character fully due to the lack of content that actually requires a player to be end game. Those 'elitist' players have spent 2 years doing training runs for content such as tomm or zariel because its something to do and alot of us actually enjoy helping people, though I know obviously that isnt all of the 'elitist' playerbase for sure.
We try to check if we can cleanse the dot and we can Feedback It is better if we cant cleanse this dot because it is the tankcheck and we need a mechanic to force tank to swap aggro
> @stark760 said: > Endgamer? You mean someone that likes to run TOMM/Zariel? And that's it...to each their own. I'd rather not have content, where 1-2 groups only in game are running, and end result is running with a bunch of people over and over, and usually they have elitist attitudes. Difficult doesn't mean it has to be impossible, so you can have bragging rights.
I think you're missing the point. There needs to be some form of 'end game'. There is lots for the casual players to still do like Bishop mentioned, tomm and zc are significantly easier now and those players can work towards those or vault of stars. However, for that small minority of the community that are completely end game and have done all that content a thousand times over, what are we supposed to do? We are at the point of 1 rotating halaster and zariel whilst running vos naked for fun. As I mentioned earlier there is currently no reason at all to actually gear up a character fully due to the lack of content that actually requires a player to be end game. Those 'elitist' players have spent 2 years doing training runs for content such as tomm or zariel because its something to do and alot of us actually enjoy helping people, though I know obviously that isnt all of the 'elitist' playerbase for sure.
People are going in at 80k, everything maxed, including collars. Much stronger than they will than on live, at least for 99.99% of players. It was still difficult, but fun. This was to iron out kinks. from what I understand, they already added much more mobs since owlbear tests and feed back. no reason to think they won't add some more. As it is, being difficult for 10 people at 80k IL, gives people a reason to at least try and cap all that stuff coming.
Also glad there wasn't 1 shot mechs for 2-3 weeks that needed addressed, like in TOMM, that stalled progress until patches came out. If that's what people wanted from this...don't know what you want.
I think people misunderstood TOMM. It was intended to be almost impossible, as too many said there wasn't enough hard content pre mod 16. I'm fairly certain on stream, it was said, you got it. It was meant to be a stopgap and force months of training, and waiting for patches. If they had made phase 1 of the new trial meant not to be passed, how does that help them find bugs? After a year of VOS, i'd rather not have a trial come out that takes months to become runable. They can always add mechs and difficulty, or a master version.
> @stark760 said: > I think people misunderstood TOMM. It was intended to be almost impossible, as too many said there wasn't enough hard content pre mod 16. I'm fairly certain on stream, it was said, you got it. It was meant to be a stopgap and force months of training, and waiting for patches. If they had made phase 1 of the new trial meant not to be passed, how does that help them find bugs? After a year of VOS, i'd rather not have a trial come out that takes months to become runable. They can always add mechs and difficulty, or a master version.
If this is their intention to make a master version of the trial come shortly then sure, but either way there really needs to be an end game to strive for (for the 80k players, not 60k).
Theres probably still a good number of players, especially on console that will be maxed out day 1 as we have a bit longer than PC to prepare for it and more of an insight to what we need. Players will already be preparing for the mod now and there's still 2 months until console release.
@shivra, would you have rather it be 1 shotting on phase 1, and them not know that phase 3 was doing 1 shots...and wait for patch...to then find out phase 4 also had mechs that are 1 shot. And another patch, just to see last phase? Is the problem that the end of the trial was seen, and it took months for that to happen on TOMM?
> @stark760 said: > @shivra, would you have rather it be 1 shotting on phase 1, and them not know that phase 3 was doing 1 shots...and wait for patch...to then find out phase 4 also had mechs that are 1 shot. And another patch, just to see last phase? Is the problem that the end of the trial was seen, and it took months for that to happen on TOMM?
No, like I said if this is their intention to have it easier on preview in order to check more of the dungeon for things like exploits and bugs to make sure its running smoothly then im all for that. If its planned that when it is brought to the live server its much more difficult then it sounds great. However, as said above by those thay have completed the trial, there seems to be a lack of mechanics involved making the trial easier than it should be for an end game trial and not just something that's intended to be a 'preview only difficulty' of the trial.
Personally (and I may be in the minority for this part) I would actually like to see it take a long time for even the elite groups to complete given the rewards are worth it to run the content like in tomm. The weapons should not be unbindableand sellable yet either though (for at least a couple more mods IMO) as that would discourage training from those players to other members further down the line when the elites are finally able to complete.
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
Feedback: I expected more. We are facing a Dracolich drunk on power (why wise would he turn?) and Valindra, our old nemesis and an extremely powerful lich herself. There should be more magic involved from the Dragon and Valindra should have some new tricks, maybe even some stuff she learn from the soulmonger. Even something so simple as adding in some of the Chultan Gravemaster's AOE partial-para attack (forget the name of the power) would add enough complexity.
I hope it's challenging to beat, but I like the majority of mechs and trial can be seen and bugs worked on early. Maybe some of unknown aspect is lost, but i don't like being the guinea pig for 3 months, and waiting for each part to be worked on 1 by 1, 1 week at a time. Maybe it's different on console, and not going through that. Maybe when it goes live they can add 1 last phase, or rework the last phase to make some unknown/harder aspects and "training" required.
This doesn't feel like a trial, it feels like a skirmish where enemy HP and damage were artificially inflated to make it "endgame". None of the mechanics are new or feel interesting.
After Zariel was released, me and my friends always joked that the next trial would also be "heavily inspired by" (i.e. shamelessly copied from) a FFXIV trial, but now I'm kinda sad that it wasn't.
I hope it's challenging to beat, but I like the majority of mechs and trial can be seen and bugs worked on early. Maybe some of unknown aspect is lost, but i don't like being the guinea pig for 3 months, and waiting for each part to be worked on 1 by 1, 1 week at a time. Maybe it's different on console, and not going through that. Maybe when it goes live they can add 1 last phase, or rework the last phase to make some unknown/harder aspects and "training" required.
The main problem of "Crown" is that there are no mechanics that require skillful play, like double hypothermia in TOMM (for example), etc. A boss with a huge HP bar and a huge amount of trash (i mean mobs) is not an endgame. We want a huge number of mechanics that, like riddles, must be solved and overcome. We want to select the right artifacts and mounts for the successful completion of the trial, micromanage the group's actions, and not just run away from red zones and trash, spending a quarter of an hour mindlessly punching the boss's huge HP bar.
I hope it's challenging to beat, but I like the majority of mechs and trial can be seen and bugs worked on early. Maybe some of unknown aspect is lost, but i don't like being the guinea pig for 3 months, and waiting for each part to be worked on 1 by 1, 1 week at a time. Maybe it's different on console, and not going through that. Maybe when it goes live they can add 1 last phase, or rework the last phase to make some unknown/harder aspects and "training" required.
The main problem of "Crown" is that there are no mechanics that require skillful play, like double hypothermia in TOMM (for example), etc. A boss with a huge HP bar and a huge amount of trash (i mean mobs) is not an endgame. We want a huge number of mechanics that, like riddles, must be solved and overcome. We want to select the right artifacts and mounts for the successful completion of the trial, micromanage the group's actions, and not just run away from red zones and trash, spending a quarter of an hour mindlessly punching the boss's huge HP bar.
And you have 2 specific trials that are just like that. The game has almost no content of where there is more than 5 man. Not every trial has to be geared for being against a solo boss on a solo platform. After a long gap between content, and new enchants system hitting next month, it doesn't have to be a mech heavy-solo boss again. I'm hoping a few more 10 man trials hit soon. Once they let us re-balance our builds, then release a TOMM trial type. And in my experience, after "training" happens, and riddles or phases figured out, what happens? If possible, it gets pushed to solo tank/solo heal to skip the mechanics you just talked about liking.
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
I hope it's challenging to beat, but I like the majority of mechs and trial can be seen and bugs worked on early. Maybe some of unknown aspect is lost, but i don't like being the guinea pig for 3 months, and waiting for each part to be worked on 1 by 1, 1 week at a time. Maybe it's different on console, and not going through that. Maybe when it goes live they can add 1 last phase, or rework the last phase to make some unknown/harder aspects and "training" required.
The main problem of "Crown" is that there are no mechanics that require skillful play, like double hypothermia in TOMM (for example), etc. A boss with a huge HP bar and a huge amount of trash (i mean mobs) is not an endgame. We want a huge number of mechanics that, like riddles, must be solved and overcome. We want to select the right artifacts and mounts for the successful completion of the trial, micromanage the group's actions, and not just run away from red zones and trash, spending a quarter of an hour mindlessly punching the boss's huge HP bar.
And you have 2 specific trials that are just like that. The game has almost no content of where there is more than 5 man. Not every trial has to be geared for being against a solo boss on a solo platform. After a long gap between content, and new enchants system hitting next month, it doesn't have to be a mech heavy-solo boss again. I'm hoping a few more 10 man trials hit soon. Once they let us re-balance our builds, then release a TOMM trial type. And in my experience, after "training" happens, and riddles or phases figured out, what happens? If possible, it gets pushed to solo tank/solo heal to skip the mechanics you just talked about liking.
This game is full of content with just mindless smack the boss content. We do not need more of it. We really should be focusing more on mechanic heavy content. This is an Action MMORPG after all, we need that action to retain players. Trials should be more involved, there are 10 players in it after all. Not to mention that this particular trial has the main OG villain of the game. Valindra needs to be something to be feared, a true threat to Neverwinter.
I hope it's challenging to beat, but I like the majority of mechs and trial can be seen and bugs worked on early. Maybe some of unknown aspect is lost, but i don't like being the guinea pig for 3 months, and waiting for each part to be worked on 1 by 1, 1 week at a time. Maybe it's different on console, and not going through that. Maybe when it goes live they can add 1 last phase, or rework the last phase to make some unknown/harder aspects and "training" required.
The main problem of "Crown" is that there are no mechanics that require skillful play, like double hypothermia in TOMM (for example), etc. A boss with a huge HP bar and a huge amount of trash (i mean mobs) is not an endgame. We want a huge number of mechanics that, like riddles, must be solved and overcome. We want to select the right artifacts and mounts for the successful completion of the trial, micromanage the group's actions, and not just run away from red zones and trash, spending a quarter of an hour mindlessly punching the boss's huge HP bar.
And you have 2 specific trials that are just like that. The game has almost no content of where there is more than 5 man. Not every trial has to be geared for being against a solo boss on a solo platform. After a long gap between content, and new enchants system hitting next month, it doesn't have to be a mech heavy-solo boss again. I'm hoping a few more 10 man trials hit soon. Once they let us re-balance our builds, then release a TOMM trial type. And in my experience, after "training" happens, and riddles or phases figured out, what happens? If possible, it gets pushed to solo tank/solo heal to skip the mechanics you just talked about liking.
This game is full of content with just mindless smack the boss content. We do not need more of it. We really should be focusing more on mechanic heavy content. This is an Action MMORPG after all, we need that action to retain players. Trials should be more involved, there are 10 players in it after all. Not to mention that this particular trial has the main OG villain of the game. Valindra needs to be something to be feared, a true threat to Neverwinter.
No it's not. Not trials anyways. Svardborg is a joke now, CODG also, demo reworked but still 6-8 min on first day, tiamat was hard when 25 man, now? That leaves the last 2 high tier trials TOMM and zariel. I'm guessing those aren't what you meant by mindless smack the boss content. So what content in 10 man are you talking about? I agree Valindra should have more, but she does always come back. Hopefully they continue it like after malabogs storyline.
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arazith07Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,719Arc User
I hope it's challenging to beat, but I like the majority of mechs and trial can be seen and bugs worked on early. Maybe some of unknown aspect is lost, but i don't like being the guinea pig for 3 months, and waiting for each part to be worked on 1 by 1, 1 week at a time. Maybe it's different on console, and not going through that. Maybe when it goes live they can add 1 last phase, or rework the last phase to make some unknown/harder aspects and "training" required.
The main problem of "Crown" is that there are no mechanics that require skillful play, like double hypothermia in TOMM (for example), etc. A boss with a huge HP bar and a huge amount of trash (i mean mobs) is not an endgame. We want a huge number of mechanics that, like riddles, must be solved and overcome. We want to select the right artifacts and mounts for the successful completion of the trial, micromanage the group's actions, and not just run away from red zones and trash, spending a quarter of an hour mindlessly punching the boss's huge HP bar.
And you have 2 specific trials that are just like that. The game has almost no content of where there is more than 5 man. Not every trial has to be geared for being against a solo boss on a solo platform. After a long gap between content, and new enchants system hitting next month, it doesn't have to be a mech heavy-solo boss again. I'm hoping a few more 10 man trials hit soon. Once they let us re-balance our builds, then release a TOMM trial type. And in my experience, after "training" happens, and riddles or phases figured out, what happens? If possible, it gets pushed to solo tank/solo heal to skip the mechanics you just talked about liking.
This game is full of content with just mindless smack the boss content. We do not need more of it. We really should be focusing more on mechanic heavy content. This is an Action MMORPG after all, we need that action to retain players. Trials should be more involved, there are 10 players in it after all. Not to mention that this particular trial has the main OG villain of the game. Valindra needs to be something to be feared, a true threat to Neverwinter.
No it's not. Not trials anyways. Svardborg is a joke now, CODG also, demo reworked but still 6-8 min on first day, tiamat was hard when 25 man, now? That leaves the last 2 high tier trials TOMM and zariel. I'm guessing those aren't what you meant by mindless smack the boss content. So what content in 10 man are you talking about? I agree Valindra should have more, but she does always come back. Hopefully they continue it like after malabogs storyline.
That's exactly what I mean though. Joke, mindless, whatever descriptor you want to use, there are plenty of those, but not really any that requires engagement and at least a modicum of strategy.
Sorry in advance for the l o n g post I'll start with a few things I like- The setting is aesthetically pleasing not super bright/dark or straining on the eyes. Our dragon foe has a clean imposing appearance and the grappling hook platforming is a nice change from the usual travel methods.
For the actual trial, at first look it's underwhelming. The mechanics aren't engaging they're too simplistic. There's looks to be little or no penalty to failing most mechs outside of the occasional death, and nothing that takes more that very basic situational awareness. Many of the advanced and max geared players look forward to trials to enjoy a dynamic experience that gives them a chance to learn new strategies and develop better team synergy. We invest heavily in our characters, what motivation is there to continue these upgrades or encourage others to do the same if content either scales us or is so simple we could complete it with significantly less gear and a bit more attention to red? Some of the mechs used in vos were great: shifting cleave with placement requirements, the life sapping tether Malthar uses, the oscillating vunerability of the golems and the mobile light pools. All of those created an engaging environment where you had to pay attention to your play and the entirety of the team had an active role, especially at first. It feels like the mechanics in Crown of K are big steps backwards. More hp or just harder hitting attacks aren't enough to make this an epic finale to an otherwise entertaining saga. Many late game players have been looking forward to this eagerly, having it be completed with in a day and, more so, ran near to complete with less than the recommended support classes is disheartening. With demo almost exclusively being ran by solo tanks avoiding basic mechanics and most 3rd mb (VoS) farms jumping hedges, this is begining to feeling like a new standard where "exploiting" mechanics to complete content is encouraged. Why bother to max your HoT healer to keep up with dots a pally shield can withstand, why max a tank if the groups of 10 only need 1, why get to 80k if you can complete it significantly lower with 7 or 8 dps with in the first few days? Please give the, now very bored, endgame community something to struggle a bit with. The normal ZC/Master ZC was a great direction. It made content available to varying levels of players and also made a great tool for teaching and helping players get familiar with the mechanics before trying the advanced version, something similar would be ideal if the worry is inclusivity. The most addictive part of this game is the multifaceted active combat system coupled with the effect group cooperation, reaction time, and focus can have on your performance. This trial in it's current state just doesn't do any of that justice
Hit boxes.... Hit boxes and once more hit boxes.... its impossible to kill anything around the dragon.... also the dot that comes with support/summoners hits like truck... dunno if it is intended.
We have just passed the trial on the ru server. I would like to say that it is necessary to correct the Valindra and Dragon models, since sometimes the blows are directed at the wrong target. There are still some problems, for example, with the fact that you can force a dragon to stand afk at the first stage and kill it if you put it right, sometimes there are problems with hooks. Also, sometimes after death at the stage with phylacteries, it is impossible to re-enter the arena and you have to re-enter the dungeon. It was quite interesting, thank you)
Had fun in new trial. Maybe make the bahamut claw and scale available on preview for those that didn't save them, or ever get those armor kits. Good stuff I think though.
Brief overviews of the runs we did two separate days.
Day 1. -Multiple attempts but the miasma/supports was killing everyone too fast with DoT. -Some supports was not targetable due to proximity of the dragon, moving the dragon seem to help but not always. -When we switched to 3 healers, the runs was good but due to one person dying during the island hopping, we could not continue forward.
Day 2. Same as day 1, the runs was better once we switch to three healers. This time we did a few attempts to take the dragon around the arena so that supports are targetable, seem to be better. Again, we could not continue forward to the next phase when one person die.
I didn't see the (Master) listed next to the trial name on the Q list, so assuming this is the "normal" version. The "Master" version would increase in difficulty and more mechanics? So far we are enjoying this trial and would hope it be on preview for longer duration.
This dungeon looks like matrix 4 movie - as if I've seen all this before, in some places it is too long - why jump on the islands with these hooks, I understand if some kind of mechanics beat between the islands during the flight - sometimes boring. And we have been waiting for this for a year ?!
Hello. So, what want to say. In short - TOMM was a great trial and I want to thank everyone who did it, it was much fun really. But, it was 2.5 years ago (or more?). After that success with TOMM we had bugged Zariel with useless loot, but all the same, we wasn`t able to pass faze with demons on the 1st day, not to mention the whole trial. So, after then we waited a year, and we hoped to get some reason to do all these build improvemets, suggested by new Modules and to spend money on it. And finally, what we see now? We have a big heroic encounter with 1 fat dragon and and 3 primitive mechanics. Yes, some of them can kill, but when you get up and continue, you see all THE SAME THING till the end. NO new fazes NO things to think about...We had it done in 5 ours and we don`t want to go there because it`s too boring. I`m done with Newerwinter. Bye and thanks for the TOMM again.
I would like to agree with @purebishop and @nataka that this new trial is a hige dissapointnent. From one hand, it is something new, and new content is always great, we will have something new to do. From another hand, since I can pretty much call myself an endgame player, I am a little bit tired of running Zariel and TOMM again and again and wanted something new and challenging. I was hoping that the general idea for the trials is that those dungeons should be some kind of a tricky complex puzzle and demand more skill/tactics/teamplay than just pay-to-win(gearing up won't be cheap after the changes which will come with the new mod), patience and timing knowlenge(in fact, you just need to play calmly and don't get into the red zones). There is nothing tricky or complex in terms of mechanics in the new trial, there are just tons of mobs and a dragon(we are in the D&D, boyz) with a lot of HP. And I can't agree with you @stark760 - we need that type of content not beacause there are some mythic "noobs" and "elitists", but beacuse it gives the players motivation to gear up and, by demand, some way to gain more interesting game experience. We have a lot of content to play just4fun with little need to play swetty(pretty much everything except VOS Hard Mode, TOMM and Zariel), but we have nothing that makes us think/investigate/plan/re-build, nothing challenging. And in the current state the new trial can be hardly called challenging. Borring, anoying, requiring a lot of patience due to the same mechanics going again and again - yes, but it is nothing like even Zariel, not to mention TOMM. I have no idea how this can be changed without significant changes to the dungeon itself. I mean, we can propose adding some more mechanics but it will move the trial release day for an unknown amount of time, but I am not sure it will be considered as an option even if we have the petition signed with all the server players. With this trial in its current form, the endgame will be dead and a lot of old/experienced players will leave for some other game to play.
I have thought on multiple options to make this trial harder and this is what I have come up with: 1.Add mechanics from the end of the Tower of Valindra, such as a carousel with souls for example))) And/or complicate the mechanics by making the carousel like a chessboard(like in Zariel) 2.When the Phylactery starts jumping on the platform, you can add the Zariel fan mechanic, when you either stand in between or behind Zariel's back 3.When there is a magic ball with incoming damage to the player, add a black hole from the Vault of Stars on the hit(it will give the motivation to run further) 4. Like the lava in Lostmouth's lair in the final stage of the boss, you can make parts of the circle just as dangerous, just adjust it to the mechanics of Valindra or Dracolich
Hello, we tried to finish the trial with our guild for about 6-7 hours now (all endgame players, regularly farming ZCM and ToMM on live and doing deathless here and there) In the new trial we took down 4-5 bars of HP of the Dragon in the last phase, that's the furthest we got after 7 hours of the trials. We all knew the mechanics in the beggining, so there was no finding out new mechanics (YT and info from other players).
In general the trial is a bit boring in the mechanics subject. I was hoping for something more like ToMM or Zariel, but it's not too bad, it's just different, closer to the new Demogorgon trial in that subject and I understand that's what you were aiming for.
My feedback about particular parts of the trial: 1. Most important - Hit Box of the Dragon: Please do something about size of dragon's hitbox (it's too big) or adjust aiming assist, because when range dps try to killl the 'Support', even though the dragon is NOT targetted and sometimes is not even on the screen, the skills go to the dragon, not the Support (same situation with targeting Valindra by the other tank when she's close to the dragon). All of the range DPS in my group had the same issue, we had to turn back on the dragon to not see any part of it on the screen, look down on the ground in the direction of the 'Support' with hope that our skills hit the 'Support'
2. Second most important - Electricity circles during Push mechanic: in the 4th and 5th phase please don't mix the mechanics of 'push' (after landing the dragon) with the electricy circles mechanic. A lot of players got pushed into the red electric circles and died and it couldn't be avoided. In my opinion it's too random and not dependent on the player skill or experience, it's just out of place on the endgame trial and it looks unpolished, like the mechanic is not intended to be there. It would be different if you could avoid or dash somehow from it or position yourselve differently, but you cant' as you are controlled during the flying from 'push' mechanic and the circles sometimes appear during your flight.
3.Third most important - Last phase Boss HP: The boss on the last phase has way too much HP, please lower it down a bit.
4. Just a suggestion to make the life easier - DoT from the Support spawn: In my opinion there should be an icon for the DoT damage from 'Supports' on the player's 'active effects bar' with a timer, moreover the DoT should end when last support dies, as sometimes it's still hitting even for more than 5-10 seconds after the last 'Support' dies. Moreover I think the dmg from that DoT could be tuned down a little bit.
@firewaxwork I would prefer to wait another month or 2 maybe if it makes the trial worth running and let them add parts into it. Agree with everything you posted though.
I would like to agree with @purebishop and @nataka that this new trial is a hige dissapointnent. From one hand, it is something new, and new content is always great, we will have something new to do. From another hand, since I can pretty much call myself an endgame player, I am a little bit tired of running Zariel and TOMM again and again and wanted something new and challenging. I was hoping that the general idea for the trials is that those dungeons should be some kind of a tricky complex puzzle and demand more skill/tactics/teamplay than just pay-to-win(gearing up won't be cheap after the changes which will come with the new mod), patience and timing knowlenge(in fact, you just need to play calmly and don't get into the red zones). There is nothing tricky or complex in terms of mechanics in the new trial, there are just tons of mobs and a dragon(we are in the D&D, boyz) with a lot of HP. And I can't agree with you @stark760 - we need that type of content not beacause there are some mythic "noobs" and "elitists", but beacuse it gives the players motivation to gear up and, by demand, some way to gain more interesting game experience. We have a lot of content to play just4fun with little need to play swetty(pretty much everything except VOS Hard Mode, TOMM and Zariel), but we have nothing that makes us think/investigate/plan/re-build, nothing challenging. And in the current state the new trial can be hardly called challenging. Borring, anoying, requiring a lot of patience due to the same mechanics going again and again - yes, but it is nothing like even Zariel, not to mention TOMM. I have no idea how this can be changed without significant changes to the dungeon itself. I mean, we can propose adding some more mechanics but it will move the trial release day for an unknown amount of time, but I am not sure it will be considered as an option even if we have the petition signed with all the server players. With this trial in its current form, the endgame will be dead and a lot of old/experienced players will leave for some other game to play.
Mythic elitists?...yeah, i stopped reading there on your 1st post.
Comments
> Endgamer? You mean someone that likes to run TOMM/Zariel? And that's it...to each their own. I'd rather not have content, where 1-2 groups only in game are running, and end result is running with a bunch of people over and over, and usually they have elitist attitudes. Difficult doesn't mean it has to be impossible, so you can have bragging rights.
I think you're missing the point. There needs to be some form of 'end game'. There is lots for the casual players to still do like Bishop mentioned, tomm and zc are significantly easier now and those players can work towards those or vault of stars. However, for that small minority of the community that are completely end game and have done all that content a thousand times over, what are we supposed to do? We are at the point of 1 rotating halaster and zariel whilst running vos naked for fun. As I mentioned earlier there is currently no reason at all to actually gear up a character fully due to the lack of content that actually requires a player to be end game. Those 'elitist' players have spent 2 years doing training runs for content such as tomm or zariel because its something to do and alot of us actually enjoy helping people, though I know obviously that isnt all of the 'elitist' playerbase for sure.
Feedback
It is better if we cant cleanse this dot because it is the tankcheck and we need a mechanic to force tank to swap aggro
> I think people misunderstood TOMM. It was intended to be almost impossible, as too many said there wasn't enough hard content pre mod 16. I'm fairly certain on stream, it was said, you got it. It was meant to be a stopgap and force months of training, and waiting for patches. If they had made phase 1 of the new trial meant not to be passed, how does that help them find bugs? After a year of VOS, i'd rather not have a trial come out that takes months to become runable. They can always add mechs and difficulty, or a master version.
If this is their intention to make a master version of the trial come shortly then sure, but either way there really needs to be an end game to strive for (for the 80k players, not 60k).
Theres probably still a good number of players, especially on console that will be maxed out day 1 as we have a bit longer than PC to prepare for it and more of an insight to what we need. Players will already be preparing for the mod now and there's still 2 months until console release.
> @shivra, would you have rather it be 1 shotting on phase 1, and them not know that phase 3 was doing 1 shots...and wait for patch...to then find out phase 4 also had mechs that are 1 shot. And another patch, just to see last phase? Is the problem that the end of the trial was seen, and it took months for that to happen on TOMM?
No, like I said if this is their intention to have it easier on preview in order to check more of the dungeon for things like exploits and bugs to make sure its running smoothly then im all for that. If its planned that when it is brought to the live server its much more difficult then it sounds great. However, as said above by those thay have completed the trial, there seems to be a lack of mechanics involved making the trial easier than it should be for an end game trial and not just something that's intended to be a 'preview only difficulty' of the trial.
Personally (and I may be in the minority for this part) I would actually like to see it take a long time for even the elite groups to complete given the rewards are worth it to run the content like in tomm. The weapons should not be unbindableand sellable yet either though (for at least a couple more mods IMO) as that would discourage training from those players to other members further down the line when the elites are finally able to complete.
After Zariel was released, me and my friends always joked that the next trial would also be "heavily inspired by" (i.e. shamelessly copied from) a FFXIV trial, but now I'm kinda sad that it wasn't.
I'll start with a few things I like- The setting is aesthetically pleasing not super bright/dark or straining on the eyes. Our dragon foe has a clean imposing appearance and the grappling hook platforming is a nice change from the usual travel methods.
For the actual trial, at first look it's underwhelming. The mechanics aren't engaging they're too simplistic. There's looks to be little or no penalty to failing most mechs outside of the occasional death, and nothing that takes more that very basic situational awareness. Many of the advanced and max geared players look forward to trials to enjoy a dynamic experience that gives them a chance to learn new strategies and develop better team synergy. We invest heavily in our characters, what motivation is there to continue these upgrades or encourage others to do the same if content either scales us or is so simple we could complete it with significantly less gear and a bit more attention to red? Some of the mechs used in vos were great: shifting cleave with placement requirements, the life sapping tether Malthar uses, the oscillating vunerability of the golems and the mobile light pools. All of those created an engaging environment where you had to pay attention to your play and the entirety of the team had an active role, especially at first. It feels like the mechanics in Crown of K are big steps backwards. More hp or just harder hitting attacks aren't enough to make this an epic finale to an otherwise entertaining saga. Many late game players have been looking forward to this eagerly, having it be completed with in a day and, more so, ran near to complete with less than the recommended support classes is disheartening. With demo almost exclusively being ran by solo tanks avoiding basic mechanics and most 3rd mb (VoS) farms jumping hedges, this is begining to feeling like a new standard where "exploiting" mechanics to complete content is encouraged. Why bother to max your HoT healer to keep up with dots a pally shield can withstand, why max a tank if the groups of 10 only need 1, why get to 80k if you can complete it significantly lower with 7 or 8 dps with in the first few days?
Please give the, now very bored, endgame community something to struggle a bit with. The normal ZC/Master ZC was a great direction. It made content available to varying levels of players and also made a great tool for teaching and helping players get familiar with the mechanics before trying the advanced version, something similar would be ideal if the worry is inclusivity. The most addictive part of this game is the multifaceted active combat system coupled with the effect group cooperation, reaction time, and focus can have on your performance. This trial in it's current state just doesn't do any of that justice
Day 1.
-Multiple attempts but the miasma/supports was killing everyone too fast with DoT.
-Some supports was not targetable due to proximity of the dragon, moving the dragon seem to help but not always.
-When we switched to 3 healers, the runs was good but due to one person dying during the island hopping, we could not continue forward.
Day 2.
Same as day 1, the runs was better once we switch to three healers. This time we did a few attempts to take the dragon around the arena so that supports are targetable, seem to be better. Again, we could not continue forward to the next phase when one person die.
I didn't see the (Master) listed next to the trial name on the Q list, so assuming this is the "normal" version. The "Master" version would increase in difficulty and more mechanics? So far we are enjoying this trial and would hope it be on preview for longer duration.
1.Add mechanics from the end of the Tower of Valindra, such as a carousel with souls for example))) And/or complicate the mechanics by making the carousel like a chessboard(like in Zariel)
2.When the Phylactery starts jumping on the platform, you can add the Zariel fan mechanic, when you either stand in between or behind Zariel's back
3.When there is a magic ball with incoming damage to the player, add a black hole from the Vault of Stars on the hit(it will give the motivation to run further)
4. Like the lava in Lostmouth's lair in the final stage of the boss, you can make parts of the circle just as dangerous, just adjust it to the mechanics of Valindra or Dracolich
In the new trial we took down 4-5 bars of HP of the Dragon in the last phase, that's the furthest we got after 7 hours of the trials. We all knew the mechanics in the beggining, so there was no finding out new mechanics (YT and info from other players).
In general the trial is a bit boring in the mechanics subject. I was hoping for something more like ToMM or Zariel, but it's not too bad, it's just different, closer to the new Demogorgon trial in that subject and I understand that's what you were aiming for.
My feedback about particular parts of the trial:
1. Most important - Hit Box of the Dragon: Please do something about size of dragon's hitbox (it's too big) or adjust aiming assist, because when range dps try to killl the 'Support', even though the dragon is NOT targetted and sometimes is not even on the screen, the skills go to the dragon, not the Support (same situation with targeting Valindra by the other tank when she's close to the dragon). All of the range DPS in my group had the same issue, we had to turn back on the dragon to not see any part of it on the screen, look down on the ground in the direction of the 'Support' with hope that our skills hit the 'Support'
2. Second most important - Electricity circles during Push mechanic: in the 4th and 5th phase please don't mix the mechanics of 'push' (after landing the dragon) with the electricy circles mechanic. A lot of players got pushed into the red electric circles and died and it couldn't be avoided. In my opinion it's too random and not dependent on the player skill or experience, it's just out of place on the endgame trial and it looks unpolished, like the mechanic is not intended to be there. It would be different if you could avoid or dash somehow from it or position yourselve differently, but you cant' as you are controlled during the flying from 'push' mechanic and the circles sometimes appear during your flight.
3.Third most important - Last phase Boss HP: The boss on the last phase has way too much HP, please lower it down a bit.
4. Just a suggestion to make the life easier - DoT from the Support spawn: In my opinion there should be an icon for the DoT damage from 'Supports' on the player's 'active effects bar' with a timer, moreover the DoT should end when last support dies, as sometimes it's still hitting even for more than 5-10 seconds after the last 'Support' dies. Moreover I think the dmg from that DoT could be tuned down a little bit.