Prophecy of doom is wroking WAY BETTER than intented!

dyukiller · May 2020

Suddently thousands of DC dps pop on neverwinter sever, even my guildies and friend that played as cw,barb,tr and hunter for years just drop their toons and spent their time and ad to master and build up a DC dps, as a tank i dont mind much about the paingiver, i just want to know if the party manage to complete the challenge.
That said, i was wondering why this old school guys like me did that, well i saw that happen when plague fire was hiting absurd dmg on tr's shadow of deminse, i saw that happen when the soul puppet was killing bosses in second, i saw that whe the gf was abble to hit kill bosses, all those times something wasn't work as it should.

So i asked to a friend to tell me what is so awesme on dc to make him leave his class behind and bet in a dc dps, the answer was a print of profecy of doom hitting almost 8 milions, LOL, yes a big LOL to you guys, now is the point you dc gets angry cuz you problaby think the toon is a reflection of you in game, so im trying to make joke of you, but not.
So dont waste your time giving me arguments, cuz they already did: this only happens with certain buff, bla bla bla etc.

The tooltip is the best part, thay said that it says: you gonna give back 30% of all damage you did in 10 seconds. LOL !

if he hits let's say 7m and 7m is 30%, the 100% is: 23,1m in 10 seconds!

Anyway, idk if its getting the party dgm, or the POD dmg going thru wrong math that use players buff and enemie debuffs, i really don't mind.

i just fell sorry for all that get into this and waste their time and ad in something that problably gonna be fixed, Imo the dev's know that, but they may noticed that there's a lack of healers in game and this is their solution, one day you see a patch note saying that POD is fixed and boom all theses dps become useless, but you've spet in mounts, insiginas, compys, artfacts, gear and enchants, so you think at least i can use it as a healer if we need... exactly as the expected.

yeah kinda of illuminatti stuff, but in 5 years in this game i saw it happened before.

carloswartune · May 2020

There's nothing bugged with POD. It does exactly what it says, 30% of the player's damage dealt during the time period. The damage dealt by it is fixed, it does not get increased by buffs and debuffs (as opposed to the old Shadow of Demise, that dealt insane damage due "double dipping"). I tested it with the help of a friend.

The high damage numbers you are seeing is not a problem with POD per se (it's working exactly as per the description). It's just due to the absurd number of damage Arbiter can deal in a burst. By using Perfect Balance optimally, an Arbiter can use Guardian of faith, 4x Forgemaster's Flame and 4x Dauting Light during the POD time frame, and that's the reason why POD hits so hard.

When they change Arbiter, it won't be a fix, because everything is working correctly now. It will be a plain nerf.

tom · May 2020

it works exactly like it is supposed to work

giz · May 2020

Well it's the bad about this community. People hates to see a "healer" class being good on its DPS spec. Those that plays DPS on their Clerics will still playing DPS on the same class or on the new BIS class. You need different setup for a healer spec, it's not that easy to be a BIS healer with a 100% DPS pets setup. If they aren't interested in healing they will move to other class instead of spend AD to play a different role.

durugudesu · May 2020

giz#2086 said:
Well it's the bad about this community. People hates to see a "healer" class being good on its DPS spec. Those that plays DPS on their Clerics will still playing DPS on the same class or on the new BIS class. You need different setup for a healer spec, it's not that easy to be a BIS healer with a 100% DPS pets setup. If they aren't interested in healing they will move to other class instead of spend AD to play a different role.

While its not easy being a healer with dps setup, it is absolutely very easy to dps even with healer companions as an arbiter.

And what has that do to with PoD btw? The reason PoD can get so high is because of stacking of debuffs and damage increase, which is limited to 10 persons in a trial, but in an open instance is not.

Not sure why you still bring up [people hatest to see a "healer" class being good on its DPS spec], even if you dont agree with it, just the mere mention of this argument makes "people" think about how your "logic" is very different from everyone else's.

dyukiller · May 2020

Ok, i do believe that ! PoD is working correctly, meaning that's worse that I thought!!

First of all I don't mind, I don't care actually who is the top dps now, dc has a dps role and that is great, this brings new play style and diversity to the game, the problem happens when a toon overcomes all other in game, becoming the meta and destroying the diversity.

Here's my point, if I remember correctly, all the changes in mod 16 have been made to, dev's words was like:
Control power scalability and buffs because players could kill bosses too fast, some skilled players managed to stack buffs and kill bosses in seconds and this was not what they want to.

Now I see a party of 8 DC, 1 tank and 1 op melting halastor in 9 minutes, relax guild posted on Facebook this.

4 DC and 1 tank killing bosses in IC in 1 rotation.
Forge bam 8 millions
Daunting, boom 6 millions
Forge again, 7 millions
Daunting, 4 millions
Pod boom 8 millions

Majority of dps class cant deal these numbers, not on encounters, maybe a critical daily with pretty good debuff and buff, but encounters?

Look, enjoy the class, have fun.

I'll be there to tank and be healed by you guys when the nerf come, and don't fool yourselves, it will.

sax1993 · May 2020

So much salt lol. Prophecy is not broken it deals 30% of the damage you dealt in a 10 second window. Yes you can hit over 8 mil but it is RARE. My average PoD hit in ToMM is between 2 and 3 million on numerous runs I have save in ACT. Sure if I was averaging 7-8 mils a run you could say it’s broken but it’s not.

AoE we are subpar unless the enemies are balled up for searing javelin to hit them all and daunting is a tiny AoE circle that can hit 2 mobs 3 is PUSHING it.

Single target we use perfect balance to be able to use multiple encounters in a row but then there is a down time of us having to build our divinity up. Why DCs shine in ToMM is because they rebuild their divinity in between phases so when it’s the next phase they’re ready to go all out again with that rotation. If this was a continuous boss fight with no phases you wouldn’t see DCs doing so much damage. Even then there are wizards that can still hang with DCs even after the fixed storm spell. I’ve been beaten in DPS in ToMM on my DC by every DPS class including Warlock and Fighter. It’s not an issue with DC being overpowered just because the majority of players who play the other classes haven’t fully optimized their build to push it to its limit.

sax1993 · May 2020

Also there have been 8 CW runs in ToMM done in 10 minutes also so should wizards be nerfed as well?

carloswartune · May 2020

Hellbringers also did a 10 minute run:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twHnjJAHqUE.
Please create a forum post to complain about SW DPS being overpowered too.

giz · May 2020

carloswartune#5709 said:
Hellbringers also did a 10 minute run:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twHnjJAHqUE.
Please create a forum post to complain about SW DPS being overpowered too.

That was fixed. Was the Creeping Death stacking bug.

carloswartune · May 2020

giz#2086 said:

carloswartune#5709 said:
Hellbringers also did a 10 minute run:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twHnjJAHqUE.
Please create a forum post to complain about SW DPS being overpowered too.
That was fixed. Was the Creeping Death stacking bug.

I know, I was just taking a jab at the "10 minutes ToMM, must nerf" thing. I wonder how much time this group would take to complete ToMM now.

tuna · May 2020

in single target no matter if things are working as intended or not clerics are blowing everyone out the watter closly followed by cw's and both classes with a non complete toon can make completed good players in other classes look bad thats the bottom line. and i play a cw

dyukiller · May 2020

Look, They've been fixing broken stuff constantly, SW had Creeping Death fixed, CW had Storm Spell incorrectly influenced by Critical rate fixed, and still things to fix like CW has a feat that should give dmg buff only to at wills/daily (i guess) working on encounters hiting 3m+ on desintegrate.
Barbarians can crit bilethorn.

i'm complaining! YES i do this every single time i found something that IMO is working better than it should be.

WHY?
because i find unfair to other players that put effor and time, even money to build an end game toon, then run against(once dps thinks paingiver is a competition) some broken class and get disapointed, so they spend their time trying to figure out what's the problem with their toon, when the problem is a broken class as dc is right now.

Sax,assuming that is you, we played togheter on xbox couple time, you have a fat halfling, don't you?
So, while ppl is trying to buy a DB to have 3% more dmg, you reather play as halfling, that gives you nothing besides the aparecence that you probably find funny, but even as a halfling you did 70m more dmg than everybody on that run, why will someone( in perfect judgement) give up of 3% more dmg in a dps class? you guys don't even give up from rusted iron that take away 25% IH, only because it guve 5% more dmg.
i know, this is funny, you do much more dmg than overall ppl with your dc, ppl get kind of angry/surprised, and say "who is this guys? let me inspect him", and what they see?
A fat red head halfling , wearing a wierd costume, classic!

everytime that i go to chults and i see wesley kaiser,subzirow, mandela,.... sigh.... a lot of ppl running dc instead of their old toons, this really put down, all those great warriors fall on their knees and accept the fact that they can't do better, not becouse they are bad or their toons aren't BIS, but DC is so broken that is almost impossible to get close,they just give up plus the farm, ohh the farm, run tomm in 11 minutes is way better, oh yeah, and me? i just try to hold the aggro and not be killed in the process, look, i'm the last one that should complain, this is pretty good to me actualy, DC kills fast, i don't get stacks of A.ball and minimize the chance of spending scolls.

DC is broken, everybody know, so please don't act like you all don't know that, or like i was telling nonsense things cuz i've envy or something, i could easily create a DC as well.

but above all arguments that a i could give you, i just need one:
SENSEI SLAYS.

this is an ancestral knowledge: "if sensei is playing as, it's bugged somehow"

tom · May 2020

dyukiller said:
Look, They've been fixing broken stuff constantly, SW had Creeping Death fixed, CW had Storm Spell incorrectly influenced by Critical rate fixed, and still things to fix like CW has a feat that should give dmg buff only to at wills/daily (i guess) working on encounters hiting 3m+ on desintegrate.
Barbarians can crit bilethorn.

i'm complaining! YES i do this every single time i found something that IMO is working better than it should be.

WHY?
because i find unfair to other players that put effor and time, even money to build an end game toon, then run against(once dps thinks paingiver is a competition) some broken class and get disapointed, so they spend their time trying to figure out what's the problem with their toon, when the problem is a broken class as dc is right now.

Sax,assuming that is you, we played togheter on xbox couple time, you have a fat halfling, don't you?
So, while ppl is trying to buy a DB to have 3% more dmg, you reather play as halfling, that gives you nothing besides the aparecence that you probably find funny, but even as a halfling you did 70m more dmg than everybody on that run, why will someone( in perfect judgement) give up of 3% more dmg in a dps class? you guys don't even give up from rusted iron that take away 25% IH, only because it guve 5% more dmg.
i know, this is funny, you do much more dmg than overall ppl with your dc, ppl get kind of angry/surprised, and say "who is this guys? let me inspect him", and what they see?
A fat red head halfling , wearing a wierd costume, classic!

everytime that i go to chults and i see wesley kaiser,subzirow, mandela,.... sigh.... a lot of ppl running dc instead of their old toons, this really put down, all those great warriors fall on their knees and accept the fact that they can't do better, not becouse they are bad or their toons aren't BIS, but DC is so broken that is almost impossible to get close,they just give up plus the farm, ohh the farm, run tomm in 11 minutes is way better, oh yeah, and me? i just try to hold the aggro and not be killed in the process, look, i'm the last one that should complain, this is pretty good to me actualy, DC kills fast, i don't get stacks of A.ball and minimize the chance of spending scolls.

DC is broken, everybody know, so please don't act like you all don't know that, or like i was telling nonsense things cuz i've envy or something, i could easily create a DC as well.

but above all arguments that a i could give you, i just need one:
SENSEI SLAYS.

this is an ancestral knowledge: "if sensei is playing as, it's bugged somehow"

just because you want it to be broken doesnt mean it is broken. Its working exactly how its intended. Barb is doing even more dps then cleric on preview after the latest changes, are you going to complain about that next? And about fighter, they do just as much dps. CW too? looks like all classes are broken lmao

originalsin · May 2020

dyukiller said:
Ok, i do believe that ! PoD is working correctly, meaning that's worse that I thought!!

First of all I don't mind, I don't care actually who is the top dps now, dc has a dps role and that is great, this brings new play style and diversity to the game, the problem happens when a toon overcomes all other in game, becoming the meta and destroying the diversity.

Now I see a party of 8 DC, 1 tank and 1 op melting halastor in 9 minutes, relax guild posted on Facebook this.

4 DC and 1 tank killing bosses in IC in 1 rotation.

Forge bam 8 millions

Daunting, boom 6 millions

Forge again, 7 millions

Daunting, 4 millions

Pod boom 8 millions
.

What are those numbers? Is it an inability to distinguish millions from hundred thousands?

And we didn’t have a diversity problem before when DC DPS was so rare, that seeing two in a party would be a subject of discussion?

clericalist · May 2020

A bit off topic (but not too much), why are people who picked the cleric wanting to play the dps role in parties? Is this what you had in mind when started your character? If you prefer playing dps over healer, why not pick a class that is meant to be a dps, the dps role should be used for solo content, these numbers are definitely not as intended. My main is a cleric but this is nonsense, a cleric doing more dps that dps specialists will be and rightly should be nerfed.

tom · May 2020

clericalist said:
A bit off topic (but not too much), why are people who picked the cleric wanting to play the dps role in parties? Is this what you had in mind when started your character? If you prefer playing dps over healer, why not pick a class that is meant to be a dps, the dps role should be used for solo content, these numbers are definitely not as intended. My main is a cleric but this is nonsense, a cleric doing more dps that dps specialists will be and rightly should be nerfed.

who are you to say that the clerics dps path is only intended for solo play? The devs clearly stated that they aim to have all dps paths to be comparable in terms of dps output.

arazith07 · May 2020

Cleric has been my first and main character for seven years now. I do enjoy the support role, however there are many times, especially after dealing with a particularly hard-headed or brain dead group of random people, that you just want to kick back for an easy run and only have to worry about yourself. It's a huge plus that I don't have to worry about upkeeping a whole another character to be able to enjoy dps since M16.

sax1993 · May 2020

I play as a Halfling because I prefer the look and enjoy wearing head armor rather than a minimal buff that the Dragonborn gives. 3% damage which in a perfect world of a 200M ToMM run is a measly 6 million more, and when I say in a perfect world it's not like that as all +% damage buffs are additive to each other so that 3% is not my damage multiplied by 3%, so it's even less than 6 million.

Again, I don't think that Arbiter is deserving of a nerf. Just because in ToMM you see them top performing (and it's not by much as I said I have been beaten by EVERY class in this game in a run, and have numerous ACT logs on PC with other classes fairly close to my DPS) it's because that encounter is literally set up for us to do well. Every phase starts off with an easy 10 seconds of no mechanics for us to get our full rotation off with no interruption. If you mess up your flow of rotation at any point in the dungeon you're going to do sub-par DPS, if you think it's so easy create an arbiter and see how crucial it is to keep that flow of your rotation up. When you take a down or he phases too quickly before you get your rotation off Arbiter loses a ton of DPS to get back into that flow of its rotation. Then we go into the AoE side of things I already mentioned we are no where near the level of Barbs,Rangers,Rogues, etc as mobs need to be in a single file line for us to even compete with searing javelin.

As for people swapping to Arbiter from their other classes? We have multiple character slots for a reason, to play different things if we didn't this game would grow stale quick if you played one class mainly. IIRC when ToMM first dropped tons of DPS classes swapped to Wizards because they were easily top performing at the time, one Barbie main that swapped to CW for ToMM is actually in this discussion right now?

Cleric has been my main since Mod 5 on Xbox back in 2015, since then I have always played the DPS/DPS Support role which was Divine Oracle at the time because I enjoyed the playstyle a lot compared to a plain old healer, you can scroll back in this forum and see my Divine Oracle guide from 5 years ago. The DPS role it has is definitely not for solo play only that's a joke the Devs stated themselves they want all DPS roles to be balanced with each other, if that weren't the case where is Paladin's DPS role for "soloing"?

vorphied · May 2020

clericalist said:
A bit off topic (but not too much), why are people who picked the cleric wanting to play the dps role in parties? Is this what you had in mind when started your character? If you prefer playing dps over healer, why not pick a class that is meant to be a dps, the dps role should be used for solo content, these numbers are definitely not as intended. My main is a cleric but this is nonsense, a cleric doing more dps that dps specialists will be and rightly should be nerfed.

As respectfully as possible, this is nonsense. Arbiter is a DPS path, plain and simple. Players were already using Divine Oracle as a DPS option prior to M16, and Arbiter was created to give those players a dedicated path intended to be competitive with other DPS. It's silly to suggest that Cleric should be only a healer or a stop-gap solo DPS.

That being said, Arbiter overperforms a bit in single-target. The skill floor is higher, but the results are undeniably out of sync with the majority of other DPS options. In the interest of balance, they should do a little bit less damage or (ideally) everyone else should be brought to their level and the game content further tweaked if necessary to offset the increased party damage.

sunshinehappy · May 2020

I just want to to cast at-wills to reach my 6 colored dots then throw out an encounter and repeat. This prophecy rotation is not enjoyable for me.

originalsin · May 2020

clericalist said:
A bit off topic (but not too much), why are people who picked the cleric wanting to play the dps role in parties? Is this what you had in mind when started your character? If you prefer playing dps over healer, why not pick a class that is meant to be a dps, the dps role should be used for solo content, these numbers are definitely not as intended. My main is a cleric but this is nonsense, a cleric doing more dps that dps specialists will be and rightly should be nerfed.

When I picked the cleric, I was told I don’t need to heal, that’s the job of the temp lock. You may have signed up to watch health bars but I didn’t.

clericalist · May 2020

originalsin#4257 said:

clericalist said:
A bit off topic (but not too much), why are people who picked the cleric wanting to play the dps role in parties? Is this what you had in mind when started your character? If you prefer playing dps over healer, why not pick a class that is meant to be a dps, the dps role should be used for solo content, these numbers are definitely not as intended. My main is a cleric but this is nonsense, a cleric doing more dps that dps specialists will be and rightly should be nerfed.
When I picked the cleric, I was told I don’t need to heal, that’s the job of the temp lock. You may have signed up to watch health bars but I didn’t.

People seem to forget that this is supposed to be a Dungeons and Dragons themed game. Despite all the problems, broken design, game metas that the self declared "experts" say we should follow - the guiding principle in how this game should be played and developed is Dungeons and Dragons. The further it gets from this, the worse the game, if the warlock is intended to be a healer and the cleric a damage dealer, that is wrong, no amount of "but its the current meta and we just have to accept it" will change this fact.

flublblblu · May 2020

clericalist said:

originalsin#4257 said:

clericalist said:
A bit off topic (but not too much), why are people who picked the cleric wanting to play the dps role in parties? Is this what you had in mind when started your character? If you prefer playing dps over healer, why not pick a class that is meant to be a dps, the dps role should be used for solo content, these numbers are definitely not as intended. My main is a cleric but this is nonsense, a cleric doing more dps that dps specialists will be and rightly should be nerfed.
When I picked the cleric, I was told I don’t need to heal, that’s the job of the temp lock. You may have signed up to watch health bars but I didn’t.
People seem to forget that this is supposed to be a Dungeons and Dragons themed game. Despite all the problems, broken design, game metas that the self declared "experts" say we should follow - the guiding principle in how this game should be played and developed is Dungeons and Dragons. The further it gets from this, the worse the game, if the warlock is intended to be a healer and the cleric a damage dealer, that is wrong, no amount of "but its the current meta and we just have to accept it" will change this fact.

You clearly havn't played D&D recently, clerics are huge damage dealers, Light cleric is a very strong domain and very damage oriented, and celestial warlock are good at healing.

vorphied · May 2020

clericalist said:

originalsin#4257 said:

clericalist said:
A bit off topic (but not too much), why are people who picked the cleric wanting to play the dps role in parties? Is this what you had in mind when started your character? If you prefer playing dps over healer, why not pick a class that is meant to be a dps, the dps role should be used for solo content, these numbers are definitely not as intended. My main is a cleric but this is nonsense, a cleric doing more dps that dps specialists will be and rightly should be nerfed.
When I picked the cleric, I was told I don’t need to heal, that’s the job of the temp lock. You may have signed up to watch health bars but I didn’t.
People seem to forget that this is supposed to be a Dungeons and Dragons themed game. Despite all the problems, broken design, game metas that the self declared "experts" say we should follow - the guiding principle in how this game should be played and developed is Dungeons and Dragons. The further it gets from this, the worse the game, if the warlock is intended to be a healer and the cleric a damage dealer, that is wrong, no amount of "but its the current meta and we just have to accept it" will change this fact.

Even in old-school D&D clerics were not exclusively healers. They had specializations for offense at least as far back as 2E....

It's your perspective on D&D clerics that is like this, not the actual game.

kythelion · May 2020

Old school clerics had pretty limited casting, so damage, and sometimes even tanking, was part of their repertoire. There's a reason old school clerics carried a mace and wore armor. I miss the days of bashy clerics ....

New school clerics are pretty hefty damage though, this is truth.

keru · May 2020

"when the nerf come" , and don't fool yourselves, it will."

You're absolutely right. Probly they will nerf it to only provide 10%
and then go back to be a miserable Dps class who's only good for doing daily quests lol.
To us Clerics Arbiters out there , let's enjoy it while it last!

originalsin · May 2020

clericalist said:

People seem to forget that this is supposed to be a Dungeons and Dragons themed game. Despite all the problems, broken design, game metas that the self declared "experts" say we should follow - the guiding principle in how this game should be played and developed is Dungeons and Dragons. The further it gets from this, the worse the game, if the warlock is intended to be a healer and the cleric a damage dealer, that is wrong, no amount of "but its the current meta and we just have to accept it" will change this fact.

Except clerics don’t have to heal in DnD anymore. War and tempest domain‘s abilities that are focused on self damage, light Domain is also a good choice. Divine soul Sorcerer and celestial warlock are competitive with clerics at healing.

In 5E, in most circumstances, healing is the most efficient when done at 0 health. Making having one dedicated healer less useful than having a bunch of people who can heal a tiny bit.

carloswartune · May 2020

originalsin#4257 said:

clericalist said:

People seem to forget that this is supposed to be a Dungeons and Dragons themed game. Despite all the problems, broken design, game metas that the self declared "experts" say we should follow - the guiding principle in how this game should be played and developed is Dungeons and Dragons. The further it gets from this, the worse the game, if the warlock is intended to be a healer and the cleric a damage dealer, that is wrong, no amount of "but its the current meta and we just have to accept it" will change this fact.

Except clerics don’t have to heal in DnD anymore. War and tempest domain‘s abilities that are focused on self damage, light Domain is also a good choice. Divine soul Sorcerer and celestial warlock are competitive with clerics at healing.

In 5E, in most circumstances, healing is the most efficient when done at 0 health. Making having one dedicated healer less useful than having a bunch of people who can heal a tiny bit.

Same thing every time. People think D&D is limited to that same "generic medieval fantasy" theme so prevalent in computer RPGs these days. Then we get stupid complains like "dinosaurs have nothing to do with D&D", "outer space isn't D&D", "cars are an insult to D&D", "Clerics dealing damage isn't D&D", "Warlocks can't heal, that's not D&D", even though all of these are present in official D&D material. They probably would lose their hamster if they heard about Spelljammer or Eberron.

sunshinehappy · May 2020

Is there a 2nd best dps rotation to replace the prophecy of doom strategy if it gets nerfed? Or will we have to start over on another class

tempus86 · June 2020

Well, has anyone actually worked out how much a forgemasters should actually be hitting for? because to me the numbers look pretty fishy.

new lionheart weapons top end damage is 5800. forgemasters with 6 pips, is 1250magnitude right? 650, + 100 per pip.
Pretty sure the formula, is - weapon x magnitude/100 x power x CA x Crit Sev x all % buffs added together.

So that's 5800 x 12.5, for the basic hit. 72500.
assume 300k power
150% crit sev
72500 x 4 x 2 x 2.5. is 1.45million, before percentage buffs.

Lets assume 200% buffs from mounts/artefacts/class stuff etc.
that's still only gonna give 4.5mil on a perfect hit
Not even sure you can get 200% either.

So what am I missing

Prophecy of doom is wroking WAY BETTER than intented!

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