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Questions for the long term players....
barkloud
Member Posts: 38 Arc User
To start my highest level charactor is level 77, which was mostly leveled in Mod 15. It was a Paladin and after spending five minutes comically watching my trash mob in the undermountain regen to full life over and over I decided to create a Wizard, which I have been trying to play.
I have found other mmo's I like, but the "expletive filled" chat and discord is sometimes too much for me. I really like the community of this game, so I can tolerate a substancial level of gameplay frustration, but this current Mod's is a little much for me.
I am looking for a long term game to play and am more than willing to wait through short term frustrations. So I thought I would ask a few questions:
How often does Neverwinter come out with Mods?
Do most new mods have the problems that Mod 16 has had?
How long does the development team typically take to fix new Mods?
Do the developers stick to their guns or do they bend to the will of the players?
If you had to gauge the state of the game over the years, would it be more like Mod 15 or Mod 16?
I stated in another post, the developer seemed genuine in his comments, but I have not followed this game so I do not know if it was truthful or lip service. I have no problem buying VIP or spending money that is the equivalent of a typical mmorpg monthly fee. I just do not want to dump money in a game that is going to be just as frustrating 90 days from now as it is today.
Thanks in advance to those who answer.
I have found other mmo's I like, but the "expletive filled" chat and discord is sometimes too much for me. I really like the community of this game, so I can tolerate a substancial level of gameplay frustration, but this current Mod's is a little much for me.
I am looking for a long term game to play and am more than willing to wait through short term frustrations. So I thought I would ask a few questions:
How often does Neverwinter come out with Mods?
Do most new mods have the problems that Mod 16 has had?
How long does the development team typically take to fix new Mods?
Do the developers stick to their guns or do they bend to the will of the players?
If you had to gauge the state of the game over the years, would it be more like Mod 15 or Mod 16?
I stated in another post, the developer seemed genuine in his comments, but I have not followed this game so I do not know if it was truthful or lip service. I have no problem buying VIP or spending money that is the equivalent of a typical mmorpg monthly fee. I just do not want to dump money in a game that is going to be just as frustrating 90 days from now as it is today.
Thanks in advance to those who answer.
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Comments
Mod 16 with its massive amount of sweeping changes made it a completely different game and has finally drove me to stop playing again. and I still have about 300 days of VIP left ( I am going to use all the keys still just giving away whatever I get to my guild so people that do still enjoy the game get some benefit out of it and it is not just lost money for cryptic's gain But after a few patches into mod 16 it has only gotten worse since launch even to the point of removing 2 of the most popular dungeons last week because they messed them up so bad they were unplayable....they may be back someday but they also removed stuff in the past and never put it back in so who knows. Personally for me it is just enough I will not play again or support cryptic again, Which makes me sad as Forgotten realms is a world I love and they are working on a MTG mmo and I love mtg as well but the trust is no longer there for me.
Basically I would say it boils down to this are you having fun playing now? because they have already said the scaling is working as intended so other then minor tweaks (usually couple with other changes that offset those tweaks) you can expect it to remain as is, they want the game slower for everything to be harder and to take longer than it was before mod 16. They want progression to be completely pointless everywhere but a the newest content they deliver as only 2 campaigns will be unscaled at all times so the more mods released the more and more scaled content to unscaled will exist. So if you want the mod 15 version of the game honestly likely best to move on if you want the mod 16 stuff you are fine to play. personally usually I enjoy the more challenging and harder mmo's but not NW model where they try to get you to gamble for good gear through lock boxes since it makes them money....those I prefer the casual game play. Challenging games I expect loot and gear to mostly come from the challenging encounters.
I would throw a word of caution as well it is not always true but many of the moves neverwinter has taken in mod 16 also show signs of their cash flow drying up and them trying to make it harder to do some things without paying. They devalued AD by uping the exchange limit and making it harder to farm ad as well. Tripled the amount of seals needed to get 1k rad as well as flat out did not give the option at all for one of the new seals (mountain). Just by playing the new mod it is easy to tell they rushed it out way to fast. The new mod pack in the zen store is the single most expensive thing they have every had at a whooping $200. In the past I have witnessed similar moves by other games start within a year or two of them just shutting down the servers or announcing there would basically no longer be any real support for the game. So that makes me kinda questionable about how the game is performing from a financial perspective for them....
It feels a lot like that's what Cryptic is trying to do here with Undermountain. It's painfully clear that their staff is horribly undermanned to rise up to the challenge of fixing all that is broken in the game (whether they think it's working as intended or not) because the developers have either left willingly or have been transferred to other projects. I really don't expect the game to even release another module after this, but I would be happy if it did as the Forgotten Realms is my favorite universe in which to adventure.
Do most new mods have the problems that Mod 16 has had? no. Only mod 6 comes close.
How long does the development team typically take to fix new Mods? Half fixed before next mod. A quarter of it never gets fixed.
Do the developers stick to their guns or do they bend to the will of the players? They tend to stick to their guns. I believe they listen strongly to the advice of a handful of liked/trusted play-testers. In my experience, Most changes resulting from community outcry have been over-reactions and under-reactions from developers, rather than an appropriate, thoughtfully balanced response.
If you had to gauge the state of the game over the years, would it be more like Mod 15 or Mod 16? Mod15. Big mistake to judge the game on its present player sentiment. It will improve.
Do the developers stick to their guns or do they bend to the will of the players? I have rarely seen developers to bend their wills because players being vocal doesn't mean they represent the majority or it is wise they want. And I can accept it because I have seen game die because developers tended to listened to the vocal minority all the time. The golden path must be in the middle.
As I suspect currently Arc don't listen to players as much they should because as I told earlier they may be forced by investors and I think they lack the adequate number of developers taking care of this game.
If I may make a more reasonable suggestion, go to gog.com and consider buying Neverwinter Nights 1 & 2 since they do provide a nice backstory to the events of Neverwinter Online. Play those until mod 17 is released which hopefully will fix the mess mod 16 has made... or until Neverwinter Online is shut down completely which is certainly not a stretch of the imagination nowadays.
I'd be very interested to read that and to dig deeper into where the source found that information.
It's useless info, but they "read it somewhere".
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I don't think that people need to dig too deep here.
The devs were having problems with the old code. It was a mess.
The game was in a state of imbalance. Horrible imbalance. It needed fixing.
I don't think that there is more to it than that, and the devs told us that much.
The reverting to a simple class name is just reality slapping them in the face.
Did anyone really expect a second Wizard or Rogue class? Did anyone think that there was another Cleric or Warlock around the corner?
- Most of the time they stick to their guns, like with the Gateway removal, the coalgate and recently the scaling (for now at least)
- Extremely rarely they listened to the players, like with keygate. When they changed the way dungeon chests were working, the players reacted too strongly and the devs waited to have a complete restructuration of the loot table before implementing that.
- Sometimes they trick the community by suggesting huge changes, then back up a bit and reduce them when people get angry, so they can still pass significant changes and as a bonus people feel listened. Happened with the bonding changes for example.
There are going to be issues, which there are.
They will identify and work on those issues, which they are.
What Mod 16 equates to is basically creating an entirely new game then trying to integrate that new game into an existing one without any significant downtime. It's a huge undertaking, don't let the rampant whining that these forums are full of influence you.
Neverwinter gets 2-3 new mods per year, usually 3.
At most, 1-2 things tend to break for each Mod, they're generally things no-one could see coming and often not particularly disruptive.
Disruptive problems are fixed within a week or two. Issues that are less problematic can take longer, some deemed low priority and put off to be fixed in large Bug Fix months where they devote all their time to fixing bugs.
The Dev. team doesn't cater to the whims of the community, mostly because the community acts largely like toddlers as evidenced by most of the users here. They do work on scaling back things that are too intrusive but it is generally to a point they originally intended it to be anyway.
The game is good enough that most of the Veteran players still play it. Mod16 is a major outlier.
Basically:
- Wallet Warriors who bought their way to max gear feel robbed because they made poor financial decisions and because, honestly, they suck at the game and Mod16 exposes bad players.
- People with the attention span of a cube of cheese do nothing but abuse the Dev. team because everything isn't fixed in 2 seconds and they think it's as easy as flipping a switch.
- Trolls troll.
To my mind the notion that "someone forced them to adopt 5e because corporate oversight..." is far less believable than "Devs wanted to distance the game from 4e because... why the hell would you want to still be associated with 4e???" which also happens to make sense without needing a conspiracy of dark overlords.
I just like to think that the occasional nudge to back up claims of corporate interference and evil machinations by citing with source might one day cause someone to either do that, or think twice before becoming another link in the daisy chain of fairly implausible claims.
It would make sense for WoTC pushing for the game to move more towards 5e.
So my theory is they lost so much income that they needed to get the money flowing again and could not economically tolerate a delay of the launch.
Of course the mess known as 'mod 16' probably also have cost them a lot of money from reduced Zen sales.
Mod16 move significantly towards 5E, I mean?
We have a completely different stat system here than in 5E. Since when did Paladins need intelligence to deal more damage?
Strength is useful to Rogues in D&D, but it's not a priority. Now it seems like it is here.
I have not played 5E, but I have looked at the SRD documents online along with official excerpts.
What we have here does not seem particularly close to 5E to me. Not as I understand things.
These dungeons have not returned since module 6;
- Lair of the Mad Dragon -- Helm's Hold
- Throne of Idris -- Ebon Downs
- The Dread Vault -- Whispering Caverns
- Fardelver's Crypt -- Gauntlgrym
- Dwarf King Crypt -- Gauntlgrym
The "version" of Lair of the Mad Dragon they offered for "Tales of Old" is not a level 34 dungeon in Helm's Hold. Beyond that I have seen too much content removed and not enough fixed from the past. Asking my opinion of Cryptic Studios game development over time is of very poor quality. Many people have asked them to take a break from make "extra stuff" and just repair what we have.Some of the behaviour by Cryptic in this MOD makes me suspicious they want to be done with the IP and there might be some contractual issue keeping them from just shutting it down. Unless that is, the numbers get so low they reach some benchmark that they can or WotC pulls the IP plug.
The range of player responses varies greatly to the mod.
Mod 16 is unusual because of the sheer scope of the changes. Most mods for a player in your position add very little that is immediately relevant.
The devs “stick to their guns” in the broad sense of whatever they do. But they do listen to player feedback, the problem is the forum feedback is not the only source of feedback and the forum community tends to be unable to grasp that their voice is not the only one.
Expect changes to continue in 16 at least weekly that will improve your experience. Get a guild and ask questions, right now even veterans have things to learn. (I play tested a lot, and I’m still learning details of this mod.)
Obsidian Oath - Warlock
A whole lot of other Obsidian toons as well.