[PC] Mod15 PvE DC Guide: Help Me Michela!

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Comments

  • adinosii
    adinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User

    If I'll ever get my hands on one of those sets I'll do some testing myself.

    Well, I think I have the artifacts lying around somewhere, and the neck/belt pieces can be bought in the store, so it's easy enough to test them on Preview.
    Hoping for improvements...
  • chemjeff
    chemjeff Member Posts: 544 Arc User
    Thank you for the excellent guide. I did not know about the Light of Divinity offhand feature before. It is amazing.

    But, I was a little disappointed that you didn't include something on Frost as a debuffing enchant. Personally I think it deserves at least as much of a mention as Plague Fire does. What do you think?
  • rjc9000
    rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,398 Arc User
    Frost is pretty good, and even appears in the DO support enchantment section, though the uptime is not ... great.

    Frost didn't appear in the AC section because the idea was to have something assist in placing Bear your Sins on mobs. I figured that, if we're picking support enchants, we might as well pick the ones that double duty for placing ByS on mobs. Hence why I only selected Plaguefire and Dread for that section.

    Keep in mind that ByS is easily applied by FF and BtS, since both have a DoT component. If you find that you don't need ByS on mobs, or use some other gimmick to place ByS on mobs (ex: 1 point in Fire of the Gods, Death Salad, or Wereat Theif), then feel free to run Frost.

  • adinosii
    adinosii Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 4,294 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:

    If you find that you don't need ByS on mobs, or use some other gimmick to place ByS on mobs (ex: 1 point in Fire of the Gods, Death Salad, or Wereat Theif), then feel free to run Frost.

    There are a few other reasons why an AC might want to use Frost. A typical AC build has low Crit%, so the Crit Severity bonus of Dread is kind-of wasted - also Dread is quite popular with some other classes. In contrast, Frost is rarely used by any classes except DCs, so you will typically have less chance of duplicated, non-stacking enchants.

    To me that outweights the drawback of having to ensure DoTs in some other way.

    Hoping for improvements...
  • rjc9000
    rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,398 Arc User
    adinosii said:

    rjc9000 said:

    If you find that you don't need ByS on mobs, or use some other gimmick to place ByS on mobs (ex: 1 point in Fire of the Gods, Death Salad, or Wereat Theif), then feel free to run Frost.

    There are a few other reasons why an AC might want to use Frost. A typical AC build has low Crit%, so the Crit Severity bonus of Dread is kind-of wasted - also Dread is quite popular with some other classes. In contrast, Frost is rarely used by any classes except DCs, so you will typically have less chance of duplicated, non-stacking enchants.

    To me that outweights the drawback of having to ensure DoTs in some other way.

    I figured that, by the law of large numbers, you'll put a Crit on enemies *some day*.

    Also, the Critical based debuff stacks with any other Dread Crit based debuff, so you don't actually need to swap in and out enchantments if you got a Dread.

  • michela123
    michela123 Member Posts: 257 Arc User
    There’s a typo in this formula:
    Power Shared= (0.33+0.15+0.10)*(1+0.65*3+0.31)*1.2*Base Power

    It should be like this:
    Power Shared = Base Power * 0.58 + (Base Power * 0.58 * (1.95 + 0.31)) * 1.2

    Ok, I helped.
  • rjc9000
    rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,398 Arc User

    There’s a typo in this formula:
    Power Shared= (0.33+0.15+0.10)*(1+0.65*3+0.31)*1.2*Base Power

    It should be like this:
    Power Shared = Base Power * 0.58 + (Base Power * 0.58 * (1.95 + 0.31)) * 1.2

    Ok, I helped.

    Is that the work of an enemy [BLAME SHARP]???

  • werdandi#8366
    werdandi#8366 Member Posts: 332 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:


    Also, the Critical based debuff stacks with any other Dread Crit based debuff, so you don't actually need to swap in and out enchantments if you got a Dread.

    I believed the debuff stacking worked only if the dread enchants were not of the same rank. So you mean it works even at same rank ?

  • rjc9000
    rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,398 Arc User

    rjc9000 said:


    Also, the Critical based debuff stacks with any other Dread Crit based debuff, so you don't actually need to swap in and out enchantments if you got a Dread.

    I believed the debuff stacking worked only if the dread enchants were not of the same rank. So you mean it works even at same rank ?

    Dread has two debuffs: one that you get from attacking, and one you get from scoring a Critical hit on enemies.

    The one you get from scoring a Critical hit will stack regardless of rank or whatever.

    I do not know off the top of my head whether or not the "normal" debuff will stack depending on rank or not.

  • nihlocke#5890
    nihlocke#5890 Member Posts: 69 Arc User
    A question about Barovia boons: in every spec you suggest using Righteous Sacrifice as the last boon. Does it proc like Primal Weapons, aka when you get damaged OR healed for 10% of your maximum HPs?
    Also, does Hypnotic Gaze even proc at all with the abilities DCs usually use?
  • rjc9000
    rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,398 Arc User
    edited September 2018

    A question about Barovia boons: in every spec you suggest using Righteous Sacrifice as the last boon. Does it proc like Primal Weapons, aka when you get damaged OR healed for 10% of your maximum HPs?

    The one on the DPS DO is a bit of a mistake, I forgot to uncheck it from the support builds. The DPS DO one should have 3/3 Undying Death with 1/1 in Bloodlust.

    As for behavior of the boon, it procs like the "get hit" portion of Primal: postmitigated damage. However, the DC themself will not benefit from the skill. I know it's a violation of common sense skill, especially on the support build, but I saw nothing else of note that supported teammates on bossfights.

    The healing boon is useless because lolhealing.
    Hypnotic Gaze has the issues as presented below.

    The DPS one has potential on an AC build, however, Pickles is slacking and hasn't told me if the Power is shareable. Not shareable means the boon is useless for AC.

    Additionally, in a practical sense, I can't see ACs making use of this bonus for when it counts. The most important AA+BoB is the one deployed before Bondings freeze the bonus, which is usually the first AA deployed. Seeing as ACs deploy their AA+BoB right at the start of combat or before they face off against the giant loot pinatas, which would mean that they would not have 10 stacks of the bonus. It might be useful for subsequent AAs, but given the long downtime of the buff, I cannot guarantee that AA will be fired while the boon is active.

    Also, a lot of recent areas have times when you are forced to take a lot of damage (ex: discount dracula drop-in, deathbabby's random cries during elevator and after killing acercrack, or Nostura's AIDs), so I figured this bonus could be active for those fights.


    Also, does Hypnotic Gaze even proc at all with the abilities DCs usually use?

    Yes.

    It worked on Divine BtS, Divine FF, regular Chains, and T-Rex combat power. There might be more, but these are amongst the most common DC abilities that would "logically" (if it even exists) proc it.

    However, the reason I did not recommend this boon is because, according to the HR Discord, it did not proc on bosses. I suspect this is because you actually need to have the CC effect work (ie, doesn't work vs. CC immune targets).

    This seems to be the case, as I tried the above powers vs. dummies. When I tried it on Baphomet, none of these powers would proc Hypnotic Gaze.

    However, I did not try these procs versus many other CC immune bosses (ex: Drufti, neo CN Porkus, Lostmauth, etc.), so I cannot say for certain if it's just Baphomet that didn't proc Hypnotic Gaze, or most bosses in general.

    Also, I did not check if this boon even worked, much less the subtleties of its performance (ex: If Hypnotic Gaze works through Drow Ambush Tactics, or if Righteous Sacrifice is shareable through AA and/or Aura Gifts). Bonjovia is not my favorite module and the less I have to remember of it, the happier I am.

  • mebengalsfan#9264
    mebengalsfan#9264 Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    For an AC build what is currently the BiS gear (just armor pieces).

    I'm currently using the following and plan to swap out my Chest Piece for the Faithlord's Restoration Chasuble.

    Head: Rex Crona
    Chest: Primal Restoration
    Hands: Ronjon - nice 2700+ power
    Feet: Vivified Primal


    Will my gear be good for a AC DC or should I swap my hands out for something else?
  • dupeks
    dupeks Member Posts: 1,789 Arc User
    edited September 2018


    Head: Rex Crona
    Chest: Primal Restoration
    Hands: Ronjon - nice 2700+ power
    Feet: Vivified Primal

    Here are some thoughts:
    Head: Guise of the Wolf Clan (2500 in party) or Decaying Habit (similar to rex corona, but better for most situations and only a little worse in steady state)
    Chest: The Artifact's (3200 power) or Faithlord's (a little less power for Restoration)
    Hands: Ronjon - nice 2700+ power. I actually think vivified primal still competes with Donjon, but Executioner pulls ahead firmly.
    Feet: Vivified Primal is decent, it's probably keep until Faithlord. Not many fantastic options, but a few have 1500 power ish.

    PS: Saw your comment Anri I'll see what I can do this weekend.
    Post edited by dupeks on
  • xs13red
    xs13red Member Posts: 82 Arc User
    vivified primal arms can be better in longer fights or with higher power levels. 5% increase in power that shares. In 30 second fight executioner is better. with 5 stacks primal has more power at 36000. 4 stacks 43000 power. 3 stacks 56,500. Tested using weapons of light and AA, no companions. If you are dealing enough damage or proccing heals, stacks "should" not be too difficult. If you can get lucky to receive executioner arms-keep them.
    HELLBRINGER TEMPLOCK-DEMONEYE
    TR-SNE
    CW-ELIKIA-MOF T
    DC-BUFFY ON HEELZ-BUFF/DEBUFF
    GF-BAIT
    GWF-MEATHEAD
    HR-SPLIT NOCK
    XBOX ONE
  • vnugo
    vnugo Member Posts: 1 Arc User
    1. get crown of the undead
    2. use hallowed ground
    3. kick your tank out of the instance
  • mebengalsfan#9264
    mebengalsfan#9264 Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    dupeks said:


    Head: Rex Crona
    Chest: Primal Restoration
    Hands: Ronjon - nice 2700+ power
    Feet: Vivified Primal

    Here are some thoughts:
    Head: Guise of the Wolf Clan (2500 in party) or Decaying Habit (similar to rex corona, but better for most situations and only a little worse in steady state)
    Chest: The Artifact's (3200 power) or Faithlord's (a little less power for Restoration)
    Hands: Ronjon - nice 2700+ power. I actually think vivified primal still competes with Donjon, but Executioner pulls ahead firmly.
    Feet: Vivified Primal is decent, it's probably keep until Faithlord. Not many fantastic options, but a few have 1500 power ish.

    PS: Saw your comment Anri I'll see what I can do this weekend.

    My understanding is that the Guise is worth using on any fight that last well over 2 minutes, which would make it a must have for any DC in CR. As for Rex vs Decaying it comes down to how long the fight last. Decaying out performs the Rex greatly in the first 1:30 seconds. After that time the Rex surpass the Decaying and stays ahead slightly. Just like how the Guise stays slightly ahead of the Rex after 2 minutes.

    Now I know some will argue that you get more power from the Decaying over the first 1:30 seconds. I'm not arguing that, but after that time you are not sharing the same amount of power and the Rex become better until 2 minutes. At 2 minutes the Guise becomes the highest power sharing head piece.

    If I had to have just two head pieces I would go with the Decaying for all content expect CR. In CR I would use Decaying on everything but the boss fights. I would use the Guise on bosses.

    I have the Decaying and Rex. I will admit I am lazy and will keep the Rex for my head piece as it is a nice in between the Decaying and Guise.

    As for the Faithlord chest plate, does the power share for the 1500 power gain from having 50% or more health? If so, than I will go get that piece first than the boots.

    As for hands, I have yet to see the executioners hands, though I do hope one day I get them.
  • dupeks
    dupeks Member Posts: 1,789 Arc User
    edited September 2018


    I have the Decaying and Rex. I will admit I am lazy and will keep the Rex for my head piece as it is a nice in between the Decaying and Guise.

    I have all 3, and for precisely that reason I never end up wearing Rex.
    Guise is noticeably (and at times dramatically) better for end-game content. Specifically: MSP, TONG, CODG, CR because they all feature long boss fights during which you cannot reset your hat.
    Habit is noticeably and dramatically better for soloing and non-end-game content, where boss fights never last more than 1:30.
    In my experience, there really isn't content that falls in between :P

    As for the Faithlord chest plate, does the power share for the 1500 power gain from having 50% or more health? If so, than I will go get that piece first than the boots.

    It shares.

    As for hands, I have yet to see the executioners hands, though I do hope one day I get them.

    Yeh... and once they drop they start dropping all over. Primal is not too far behind though, especially if you're diligent about getting a stack or two before AA (can use DG etc. out of combat).

  • mebengalsfan#9264
    mebengalsfan#9264 Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    edited October 2018
    dupeks said:


    I have the Decaying and Rex. I will admit I am lazy and will keep the Rex for my head piece as it is a nice in between the Decaying and Guise.

    I have all 3, and for precisely that reason I never end up wearing Rex.
    Guise is noticeably (and at times dramatically) better for end-game content. Specifically: MSP, TONG, CODG, CR because they all feature long boss fights during which you cannot reset your hat.
    Habit is noticeably and dramatically better for soloing and non-end-game content, where boss fights never last more than 1:30.
    In my experience, there really isn't content that falls in between :P

    As for the Faithlord chest plate, does the power share for the 1500 power gain from having 50% or more health? If so, than I will go get that piece first than the boots.

    It shares.

    As for hands, I have yet to see the executioners hands, though I do hope one day I get them.

    Yeh... and once they drop they start dropping all over. Primal is not too far behind though, especially if you're diligent about getting a stack or two before AA (can use DG etc. out of combat).

    In T9 I use Decaying Habit as the group I run with is is an OP Tank, GF DPS, TR DPS, and another DC. We kill all bosses in under 30 seconds. Same group in CR we beat it typically around 19 minutes or so. Again, other than the 1st and last boss the decaying wins out. The Rex is what I wear on those bosses as those fights don't last more than 2 minutes anyways.

    It is pretty sad that the devs allow both TR and GF to produce so much damage in so little time. Both are sick when properly buffed and having the Decaying ensures both get max power for their big hits in the first minute of the fight.

    The only time I would use Guise is in CoDG. All other content with this group most bosses don't last more than 30 seconds. When I don't run with this group, I run my Rex.

  • rjc9000
    rjc9000 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 2,398 Arc User
    edited February 2019
    Seeing as the new announcements for Mod 16's pretty big changes are out, I will probably un-publicize this April Fools joke (and probably most of my other stuff) after one week until I can actually get the time to do a fundamental re-write.

  • mebengalsfan#9264
    mebengalsfan#9264 Member Posts: 3,169 Arc User
    rjc9000 said:

    Seeing as the new announcements for Mod 16's pretty big changes are out, I will probably un-publicize this April Fools joke (and probably most of my other stuff) after one week until I can actually get the time to do a fundamental re-write.

    I wonder if DC even power share any more...

    Hmm...that would solve the power creep issue in NWO, removal of power sharing.