That only a "meta" group can complete ToNG is obvious hyperbole. It is understandable, though. If you are the only player in your guild that has unlocked Hero's Accord, for instance. Or if you have a work/school/life schedule which prevents playing on a regular schedule, so friends are not online when you are. Sometimes PUG queue is the only option. And for those players in THAT position... if you don't fit the meta, You are HAMSTER'd.
Not true...I jumped on my DC with 2 SW and one HR and we blinded Q into T9. We got a 12K GF and we ended up beating t9 in around 40 minutes with zero wipes. Yeah the rest of us were 16K+ but the point is if you do blind Q and get a group of skilled players that have gone through it a bunch, than it is a cake walk.
Ran a super-fast run with my Fury SW, MoF Oppressor CW, ACDC, OP, and a templock. We only had one set of souls on Ras Nsi before he tried the wipe and 2 sets of balls on Orcus. Didn't actually check the time, but probably no more than 20 min.
I've been outdoing a few GWF's of similar item level lately. They're not all they're cracked up to be in the hype. It is more about the player than it is the item level or class.
Ran a super-fast run with my Fury SW, MoF Oppressor CW, ACDC, OP, and a templock. We only had one set of souls on Ras Nsi before he tried the wipe and 2 sets of balls on Orcus. Didn't actually check the time, but probably no more than 20 min.
I've been outdoing a few GWF's of similar item level lately. They're not all they're cracked up to be in the hype. It is more about the player than it is the item level or class.
I know a few SW that are now out damaging GWF. In one run the 18K GWF called the SW a cheater and quit after Withers. The GWF took the buff on Orucs and the SW was only 50 million behind him after Withers. I guess the GWF did not realize I was using my exaltation buff on the SW. The GWF rage quit because a SW was doing good damage. Got another DPS and we finished Rasi no problem.
SW are now closer to HR and GWF when properly played and built.
I know my CW does great on adds and on Orcus I take a DPS lose due to taking the Temp HP buff which removes the ability to gain the 10% damage buff from the primal weapons.
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mamalion1234Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 3,415Arc User
1: Cw renegade 2: cw opressor 3:sw templock/ or and fury ( if he is good fury yea ). 4: op devotion 5: dc ac
or
1: cw opressor 2: sw templock/ or and fury ( if he is good fury yea). 3: op devotion 4: dc ac 5: dc do
or
1:cw opressor 2:sw templock 3: op devotion 4:dc ac( if he is decent ac ofcourse) 5: gf conqueror ( if he is good conqueror) .
IF you noticed no tank at all in party thanks to "balanced" sherped devotion insignias + those classes give some mitigation tools.
op devo who can bane 2+ people and boss as well as cd buff+gf+some main dps+dc+another support class and you can do it under 20min if they are competent players
op and dc id say is key in any decent run...the dc isnt force to go ac for cc immmune.because the op can use clensing touch to remove cc..if youre worried about 2nd boss just move the red to dwarfs....you dont have to endure the perma cc or fire lol.... other 3 should be dps+support or 3 more dps or 2 dps and 1 more support.. keep in mind the devo doesnt have to go tank at all...if it can focus bane and cd buffs+defence daily the op and dc can manage keeping party alive at all 3 bosses... asuming there is no gf and the run isnt going fast id say the op can go tank dps spec or even just pure tank(stil ahve to focus on cd buffs though need to help party)
sw hb can either templock or do the fury(not needed cause oyu can use full support rotation and still do dps on templock) cw mof can support and dps
this may vary from player to player but still from what ive seen so far is when you got a good dc and op devo you can make do with any 3 other classes asuming they are dps or support or both.... same here apply to meta party dont expect speed runs with nubs...meta party dc ac do op devo gf+main dps only produce wonderfull results if they are competent...same go for the other setups...yes other setups have slower time but who cares you can mange under 25min runs..
as a side note for soulbinder sw id say the meta party whould be diferent..needa hb templock+dc ac+op devo+gf tact and you can speed rush it..we can make do with either do or templock for sub 14min runs as long as the op and dc ac is competent and you as a sw can time well..i dont include dps gf cause im not a wheelchair..if you want a dps gf play templock and enjoy fast melts
op devo who can bane 2+ people and boss as well as cd buff+gf+some main dps+dc+another support class and you can do it under 20min if they are competent players
op and dc id say is key in any decent run...the dc isnt force to go ac for cc immmune.because the op can use clensing touch to remove cc..if youre worried about 2nd boss just move the red to dwarfs....you dont have to endure the perma cc or fire lol.... other 3 should be dps+support or 3 more dps or 2 dps and 1 more support.. keep in mind the devo doesnt have to go tank at all...if it can focus bane and cd buffs+defence daily the op and dc can manage keeping party alive at all 3 bosses... asuming there is no gf and the run isnt going fast id say the op can go tank dps spec or even just pure tank(stil ahve to focus on cd buffs though need to help party)
sw hb can either templock or do the fury(not needed cause oyu can use full support rotation and still do dps on templock) cw mof can support and dps
this may vary from player to player but still from what ive seen so far is when you got a good dc and op devo you can make do with any 3 other classes asuming they are dps or support or both.... same here apply to meta party dont expect speed runs with nubs...meta party dc ac do op devo gf+main dps only produce wonderfull results if they are competent...same go for the other setups...yes other setups have slower time but who cares you can mange under 25min runs..
as a side note for soulbinder sw id say the meta party whould be diferent..needa hb templock+dc ac+op devo+gf tact and you can speed rush it..we can make do with either do or templock for sub 14min runs as long as the op and dc ac is competent and you as a sw can time well..i dont include dps gf cause im not a wheelchair..if you want a dps gf play templock and enjoy fast melts
My fastest T9 since mod13 for me was a bit over 10 minutes. You can still do the super fast speed runs with OP Tank, 2 DC the with the DO setup more as a DPS, 1 buff DPS and any strong DPS. That fast time was with an OP tank, me on my DC as a DO, a AC DC, a HR using LSS, and a GF DPS using ITF.
You just need 3 good people. The rest is bonus and can be any. I usually run it with: me as TR, a sw with all feats spent into the temp tree, and a prot op. Usual time if it's only us is ~25 minutes, all ~17k itm lv. SW with full points in temptation is waaay too underrated. If you want to speedrun i reccomend two dc's, op devo, sw temp/gf and a good dps. My fastest time was 14:59 (ras reached 0 hp at 13:12..but oh well) The setup for the speedrun: 17k TR 17k SW 18k DC AC 12k DC DO 17k OP DEVO
You just need 3 good people. The rest is bonus and can be any. I usually run it with: me as TR, a sw with all feats spent into the temp tree, and a prot op. Usual time if it's only us is ~25 minutes, all ~17k itm lv. SW with full points in temptation is waaay too underrated. If you want to speedrun i reccomend two dc's, op devo, sw temp/gf and a good dps. My fastest time was 14:59 (ras reached 0 hp at 13:12..but oh well) The setup for the speedrun: 17k TR 17k SW 18k DC AC 12k DC DO 17k OP DEVO
Did a T9 last night. OP Tank, 2 DC, me on my CW and a GF. Took under 15 minutes. Than removed the GF for GWF, took around 25 minutes. Swapped the GWF for a TR, took around 25 minutes.
Later on jumped on my DC got another with a OP Tank, 2 DC, a HR and a GF. Took around 15 minutes. Swapped out the HR for a SW, again around 15 minutes. Than swapped out the SW for a GWF, once again it was around 20+ minutes.
The damage buff from HR, CW, or SW outweigh the personal damage that an average GWF or TR provides.
I find the best group composition is OP Tank, 2 DCs and a GF. After that adding any class that is willing to buff the GF damage further makes the run quicker, especially if you have a really good GF that knows how to melt stuff fast. If that other DPS class can also do decent damage, even better. A SW, CW and HR help with their damage buff and they all can do decent damage. If you use mics, you can clearly communicate when you will apply your buff/debuff and it will ensure quicker runs.
Nothing against TR or GWF, there are many players out there running both classes as DPS in content. The only problem is that many are not properly built and add unneeded time to content. If built properly than the TR and GWF are really good and you can get a T9 speed run in. The problem is there are so many GWF and TR out there that many are not built right and under perform their IL.
Comments
I've been outdoing a few GWF's of similar item level lately. They're not all they're cracked up to be in the hype. It is more about the player than it is the item level or class.
SW are now closer to HR and GWF when properly played and built.
I know my CW does great on adds and on Orcus I take a DPS lose due to taking the Temp HP buff which removes the ability to gain the 10% damage buff from the primal weapons.
2: cw opressor
3:sw templock/ or and fury ( if he is good fury yea ).
4: op devotion
5: dc ac
or
1: cw opressor
2: sw templock/ or and fury ( if he is good fury yea).
3: op devotion
4: dc ac
5: dc do
or
1:cw opressor
2:sw templock
3: op devotion
4:dc ac( if he is decent ac ofcourse)
5: gf conqueror ( if he is good conqueror) .
IF you noticed no tank at all in party thanks to "balanced" sherped devotion insignias + those classes give some mitigation tools.
op and dc id say is key in any decent run...the dc isnt force to go ac for cc immmune.because the op can use clensing touch to remove cc..if youre worried about 2nd boss just move the red to dwarfs....you dont have to endure the perma cc or fire lol....
other 3 should be dps+support or 3 more dps or 2 dps and 1 more support..
keep in mind the devo doesnt have to go tank at all...if it can focus bane and cd buffs+defence daily the op and dc can manage keeping party alive at all 3 bosses... asuming there is no gf and the run isnt going fast id say the op can go tank dps spec or even just pure tank(stil ahve to focus on cd buffs though need to help party)
sw hb can either templock or do the fury(not needed cause oyu can use full support rotation and still do dps on templock)
cw mof can support and dps
this may vary from player to player but still from what ive seen so far is when you got a good dc and op devo you can make do with any 3 other classes asuming they are dps or support or both....
same here apply to meta party dont expect speed runs with nubs...meta party dc ac do op devo gf+main dps only produce wonderfull results if they are competent...same go for the other setups...yes other setups have slower time but who cares you can mange under 25min runs..
as a side note for soulbinder sw id say the meta party whould be diferent..needa hb templock+dc ac+op devo+gf tact and you can speed rush it..we can make do with either do or templock for sub 14min runs as long as the op and dc ac is competent and you as a sw can time well..i dont include dps gf cause im not a wheelchair..if you want a dps gf play templock and enjoy fast melts
I usually run it with: me as TR, a sw with all feats spent into the temp tree, and a prot op. Usual time if it's only us is ~25 minutes, all ~17k itm lv.
SW with full points in temptation is waaay too underrated.
If you want to speedrun i reccomend two dc's, op devo, sw temp/gf and a good dps. My fastest time was 14:59 (ras reached 0 hp at 13:12..but oh well)
The setup for the speedrun:
17k TR
17k SW
18k DC AC
12k DC DO
17k OP DEVO
Did a T9 last night. OP Tank, 2 DC, me on my CW and a GF. Took under 15 minutes. Than removed the GF for GWF, took around 25 minutes. Swapped the GWF for a TR, took around 25 minutes.
Later on jumped on my DC got another with a OP Tank, 2 DC, a HR and a GF. Took around 15 minutes. Swapped out the HR for a SW, again around 15 minutes. Than swapped out the SW for a GWF, once again it was around 20+ minutes.
The damage buff from HR, CW, or SW outweigh the personal damage that an average GWF or TR provides.
I find the best group composition is OP Tank, 2 DCs and a GF. After that adding any class that is willing to buff the GF damage further makes the run quicker, especially if you have a really good GF that knows how to melt stuff fast. If that other DPS class can also do decent damage, even better. A SW, CW and HR help with their damage buff and they all can do decent damage. If you use mics, you can clearly communicate when you will apply your buff/debuff and it will ensure quicker runs.
Nothing against TR or GWF, there are many players out there running both classes as DPS in content. The only problem is that many are not properly built and add unneeded time to content. If built properly than the TR and GWF are really good and you can get a T9 speed run in. The problem is there are so many GWF and TR out there that many are not built right and under perform their IL.