I expect they would cut out what once was an award for 1.x million pts required in overflow xp. However why did they have to find another way to cut down on AD. So people wondering why getting notice of overflow xp gained level that is why it is showing up more often when you only need 100,000 vs 1.x million.
I still do not see how this is good for players. Cheating/exploit for leveling up 1.x million in experience, no. If someone wants to spend that much time to earn that much to have a higher chance to maybe nab 30k AD I don't see why that is an issue.
Why don't we ask the community would want the 1.x million brought back and with the nerf. Then do a follow up poll, if we had to reduce something rAD or amount you could refine in a day down to maybe 25k a day, which would you want?
See if you can barely get to 36,35 or whatever the current limit is for refining, that is just another tool that makes rAD harder to earn and harder to advance your character and buy from the AH. Or were both of these changes meant to hopefully push users into spending real money instead by making the AD to hard get enough to buy from the AH the things sold in the Zen Market? I know unfair swipe, but as I have said they never asked the community as a whole, they either asked select players, or they came up with the idea themselves not realizing how this affects the average player.
Should it matter how one plays. If someone doesn't like the gravy train, then why not donate what you don't want to your guild or buy something and put in guild bank and if not in a guild buy an item on AH, when on a dung (random epic or norm) and you see a player with below par gear, donating the item to them and tell them to pay it forward.
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hammbo1969Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 165Arc User
I didn't really give this thread a lot of thought until this weekends x2 XP. I've just consumed all the XP books I've acquired on my ten toons and gained about 3-5 overflow levels on each, and not a single AD reward.
I'm not overly bothered, as I'm not lacking on the AD front, but it seemed to me that what I lost in possible Ad rewards I gained in power points. Which I found strange, as there is a zen market item for power points and they seem ridiculously easy to come by now.
1
plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,355Arc User
I didn't really give this thread a lot of thought until this weekends x2 XP. I've just consumed all the XP books I've acquired on my ten toons and gained about 3-5 overflow levels on each, and not a single AD reward.
I'm not overly bothered, as I'm not lacking on the AD front, but it seemed to me that what I lost in possible Ad rewards I gained in power points. Which I found strange, as there is a zen market item for power points and they seem ridiculously easy to come by now.
I expect you need to have 100 XP overflow rewards to get one AD reward for the same AD reward per XP ratio (not AD reward per "XP overflow reward" ratio) as before mod 13.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
I mostly received XP books and black pearls before the change and now that is all I have gotten sense.
At least now, the books get you about 1/3 of the way to the next XP reward. Before the books barely moved the needle.
Careful, they will nerf the XP books now LOL
Stop. Giving. Them. Ideas!!!
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myles08807Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 409Arc User
It's very sad to see people gain a YUUUGE advantage a few weeks ago in the contraction of the number of XP required for an overflow reward...and then complain when the top-tier prize that they're STILL GETTING MORE OFTEN doesn't drop quite as often.
It's very sad to see people gain a YUUUGE advantage a few weeks ago in the contraction of the number of XP required for an overflow reward...and then complain when the top-tier prize that they're STILL GETTING MORE OFTEN doesn't drop quite as often.
Sad is one word for it - not the word I probably would have used but it'll do.
1
minotaur2857Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,141Arc User
It's very sad to see people gain a YUUUGE advantage a few weeks ago in the contraction of the number of XP required for an overflow reward...and then complain when the top-tier prize that they're STILL GETTING MORE OFTEN doesn't drop quite as often.
What top prize we're getting more often, we're not, I'm getting the 30K rADs about half as often as I was before all the changes.
It also showed a serious disadvantage to players below level 70 and players with fewer characters allowing just a few players to pretty much dominate the Neverwinter economy.
Yeah I understand why the RAD overflow was nurfed, because some players were exploiting the availability of those RAD's getting several RAD overflow bonuses a day, the more characters they had the more they received.
Trying to keep the in game playing field and economy as even as possible for as many players as possible... that I can understand.
Just informational for you guys who chew on the statistics. Well it has been about a week with all 8 of my characters doing random stuff. I would estimate at least 50% of my 8 overflow once a day... that sounded so wrong. Anyways that is roughly 28 to 32 XP overflows and the 30K finally dropped for one of my characters.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,355Arc User
Just informational for you guys who chew on the statistics. Well it has been about a week with all 8 of my characters doing random stuff. I would estimate at least 50% of my 8 overflow once a day... that sounded so wrong. Anyways that is roughly 28 to 32 XP overflows and the 30K finally dropped for one of my characters.
If you can get a AD drop within 50 XP overflow reward, you are doing great. I expect you need over 100 to have the similar drop rate as before mod 13 using AD drop per XP ratio (not per XP overflow reward).
If you had one AD reward per 6 XP overflow rewards before mod 13, you will need ~102 XP overflow rewards now to have the similar ratio (AD drop per XP ratio).
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
I don't really care about the decrease in AD drop from leveling, I am concerned about the use of the term exploit tied into this conversation. What exploit? Multi characters? Some people like to test out how the different classes work. Exp boosters? The HP buff from the prosperity insignia can be very significant for say an OP.
It is neither exploitation nor cheating to boost your character's exp, nor is it such to have multi characters.
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plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,355Arc User
edited April 2018
As far as I concern, it is neither exploitation nor cheating. The game is promoting to have more character and gaining XP. You can buy stuff from Zen store to boost XP. If you spend a lot of time in the game, of course, you should have upper hand over the new comer. If you invest various things to boost your AD income, of course, you should have upper hand over the new comer. Can the new comer catch up? Of course they can. They just need to spend time/effort/resource. Can the new comer pass the long timer? of course, they can. I know many did. Again, they spend time/effort/resource.
With this new XP reward, I don't know if this is intentional. I can view this as indirect promotion to have more characters. With so much XP rewards, besides AD reward (let assume it is the same drop rate as before mod 13), you get more RP and more XP tomes. With so much XP tomes, someone posted a character was raised to level 70 in 7 seconds during 2xXP. That is the newcomer does not need to spend a lot of time to raise a character the 'good' old way like the old timers.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
Well, TBH, if you are using exp books from overflow then you are not a newcomer. If you get the books/boosters from the game then, well same as it ever was.
So opened up my overflow XP rewards on all my characters today and noted how many were AD rewards:
11 / 494 = 2.2%
Prior to the change, it was dropping on average 1/5 = 20% (approximately)
So if it was reduced by a factor of 10 (as XP was reduced from 1.7mil to 170k) then my results are close to this change.
It was reduced from 1.7 million to 100K (not 170k). If we use the pre-mod 13 scale, you get 11 AD reward in 29 "pre-mod 13" XP overflow rewards. It is less than 1 in 3. You are doing super good.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
1
plasticbatMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 12,355Arc User
Well, TBH, if you are using exp books from overflow then you are not a newcomer. If you get the books/boosters from the game then, well same as it ever was.
I guess my newcomer is anyone who played less than 1 year.
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
Like many issues my use of the word "exploit" is more or less a subjective opinion based on one's personal perspective...
(*By the way an "exploit" is commonly defined as: To make full use of and derive benefit from an act or action - still think exploit is inappropriate?)
If the overflow RAD thing wasn't an issue (I didn't say exploit), Cryptic and Neverwinter probably wouldn't have nurfed it, the very fact that they felt it needed to be addressed because the way it was being used and effecting the in game economy (again I avoided the word exploit), people taking advantage of a an in game mechanic (no exploit word used here either) had a negative effect for other players in the game.
Object to my personal opinion that former frequency of overflow AD's was an "exploit" that some players appeared to be taking advantage of or not - the fact remains because of the apparent problems that particular mechanic appeared to cause, someone decided the frequency needed to be brought down a bit.
So opened up my overflow XP rewards on all my characters today and noted how many were AD rewards:
11 / 494 = 2.2%
Prior to the change, it was dropping on average 1/5 = 20% (approximately)
So if it was reduced by a factor of 10 (as XP was reduced from 1.7mil to 170k) then my results are close to this change.
It was reduced from 1.7 million to 100K (not 170k). If we use the pre-mod 13 scale, you get 11 AD reward in 29 "pre-mod 13" XP overflow rewards. It is less than 1 in 3. You are doing super good.
Adding to a few statistics: I opened 50 XP rewards across 8 Toons. 15.7% XPTomes, 17.6% Black Pearl, 41.2% Flawless Sapphire, 7.8% (5) Flawless Sapphire, 15.7% Black Opal, 2% 30,000 AD and just for fun, 25.5% Power points.
I wish I would have saved more of them during the double XP last weekend, but I forgot about the double refinement this weekend. With the placement on the screen, I don't know that I will save them all for the next 2X enchant--I can't figure out how to move it and it covers up my quest log.
50 is a small sample, but it seems to work with Vordayn's larger sample size.
@plasticbat OF COURSE the only toon to get the 30,000 AD didn't have sufficient bonus AD to fully realize the potential 45,000 AD LMAO!!
So opened up my overflow XP rewards on all my characters today and noted how many were AD rewards:
11 / 494 = 2.2%
Prior to the change, it was dropping on average 1/5 = 20% (approximately)
So if it was reduced by a factor of 10 (as XP was reduced from 1.7mil to 170k) then my results are close to this change.
It was reduced from 1.7 million to 100K (not 170k). If we use the pre-mod 13 scale, you get 11 AD reward in 29 "pre-mod 13" XP overflow rewards. It is less than 1 in 3. You are doing super good.
Ah yes, my mistake. And if you look at the ratio, it is pretty good.
So opened up my overflow XP rewards on all my characters today and noted how many were AD rewards:
11 / 494 = 2.2%
Prior to the change, it was dropping on average 1/5 = 20% (approximately)
So if it was reduced by a factor of 10 (as XP was reduced from 1.7mil to 170k) then my results are close to this change.
It was reduced from 1.7 million to 100K (not 170k). If we use the pre-mod 13 scale, you get 11 AD reward in 29 "pre-mod 13" XP overflow rewards. It is less than 1 in 3. You are doing super good.
Ah yes, my mistake. And if you look at the ratio, it is pretty good.
No, it is not pretty good. I said "super good".
*** The game can read your mind. If you want it, you won't get it. If you don't expect to get it, you will. ***
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greywyndMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 7,134Arc User
i would love to get some BOA rp and not xp books on overflows, is like a try again joke....
The books are a lot less painful now than they were.
I'm not looking for forgiveness, and I'm way past asking permission. Earth just lost her best defender, so we're here to fight. And if you want to stand in our way, we'll fight you too.
My opinion is unchanged, the 30K AD reward is nothing more than a "jackpot" on the slot machine. Books and black pearls are the lemons. I know someone will say, "But it isn't gambling unless there is real cash involved." The reward is not cash but a surge of dopamine the brain produces in many players when they score, hit it big, or win. This has nothing to do with currency but a satisfaction produced by a habitual external stimulus. From what I have read, 2% seems to be the average for the 30K and jackpot which is lower than the 15% chance of winning a $1 scratch off ticket in Michigan. Just try to be aware of what motivates you to play. I play social games to have fun with my friends, if I want to play the virtual slots, I have Facebook for that kind of crud.
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soditalloverMember, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 88Arc User
edited April 2018
well here is my two cents, the way rng works is difficult to calculate on a per toon basis. for instance before the ad reward nerf i was getting 1 reward for every 6 overflows on average across my account which was a nice little reward for my effort then after the nerf i got one reward for every 14 bags opened across my account how ever you might think that's fine cos i have x on one toon so ill get x number of rewards however that's not how rng works its all or nothing yesterday i opend 68 rewards on my main just to see what id get and if the average was correct i should have seen 4~5 ad rewards however i got 0 rewards. an d thats the thing one player will get lots and lots, and the next 50 players get zero its the same all over the server some players get items some get lots and then some get none i know players who have never had a +5 ring from any content and others that have 100+ rings and they both have run the same amount of content. and its the same for everything in the game some lose out and others get rich id rather see a points based system that can be used to purchase rewards that was players that work hard and grind out content get the items they want/need
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minotaur2857Member, NW M9 PlaytestPosts: 1,141Arc User
I think the issue for me is in fact a reduction in XP for some of the tasks. I'm not sure exactly what they reduced in XP that was a task I actually do, but I'm NOT getting 17x the awards, hence cutting the chance by a factor of 17 is massively reducing my ADs.
It's now 22 days since the patch, I've had 6 awards in just under 300 level ups (and I didn't get one until my 128th). I was getting ADs around every other day before, now it's once every 3-4 days.
... after the nerf i got one reward for every 14 bags opened across my account how ever you might think that's fine cos i have x on one toon so ill get x number of rewards however that's not how rng works its all or nothing yesterday i opend 68 rewards on my main just to see what id get and if the average was correct i should have seen 4~5 ad rewards however i got 0 rewards. ...
I posted about this issue a while ago on this other thread here, the Random Number Generator that Cryptic uses in this game is streaky. For example; You would expect random numbers 1 to 6 to be a series like "136245261354641325416235" but with Cryptic's version you get more like "224111323314455243655666" same results but massive runs of repeats.
Comments
I still do not see how this is good for players. Cheating/exploit for leveling up 1.x million in experience, no. If someone wants to spend that much time to earn that much to have a higher chance to maybe nab 30k AD I don't see why that is an issue.
Why don't we ask the community would want the 1.x million brought back and with the nerf. Then do a follow up poll, if we had to reduce something rAD or amount you could refine in a day down to maybe 25k a day, which would you want?
See if you can barely get to 36,35 or whatever the current limit is for refining, that is just another tool that makes rAD harder to earn and harder to advance your character and buy from the AH. Or were both of these changes meant to hopefully push users into spending real money instead by making the AD to hard get enough to buy from the AH the things sold in the Zen Market? I know unfair swipe, but as I have said they never asked the community as a whole, they either asked select players, or they came up with the idea themselves not realizing how this affects the average player.
Should it matter how one plays. If someone doesn't like the gravy train, then why not donate what you don't want to your guild or buy something and put in guild bank and if not in a guild buy an item on AH, when on a dung (random epic or norm) and you see a player with below par gear, donating the item to them and tell them to pay it forward.
I'm not overly bothered, as I'm not lacking on the AD front, but it seemed to me that what I lost in possible Ad rewards I gained in power points. Which I found strange, as there is a zen market item for power points and they seem ridiculously easy to come by now.
Yeah I understand why the RAD overflow was nurfed, because some players were exploiting the availability of those RAD's getting several RAD overflow bonuses a day, the more characters they had the more they received.
Trying to keep the in game playing field and economy as even as possible for as many players as possible... that I can understand.
Well it has been about a week with all 8 of my characters doing random stuff. I would estimate at least 50% of my 8 overflow once a day... that sounded so wrong. Anyways that is roughly 28 to 32 XP overflows and the 30K finally dropped for one of my characters.
If you had one AD reward per 6 XP overflow rewards before mod 13, you will need ~102 XP overflow rewards now to have the similar ratio (AD drop per XP ratio).
It is neither exploitation nor cheating to boost your character's exp, nor is it such to have multi characters.
If you spend a lot of time in the game, of course, you should have upper hand over the new comer.
If you invest various things to boost your AD income, of course, you should have upper hand over the new comer.
Can the new comer catch up? Of course they can. They just need to spend time/effort/resource.
Can the new comer pass the long timer? of course, they can. I know many did. Again, they spend time/effort/resource.
With this new XP reward, I don't know if this is intentional. I can view this as indirect promotion to have more characters. With so much XP rewards, besides AD reward (let assume it is the same drop rate as before mod 13), you get more RP and more XP tomes. With so much XP tomes, someone posted a character was raised to level 70 in 7 seconds during 2xXP. That is the newcomer does not need to spend a lot of time to raise a character the 'good' old way like the old timers.
11 / 494 = 2.2%
Prior to the change, it was dropping on average 1/5 = 20% (approximately)
So if it was reduced by a factor of 10 (as XP was reduced from 1.7mil to 170k) then my results are close to this change.
If we use the pre-mod 13 scale, you get 11 AD reward in 29 "pre-mod 13" XP overflow rewards.
It is less than 1 in 3. You are doing super good.
(*By the way an "exploit" is commonly defined as: To make full use of and derive benefit from an act or action - still think exploit is inappropriate?)
If the overflow RAD thing wasn't an issue (I didn't say exploit), Cryptic and Neverwinter probably wouldn't have nurfed it, the very fact that they felt it needed to be addressed because the way it was being used and effecting the in game economy (again I avoided the word exploit), people taking advantage of a an in game mechanic (no exploit word used here either) had a negative effect for other players in the game.
Object to my personal opinion that former frequency of overflow AD's was an "exploit" that some players appeared to be taking advantage of or not - the fact remains because of the apparent problems that particular mechanic appeared to cause, someone decided the frequency needed to be brought down a bit.
I opened 50 XP rewards across 8 Toons. 15.7% XPTomes, 17.6% Black Pearl, 41.2% Flawless Sapphire, 7.8% (5) Flawless Sapphire, 15.7% Black Opal, 2% 30,000 AD and just for fun, 25.5% Power points.
I wish I would have saved more of them during the double XP last weekend, but I forgot about the double refinement this weekend. With the placement on the screen, I don't know that I will save them all for the next 2X enchant--I can't figure out how to move it and it covers up my quest log.
50 is a small sample, but it seems to work with Vordayn's larger sample size.
@plasticbat OF COURSE the only toon to get the 30,000 AD didn't have sufficient bonus AD to fully realize the potential 45,000 AD LMAO!!
It's now 22 days since the patch, I've had 6 awards in just under 300 level ups (and I didn't get one until my 128th). I was getting ADs around every other day before, now it's once every 3-4 days.