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Forums > Home› Neverwinter Discussion › General Discussion (PC)

Can we get a dev blog on the new Abandon/Kick/Leave Penalty system?

lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
in General Discussion (PC)
Hey @nitocris83 , any chance we can get a dev blog detailing the changes to Vote Kick/Vote Abandon/Leaver Penalty?

I know more details than most people because I participated in the preview discussion, but I don't know for sure what went live and I don't have an easy place to send people to learn even that much because it was in the middle of a long thread.

As I understand it:

VOTE KICK:
1) Each character may initiate a vote to kick another member of the group once per 4 hours
2) A player may vote on whether or not to kick someone else at any time, regardless of 1)
3) Someone who is kicked gets no leaver penalty

VOTE ABANDON:
1) Each character may initiate a vote to abandon a queue once per four hours, after a certain minimum time in the dungeon
2) A player may vote on whether or not to abandon at any time, regardless of 1)
3) Members of a group that votes to abandon get no leaver penalty.

LEAVER PENALTY:
1) If you leave a queue without being kicked and without successfully voting to abandon, you get the leaver penalty
2) Characters with the leaver penalty cannot join other queues for 30 minutes
3) This time is character-dependent, but appears to be logged-in-time-dependent - you can switch toons and join queues again, but your toon with the penalty has to be logged in for 30 real minutes in order to lose the penalty.

Am I right? Any additional major points to raise? Is the 4 hour limit character-dependent or account-dependent, and if it's character-dependent, does it only count down while you're logged in? Is there any way to see your countdown status for votes?

Thanks,

Comments

  • pitshadepitshade Member Posts: 5,665 Arc User
    I seem to remember from long ago that the penalty only applies to the first person that bails. Is this true? As stated, there isn't an awful lot of information about this awful feature.
    "We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
  • intothegrooveintothegroove Member Posts: 39 Arc User
    I think clarification on this is definately needed. I've been a casual player since 2014 and i'd never adandoned a dungeon until recently. Now unfortunately more and more people are finding it necessary to bail after the implementation of this new Epic Dungeon Random Queue. Havn't encountered one person with something positive to say about this.
  • lantern22lantern22 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,111 Arc User
    pitshade said:

    I seem to remember from long ago that the penalty only applies to the first person that bails. Is this true? As stated, there isn't an awful lot of information about this awful feature.

    I think you might be right, I was the 2nd or 3rd person to bail on FBI last night and I didn't get a penalty
  • sangrinesangrine Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 575 Arc User
    As a side note, it seems that in random dungeons/skirmishes, empty player spots (due to players who leave) always remain empty for the entire duration. New players are never sent to refill empty spots. Am I mistaken about this? Is this working correctly?
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  • lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    spunkmeier said:

    sangrine said:

    As a side note, it seems that in random dungeons/skirmishes, empty player spots (due to players who leave) always remain empty for the entire duration. New players are never sent to refill empty spots. Am I mistaken about this? Is this working correctly?

    You need to request new players now.

    I became leader after a player left, right clicked my picture icon and an option to request reinforcements was there.

    That is good to know and I didn't know it. Thanks!

    ( @nitocris83 this would be another REALLY COOL thing to have in a dev blog explainer post thingy!)
  • nitocris83nitocris83 Member, Cryptic Developer, Administrator Posts: 4,498 Cryptic Developer
    I recently had some great discussions with Devs on how we approach Dev blogs. Because they can be time consuming, we usually save them up for module releases but we'd like to start addressing in-between module needs as well so suggestions such as these are really useful to us. I'll circle back with the relevant people and see where I can put in a request for a blog :)
  • arcanjo86arcanjo86 Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,093 Arc User
    today my dc was random queue to fbi but we couldnt vote abandon as a party without 15min inside the dungeon, wtf, if my dc isnt fit to run FBi (my dc was being one shoted), why cant i vote to abandon right at the begining?, my dc only fits for etos/ecc/egwd/vt/mc/CN/elol, random queue is HAMSTER up, no one was or is willing to stay 15min afk to vote to abandon a dungeon that they cant complete.
  • lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    arcanjo86 said:

    today my dc was random queue to fbi but we couldnt vote abandon as a party without 15min inside the dungeon, wtf, if my dc isnt fit to run FBi (my dc was being one shoted), why cant i vote to abandon right at the begining?, my dc only fits for etos/ecc/egwd/vt/mc/CN/elol, random queue is HAMSTER up, no one was or is willing to stay 15min afk to vote to abandon a dungeon that they cant complete.

    I *think* the best fix there is to kick you - or, if the rest of the group don't want to waste their kicks, for you to spend your kick on one of them (preferably not a DPS, those refill too fast. Kick the tank!).

    Once the group is 4/5, the rest should be able to leave without penalty. Or, if they kick you, they can hope for a better healer?

    Alternately, since you appear to think you're the weak link, you just leave and take the penalty, and the rest of the group can then leave without penalty while you go run your daily Stronghold quests or farm the event or something for 30 minutes.

    But this is with my naive understanding of how the Leaver Penalty works. Which is one of the reasons I want a Dev Blog on it.

    (Finally: If you're talking about the giants on the hill? EVERYONE gets one-shotted by the thrown rocks. My 16K DC who runs FBI gets one-shotted by those. Tanks need to be careful of those, they're NOT like the rocks thrown by the giants in Cold Run. You really need to prioritise getting out of the area of those over most other things during that part of the dungeon.)
  • lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    nitocris83 said:

    I recently had some great discussions with Devs on how we approach Dev blogs. Because they can be time consuming, we usually save them up for module releases but we'd like to start addressing in-between module needs as well so suggestions such as these are really useful to us. I'll circle back with the relevant people and see where I can put in a request for a blog :)

    Thanks!

    The big issue here is that it's a major change to the rules of grouping (no infinite kicks! No free abandons! Cooldowns and timers!) and a major change to the CONSEQUENCES of group actions (voting to kick a griefer means no more kicks for 4 hours! Leaving a failed run WITHOUT voting to abandon locks you out for 30 minutes!) and there's a lot of questions we don't have answers for (What happens to the SECOND person to abandon a failed run without voting to abandon? If 4/5 take the leaver penalty immediately and I'm left in FBI all alone, do I get a leaver penalty for quitting? Is there a way to see which cooldowns are ticking for me? Are the cooldowns per account, or per character? etc etc etc)

    I would really love a detailed explanation of the rules so we'd be able to learn if some behaviours (eg, leaving when people have already left) are safe and what causes a penalty.
  • pitshadepitshade Member Posts: 5,665 Arc User
    I was under the impression that leaver penalty applied to all queues. However last night, I organized salvage runs for ETOS, private queue. Towards the end of our runs, I decided that it would be better to swap from my CW to DC, to smooth out the run. I passed queue lead to a friend, dropped party, swapped to DC and rejoined. Later, going back to my CW, there was no indication of a Penalty. So was the penalty not implemented in private queue? I certainly hope that this is the case as it serves no purpose there.
    "We have always been at war with Dread Vault" ~ Little Brother
  • ecrana#2080 ecrana
    ecrana#2080
         Member Posts: 1,654 Arc User
    pitshade said:

    So was the penalty not implemented in private queue? I certainly hope that this is the case as it serves no purpose there.

    I see no reason why there should be any penalty added to private queue. The whole point of private queues is to run things the way you want to run them. Swapping alts in is a common thing in private, especially if someone needs to leave all of a sudden, or you want to give up your spot, etc.
  • lowjohnlowjohn Member, NW M9 Playtest Posts: 1,061 Arc User
    pitshade said:

    I was under the impression that leaver penalty applied to all queues. However last night, I organized salvage runs for ETOS, private queue. Towards the end of our runs, I decided that it would be better to swap from my CW to DC, to smooth out the run. I passed queue lead to a friend, dropped party, swapped to DC and rejoined. Later, going back to my CW, there was no indication of a Penalty. So was the penalty not implemented in private queue? I certainly hope that this is the case as it serves no purpose there.

    I can answer that! From the previous thread, Leaver Penalty should NOT apply to private queues, meaning what you're seeing is working as intended.

    @nitocris83 that's another thing to ask for inclusion in the dev blog: Which queues are subject to penalties?

    (And: If you pick up leaver penalty from a Public Queue, can you then join a private queue?)

    I'm going to book out some time to do SCIENCE to this and run a ton of tests. Maybe this weekend.
  • joehighland1joehighland1 Member Posts: 10 Arc User
    Leaver penalty should not even be enforced in this game. there are enough players to fill the gap left by one or a few players that decided to leave for what ever reason. This new fiasco they have created will most likely be the finale straw players needed to find another game to enjoy. i mean really why be forced to stay in a fail skirmish or instance? for the geared players it really makes ya not want to even help the not geared players its very frustrating to have to pull everyone along most of the time. you can only do that so often. anyway within the first 30 secs to 1 min in the skirmish or dungeon you can tell its gona fail, so again why force players to stay in a fail/failing part of a game that is already outdated? Thanks for taking almost all the fun out of the game! i guess its one less thing i have to worry about.
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