Extremely long que times for Svardbord

residentgearhed · February 2017

I am usually waiting que for at least an hour in SOMI, This is a brand new skirmish but is anyone even playing this.I am a 4.1K SW so I understand that DC's and GF's are more of a priority.Im just trying to get my Marks.I Have aleady done the heavy grinding. 200 Turtle Moults,300 lanolin. just to be slowed down a by que thats worst than watching paint dry.Probably have to suffer though it though
.Just venting some anger and frustration.

rjc9000 · February 2017

residentgearhed said:
I am usually waiting que for at least an hour in SOMI, This is a brand new skirmish but is anyone even playing this.I am a 4.1K SW so I understand that DC's and GF's are more of a priority.Im just trying to get my Marks.I Have aleady done the heavy grinding. 200 Turtle Moults,300 lanolin. just to be slowed down a by que thats worst than watching paint dry.Probably have to suffer though it though.
Just venting some anger and frustration.

It's like that on PC too: nobody pugs Svardborg. Everyone forms premade teams, and even then teams can potentially wait upwards of an hour (or hours) to finish up their team.

And if you're a DPSer, you're also competing with all the other DPSers who want their weapons. The way the raid is designed is somewhat of a paradox, in that the people who want the new raid (DPSers) need to employ the help of those who generally don't need the new raid (GF/DC/OP).

The best way to get into a run is to make the team yourself. It might not easy to get the help of the rare support players, but you get to call the shots and form up however you like.

(btw, for the DCs/GFs/OPs out there reading this, if you really want to milk this for all it's worth, try putting yourself in LFG channels, but demanding goods like SMoPs or 5 Lanolin per run. Devious, but a great way to profit from DPSer desperation.)

thejawlives · February 2017

Speak for yourself @rjc9000 ...I would not, and assume most, will refuse to pay another player to grace us with his presence for runs.

kydavi · February 2017

Refuse to bribe anyone to play with me.

rjc9000 · February 2017

kydavi#1678 said:
Refuse to bribe anyone to play with me.

thejawlives said:
Speak for yourself @rjc9000 ...I would not, and assume most, will refuse to pay another player to grace us with his presence for runs.

*shrugs* Each to their own.

I know of a DC on PC who charged 50K AD per Esvard run when it was news.

He made quite a killing.

thejawlives · February 2017

Must be a PC thing...not seen this on console yet. All classes need each other and should help each other. I'm all for making a buck, but I much prefer integrity.

sundance777 · February 2017

There are several players that I know on Xbox that are not able to go to this content yet as they don't have it unlocked and don't have the frost resist to go either. In our guild of 150 players, only one person has the requirements to go to svardbord so far and 3 or 4 that could go to FBI. Many in the guild have no desire to meet the gear gate on the content and to run something for what is perceived as little or no reward. I am sure other guilds have many more players that can go, but I think in general the population of those that can go is still fairly low compared to those that can run elol or cn which will cause longer wait times.

kydavi · February 2017

Unfortunately that seems to be the case; most people can't run it and many of those that can don't feel the reward justifies the effort.

No one wants to do a 40+ minute (for any sub 4K group) dungeon run when the only gear they want (relic armor) has such a trash drop rate, not to mention that you might get a piece you don't need.

It also doesn't help that relic armor is worse than elemental dragon flight unless you constantly feed it voninblood, and who the hell wants to do that? Sure, you can get it vivified, but between collecting the armor, restoring it, and finally vivifying it, that is a lot of work and most players are content to stick with what they have or wait for future content (or they add a premium short cut, like the seeker's wands).

Ultimately, Mod 10/10.5 was designed as a huge grind aimed at ultra-high IL players that had effectively run out of things to do, as such they are the only ones regularly running it. For those of us still building characters, it borders on unplayable, as demonstrated by the empty que lines.

ltsmithneko · February 2017

kydavi#1678 said:
Unfortunately that seems to be the case; most people can't run it and many of those that can don't feel the reward justifies the effort.

No one wants to do a 40+ minute (for any sub 4K group) dungeon run when the only gear they want (relic armor) has such a trash drop rate, not to mention that you might get a piece you don't need.

It also doesn't help that relic armor is worse than elemental dragon flight unless you constantly feed it voninblood, and who the hell wants to do that? Sure, you can get it vivified, but between collecting the armor, restoring it, and finally vivifying it, that is a lot of work and most players are content to stick with what they have or wait for future content (or they add a premium short cut, like the seeker's wands).

Ultimately, Mod 10/10.5 was designed as a huge grind aimed at ultra-high IL players that had effectively run out of things to do, as such they are the only ones regularly running it. For those of us still building characters, it borders on unplayable, as demonstrated by the empty que lines.

cx Im still about to run out of things to do.

hughmungus · February 2017

ltsmithneko said:

kydavi#1678 said:
Unfortunately that seems to be the case; most people can't run it and many of those that can don't feel the reward justifies the effort.

No one wants to do a 40+ minute (for any sub 4K group) dungeon run when the only gear they want (relic armor) has such a trash drop rate, not to mention that you might get a piece you don't need.

It also doesn't help that relic armor is worse than elemental dragon flight unless you constantly feed it voninblood, and who the hell wants to do that? Sure, you can get it vivified, but between collecting the armor, restoring it, and finally vivifying it, that is a lot of work and most players are content to stick with what they have or wait for future content (or they add a premium short cut, like the seeker's wands).

Ultimately, Mod 10/10.5 was designed as a huge grind aimed at ultra-high IL players that had effectively run out of things to do, as such they are the only ones regularly running it. For those of us still building characters, it borders on unplayable, as demonstrated by the empty que lines.
cx Im still about to run out of things to do.

I wish you'd run out of things to say...

ltsmithneko · February 2017

hughmungus#9204 said:

ltsmithneko said:

kydavi#1678 said:
Unfortunately that seems to be the case; most people can't run it and many of those that can don't feel the reward justifies the effort.

No one wants to do a 40+ minute (for any sub 4K group) dungeon run when the only gear they want (relic armor) has such a trash drop rate, not to mention that you might get a piece you don't need.

It also doesn't help that relic armor is worse than elemental dragon flight unless you constantly feed it voninblood, and who the hell wants to do that? Sure, you can get it vivified, but between collecting the armor, restoring it, and finally vivifying it, that is a lot of work and most players are content to stick with what they have or wait for future content (or they add a premium short cut, like the seeker's wands).

Ultimately, Mod 10/10.5 was designed as a huge grind aimed at ultra-high IL players that had effectively run out of things to do, as such they are the only ones regularly running it. For those of us still building characters, it borders on unplayable, as demonstrated by the empty que lines.
cx Im still about to run out of things to do.
I wish you'd run out of things to say...

If you dislike me so much, avoid my comments. Not reason for you to be disrespectful to someone you don't know, and disagree with them on things that have zero reason to be disagree'd on. So if you don't have nothing further to add on to this Topic, shoo. :P

Just try the chat, most peeps will pick ya up eventually, just type something like this "GWF 4.3k IL lf MSvA. ^-^", something around those lines.

ddem0n888 · February 2017

Getting a run as DPS, even at 4.2K can be a challenge so I don't know how the lower level toons manage. Funnily enough my 3.3k DC was finding runs easily

Now she's 3.7k....

And @ltsmithneko how many Guilds you been in lately? lol

kydavi · February 2017

We don't, that's the issue, I've gone whole days and never got into a SVA/MSA/FBI; doesn't matter that I can dish massive damage, my IL (3.3 with the new weapons, took a hit there) gets me excluded.

On the other hand, my GF just hit 2.8 and gets asked to run content to the point of harassment, if only a tank wasn't so boring to solo...

ltsmithneko · February 2017

ddem0n888 said:
Getting a run as DPS, even at 4.2K can be a challenge so I don't know how the lower level toons manage. Funnily enough my 3.3k DC was finding runs easily Now she's 3.7k....

And @ltsmithneko how many Guilds you been in lately? lol

hmm... welp went from Chocolate Milk Squad , to LGPG, then PG, and currently TLO. c:

thegravelnome · February 2017

Silly question. I haven't done many pug dungeons but is it possible to run SVA In a private group w/o 2 tanks and 2 heal?

kydavi · February 2017

Yeah, but unless you are crazy high IL, you'll likely get owned (especially without buffing clerics).

thegravelnome · February 2017

I don't disagree at all that you will get your <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> handed to you! Lol I was just curious if is possible. Another thing that comes into effect is knowing your class. I've seen lower item level characters run by people that know their class outperform High item level characters.

mordekai · February 2017

Since Guild Boons and the change to Companions Gift on Bonding stones, IL has become a poor guide to a characters value in a dungeon.
It would be worth the devs looking into revising the old IL to develope a system that could include the active bonuses of boons mounts and companions.

neverburnaclown · February 2017

My cleric gets message <font color="orange">HAMSTER</font> daily about doing msva.

all of you should be charged by dc's to run this.

Double price for '4k hunter ranger' groups

All you guys asking for 4dc runs are just making the nerf come faster.

kydavi · February 2017

Agreed, IL is at best a barometer for player ability and by no means a perfect representation; it ignores a number of major stats and features (plus, some items at the same level do not have the same output).

thegravelnome · February 2017

So since it seems a lot of people realize item level doesn't mean anything anymore other than to keep you out of dungeons you want to do, what criteria should b used to "judge people" ? What should you look for when you inspect someone that indicates they have the ability to play well as opposed to being a "wallet Warrior" not that there's anything wrong with that.

I just had an idea. In Diablo 3 you have the ability to run a solo Rift if you can defeat X number of enemies in a certain amount of time you clear the rift you can proceed to the next one. If they could Implement something like that, almost a colosseum type thing, where you have to do so many task based on your class so many heels so much tanking excetera. If the tasks are completed within a certain amount of time you are assigned a passing score. would this be a fair way to evaluate a player's ability level in addition to everything else they have ?

kydavi · February 2017

An easy fix would be adding an item level to campaign boons, companions, bonding stones, and mount insignias. Then you really know what you are running with.

For example, my HR is only 3.3k right now, but I have 3 r12 bondings on my striker companion and with those I regularly out damage toons that have several hundred item level on me. Actually just ran FBI with two other HRs, one 4.1k trapper and the other 3.8k combat/trapper mix, both good players and yet I out damaged them by almost 20 million points. They had invested in IL while I invested in my companion; upside was that I was able to outperform them, down side was that they can run SVA/MSVA whenever they want and I have to practically beg to get a run.

thegravelnome · February 2017

I agree that this whould b an ez fix, however it does nothing to address the player. Do they know how to play the toon? Have they prepared by research and talking to others? Or did they power level their toon with a buddy from The Guild, and slap a bunch of high-level gear on it and expect outperform everybody else? That is why I suggest we need need some way of being able to rank the player not necessarily the equipment

mordekai · February 2017

The only way people get better, no matter how many blogs they read on the perfect build, is by doing it.
There is already a built in criteria, and while its not perfect, having other players determine a second wall of accessibility is what stops players from becoming better.
Item level could be amended, as mentioned above, with point values applied to anything like boons, mounts, insignia, companions and their gear. Even something as simple as how many additional power points a character has earned can make a big difference to their potential in a dungeon.

But helping novice and intermediate players is the best way for experienced players to increase the pool of better characters to run dungeons with. Snubbing "weak" characters and even booting them based on IL alone is counterproductive. Not to mention rude and selfish.

thegravelnome · February 2017

I completely agree! Elitism does nothing but tear new players down. I have 2 new mebers in my guild that almost quit due to it. One is a pally and the other a healer. We need more of those classes, we need to aid them not run em off!

kydavi · February 2017

I'm close to quitting honestly, despite the significant time investment I have put into my character; I can't run the stuff I want to run, not because I don't meet requirements or lack the skill, but because of the mercenary mentality and elitist nature of many high level players. Whenever I try to get into the T3 content, there is always a higher IL DPS in the wings and I keep getting kicked to make room for them, of course that is if I can even get in a que.

Sitting in SoMI and reading the zone chat, there are tons of calls for people to run T3 stuff; most of it wants DC/GF, but whenever they want DPS they never ask for lower than 3.6k, often stipulating 3.8k or higher. People want fast runs, but more importantly they want guaranteed success with no room for potential failure. Elitism is part of the issue, but the keys are another problem. I won't turn this into a key complaint thread, but with SVA/MSA it is a real problem.

For regular dungeons you can buy more keys from the key vendor if you want to run more after you run out, for special keys (demo/edemo, etc) you can stock pile as many as you want and run when you feel like it, but with SVA/MSVA you can only accumulate 5 keys of each type at a time; the elk and giant keys are ok since you can grind out more with some time investment, but the arcane key is limited to one a day, no matter how much you play. And thus the problem, once you are out of arcane keys, you aren't gonna run the skirmish until you stock them back up to 5 to match the other two types (cuz who the hell is gonna run it and skip a chest, you need them marks!). There needs to be a way to accumulate arcane keys beside running dallies.

So we have a two headed problem here; first is an elitist and selfish community, second is mechanical design which discourages free play and forces limited engagement. Something about how SVA/MSVA is run needs to change, I know I am not alone in feeling increasingly discouraged by this.

thegravelnome · February 2017

Well said. I am a day one player who has a item level of 2.7 why so low? Because I don't care about chasing a number. I get through end game content just fine by knowing my hr and using that knowledge. However with a low gs, it looks on paper that I couldn't possibly be of any help.

Elitism will kill this game if we as a community are not careful. So what can we as a community do to fight back against this mentality? Naming and shaming doesn't work. The only thing I can think of is a change in enough players to not accept elitism as just another part of the game. A change that will cause enough player to say enough is enough. A change that will have people saying I don't care what your number is please run this with me. More people on headsets willing to help others, give pointers, and train newer people so they can understand the game. More people willing to take a little extra time and not be so impatient if the payoff helps somebody else instead of just themselves. The change has to start with you though. the person reading these words right now. Will you be part of the solution or part of the problem? I know which side I'm going to be on. Take 5 minutes today to help somebody beneath you. You might be surprised what you end up getting out of it

thefiresidecat · February 2017

the other reason for no que possible (come on at first edemo was crazy to pug but everyone was doing it..) is because of hte extremely high bar to get in for support class. they realllly need to make it easier for support class to qualify. like support gets a free pass. this game just doesn't have the player base to support what they're trying to do here.

rjc9000 · February 2017

thefiresidecat said:
the other reason for no que possible (come on at first edemo was crazy to pug but everyone was doing it..) is because of hte extremely high bar to get in for support class. they realllly need to make it easier for support class to qualify. like support gets a free pass. this game just doesn't have the player base to support what they're trying to do here.

Lmao on PC, that already happens on (most) premade teams, which as been the subject of much lamentation and debate.

Are you a GF, DC, or OP that is barely 3200ish but can enter the door?
Come right in, we got a spot with your name on it!

Are you a CW/HR/TR/SW, or "worst" of all, a GWF who can DPS in Svardborg?
You need 4k Ilvl, R12 Bondings, and a legendary mount, or GTFO.

(exaggerated for purposes of demonstration)

I've been on the recieving end of both of these scenarios. It pisses me off, that people are only willing to give you a pass if you have exactly what they need, otherwise, no go.

Nowadays, I only do Svardborg if someone ~~begs~~ ~~holds me at gunpoint~~ asks me politely to go or if a team has been waiting for 40+ minutes for one last support player.

thegravelnome#9466 said:
Well said. I am a day one player who has a item level of 2.7 why so low? Because I don't care about chasing a number. I get through end game content just fine by knowing my hr and using that knowledge. However with a low gs, it looks on paper that I couldn't possibly be of any help.

Elitism will kill this game if we as a community are not careful. So what can we as a community do to fight back against this mentality? Naming and shaming doesn't work. The only thing I can think of is a change in enough players to not accept elitism as just another part of the game. A change that will cause enough player to say enough is enough. A change that will have people saying I don't care what your number is please run this with me. More people on headsets willing to help others, give pointers, and train newer people so they can understand the game. More people willing to take a little extra time and not be so impatient if the payoff helps somebody else instead of just themselves. The change has to start with you though. the person reading these words right now. Will you be part of the solution or part of the problem? I know which side I'm going to be on. Take 5 minutes today to help somebody beneath you. You might be surprised what you end up getting out of it

I don't disagree.

I don't mind helping out new players with FBI or Svardborg, or just tanking/DPSing/supporting in general, as I too once had my period of suckiness.

To quote the owner of a certain SKT channel, "if you're so good at FBI/Svardborg [Mr/Mrs. 4k HDPS R12 Bondings ], teach the newbies on how to get through the content."

Paraphrased, but this is the general idea.

armwald · February 2017

This is what is wrong with 10.5 mod no way to progress by PUG.

I remember having no trouble as a DPS PUGing Castle Never Edemo Demo a couple weeks after it came out. Easier to progress on your own schedule not being dependent on others.

Extremely long que times for Svardbord

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